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Remember guys, this is the general discussion thread. Keep whine/QQ posts in the appropriate QQ memorial thread! Thanks! |
On April 11 2012 06:40 Mogwai wrote:
Yea, in jungle it's W>E>Q, in lane it's E>W>E.
You max E over W in lane? I find it pushes too hard and uses too much mana. I like W a lot more for the superior trading and better sustain. E is very hard to use offensively as well because of how slow the animation is.
Also, Naut is probably one of the most dangerous champs in the game at level 6. As can generally do half their half of guaranteed damage with them having no ability to respond.
auto, w to reset for another auto, e. they start running so you ult. Ult guarantee's a q which lets you hit another w powered auto and then e when it gets off cooldown. Throw in an ignite and it is huge burst.
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United States47024 Posts
On April 11 2012 06:45 Diks wrote:
I have a question :
- What are the advantages of a Maokai jungler ?
I've seen in IPL4 and other tourneys some Maokai in the jungle (specially from TheOddOne), but on all the game I witnessed, I saw poor ganks and a slow jungle clear time.
I'm not familiar with Maokai, so I would like to know your insight on why and when to go Maokai jungle. thanks
Maokai's jungle kit allows for some of the best early-level jungle ganks in the game. Poor ganks are largely an issue of execution rather than Maokai being bad at it.
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On April 11 2012 06:29 Mogwai wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2012 06:24 Chiharu Harukaze wrote:On April 11 2012 06:23 Sabin010 wrote:
What about Blitz? He has a great amount of peel. Slow in da jangles and can't go top lane without being wrecked by the popular guys. Even with W max and Madred your clear speed seems too slow. But if you can get away with it, sure. Blitz is pretty good top IMHO. He has a few rough matchups, but he also wins quite a few and is a god at supporting ganks. I'd honestly be recommending people to play it a lot if Nautilus wasn't pretty much stronger in every way top.
Any chance of you writing a guide for nautilus top?
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On April 11 2012 06:41 Xevious wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2012 06:34 Slayer91 wrote:
I'm playing jungle naut for the first time he seems super fast with good clears if you max W, dunno what you're supposed to max, prolly E. E probably clears faster overall but W has good aoe and you kind of have to max it to stay alive since your only sustain item will be philo stone. edit: beat me to it, derp..
E way slower. Two auto attacks from W is equivalent to the maximum possible damage from an equal rank of E. Realistically speaking you're A) not going to get the maximum E damage and B) you're going to get way more than two auto attacks out of W.
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T_D do you remember the dig vs clg games, the 2nd bo3 they did in losers bracket? CLG went double randuins. If you have an AD that can constantly reposition without losing AS, like doublelift, non-repositioning peels (such as slows), then the slow peels is just as effective as snares.
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It kinda sounds like TD is saying, if I have a team that kills you faster than you kill me, my carry is therefore protected. Probably an oversimplification but it seems thats the gist of the argument. Why snare when you can't do anything if you're dead.
Isn't how fast you can kill something directly related to positioning which is directly affected by peeling though?
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On April 11 2012 06:50 anmolsinghmzn2009 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2012 06:29 Mogwai wrote:On April 11 2012 06:24 Chiharu Harukaze wrote:On April 11 2012 06:23 Sabin010 wrote:
What about Blitz? He has a great amount of peel. Slow in da jangles and can't go top lane without being wrecked by the popular guys. Even with W max and Madred your clear speed seems too slow. But if you can get away with it, sure. Blitz is pretty good top IMHO. He has a few rough matchups, but he also wins quite a few and is a god at supporting ganks. I'd honestly be recommending people to play it a lot if Nautilus wasn't pretty much stronger in every way top. Any chance of you writing a guide for nautilus top?
it'll be a little while, my naut is still a work in progress.
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It's not really about peeling, it's about preventing an initiate and getting free damage on them, damage threats accomlish the role well in actual teamfights, but when you're trying to intiate someone who can constantly CC your tanks and then run off while they take poke damage is one the ways you win a teamfight when you're behind but not at a tower, since they lose so much just to start the teamfight.
In an actual fully engaged teamfights CCing bruisers is a lot lesse effective because their AP and AD carry are bigger threats, but in non-engaged situations that isn't the case, if the AD and AP carry are too far forward your CC and insta gib them, so they need someone else to get some spells off and a really tanky guy with CC can prevent that type of play well. If he's not tanky you just kill him when he keeps runninng melee to cc your guys.
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On April 11 2012 06:42 Two_DoWn wrote:
I mean, if peel was the be all and end all of teamfighting, amumu would still be a must pick, so would singed, and so would naut. And it isnt just because mummy and singed have weak early games: plenty of champs have weak early games but are still picked because of their power (ryze, vlad, ect). Its just because peel isnt important in teamfights.
i don't see mumu as a peeler at all. he only has 2 cc. one of them having like the highest cd in the game and the other having a medium cd. sure mumu can peel but i don't think he is particularly good at it. in my eyes amumu's purpose is to bandage to a tank or minion then ult their carrys so that your ken/vlad/rumble/wu can blow them up.
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I think peeling is overrated, by default it means you're either behind or misplaying team fights because you can't stop their carries from diving yours. The only cases where it would be more correct to peel than to dive their carries is if your AD is a lot stronger than theirs and you're still losing fights somehow.
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On April 11 2012 07:08 jadoth wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2012 06:42 Two_DoWn wrote:
I mean, if peel was the be all and end all of teamfighting, amumu would still be a must pick, so would singed, and so would naut. And it isnt just because mummy and singed have weak early games: plenty of champs have weak early games but are still picked because of their power (ryze, vlad, ect). Its just because peel isnt important in teamfights. i don't see mumu as a peeler at all. he only has 2 cc. one of them having like the highest cd in the game and the other having a medium cd. sure mumu can peel but i don't think he is particularly good at it. in my eyes amumu's purpose is to bandage to a tank or minion then ult their carrys so that your ken/vlad/rumble/wu can blow them up.
mumu's ulti is meant to ult everyone, not just carrys.
in mid game he just does massive aoe damage, due to his E and his W. in late game i feel he's just an ant-bruiser, due to %hp dmg, It really wittles down bruisers really hard.
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amumu gets raped too hard by the popular junglers today who counter really well and are stronger 1v1 and more mobile.
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Well I was talking specifically about teamfighting. not necessarily early game jungle phase.
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Edit: fuck it, I don't know what I'm talking about, I'm just distracting myself from things that need doing.
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On April 11 2012 06:47 petered wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2012 06:40 Mogwai wrote:
Yea, in jungle it's W>E>Q, in lane it's E>W>E. You max E over W in lane? I find it pushes too hard and uses too much mana. I like W a lot more for the superior trading and better sustain. E is very hard to use offensively as well because of how slow the animation is. Also, Naut is probably one of the most dangerous champs in the game at level 6. As can generally do half their half of guaranteed damage with them having no ability to respond. auto, w to reset for another auto, e. they start running so you ult. Ult guarantee's a q which lets you hit another w powered auto and then e when it gets off cooldown. Throw in an ignite and it is huge burst.
Mostly it's because of E's lower CD, but you make a pretty good point about the merits of W for trading. It's probably matchup dependent.
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Oh holy shit, Kerp on the 4PL Play4Fame stream with guardsmanbob commentary 
Too bad I didn't catch this earlier >_<
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On April 11 2012 06:45 Diks wrote:
I have a question :
- What are the advantages of a Maokai jungler ?
I've seen in IPL4 and other tourneys some Maokai in the jungle (specially from TheOddOne), but on all the game I witnessed, I saw poor ganks and a slow jungle clear time.
I'm not familiar with Maokai, so I would like to know your insight on why and when to go Maokai jungle. thanks
Teams in group C of the OGN tourney jungled maokai with a lot of success. The vods may give you the example you're looking for.
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On April 11 2012 07:24 Shikyo wrote:Oh holy shit, Kerp on the 4PL Play4Fame stream with guardsmanbob commentary Too bad I didn't catch this earlier >_<
Is that the same Kerp that used to play WoW in Last Resort?
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On April 11 2012 07:26 Shifft wrote:Show nested quote +On April 11 2012 07:24 Shikyo wrote:Oh holy shit, Kerp on the 4PL Play4Fame stream with guardsmanbob commentary Too bad I didn't catch this earlier >_< Is that the same Kerp that used to play WoW in Last Resort?
His actual nick is Ashee so probably not
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I only realized recently that naut's aoe dot applies the first tick every time you attack, which explains why I see wit's end on him and why it seems to work.
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EPT
