EPTBasically the mistakes you can make with ryze have a low level of interactivity. There are plenty of them, he requires skill, but they don't have a lot to do with your opponent.
[Patch 1.0.0.131: Ahri] General Discussion - Page 99
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Want to rage about your latest loss? Use the QQ thread. If you whine in GD, you'll get warned. ===== + Show Spoiler + If your [Stream] thread was moved to the general TL Stream subforum (aka SC stream land), find your thread and PM it to me and I'll move it back to LoL territory. I can argue with staff that moving a non-SC thread into a SC subforum is just asking for that thread to get buried. - Neo, Dec. 15 2011, 6:33 KST I have admin approval. I'll be moving LoL streams back to the subforum. Stream name will be based on Summoner name. - Neo 7:07 KST | ||
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UniversalSnip
9871 Posts
Basically the mistakes you can make with ryze have a low level of interactivity. There are plenty of them, he requires skill, but they don't have a lot to do with your opponent. | ||
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Aukai
United States1183 Posts
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
On December 19 2011 09:30 STS17 wrote: You're right, they force you to play passively and farm and avoid fighting while at a disadvantage. While someone who opts not to get them and instead get more immediately cost-efficient items can take advantage of that by forcing you into a fight while you're at a disadvantage. In essence they promote the opposite of what soto/mejai's promotes you to do. Believe it or not some teams want to be aggressive Except the other difference is that the cost-inefficiency of gold items are much less than the cost-inefficiency of stack items. Philo is cost efficient as soon as you buy it. HoG is cost inefficient, but not by much and it's very cheap. No one ever buys Avarice or Kage's unless you're a support, in which case the inefficiency isn't an issue or if you're planning on build it into Ghostblade or DFG, which case you're not sitting on Avarice or Kage's for very long at all. SotO and Mejais are inefficient by a pretty large margin and they're both pretty fucking expensive. The upgrade cost of SotO and Mejais are 800~1k while upgrade cost of HoG is 350. | ||
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Aukai
United States1183 Posts
Anyway arguing against GP10s doesn't prove Soto/Mejai is good. This is like arguing for the sake of arguing. | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
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Abenson
Canada4122 Posts
On December 19 2011 09:38 Ryuu314 wrote: Also, I really really don't like Colby+Dyrus commentary because they're both boring as fuck to listen to and make me fall asleep zzzz Oddone's commentary is great tho, you can listen to that! | ||
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Aukai
United States1183 Posts
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tobi9999
United States1966 Posts
who the hell am I to tell you what to do go for mejais everygame, obviously it's good because you say it is. when you hit rank 1, i'll pay you lessons on how to build snowball items. | ||
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BlackMagister
United States5834 Posts
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
On December 19 2011 09:40 Abenson wrote: Oddone's commentary is great tho, you can listen to that! Yah his commentary is nice, but the background noise is terrible. So loud D: | ||
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STS17
United States1817 Posts
On December 19 2011 09:24 TheYango wrote: I'm getting trolled hard, but as with the BT and Warmog's examples, you're ignoring the crucial difference between having to get stacks from champ kills and from being able to get them off minions/free gold. Having snowball/stack items makes you worse immediately in fights. However, with stacks that can be recovered through farming/stalling, you can pull ahead by avoiding fights. Do you not see how silly it is to have items that immediately make you worse at fighting, but REQUIRE you to fight to catch up? You can play around the immediate disadvantage of BT/Mog's/RoA/Gp10 items by stalling/farming. You can't similarly play around the disadvantage of snowball items. I'm not trying to troll you (or anyone here). It is not impossible to play around the disadvantages of snowball items (i.e. buying one then immediately forcing a fight such as at dragon where your opponents mid/bottom still have their gold sitting in the bank and haven't spent it so you are basically in the same situation gold-disadvantage wise but kills/assists you earn in the fight recoup the cost of the item in addition to giving you the gold) but it is much harder to do than playing around the disadvantage of something like a g/10 item. I know you (you as a forum) think I'm just trolling you all with this but if you wanted to you could have completely ignored the topic and let it die but instead you choose to entertain the debate, despite thinking you were falling for "troll-bait". It is something I have played around with and have had success with which is why I wanted to open it up for discussion, and I thank all of you for participating in it ^^ | ||
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BloodNinja
United States2791 Posts
On December 19 2011 09:43 BlackMagister wrote: Does support GP beat support Yorick beacuse GP can feed off the ghouls with parlay. In this game at least support Yorick is helping bully other team out of lane. I didnt think ghouls gave gold. Did that change recently? | ||
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Craton
United States17234 Posts
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arb
Noobville17920 Posts
On December 19 2011 09:46 BloodNinja wrote: I didnt think ghouls gave gold. Did that change recently? gp gets the bonus gold from parrrley but they dont give gold | ||
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Psyonic_Reaver
United States4330 Posts
On December 19 2011 09:41 tobi9999 wrote: no point in arguing. who the hell am I to tell you what to do go for mejais everygame, obviously it's good because you say it is. when you hit rank 1, i'll pay you lessons on how to build snowball items. You're kind of a dick to some of the better players in this forum and you're arguing because you think everybody is telling you you're wrong instead of looking at is as another opinion. Either take the advice or ask better questions. Don't act like a child. Get out of this forum if you're going to act like this. | ||
TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On December 19 2011 09:45 STS17 wrote: I'm not trying to troll you (or anyone here). It is not impossible to play around the disadvantages of snowball items (i.e. buying one then immediately forcing a fight such as at dragon where your opponents mid/bottom still have their gold sitting in the bank and haven't spent it so you are basically in the same situation gold-disadvantage wise but kills/assists you earn in the fight recoup the cost of the item in addition to giving you the gold) but it is much harder to do than playing around the disadvantage of something like a g/10 item. If that situation ever arose, I would just give up the Dragon, and continue farming. Even if you take a free Dragon, it still doesn't recoup the gold value deficit of buying SotO/Mejai's. That's how far behind the curve SotO and Mejai's are as items. | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
On December 19 2011 09:45 STS17 wrote: I'm not trying to troll you (or anyone here). It is not impossible to play around the disadvantages of snowball items (i.e. buying one then immediately forcing a fight such as at dragon where your opponents mid/bottom still have their gold sitting in the bank and haven't spent it so you are basically in the same situation gold-disadvantage wise but kills/assists you earn in the fight recoup the cost of the item in addition to giving you the gold) but it is much harder to do than playing around the disadvantage of something like a g/10 item. I know you (you as a forum) think I'm just trolling you all with this but if you wanted to you could have completely ignored the topic and let it die but instead you choose to entertain the debate, despite thinking you were falling for "troll-bait". It is something I have played around with and have had success with which is why I wanted to open it up for discussion, and I thank all of you for participating in it ^^ I mean, the premise is okay. Buy potentially high power items to give yourself Teemo's global taunt on a tank. But the problem is that stack items are just so darn inefficient for so long and are so unreliable that it's just not a good idea for most situations. The comparison to gold items is flawed because gold items aren't nearly as inefficient (philo isn't inefficient at all) and the disadvantage of getting them are much much smaller. They also have a back-up option and build into something, whereas if you have no stacks on your stack items it's 1k+ of worthless crap that you can't do anything with but sell it. EDIT: TOO is so funny. He hates amumu and dat skin so hard lololol | ||
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NotSorry
United States6722 Posts
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arb
Noobville17920 Posts
On December 19 2011 09:54 NotSorry wrote: Do more pros use smart cast or not? probably down to preference ive seen a few click and a few use smart cast though | ||
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Ryuu314
United States12679 Posts
On December 19 2011 09:55 arb wrote: probably down to preference ive seen a few click and a few use smart cast though from what I've seen on streams, they generally use smartcast except for more "valuable" spells like ultis and stuff. | ||
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