EPTMalz is also really really good @ gibbing enemy initiators and making it a 5v4 right away.
[Patch 1.0.0.131: Ahri] General Discussion - Page 164
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Want to rage about your latest loss? Use the QQ thread. If you whine in GD, you'll get warned. ===== + Show Spoiler + If your [Stream] thread was moved to the general TL Stream subforum (aka SC stream land), find your thread and PM it to me and I'll move it back to LoL territory. I can argue with staff that moving a non-SC thread into a SC subforum is just asking for that thread to get buried. - Neo, Dec. 15 2011, 6:33 KST I have admin approval. I'll be moving LoL streams back to the subforum. Stream name will be based on Summoner name. - Neo 7:07 KST | ||
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JackDino
Gabon6219 Posts
Malz is also really really good @ gibbing enemy initiators and making it a 5v4 right away. | ||
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tobi9999
United States1966 Posts
On December 24 2011 06:50 Inschato wrote: Least mobile? Haven't you ever seen his dance? Can't touch this. Also, he doesn't even walk, he glides. Magus doesn't have anything on Malzahar. DUDE GLIDING < TELEPORTING HAVE YOU SEEN THAT TWISTED FATE?????? fawking OP and like, KAssadin, wtf is that???? flash on <10 second CD?? EDIT: Also, Jack Dino you can't interrupt Sion's boots 5 when he has his shield up, Malzahar? no shield  . But I guess if you want to be mobile on Malzahar build boots 5, maybe it can work. Plus Sion has doesn't have to ult to kill people, just his Q W does more than malz's entire combo before level 11 lol. actually now I'm not sure if Sion's boots 5 can be broken or not if he's in shield o_O. Either way, Sion can leave lane since he has an escape with his stun, Malz can't unless everything is warded, or he risks either wasting time or dying, since his ult isn't even an escape. Sion can leave any time, Malz can only leave and be effective when he has ult. | ||
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Hidden_MotiveS
Canada2562 Posts
On December 24 2011 06:53 JackDino wrote: I don't understand how people can say champ x isn't mobile and then say sion is a mobile champ, sion isn't a fucking mobile champ either. Buy boots5 on malz, gz, now malz is mobile. Only time he stands still is when he ults, malz still outputs a shitton of dmg otherwise. Malz is also really really good @ gibbing enemy initiators and making it a 5v4 right away. Need a mobile character? Why not malzahar? | ||
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NotSorry
United States6722 Posts
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JackDino
Gabon6219 Posts
On December 24 2011 07:05 tobi9999 wrote: DUDE GLIDING < TELEPORTING HAVE YOU SEEN THAT TWISTED FATE?????? fawking OP and like, KAssadin, wtf is that???? flash on <10 second CD?? EDIT: Also, Jack Dino you can't interrupt Sion's boots 5 when he has his shield up, Malzahar? no shield . But I guess if you want to be mobile on Malzahar build boots 5, maybe it can work. Plus Sion has doesn't have to ult to kill people, just his Q W does more than malz's entire combo before level 11 lol. actually now I'm not sure if Sion's boots 5 can be broken or not if he's in shield o_O. Either way, Sion can leave lane since he has an escape with his stun, Malz can't unless everything is warded, or he risks either wasting time or dying, since his ult isn't even an escape. Sion can leave any time, Malz can only leave and be effective when he has ult. Sion shield doesn't stop him from being put in combat.+ Show Spoiler + V1.0.0.120: Will now mark you in combat for receiving/dealing any damage, even if it is absorbed by shield If sion can leave lane because he has an escape with his stun malz can leave lane and kill you because it'll be a 1v1. Malz doesn't need to leave mid tho if he gets a kill(only time you dont have a stun up), he pushes so fast he can push like 2 waves into your turret. | ||
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Inschato
Canada1349 Posts
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tobi9999
United States1966 Posts
On December 24 2011 06:53 JackDino wrote: I don't understand how people can say champ x isn't mobile and then say sion is a mobile champ, sion isn't a fucking mobile champ either. Buy boots5 on malz, gz, now malz is mobile. Only time he stands still is when he ults, malz still outputs a shitton of dmg otherwise. Malz is also really really good @ gibbing enemy initiators and making it a 5v4 right away. Um, even if you gib the enemy initiator, you'll still lose the teamfight if their AP carry can do even more with their ultimate like Morgana or Kennen. I'd much rather have Gragas who can push the team away, cassiopeia who has godlike anti initiation, etcetc Also, gib enemy initiator isn't important, if their enemy AP carry can gib your AD carry, like Kassadin/LeBlanc/Sion/Etc. And also, DFG can basically do his job, if that's what you're saying that is what he's for. | ||
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overt
United States9006 Posts
Like, when I see a good Malzahar play he only uses his ult to gank or at the end of a team fight. So if you pick Malz you kind of have to build around having an AP carry that can't initiate or counter-initiate. | ||
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Requizen
United States33802 Posts
On December 24 2011 06:53 JackDino wrote: I don't understand how people can say champ x isn't mobile and then say sion is a mobile champ, sion isn't a fucking mobile champ either. Buy boots5 on malz, gz, now malz is mobile. Only time he stands still is when he ults, malz still outputs a shitton of dmg otherwise. Malz is also really really good @ gibbing enemy initiators and making it a 5v4 right away. Eh, for Sion, it also has to do with his mobility relative to his opponent. You feel really mobile when you have an instant, ranged stun. He also has a higher base MS than Malz, though not by much, admittedly, but it's there. Sion's on the higher end of MS, while Malz is middling. For Malz to use his CC, he has to stop. Sion can act as a hit and runner, which is why he's perceived as more mobile. That's how I see it. | ||
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tobi9999
United States1966 Posts
On December 24 2011 07:14 JackDino wrote: Sion shield doesn't stop him from being put in combat.+ Show Spoiler + V1.0.0.120: Will now mark you in combat for receiving/dealing any damage, even if it is absorbed by shield If sion can leave lane because he has an escape with his stun malz can leave lane and kill you because it'll be a 1v1. Malz doesn't need to leave mid tho if he gets a kill(only time you dont have a stun up), he pushes so fast he can push like 2 waves into your turret. Yea, I thought so about Sion shield. but either way... I highly doubt that Malzahar can beat a full health jungler 1v1, especially if said jungler has red buff. You can test Malzahar vs udyr,ww,skarner,rammus,shaco, etc. Malzahar will get flat out wrecked since his ult + pool + e will only take them to half, where he will then get killed by auto attacks. EVERY SINGLE AP CARRY EXCEPT MALZ can actually kite junglers through stuns and slows. Malz has to blow everything and pray to god for a kill. The only instance where Malz can roam is where he has boots 2 and the jungler doesn't (actually surprisingly common, but not common enough for him to outgank other APs most of the time unfortunately) EDIT: @ Overt, Malzahar is very strong still, it's just that as I said before, if you put him against Sion/TF / Kassadin you will just lose because they will go around ganking people while you have to push lane like a good boy, and you will die to junglers anyways. Also, he doens't have enough benefits over other AP carries to be considered that much, his damage is matched, his range isn't anything special, his tank killing abilities are matched by DFG....., his carry killing abilities are countered by QSS. The problem is that in all regards he is just equal or lesser to other AP carries, and does not excel or stand out in any area. | ||
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Cloud9157
United States2968 Posts
Seriously, if I knew I was going mid vs Malz, I would honestly go Galio mid and just force a farm fest. | ||
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Offhand
United States1869 Posts
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Cloud9157
United States2968 Posts
On December 24 2011 07:36 Offhand wrote: I might be a patch behind on this but flash is garbage now, yes? It seems flash's only purpose is to make sure I die minus a cooldown now. Its still decent enough to escape, but it definitely is not what it used to be. Mids that can stop a jungler/have a built in Ghost or Flash become a lot stronger because of the Flash nerf. I still use Flash to initiate a fight (mainly with Galio and Kennen, Flash>Ult gg), | ||
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tobi9999
United States1966 Posts
On December 24 2011 07:35 Cloud9157 wrote: I fucking hate Malzahar. I hit a complete mental block in my play whenever I face one. Been shit on as Kassadin, Swain, and Kennen. Seriously, if I knew I was going mid vs Malz, I would honestly go Galio mid and just force a farm fest. As Kassadin, learn to last hit at tower bro, if you are good at that you should just shit on him later As for Swain, I don't play him ;(, but from looking at his kit, Malzahar is amazing at countering him, since he has to be in melee range to rape people, where he will get malz ulted and die haha. Get QSS really fast, and hope for the best. Kennen, just farm and you will be so so much more useful in teamfights. Just ult before you flash in because, if he ults you, your ult will stun him and cancel it lol. If you're going against Malzahar, you can go leblanc and just laugh at him be completely worthless in lane, since he has to tower hug or die basically. Anything that can wave clear is also decent against him. | ||
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Offhand
United States1869 Posts
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NotSorry
United States6722 Posts
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zer0das
United States8519 Posts
Malz is great because you get a massive amount of farm very easily, and then start bullying the crap out of people with your nutso damage. He also punishes people for positioning like crap. His damage is all DOT though (except his q, but that takes a second to take effect too). | ||
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tobi9999
United States1966 Posts
On December 24 2011 07:54 zer0das wrote: Malz crushes Sion, because he can push way the hell harder than Sion, so Sion can't leave the lane unless he wants to lose his turret. It's not like Sion is insanely better than Malz at roaming either, other than Malz is highly ult dependent. Also I hear there's this item called Ryali's that's pretty good for slowing people down, especially if you have a a single target ability like e? Malz is great because you get a massive amount of farm very easily, and then start bullying the crap out of people with your nutso damage. He also punishes people for positioning like crap. His damage is all DOT though (except his q, but that takes a second to take effect too) Sion hard counters Malzahar in lane. I've played the matchup at least 5 times Sion vs Malzahar and at least 10 times Malzahar vs Sion I've never lost as Sion, and at best went even vs Sion. How can you push the wave harder than Sion when he clears it in 1 shield -_-, or 1 shield and 3 auto attacks pre 6. Malzahar has to relentlessly push or roam, and Sion will just kill him if he strays too far away from tower. I think the only success I had as malzahar was when I got 4min blue buff and just spammed spells. @ Udyr question, armor and scaling hp have been my favorite options since nimbleness was removed. | ||
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
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Cloud9157
United States2968 Posts
On December 24 2011 08:23 Alaric wrote: Swain can't push to save his life, Sion, Morgana, and other pushers like Malzahar shit on him because of this. I agree with all of them except Sion. They can all push a lane, but Swain can definitely take Sion on in a fight. Sion shouldn't be able to burst Swain down simply because Swain will slow him before Sion can even get close enough to burst him. Sion will stun but shouldn't be able to reach him in time. Plus Swain has complete sustain, something Sion can't deal with too well. | ||
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