EPT[Patch 1.0.0.136: Lulu] General Discussion - Page 233
| Forum Index > LoL General |
Remember guys, this is the general discussion thread. Keep whine/QQ posts in the appropriate QQ memorial thread! Thanks! | ||
|
Bluebush
United States218 Posts
| ||
|
jadoth
694 Posts
On April 10 2012 04:00 Parnage wrote: The Tristana jump bug has gotten me killed a few times. It's still in game as far as I can remember. But it's only when making jumps near or over walls from my own experience. Centaur jungle I am thinking will be fairly strong but as always numbers and actually trying it out will be the deciding factor. it seems more like an intended feature then a bug to me. her jump seems to take into account the height of walls and her flight path and if the 2 intersect you jump in place. it happens most when you are right next to the thing you want to jump over. if you jump from a bit further away it will succeed. | ||
|
arnath
United States1317 Posts
| ||
|
Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On April 10 2012 04:06 Juicyfruit wrote: That IS pretty bad though. Even at the very end if you pop everything you end up with something like 500 movespeed for a couple of seconds and still only get 40 bonus AD out of it. Sure, the ignoring collision is always nice, and maybe he doesn't need his passive at all to be good, but it's still bad design imo when you could just make it interesting by making it 1% bonus MS = 1AD and not count the flat bonus AD stuff. That way boots will give you nothing, slow won't be taken into account, MS quints will always give you 4.5AD, trinity force will give you 12 extra AD, and ghost/youmuu/shurelya will give you a load of of AD for a brief period, making it actually viable to make him a speedster. Actually, it's probably not as bad as you think. With boots2 (as I still don't think Swifties will be too great for him, but maybe), a TF, MS quints and Swiftness talent, that's 455.468 MS (if I did diminishing returns right), with 135.468 being bonus, meaning baseline 33.867 extra damage. ~33 AD for a passive that also give you the nice ghost collision ignoring isn't bad for being free. Maybe not as good as other passives (fucking Poppy), but not horrid. Now, pop (talented) Ghost and Shurelya's on top of that, and you get ~670 (again, if I did diminishing returns right), so 350 bonus, so 87.5 AD burst style, which is nothing to scoff at. Also not taking into account things like Initiator if above 70%, Janna passive, GP E, and Hecarim's E MS boost thing. His passive won't make him OP or anything, but it is a nice chunk of free damage if you build him speedy. On top of that, his low CD AoE Q and sustain W will make him a good jungler right off the bat (as long as mana isn't too big of a problem), and his E seems great for ganks. | ||
|
Slusher
United States19143 Posts
| ||
|
UniversalSnip
9871 Posts
| ||
|
Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On April 10 2012 04:45 Bluebush wrote: Has anyone tried support Naut? It's been super-fun playing kill lanes with Naut/Corki and Naut/Trist in normal games. Kinda scared to try it in ranked but it seems viable as an alternative to Leona. Only once or twice, but it was pretty funny. You basically get to force a flash whenever you feel like it if you can land Q's consistently. Especially nice I found with Cait, since you can make it so they never reach her, period. | ||
|
JackDino
Gabon6219 Posts
On April 10 2012 04:45 Bluebush wrote: Has anyone tried support Naut? It's been super-fun playing kill lanes with Naut/Corki and Naut/Trist in normal games. Kinda scared to try it in ranked but it seems viable as an alternative to Leona. Nautilus blitz is some of the most annoying shit ever, even worse than blitzstar. | ||
|
jadoth
694 Posts
On April 10 2012 04:52 UniversalSnip wrote: There's no vertical axis in this game, knockups and jumps are just cosmetically different stuns and dashes, except for a very small window of time in which a stun can be cleansed but a knockup can't. but even then knockups are something like 100% stun and 20% knockup, overlapping, so you pretty much can cleanse a knockup. I'm pretty sure you can't jump over a wall and collide with the top edge, lol. i know it seems weird and no other jump works like it but all my experience with successful and failed trist jumps point towards it having a vertical component. ziqq's q has a vertical compont, but that came way after trist so idk. even if that is not how the code works by thinking about it like that you can predict witch jumps will fail and witch won't with good accuracy. | ||
|
Frolossus
United States4779 Posts
On April 10 2012 05:11 jadoth wrote: i know it seems weird and no other jump works like it but all my experience with successful and failed trist jumps point towards it having a vertical component. ziqq's q has a vertical compont, but that came way after trist so idk. even if that is not how the code works by thinking about it like that you can predict witch jumps will fail and witch won't with good accuracy. how does ziggs Q have a vertical component? its just an animation Q is the spell that bounces right? | ||
|
Parnage
United States7414 Posts
I'll have to play trist abit later on today and try differing jumps but I seem to remember having it happen on long and short jumps not relative to my distance from the wall I am trying to go over. Then again half the time when I am using a jump like that it's quite hectic so I could be wrong. And from what I remember seeing a yordle can be missed with Q due to his height. Ala A bouncing bomb of ziggs going over the head of a yordle and not hitting him. | ||
|
iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
I know that Movespeed has a soft cap, but for the sake of "bonus movespeed" does all movepseed above the cap count towards Hecarim's damage, or is his bonus removed with the same diminishing returns as move speed in general? I could see getting my movespeed up to something ridiculous without the softcap like 1000... and with 25% of bonus movespeed turning into damage that is a solid 200~ AD easy. But, if it is restricted by the soft cap then I can't see him getting more than 50~ AD out of his passive, which realistically is pretty damn strong for free stats I guess. | ||
|
Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On April 10 2012 05:23 iCanada wrote: I've decided that Shureyla's should be core on Hec. Thats Ryze style build tanky get damages. You get a Ghostblade and I could see you just doing a ton of damage. Probably also legitimate to run Ghost/Flash, because I could see the bonus move speed giving you more damage than ignite, depending on how Movespeed caps work... I know that Movespeed has a soft cap, but for the sake of "bonus movespeed" does all movepseed above the cap count towards Hecarim's damage, or is his bonus removed with the same diminishing returns as move speed in general? I could see getting my movespeed up to something ridiculous without the softcap like 1000... and with 25% of bonus movespeed turning into damage that is a solid 200~ AD easy. But, if it is restricted by the soft cap then I can't see him getting more than 50~ AD out of his passive, which realistically is pretty damn strong for free stats I guess. MS "caps" work like this: any raw MS (that's base + bonus) between 415 and 490 only gives you 80% of it's value. Any MS above 490 only gives you 50% of it's value. Therefore, 415 is the "soft cap" and 490 is the "hard cap", though it's not really a hard cap as it's still giving you stats, it's more like a "super soft cap". Yes, if you do something silly like Swift Boots, PD, TF, Shurelya, Ghostblade, FoN, Ghost, and hit his E, you could probably max out pretty fucking high, but that's not entirely practical. | ||
|
sob3k
United States7572 Posts
On April 10 2012 04:45 Bluebush wrote: Has anyone tried support Naut? It's been super-fun playing kill lanes with Naut/Corki and Naut/Trist in normal games. Kinda scared to try it in ranked but it seems viable as an alternative to Leona. I have, but there is basically no reason to run him over Blitz or Leona, they are both better with low farm and have better disables for laning. Naut's advantage over them is his fat AOE deeps and better AOE CC, which is worth much less than singe target in lane, and playing him low farm makes him too squishy in teamfights where he really needs to be in the center of everything to do his job. | ||
|
sob3k
United States7572 Posts
On April 10 2012 05:13 Frolossus wrote: how does ziggs Q have a vertical component? its just an animation Q is the spell that bounces right? It can go over people or hit them based on the bombs hight, also the satchel charge can get him over walls or bounce off of them based on ziggs's hieght in the air. | ||
|
overt
United States9006 Posts
On April 10 2012 04:50 Slusher wrote: Voyboy got destroyed in lane as Lulu it was only because of their teamfighting, don't think Lulu top will be anything to worry about in solo que. Soraka mid explosion however is going to be -.- Soraka mid has existed forever. I doubt it'll gain much popularity. You might see it a bunch for like a week or so but most people who go AP mid would rather run shit where they get kills and burst people down. Soraka doesn't do that. She's really strong mid but she wins mid through attrition not in a single action-pack burst of a fight. Most people don't like playing like that. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On April 10 2012 04:06 Juicyfruit wrote: That IS pretty bad though. Even at the very end if you pop everything you end up with something like 500 movespeed for a couple of seconds and still only get 40 bonus AD out of it. Sure, the ignoring collision is always nice, and maybe he doesn't need his passive at all to be good, but it's still bad design imo when you could just make it interesting by making it 1% bonus MS = 1AD and not count the flat bonus AD stuff. That way boots will give you nothing, slow won't be taken into account, MS quints will always give you 4.5AD, trinity force will give you 12 extra AD, and ghost/youmuu/shurelya will give you a load of of AD for a brief period, making it actually viable to make him a speedster. Dude, it's his passive. Not all passives are 100% central to how a champion functions. A lot of them are just icing on the cake. You're treating this like it has to be as strong as a regular skill, when getting between 5 and 40 bonus AD is a perfectly reasonable bonus to get from a passive. IMO the point is that the passive is supposed to encourage you to get an extra kick out of +MS items that were already going to be good on him (e.g. Triforce), not to make you stack +MS items. The latter is fun for one game, but is actually awkward for gameplay in the long haul. | ||
|
Mogwai
United States13274 Posts
Anyway, you're being silly if you don't think it'll surge in popularity after it was used so much in a top level tourney. | ||
|
gtrsrs
United States9109 Posts
| ||
|
iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On April 10 2012 05:29 Requizen wrote: MS "caps" work like this: any raw MS (that's base + bonus) between 415 and 490 only gives you 80% of it's value. Any MS above 490 only gives you 50% of it's value. Therefore, 415 is the "soft cap" and 490 is the "hard cap", though it's not really a hard cap as it's still giving you stats, it's more like a "super soft cap". Yes, if you do something silly like Swift Boots, PD, TF, Shurelya, Ghostblade, FoN, Ghost, and hit his E, you could probably max out pretty fucking high, but that's not entirely practical. Yeah, thats what it was thought it was, was thinking that going balls deep into MS probably not that worth it, and realistically you'd probably get more AD out of just building AD items. If he clears the jungle with a decent speed I could see grabbing both Shurelya's and Ghostblade though. I like GP10's, and if both of them turn into items that I'd really like to build anyway.... Shurelya's definitely a solid item for him though. I don't think Swifties worth it, rather just get Mercs. 35 Tenacity, and 25 MR is way better than like 20 Movespeed and 5 AD. | ||
| ||
