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Want to rage about your latest loss? Use the QQ thread. If you whine in GD, you'll get warned. |
On December 02 2011 06:17 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2011 06:04 shinarit wrote:
Towers are good to be strong. It hurts snowballing, and snowballing is bad, makes comebacks less likely.
On a loosely related note, just watched a DotA2 game (HD's, but it doesnt matter), and man that courier was a bad idea. The fact that you can stay in lane for any amount of time (courier + much better hp regens) makes it very easy to snowball, because in LoL even if you force your opponent to go home, you will have to go home sooner or later too, and thats not the case in DotA. Combine it with the weak towers and damaging under tower become much more dangerous, so forcing someone home is more easier.
More snowball, worse game. It's sort of funny how people complain that DotA is too snowbally and that comebacks aren't possible, when I've basically never seen a tournament LoL game where the losing team comes back from having 2 inhibs down (where I think think of quite a few such competitive DotA games).
1. You didnt lurk enough, i saw some. Yes, competitive. I think at the season1 championship?
2. The fact that matches stretch out without an absolute winner longer makes it obvious, there are continuous comebacks through the game. One team gets an advantage, the other gets it back etc. Its on pro level, where mistakes are small.
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On December 02 2011 06:20 JackDino wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2011 06:18 shinarit wrote:On December 02 2011 06:07 Craton wrote:
How about you actually try pressuring the person trying to last hit under the tower instead of trying to convolute the mechanics? It's 100% your own fault if you're sitting their twiddling your thumbs doing nothing while they're last-hitting under the tower. Even if you're one of the handful of champs who can't do much, a lane pushed to tower is open season to go gank somewhere else or back without missing anything. If the person can be pressured out easily from under his tower that towers are too weak. Ofc if you can reach him with skills and not get hit by tower than you should do that, but than he positioned himself badly, or you are ranged and he is melee, which is not too common (maybe Kass mid is like this). Any midlane can get harass on someone trying to cs caster minions under turret without taking damage from turret. Making turrets stronger also makes pushing the wave bot weaker(push lane, plow down turret).
None said make turrets STRONGER. I said they are good as they are now.
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Yay, EUW utterly dead again.
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On December 02 2011 05:25 NotSorry wrote:
What are your guys thoughts on weakening tower damage to promote more lane aggression in the earlier stages of the game?
I think towers should do a bit less damage. Not dota levels though
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On December 02 2011 06:22 shinarit wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2011 06:20 JackDino wrote:On December 02 2011 06:18 shinarit wrote:On December 02 2011 06:07 Craton wrote:
How about you actually try pressuring the person trying to last hit under the tower instead of trying to convolute the mechanics? It's 100% your own fault if you're sitting their twiddling your thumbs doing nothing while they're last-hitting under the tower. Even if you're one of the handful of champs who can't do much, a lane pushed to tower is open season to go gank somewhere else or back without missing anything. If the person can be pressured out easily from under his tower that towers are too weak. Ofc if you can reach him with skills and not get hit by tower than you should do that, but than he positioned himself badly, or you are ranged and he is melee, which is not too common (maybe Kass mid is like this). Any midlane can get harass on someone trying to cs caster minions under turret without taking damage from turret. Making turrets stronger also makes pushing the wave bot weaker(push lane, plow down turret). None said make turrets STRONGER. I said they are good as they are now.
Atleast 2 people said turrets should be stronger(hit harder) to make csing under turret harder.
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On December 02 2011 06:23 Alaric wrote:
Yay, EUW utterly dead again.
Right on schedule.
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On December 02 2011 06:14 JackDino wrote:
Try to login EUWest, queue goes from 3 mins, reaches 30seconds, jumps to 2:xx minutes, jumps to 7 minutes, jumps to 12 minutes, jumps to 14, 22, 25. Riot is good at counting down.
the truth comes out
riot is secretly microsoft
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On December 02 2011 06:17 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2011 06:04 shinarit wrote:
Towers are good to be strong. It hurts snowballing, and snowballing is bad, makes comebacks less likely.
On a loosely related note, just watched a DotA2 game (HD's, but it doesnt matter), and man that courier was a bad idea. The fact that you can stay in lane for any amount of time (courier + much better hp regens) makes it very easy to snowball, because in LoL even if you force your opponent to go home, you will have to go home sooner or later too, and thats not the case in DotA. Combine it with the weak towers and damaging under tower become much more dangerous, so forcing someone home is more easier.
More snowball, worse game. It's sort of funny how people complain that DotA is too snowbally and that comebacks aren't possible, when I've basically never seen a tournament LoL game where the losing team comes back from having 2 inhibs down (certainly not since the change to minions that made them push much stronger), where I think think of quite a few such competitive DotA games.
I agree... just look at how long the international games were (I know that's not quite the same as dota but it's close enough), and how long the losing teams were in it, or ended up winning. Actually it's not even really disputable, dota has less snowballing at the top level. Don't have to know anything about the game to see that.
On December 02 2011 06:16 Craton wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2011 06:12 UniversalSnip wrote:
which if the drift of the thread is correct would make things more passive Based on what? That the junglers learned how to gank heavily warded bot lanes? That TP started being used more to force objective fights and sidelane ganks?
I don't know, ask yango. Didn't say that was my opinion.
On December 02 2011 06:15 Two_DoWn wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2011 06:12 UniversalSnip wrote:On December 02 2011 05:56 TheYango wrote:On December 02 2011 05:50 UniversalSnip wrote:On December 02 2011 05:38 TheYango wrote:On December 02 2011 05:34 UniversalSnip wrote:
Don't agree, you can make it so that at lower levels the more aggressive player will kill the other one and at higher levels the more aggressive player will constantly send the other one back, THEN start killing him once he's been badly weakened. Either way you get kills, just at a higher level it would take longer because you'd have to cripple your opponent with repeated bluepills. Same result though. And how do you propose doing that without just straight-up increasing the early game damage output that champs can do to each other--which is probably even MORE out of the question from Riot? Same way they've been doing it, reduce the penalties and increase the rewards for hitting people. That's the idea of the creep damage nerf, healing nerfs, potion nerfs, etc. it's still not there but when I started playing a year ago the game was noticeably more passive, especially if you go back and watch tournament games, holy shit they're so boring. Were we watching the same game? The one where US teams were all playing 1-1-1 + roamer + jungle, and people actually died early game because of level 1 Alistar shenanigans, or because of 3v1 ganks? The one where we'd have 3v3/4v4 teamfights at level 5 because every jungler became dragon-capable at level 4? actually looking at the dates it was about a year and a half ago, there wasn't a roamer and alistar didn't see any play at all, for whatever reason. Not long after that people figured out doran's stacking and then NOTHING happened until dragon fight. On December 02 2011 05:52 Craton wrote:
It's almost like people have improved since the beginning of the tournament scene. . . which if the drift of the thread is correct would make things more passive The problem with that conclusion is that junglers were getting better as well, and they are the only factor in laning that actually bring unpredictability and ganks. Now RIOT just reset all of that. Im not saying that it cant get back to that point in the future, but its going to SUCK to watch pro matches until junglers are strong again.
We'll see!
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Well my queue started at 9 minutes, nothing too fancy since they had some issues. Jumps to 35 minutes. Then to 45. In the end I had a 2h30 queue. Played a game, had one of the team crash (we'd have lost either way). Crash when someone invite for a second game. See server totally off.
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Riot loves me. Hearing you guys cry about the servers makes me happy I get my 1-day ban today :D.
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Doesn't matter,abusing lvl 5s with 200 ping on NA is just as entertaining as solo que.
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On December 02 2011 06:33 TheKefka wrote:
Doesn't matter,abusing lvl 5s with 200 ping on NA is just as entertaining as solo que.
Most of the lvl5s with 200ping are just eu west players most likely, not much abusing to go on.
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On December 02 2011 06:36 JackDino wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2011 06:33 TheKefka wrote:
Doesn't matter,abusing lvl 5s with 200 ping on NA is just as entertaining as solo que. Most of the lvl5s with 200ping are most likely euwest players you know, just the same as solo queue pretty much.
LOL.
So that's why everyone sub lvl 10 has over 100 ping on NA,I thought you all just have shitty internet.
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so I've accumulated around 3k ip and I'm seriously torn between buying shaco or nidalee. Which one has a higher skill cap? Which is easier to pick up? I mostly like playing all kinds of champions tho I really like the ones who can be build hybrid & on whom I can build sustain like lifesteal and vamp (only playing ryze, malz & Karthus as APs for that reason :p).
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Both are great. Sounds like Nidalee would suit your style a little better because of the heal. You can build her straight AP an be really strong with good sustain due to her heal. Spears and cougar form mastery make for a pretty high skill cap as well.
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Marshall Islands3404 Posts
well you need a semi specific rune page for shaco and you'll need to look up all the routes and stuff for jungling so he's much harder to pick up, they are about the same skill cap.
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Has the jungle been hotfixed yet? Biggest golem giving 37g, smalelr golem 27g while normal creeps only giving ~21g on dyrus stream.
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On December 02 2011 06:37 anmolsinghmzn2009 wrote:
so I've accumulated around 3k ip and I'm seriously torn between buying shaco or nidalee. Which one has a higher skill cap? Which is easier to pick up? I mostly like playing all kinds of champions tho I really like the ones who can be build hybrid & on whom I can build sustain like lifesteal and vamp (only playing ryze, malz & Karthus as APs for that reason :p).
I wouldn't buy either unless you've spent a decent amount of time playing them during their free weeks.
Additionally, do you feel comfortable laning? Lane Shaco is mediocre and it sounds like you play a lot of AP mid.
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ahahaha people really think it's easier to snowball to victory in DoTA than it is in LoL?
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On December 02 2011 05:27 Southlight wrote:Show nested quote +On December 02 2011 05:25 Two_DoWn wrote:On December 02 2011 05:21 Southlight wrote:
Me on a support tends to lead to that too :> Bottom lane so exciting. When I jungle and I gank your lane, you either get a kill or I feed your lane opponent doublebuff. I do not tolerate failure. That tends to make things interesting. lol when Eyedrinker and I or Turkey and I are botlane as combo it is exciting. I should upload a game from last night, was hysterical. ALWAYS TOWER DIVE GO!
We should play together botlane someday. Death to pussies.
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EPT
