EPT[Patch 1.0.0.136: Lulu] General Discussion - Page 252
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Remember guys, this is the general discussion thread. Keep whine/QQ posts in the appropriate QQ memorial thread! Thanks! | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
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cLutZ
United States19573 Posts
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sob3k
United States7572 Posts
On April 11 2012 05:51 Two_DoWn wrote: Id actually argue that Naut and Mao are exactly who you DONT want to pick when you have to protect people. Both excel at rooting people who are out of position when your team is being aggressive. But they are both much weaker when you have to play defensively. I personally feel that if you have to protect/peel for people it is much better to pick high threat tanky dps who draw threat on their own because of their ability to completely kill a team if left alone. But if you run 4 squishies and Naut, sure he can lock one person down, but the rest are gonna run right by you. Maokai yes, he is for catching people. Nautilus fuck no are you crazy? Naut is the best peeler in the game, Maokai can only root one person, Naut gets a free snare on each person, a fucking MASSSIVE slow that slows literally the entire enemy team (on tiny CD), An ult that stuns for two seconds and can ALSO knock up the entire enemy team, and a Q that actually pulls divers back off of your carries and ministuns. Nautilus is fucking god of peel | ||
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JackDino
Gabon6219 Posts
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TheKefka
Croatia11752 Posts
On April 11 2012 06:06 sob3k wrote: Maokai yes, he is for catching people. Nautilus fuck no are you crazy? Naut is the best peeler in the game, Maokai can only root one person, Naut gets a free snare on each person, a fucking MASSSIVE slow that slows literally the entire enemy team (on tiny CD), An ult that stuns for two seconds and can ALSO knock up the entire enemy team, and a Q that actually pulls divers back off of your carries and ministuns. Nautilus is fucking god of peel waaaat,once you get your cdr items(shur and fh) on maokai you have your Q up almost every second and can pretty much perm slow anyone you need to peel off,not to mention that its a knockback in their face as well. Nauts slow is a aoe that's true but the area of maos Q is not too shabby either and it regularly hits more than one person if they are chasing your carry. Maoaki is definitely not just for catching people. | ||
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Juicyfruit
Canada5484 Posts
Peeling the enemy tank is great, but if you do it while in a position where the enemy team is just going to focus YOU, and the enemy tank is more innately beefy, then you'll lose. If your team can kite well then you win. | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
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Sabin010
United States1892 Posts
Edit: Been playing him in the Jungle with fast madred's and maxing w. | ||
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Chiharu Harukaze
12112 Posts
On April 11 2012 06:23 Sabin010 wrote: What about Blitz? He has a great amount of peel. Slow in da jangles and can't go top lane without being wrecked by the popular guys. Even with W max and Madred your clear speed seems too slow. But if you can get away with it, sure. | ||
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JackDino
Gabon6219 Posts
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
On April 11 2012 06:24 Chiharu Harukaze wrote: Slow in da jangles and can't go top lane without being wrecked by the popular guys. Even with W max and Madred your clear speed seems too slow. But if you can get away with it, sure. Blitz is pretty good top IMHO. He has a few rough matchups, but he also wins quite a few and is a god at supporting ganks. I'd honestly be recommending people to play it a lot if Nautilus wasn't pretty much stronger in every way top. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On April 11 2012 06:29 Mogwai wrote: Blitz is pretty good top IMHO. He has a few rough matchups, but he also wins quite a few and is a god at supporting ganks. I'd honestly be recommending people to play it a lot if Nautilus wasn't pretty much stronger in every way top. Do you often put Naut top? I only ever see him jungle with the odd mid AP Naut for silliness. | ||
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Sabin010
United States1892 Posts
On April 11 2012 06:24 Chiharu Harukaze wrote: Slow in da jangles and can't go top lane without being wrecked by the popular guys. Even with W max and Madred your clear speed seems too slow. But if you can get away with it, sure. It's not the fastest jungle early, but your ganks are fierce. If you come from behind a pushed bot lane with mobility boots and walk up and knock up, with red buff and w you stick pretty well, and if they flash you've got the hook unless they managed to get behind minions. At level 6 the clear speed gets faster because of the ultimate's passive. | ||
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Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On April 11 2012 06:34 Slayer91 wrote: I'm playing jungle naut for the first time he seems super fast with good clears if you max W, dunno what you're supposed to max, prolly E. R>W>E>Q when I do it. The shield is just too good imo. | ||
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Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
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Xevious
United States2086 Posts
On April 11 2012 06:34 Slayer91 wrote: I'm playing jungle naut for the first time he seems super fast with good clears if you max W, dunno what you're supposed to max, prolly E. E probably clears faster overall but W has good aoe and you kind of have to max it to stay alive since your only sustain item will be philo stone. edit: beat me to it, derp.. | ||
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Two_DoWn
United States13684 Posts
Slowing someone down for a second or two helps your ad carry a little bit, but it doesnt actually solve anything. The only time it WORKS is if your ad carry is so stupidly fed that they can kill the rusher in that brief time, otherwise they still are going to get rolled. I personally feel that damage threats are MUCH more effective forms of peel. I mean, look at an M5 comp. Are you really gonna ignore a GP, Ryze, Shyvana combo to get to the Kog, knowing full well that they dont even NEED him to ace your team? The whole goal of peel is to prevent damage from going on to your carries. The ultimate way to do that is to kill the enemy team so fast that they cant hurt anyone (highly unlikely, bordering on impossible, basically what double ap hopes to do). The step right below that is to create enough damage threats so that going for one is still going to result in your team winning the fight (M5 style) or to do what dignitas did and make it so that the enemy just cant kill anything. In my mind, the WORST form of peel is the one in which you are on the back foot and trying to hold off 2-3 enemy bruisers because it means that they have already determined that the sole thing they need to do is kill your carry to win the game. And while Naut does this job better than anyone, it is precisely this fact that MAKES him bad in my eyes. He excels in the worst possible scenario: the one in which the ONLY shot you have of winning is that your ad carry is so freaking fed that he will be able to kill everything in that brief window. If you actually look at protect comps in tournament games, they arent ever based around having a tremendous amount of peel, they are based around having enough damage threats to ensure that you CANT go for the ad carry, or that even if you GET to the ad carry, you cant kill him (oh and by the way, the trip in is probably gonna kill you). Like even digs lulu/soraka shenanigans wasnt based on peel: it was using sorakas absurd dot combined with the lulu/sora heals to ensure fights went on FOREVER. They wanted you in their faces. So ya. I just dont think peel is worth anything when used defensively. The only exception I have is repositioning (singed, voli) but thats just because it forces the enemy to be somewhere they dont want to be (and likely dead soon after). I mean, if peel was the be all and end all of teamfighting, amumu would still be a must pick, so would singed, and so would naut. And it isnt just because mummy and singed have weak early games: plenty of champs have weak early games but are still picked because of their power (ryze, vlad, ect). Its just because peel isnt important in teamfights. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On April 11 2012 06:40 Mogwai wrote: Yea, in jungle it's W>E>Q, in lane it's E>W>E. You actually never get Q in lane, bee tee dubs | ||
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Diks
Belgium1880 Posts
- What are the advantages of a Maokai jungler ? I've seen in IPL4 and other tourneys some Maokai in the jungle (specially from TheOddOne), but on all the game I witnessed, I saw poor ganks and a slow jungle clear time. I'm not familiar with Maokai, so I would like to know your insight on why and when to go Maokai jungle. thanks | ||
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