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On September 07 2012 02:21 Frolossus wrote:
i thought that lich bane rush was considered horrible on every character always? why would you rather rush lich bane on TF or any other character before deathcap?
TF likes the move speed buff, and since you're most likely playing him with ap/lvl yellow and blue you have some decent ap by the time you finish lich bane (scalling runes, masteries and 1-2 dorans or kage's if you want to go dfg later)
You can go sheen, deathcap and lich bane, but i feel like lich bane 1st is ok. Its not like the ultimate op build, but its cost efficient i'd say.
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brand does not have mana issues, at all. You do not need the grail :<.
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On September 07 2012 02:20 VirgilSC2 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2012 02:10 NeoIllusions wrote:On September 07 2012 02:05 AsnSensation wrote:
Id really only get it if you are significantly behind and need some dmg more midgame objective fights.
triforce into Bt or vice versa feels like the most solid choice at the moment. This. LW is a reactionary item. If the other team isn't stacking Armor, you're better off with a BF Sword item for more deeps. Oh okay. Thanks for the tips! Also, is there a way to turn on Smartcast Range Indicators but still have it release the spell when i press the key, not release the key? I keep not firing skillshots because I click to move again before I release and it feels really weird.
I employed the tip from earlier in the thread of setting shift+key to normal cast, so when you need the range indicator you can do that but if you want spells to trigger on press then the only way is to memorize the spell ranges.
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Probably more effecient to run MS quints on TF, and MS in utility tree, and go DC before lichbane, than to rush lichbane first. But the MR from lich is indeed, very nice.
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On September 07 2012 02:21 Frolossus wrote:
i thought that lich bane rush was considered horrible on every character always? why would you rather rush lich bane on TF or any other character before deathcap?
It is. People have been going 2 dorans -> lich which with runes an masteries gives you over 120 AP to justify doing it. I still think it's silly snd would rather have deathcap first. But whatever floats their boat. Like regi builds 3 gp10 on tf. Doesn't mean it's an actually good build. >_>
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On September 07 2012 02:25 StateAlchemist wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2012 02:21 Frolossus wrote:
i thought that lich bane rush was considered horrible on every character always? why would you rather rush lich bane on TF or any other character before deathcap? TF likes the move speed buff, and since you're most likely playing him with ap/lvl yellow and blue you have some decent ap by the time you finish lich bane (scalling runes, masteries and 1-2 dorans or kage's if you want to go dfg later) You can go sheen, deathcap and lich bane, but i feel like lich bane 1st is ok. Its not like the ultimate op build, but its cost efficient i'd say.
monte had a post about this awhile ago, imma see if i can dig it up, but TF's base dmg is low enough that lichbane first is actually just fine on him.
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On September 04 2012 03:05 Seuss wrote:
Twisted Fate has very low base AD; at level 11 it's only 77. With Lich Bane, AP/Level Glyphs, masteries, and 2x Doran's you'll have ~150 AP, so your procs will do roughly twice as much damage. You also get movement speed (which is really critical to the Korean style of TF play), and once you get a NLR you're up to 230 AP.
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On September 07 2012 02:32 barbsq wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2012 02:25 StateAlchemist wrote:On September 07 2012 02:21 Frolossus wrote:
i thought that lich bane rush was considered horrible on every character always? why would you rather rush lich bane on TF or any other character before deathcap? TF likes the move speed buff, and since you're most likely playing him with ap/lvl yellow and blue you have some decent ap by the time you finish lich bane (scalling runes, masteries and 1-2 dorans or kage's if you want to go dfg later) You can go sheen, deathcap and lich bane, but i feel like lich bane 1st is ok. Its not like the ultimate op build, but its cost efficient i'd say. monte had a post about this awhile ago, imma see if i can dig it up, but TF's base dmg is low enough that lichbane first is actually just fine on him.
Yeah, as long as you have masteries/scaling runes.
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Meh, playing Taric (< me) Ez vs Janna Kog, already fed 3 kills. Even with MS quints, too much range, too much slows, that lane is "get in range, die" for me. x_x
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Lich also gives the MR for fighting in mid, which is a plus. I never honestly thought it was bad to rush it, but I'd probably go DC first if I was more focused on farming/poke.
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I mean I still like deathcap first for the same reason Reggie goes gp10, I feel like a good yellowcard>q is enough to gank I value instagibbing my lane really highly because even being at wraiths gives map pressure.
but like theres no reason to take my opinion over anyone elses, I just still like hat.
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i don't think there's any 1 way you have to build tf
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tf's base damage is a nonfactor if you are using your spells on rotation with significant AP.
i like lich bane rush as a first item only when TF is really ahead. i personally think that lich bane has the most awkward buildup of all the endgame AP items as it takes up a lot of slots (which if you're getting it as a 5/6 item as most builds do means that you won't be able to hold all of the parts and benefit from them) and the combine price is significant as well as having the 2nd highest cost of all the AP items overall.
you won't be getting that kind of gold lategame unless you get to splitpush for significant periods of time, your team is crushing teamfights, objectives, and towers (in which case you'll probably win regardless lol) or if you get to get the majority of farm from waveclearing when pushing as 5 and jungle minions etc. (the ad will probably need some regardless for lifesteal from poke etc., so this shouldn't always be the case).
as a first item, lich bane adds a small amount of damage onto your pick a cards. the utility from additional movespeed is the only real bonus that this item gives over other AP first item choices. this will only help if 1. you are so far ahead that rather than damage, additional utility and better buildup into other AP items will be unhindered, 2. if your goal is just to spam damage on towers with blue cards (which honestly usually implies 1. as you won't be splitpushing unless the enemy is grouped as 5 at a faraway tower or lane (unlikely this early, at least in solo queue), or if you can 1v1 any other hero on the other team, which usually again implies 1.). The problem with lich bane rush is that it usually leaves you unable to instaclear waves. the resultant buildup into DFG -> DCap or whatever you choose, however, is really nice if you can keep up your gank tempo while not falling behind in farm, as those pieces tend to be relatively easy and good to hold onto (gp5 from kages, big damage from NLR, etc.).
i think lich has the best buildup in most standard games as a 2nd item after dcap as you will be more likely to have slots to hold it as well as still gaining reliable farm at that stage of the game from lane and jungle farm due to your ability to instaclear and your big damage in ganks.
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well like that day we were watching westdoor spam tf, he literally went lich every game (actually I think that is the origin of Montie's post) and I'm fairly certain Ambition goes lich first also. So some really good players like it, I'm just giving my reason for not liking it, but obviously they have more experience and more accomplishments.
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I don't think what pro players do is the end-all be-all way to play. Like I said, DC gives clearing and poking power, LB gives utility and some burst (especially on towers). I can see both being very useful in different situations, or depending on playstyle. If you like to play poke games, push lane, and harass them under tower or farm enemy jungle with Red + Wild Cards, I can't fathomably see a reason to pick Lich over DC. Conversely, if you're ganking and you want to pop out, Gold go pow, and chase/run with the improved movespeed, Lich is the obvious choice for your playstyle.
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well it's not like dc first build hits like reggie build ganks (I mean I know you agree with me) but there seems to be this implication that dc gives you wet noodle ganks.
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Apparently Deman has to either quit eSports or quit his job. And this is what RiotMagus sent him: @qvDeman Let's talk. You're too good to walk away. RiotDeman maybe? I'd love that. Deman at every tournament!
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So Riot's talking about changing Twitch again (since no one's playing him) and a designer is throwing around some unfinished ideas.
I personally like him as he is minus not being able to cancel his stealthing for an instant Q steroid. Waiting 3 seconds while under fire is a real pain in the butt. All this talk about more drastic changes has me rolling my eyes and seems like the typical Riot rework train (though I've loved the eve changes).
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westdoor doesn't always rush lich. he goes dcap and dfg parts most games, sometimes stacks pen and abyssal (before the nerf). besides i think misaya is a better resource on TF, and his reasoning is similar to mine in the above post from a translation of a vod he released on youku that yango gave me.
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On September 07 2012 03:12 Zhiroo wrote:
Apparently Deman has to either quit eSports or quit his job. And this is what RiotMagus sent him: @qvDeman Let's talk. You're too good to walk away. RiotDeman maybe? I'd love that. Deman at every tournament!
Riot not happy with Deman castin doto2.
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apparently his "real job" is as a web developer, and Riot's website sucks balls so I see no problem here.
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EPT
