On September 10 2013 03:26 Alaric wrote: Man, buying oracles every 4 minutes and shitting wards instead of buying stuff like Locket (ended up trying to build Randuin's) makes even Leona so damn squishy. ;_; Too used to be able to just rush Locket to realise how harsh that meta actually is, even for supposedly "tanky" supports.
I have stopped doing that. I have come to the conclusion that your team barely uses the vision advantage enough to warrant constant oracles and dozens of wards. I still by a few additional wards and pinks over the stone wards, and i get oracles if i think the situation justifies it (which mostly means times at which i think a lot of stuff will happen around baron). Too often do i produce a major vision advantage only to have my whole team just running down midlane towards the opponent, which basically means that all that money in oracles is wasted, and suddenly the enemy support has a shurelyas and a locket while i am still on wardstone + boots. Especially considering that junglers don't really build locket, that is actually a pretty significant effect on teamfights which you gave up for all those excessive wards and oracles. I don't think the really hardcore wardbitch style of supporting is worth it in soloqueue.
I don't see a problem with you not buying wards over ruby sightstone, but man you NEED oracles. Knowing if the enemy team knows where you are is so fucking important. Every support game I played the other night I had an oracles running and one in my bag when the other support never bought one. Guess how useful her locket was while we killed the Nexus?
So I received a 20$ gift card. But in CAD fund... So I'm not able to purchase the 20$ USD on the shop for RP... Do you think riot will accept my 20$ cad...? :O
On September 10 2013 10:33 XenOmega wrote: So I received a 20$ gift card. But in CAD fund... So I'm not able to purchase the 20$ USD on the shop for RP... Do you think riot will accept my 20$ cad...? :O
Yes. I think so. It might be worth a try. What could go wrong?
On September 10 2013 10:33 XenOmega wrote: So I received a 20$ gift card. But in CAD fund... So I'm not able to purchase the 20$ USD on the shop for RP... Do you think riot will accept my 20$ cad...? :O
Yes. I think so. It might be worth a try. What could go wrong?
On September 10 2013 03:26 Alaric wrote: Man, buying oracles every 4 minutes and shitting wards instead of buying stuff like Locket (ended up trying to build Randuin's) makes even Leona so damn squishy. ;_; Too used to be able to just rush Locket to realise how harsh that meta actually is, even for supposedly "tanky" supports.
I have stopped doing that. I have come to the conclusion that your team barely uses the vision advantage enough to warrant constant oracles and dozens of wards. I still by a few additional wards and pinks over the stone wards, and i get oracles if i think the situation justifies it (which mostly means times at which i think a lot of stuff will happen around baron). Too often do i produce a major vision advantage only to have my whole team just running down midlane towards the opponent, which basically means that all that money in oracles is wasted, and suddenly the enemy support has a shurelyas and a locket while i am still on wardstone + boots. Especially considering that junglers don't really build locket, that is actually a pretty significant effect on teamfights which you gave up for all those excessive wards and oracles. I don't think the really hardcore wardbitch style of supporting is worth it in soloqueue.
I don't see a problem with you not buying wards over ruby sightstone, but man you NEED oracles. Knowing if the enemy team knows where you are is so fucking important. Every support game I played the other night I had an oracles running and one in my bag when the other support never bought one. Guess how useful her locket was while we killed the Nexus?
Completely disagree here. Wards are in most situations a lot more useful than oracles. Knowing if they know where you are is rather irrelevant as long as you know where they are and manage to kinda group your team. There are specific situations where them NOT knowing what you are doing and you knowing that they don't know is important, but those usually revolve around baron which is a rather specific case, and doesn't really warrant 24/7 oracles. Just buy it when you are in a situation where you plan to do stuff around baron.
From my experience, at a certain level of play the enemy stops giving you the completely free picks just because you got an oracles. At which point the value of that oracles rapidly plummets unless you have a team that actually coordinates to do specific plays that revolve around the enemy not having vision, like doing baron or baiting it, or constantly swapping between lanes as a group. But in most games, the plan is "we run down mid and try to do something that way". And in those cases oracles is exceedingly useless.
Also, you obviously didn't really read what i wrote. I never spoke of buying wards OVER a wardstone, that is stupid. Early game you buy as many wards as you need to keep your lane save, plus situationally pinks for either lane brushes or stuff around dragon. All of that is more important then the wardstone, and none of it stops you from ultimately getting that stone. Wardstone is of course the first item you get in pretty much any game considering it is the most efficient gp10 item AND gives you actually useful combat stats. I was speaking of wards beyond the 3 from the wardstone. Which in many cases are a better investment of your money then an oracles from my experience.
But i am sure your extensive testing consisting of "Every support game I played the other night" (My guess is two games total) gives you total knowledge.
On September 10 2013 02:29 GettingIt wrote: Why do so many rammus players build Madred's Razor? It only gives you some armor and they never complete it to wriggles which is worthless on him anyway.
Ugh. You remind me of my one friend that still builds Wriggles, on EVERY jungler. Me and my other friend have explained up and down how it's shit compared to the spirit items, shown him challenger pick rates, etc. Yet every game, Wriggles.
This is also the guy that claims it's his teammates fault he is in Silver V.
Gonna bash a guy that gets a free ward every 3 minutes? Shame on you.
He never uses the ward. At any point, in any game.
Also it's 1 min wards now.
I fucking hate the wriggle's wards. It's the most random change imaginable and it makes the item such a tedious piece of garbage because you have to divert yourself from wherever you were going to place it, and you have to do that CONSTANTLY. It's just stupid shitty busywork.
On September 10 2013 10:33 XenOmega wrote: So I received a 20$ gift card. But in CAD fund... So I'm not able to purchase the 20$ USD on the shop for RP... Do you think riot will accept my 20$ cad...? :O
Yes. I think so. It might be worth a try. What could go wrong?
Who should I contact? Support?
Yes, from what I understand, they are really helpful.
On September 10 2013 03:26 Alaric wrote: Man, buying oracles every 4 minutes and shitting wards instead of buying stuff like Locket (ended up trying to build Randuin's) makes even Leona so damn squishy. ;_; Too used to be able to just rush Locket to realise how harsh that meta actually is, even for supposedly "tanky" supports.
I have stopped doing that. I have come to the conclusion that your team barely uses the vision advantage enough to warrant constant oracles and dozens of wards. I still by a few additional wards and pinks over the stone wards, and i get oracles if i think the situation justifies it (which mostly means times at which i think a lot of stuff will happen around baron). Too often do i produce a major vision advantage only to have my whole team just running down midlane towards the opponent, which basically means that all that money in oracles is wasted, and suddenly the enemy support has a shurelyas and a locket while i am still on wardstone + boots. Especially considering that junglers don't really build locket, that is actually a pretty significant effect on teamfights which you gave up for all those excessive wards and oracles. I don't think the really hardcore wardbitch style of supporting is worth it in soloqueue.
I don't see a problem with you not buying wards over ruby sightstone, but man you NEED oracles. Knowing if the enemy team knows where you are is so fucking important. Every support game I played the other night I had an oracles running and one in my bag when the other support never bought one. Guess how useful her locket was while we killed the Nexus?
Completely disagree here. Wards are in most situations a lot more useful than oracles. Knowing if they know where you are is rather irrelevant as long as you know where they are and manage to kinda group your team. There are specific situations where them NOT knowing what you are doing and you knowing that they don't know is important, but those usually revolve around baron which is a rather specific case, and doesn't really warrant 24/7 oracles. Just buy it when you are in a situation where you plan to do stuff around baron.
I'm only in Silver 1 but having complete vision control over Baron and the relevant jungle side means the enemy team has two choices: either come and facecheck bushes to get ward control back or let you have free reign of Baron, Red buff/blue buff and the inner/outer turrets of mid/top.
On the flip side if you need to regain control of that area Oracles means you can safely and slowly work your way towards clearing objectives. Ever tried to sweep Baron with a pink and had the entire enemy team meet you there because there was an advance ward in your own jungle? It sucks and would never happen if you constantly had oracles.
From my experience, at a certain level of play the enemy stops giving you the completely free picks just because you got an oracles. At which point the value of that oracles rapidly plummets unless you have a team that actually coordinates to do specific plays that revolve around the enemy not having vision, like doing baron or baiting it, or constantly swapping between lanes as a group. But in most games, the plan is "we run down mid and try to do something that way". And in those cases oracles is exceedingly useless.
You do understand that you having oracles means that you can completely deny vision of an enemies jungle, which gives you ample opportunity to rotate freely for buffs/dragons/barons? 400g every 4mins is nothing if you are running GP10 runes + masteries + philo + passive gold.
Also, you obviously didn't really read what i wrote. I never spoke of buying wards OVER a wardstone, that is stupid. Early game you buy as many wards as you need to keep your lane save, plus situationally pinks for either lane brushes or stuff around dragon. All of that is more important then the wardstone, and none of it stops you from ultimately getting that stone. Wardstone is of course the first item you get in pretty much any game considering it is the most efficient gp10 item AND gives you actually useful combat stats. I was speaking of wards beyond the 3 from the wardstone. Which in many cases are a better investment of your money then an oracles from my experience
I probably didn't word that correctly. I agree with you that buying sightstone is enough wards and any more IN ADDITION to sightstone are usually wasted on Solo Q teams.
But i am sure your extensive testing consisting of "Every support game I played the other night" (My guess is two games total) gives you total knowledge.
I don't know what level you guys play at, but I don't see how you can win a game if the other team invests in oracles and you don't. With the rise of assassins like ahri, zed, and fizz it's essentially suicide not having ward coverage.
On September 10 2013 13:03 sung_moon wrote: Is TF on Ez/Corki such a strong midgame power spike now, that going for it first is better than the old Phage->BT->TF now?
Been doing TF->LW->Shiv on Corki 100% of the time and I feel so ridiculously strong.
Pretty much. The phage nerfs really screwed with the phage -> BT pathway because it slows your BT down without really giving you any extra teamfight presence. The speed buff is pretty insignificant compared to the slow that the whole team could benefit from previously. The sheen proc on TF is just too good to not go first now.
On September 10 2013 07:28 Pantagruel wrote: Man, Shyvana is getting nerfed : (
This is the first time my favorite champ is getting nerfed and it feels bad. Go to hell Riot!
That seems...random...
I might cry if this goes through, finally winning with Shyv again and NERF!
Hope maybe it's accommodating for some buff or something not on PBE yet.
Edit: Nevermind, Riot posted about it:
We aren't making imminent changes to Shyvana's Burnout. This datamine was another piece of Season 4 fighter testing bits of which I incorrectly promoted to the PBE (as seen with Garen). The plan was to pair it with some sexy changes to her dragon form.
FWIW our internal testing on all the changes currently shows the W you saw to be a bit too weak.
As to our overall view of Shyvana, I think she's balanced but her Dragon Form doeesn't feel sufficienly epic. I want Shyvana to be a bully, but a more moderate one early, in exchange for a lvl 16 dragon form where she becomes a literal raid boss, turning the enemy backline into a pile of charred corpses. Rez and run back.
We aren't making imminent changes to Shyvana's Burnout. This datamine was another piece of Season 4 fighter testing bits of which I incorrectly promoted to the PBE (as seen with Garen). The plan was to pair it with some sexy changes to her dragon form.
FWIW our internal testing on all the changes currently shows the W you saw to be a bit too weak.
As to our overall view of Shyvana, I think she's balanced but her Dragon Form doeesn't feel sufficienly epic. I want Shyvana to be a bully, but a more moderate one early, in exchange for a lvl 16 dragon form where she becomes a literal raid boss, turning the enemy backline into a pile of charred corpses. Rez and run back.
On September 10 2013 12:49 Itsmedudeman wrote: I don't know what level you guys play at, but I don't see how you can win a game if the other team invests in oracles and you don't. With the rise of assassins like ahri, zed, and fizz it's essentially suicide not having ward coverage.
nonono, as a sp u facecheck bush and ward then see an assassin and die. It really depends on how early i wanna get oraclle, heres my build order
starting items(the usual items u start off) if i gt asst or kill ,i get a philo stone and some wards if i feed fast, i rush ruby sighstone after getting ruby sightstone if dragon is still up, i oracle 1st. If dragon is dead, i go boots 5 and ward like mad
EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/xrdfai3.png)
