On October 18 2012 05:41 Lysteria wrote: It's sad, as it could help a lot with korean scene review to have TL focused on LoL as well.
We aim to have a better international coverage in S3, I promise. TheYango was brought on specially for his insight on the Chinese scene. Chexx and Vlani help out a ton with their consistent new postings about the Korean scene.
If there's anything we, as a subforum, can improve upon, it's to move away from the NA centric view of LoL.
I think LoL deserves its own sub forum like Dota ! There is just so many things going on to post under LoL General.
Dota 2 is great game, no doubt about it. but unfortunately it's still in beta and I don't think theres much exciting things going on. international was one of the craziest tournament so far tho. DENDIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
That being said, DotA 2 not having as easy of an access to the game as LoL certainly isn't helping its popularity. There's also the issue that DotA is much much harsher for new players than LoL so the barrier of entry would also hinder DotA's popularity. That being said, DotA can easily compete with LoL due to its immense popularity in China.
Also, the countless amount of people screaming that DotA is soo hard and high skill while LoL is newb friendly game also means that casuals are probably more willing to play LoL than DotA.
Regarding this situation though, I just find it sadly ironic that this happens after TL decides not to support LoL. It's a pity cause SlayerS was probably my fav Korean SC2 team when I still followed the scene.
On October 18 2012 05:52 tylervoss4 wrote: I think LoL deserves its own sub forum like Dota ! There is just so many things going on to post under LoL General.
Dota 2 is great game, no doubt about it. but unfortunately it's still in beta and I don't think theres much exciting things going on. international was one of the craziest tournament so far tho. DENDIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
To be honest, I think the LoL subforum benefited from some of the bad posters migrating to the DotA 2 forum (Neo knows who I'm talking about). I wouldn't want our LoL forum to get too big and have those kinds of posters come back.
The forum population arguably gets bigger with every major tourney and LR thread, though I can honestly say it's real good that there's still a visible minority of 100-200 recognizable posters to...(I don't want to say 'drown out' but I can't think of a better way to say it) the newbies and lurkers. Not that we don't welcome them or anything, but I think the subforum personalities are a good thing for us.
Can you recognize me?
On topic: yes, LoL is huge in korea, and as long as a long-term plan is in place, it will only get bigger.
For the record, yes I do.
And on topic: I'm super excited to have gotten in on the ground floor of what is shaping up to be a BW-level e-sport. I can be one of those hipster guys who says "Oh yeah I've been following the scene since 20XX" 5 years from now when we have our first bonjwa team or some shit.
On October 18 2012 05:41 Lysteria wrote: It's sad, as it could help a lot with korean scene review to have TL focused on LoL as well.
We aim to have a better international coverage in S3, I promise. TheYango was brought on specially for his insight on the Chinese scene. Chexx and Vlani help out a ton with their consistent new postings about the Korean scene.
If there's anything we, as a subforum, can improve upon, it's to move away from the NA centric view of LoL.
I think LoL deserves its own sub forum like Dota ! There is just so many things going on to post under LoL General.
Dota 2 is great game, no doubt about it. but unfortunately it's still in beta and I don't think theres much exciting things going on. international was one of the craziest tournament so far tho. DENDIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
Regarding this situation though, I just find it sadly ironic that this happens after TL decides not to support LoL. It's a pity cause SlayerS was probably my fav Korean SC2 team when I still followed the scene.
On October 18 2012 05:41 Lysteria wrote: It's sad, as it could help a lot with korean scene review to have TL focused on LoL as well.
We aim to have a better international coverage in S3, I promise. TheYango was brought on specially for his insight on the Chinese scene. Chexx and Vlani help out a ton with their consistent new postings about the Korean scene.
If there's anything we, as a subforum, can improve upon, it's to move away from the NA centric view of LoL.
I think LoL deserves its own sub forum like Dota ! There is just so many things going on to post under LoL General.
Dota 2 is great game, no doubt about it. but unfortunately it's still in beta and I don't think theres much exciting things going on. international was one of the craziest tournament so far tho. DENDIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
Regarding this situation though, I just find it sadly ironic that this happens after TL decides not to support LoL. It's a pity cause SlayerS was probably my fav Korean SC2 team when I still followed the scene.
We understand that League right now is the biggest game with the largest player base. But this isn't purely a business or numbers decision for TL. At this moment, taking into account our existing core audience (StarCraft fans), we believe that Dota 2 should be the game we add to our coverage. It "fits" TL's style, and it's very popular among our staff, who play and watch the game as well as visit sites like r/dota2. We already have an active Dota 2 forum, and pro Dota 2 players are streaming using our stream list. Though no TL game expansion can compare to us adding StarCraft 2 two years ago, this is a similar situation where all the pieces are already in place.
This doesn't mean we hate League of Legends or that it has no place on TL. In fact, we have many fans of professional LoL on TL and they and our staff have done some amazing forum-based coverage of LoL tournaments, such as MLG Summer Arena or IEM Cologne. We're not ruling out adding League, but right now we feel that Dota 2 fits us more.
Not necessarily a permanent thing. Just not right now.
I love PC bangs in Korea, especially going with friends who are right beside you. During school breaks or when there is nothing to do outside (before drinking), PC bangs are so crowded (in seoul) that it's hard to find seats for even two people. I have easily introduced the game to so many friends. Free to play sure attracts the crowds.
LoL is getting big in korea, just like bigbang did... doesn't mean it is the best moba, just like bigbang will never be the best boyband (H.O.T. 4 life). SC2 flopped in korea simply because of how the BW fans feel about the skill cap in sc2. Just like someone in this thread said, in korea sc2 has the "for newbs" stigma.
People should have learned from sc2, that using hype to artificially grow an "esport" won't last. Blizzard did it with sc2, and while they accomplished a more globally relevant game than bw, it is still primarily dominated by koreans, and they aren't even the best rts players korea has to offer.
Riot is trying to push LoL too hard too fast... a lot of people claim the game is amazing cause it is ever-changing, it only feels like that because people had to learn how to play the first couple of years. We all knew how the game would evolve based on rts and fps experience to understand the natural evolution of team-based games.
Will dota2 be better or bigger? I'd say chances are unlikely. Will LoL be the more skillful game and thus better for esports? Who knows...
All I know is that an esport in its infancy, does not deserve million dollar tournaments just so people scream "omg this game is so big look at the dollar signs".
I predict that if LoL stays huge in korea for years to come, the quality of the fans will be less than that of bw fans... the more artificial type fan... sorta like the kpop scene.
Same thing happened with SC2... all the grizzled bw fans saw all these new fans that didn't really care about the depth of the game, flocking to it because of the hype... those fans aren't ever nearly as passionate though... and there was a lot of friction between them and more seasoned fans, because of the general lack of understanding of what is skillful and what isn't. (Sorta like how people were hyping up idra and whitera in beta, when any decent korean coach could tell you their play simply wasn't top caliber, and never would be)
My prediction is that LoL will stay big until people get desensitized about the big prize pools, and actually start analyzing the game for its merits and whether it takes a ton of skill or not. Eventually people will realize that there are some very poor balancing issues at play and a lot of less skillful players can rely on certain gimmicks or balance issues to mask their inferior skill.
Riot could fix these kinda issues if they truly cared about the state of their game as an e-sport... but it serves them better to release their new champs as OP as possible so people buy them up like hot cakes.
The entry level is also not conducive for hardcore esports, having people grind up champs and runes and all that jazz.
On October 18 2012 08:56 overt wrote: locodoco called it back in September 2011. locodoco is a prophet.
Prediction at 3:40 if you don't wanna watch all of it. I followed locodoco's teachings like a good fanboy though, so it doesn't surprise me that LoL is huge in Korea.
Loco why you go to school... T_T I miss you... We need good English speaking Korean to connect our communities better.
On October 18 2012 04:47 Djin)ftw( wrote: Come now, that a couple of Ex-Slayers players move to LoL is just the beginning. There is no way that the Kespa-teams wont jump on the bandwagon when LoL is that popular. I am sure that a lot of players already play it besides SC2. As soon as KHAN, SKt1, KTF etc. create LoL teams, a lot of these SC2 players will join. Sc2 is just not popular in South Korea and I highly doubt that HotS will change that.
It will be interesting to see what becomes of Blizzard though. After the disappointing SC2 and the clusterfuck that is D3 I'm curious as to what will happen in the future.
Incidentally, KT already does have a LoL team, and CJ's had one for a little while now.
KT played in the Enter the Dragon tournament yesterday and the VoDs are up here: http://en.afreeca.tv/
They played a smaller team from Korea called RoMg.
I've followed almost every big tournament in LoL's history and OGN's tournaments have been the best in every regard (except the quality of streaming and the casting). Watching semis and finals in OGN's tournaments was mind-blowing to me, so high-level mechanics, strategies and teamwork.
On October 19 2012 05:59 robertdinh wrote: LoL is getting big in korea, just like bigbang did... doesn't mean it is the best moba, just like bigbang will never be the best boyband (H.O.T. 4 life). SC2 flopped in korea simply because of how the BW fans feel about the skill cap in sc2. Just like someone in this thread said, in korea sc2 has the "for newbs" stigma.
No, it's the opposite. I didn't know about it at first, either, but for most Koreans, SC2 is too hardcore. It's fun to watch, but too hardcore to enjoy playing.
People should have learned from sc2, that using hype to artificially grow an "esport" won't last. Blizzard did it with sc2, and while they accomplished a more globally relevant game than bw, it is still primarily dominated by koreans, and they aren't even the best rts players korea has to offer.
Riot is trying to push LoL too hard too fast... a lot of people claim the game is amazing cause it is ever-changing, it only feels like that because people had to learn how to play the first couple of years. We all knew how the game would evolve based on rts and fps experience to understand the natural evolution of team-based games.
Riot only really pushed the competitive side of LoL in season 2. Before that, they were more focused on other aspects of the fandom, namely the fan artists and casuals.
Will dota2 be better or bigger? I'd say chances are unlikely. Will LoL be the more skillful game and thus better for esports? Who knows...
I learned the hard way that a more skillful game doesn't necessarily make a better 'E-Sport'.
All I know is that an esport in its infancy, does not deserve million dollar tournaments just so people scream "omg this game is so big look at the dollar signs".
1. Didn't GSL do the same thing? 2. Who are you to say that it doesn't deserve it? 3. LoL is big not just because of the number of zeroes on the check given to the winner.
I predict that if LoL stays huge in korea for years to come, the quality of the fans will be less than that of bw fans... the more artificial type fan... sorta like the kpop scene.
Many of the 'fangirls' and the more casual fans of BW already migrated towards LoL. LoL is there to stay in Korea. Get used to it.
It's also comical how you call those kpop fans artificial. They're no more artificial than SC2 or LoL fans.
Same thing happened with SC2... all the grizzled bw fans saw all these new fans that didn't really care about the depth of the game, flocking to it because of the hype... those fans aren't ever nearly as passionate though... and there was a lot of friction between them and more seasoned fans, because of the general lack of understanding of what is skillful and what isn't. (Sorta like how people were hyping up idra and whitera in beta, when any decent korean coach could tell you their play simply wasn't top caliber, and never would be)
How is what's happening in LoL and what happened in SC2 remotely the same? I just said that, at least in Korea, the vast majority of BW fans went over to LoL, not SC2.
My prediction is that LoL will stay big until people get desensitized about the big prize pools, and actually start analyzing the game for its merits and whether it takes a ton of skill or not. Eventually people will realize that there are some very poor balancing issues at play and a lot of less skillful players can rely on certain gimmicks or balance issues to mask their inferior skill.
I don't even know how to begin responding to this. You just come off as very ignorant about LoL and Esports as a whole.
Riot could fix these kinda issues if they truly cared about the state of their game as an e-sport... but it serves them better to release their new champs as OP as possible so people buy them up like hot cakes.
See what they're trying to do for Season 3. You can see that they want to not only make the game better as a competitive game, but also give the average joes a better experience. LoL is proof that you don't have to choose between hardcore and casual.
The entry level is also not conducive for hardcore esports, having people grind up champs and runes and all that jazz.
On the contrary, the gradual learning experience that LoL provides a good way into entering the competitive scene. Much better than in SC2 where you get immediately hit by a brick wall to the face.
Hi, first post but long time Lurker. Played for AL(dreamhack 2012) elohell(warsaw and gamescom) as the jungler. Decided to post smth because of the awesome and thoughtful community(for example not flaming our games vs m5 where we were serverly outplayed even with the TL nunu top pick-also m5 clg in groups and m5 at gamescom).
Anyways I had a few thoughts about some of the posts here.
First of all LoL didn't get big just because of riot sponsoring prize money. Before LoL was big the players created a comptetitive environment by themselves(with the help of esl). I'm talking about the go4lol's(in eu) where there could be as much as 1000 teams signed up a week(for 100 euro 1st place...) where I and many others played with many different teams.
Second, it'll be really intresting how the korean pro sc2 players will perform in LoL, lately I casually played in a team with a cs1.6 legend Taz and can say that I could definitely feel his progamer experience(even though he's playing for only half a year he already has 2200 elo) so it's intresting to see how fast the sc2 pros can catch up.
If players living in korea say that LoL is getting as hyped as BW once, then LoL should be huge in korea soon.
On October 20 2012 04:18 veggie16 wrote: Hi, first post but long time Lurker. Played for AL(dreamhack 2012) elohell(warsaw and gamescom) as the jungler. Decided to post smth because of the awesome and thoughtful community(for example not flaming our games vs m5 where we were serverly outplayed even with the TL nunu top pick-also m5 clg in groups and m5 at gamescom).
Anyways I had a few thoughts about some of the posts here.
First of all LoL didn't get big just because of riot sponsoring prize money. Before LoL was big the players created a comptetitive environment by themselves(with the help of esl). I'm talking about the go4lol's(in eu) where there could be as much as 1000 teams signed up a week(for 100 euro 1st place...) where I and many others played with many different teams.
Second, it'll be really intresting how the korean pro sc2 players will perform in LoL, lately I casually played in a team with a cs1.6 legend Taz and can say that I could definitely feel his progamer experience(even though he's playing for only half a year he already has 2200 elo) so it's intresting to see how fast the sc2 pros can catch up.
If players living in korea say that LoL is getting as hyped as BW once, then LoL should be huge in korea soon.
Always nice to have a pro pop in. Hope you stick around. :3
EPT
