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On April 08 2015 01:18 FeyFey wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2015 22:39 mordek wrote:On April 07 2015 22:35 JimmyJRaynor wrote:On April 07 2015 22:31 LaughingTulkas wrote:On April 07 2015 22:24 JimmyJRaynor wrote:I'm getting buried in Heroes of the Storm offers from Blizzard. First they throw up a pay-wall and then a few weeks later they let any one in? http://www.cinemablend.com/games/Blizzard-Stop-Selling-Heroes-Storm-Beta-Keys-71126.htmlHas Blizzard announced how many people bought this "Founder's Pack". I'm guessing the number was lower than expected and Blizzard ain't saying a thing. With Blizzard pumping out more and more content each year in all of their various universes.. sooner or later they are going to have a commercial failure. and i think Heroes of the Storm is going to be just that.. Blizzard's first commercial failure. Fortunately, they can move the people working on Heroes onto other projects.. like folding and counting all the money they are making with Hearthstone and WoW. I think you are delusional. LoL and to a lesser extent Dota2 customer bases are too entrenched. ATVI falls all over themselves to reveal WoW sales totals. It'll be interesting to see waht ATVI reveals about Heroes' revenue. Nvm, it doesn't seem like a conversation is wanted or warranted. On Forums there are people that only jump in to renew their hate for something. They keep coming back even after they quit a game 10 years ago. So it helps if you check the author of a post first, it can really save your time.
For fun, I tried your experiment and found a ton of posts where JimmyJRaynor defends Blizzard and Blizzard games, although there were a couple where he was a critical too.
So I guess I'll make an actual response here. LoL is the biggest Moba by far, it's staggering how big it is. It's basically the WoW-equivalent. It's reasonable to question whether anything can take it on. Especially when you have Dota2 with such a fanatical / large niche itself.
However, there is a pretty big difference from WoW, and that MMO's are basically an exclusive endeavor. I don't know many people who play more than one hardcore. It just takes too much time. Moba's aren't like that by a long shot so a lot of people are going to be willing to try Heroes (and a lot of people here play multiple Moba's too).
Not to mention that you can't underestimate the appeal of playing Blizzard IP heroes. For instance when I look at Dota2 they have the most boring unimaginative names out there. At least LoL has backstory and lore even if you won't know / care about any of that unless you play LoL. But when it comes to playing Thrall or Jaina or Diablo there's something that just resonates if you enjoyed the games they came from. That's enough to get people to try the game.
Plus, there will be a flood of new Heroes players on release when they add WoW achievements for trying the game like they did with Hearthstone (3 HS games to get a new mount). As in millions of players and of course a lot of them will stick around.
Of course this is all speculation and prediction. You can't actually read anything into the financials of Heroes until after it releases. If ATVI brag about user numbers or Founder Pack sales during *closed beta* then that's an astoundingly good sign. If they say nothing, well that's just business as usual.
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On April 08 2015 01:18 FeyFey wrote:
On Forums there are people that only jump in to renew their hate for something. They keep coming back even after they quit a game 10 years ago. So it helps if you check the author of a post first, it can really save your time.
Yeah this is the guy who said that StarCraft 2 was an utter failure and that blizzard had given up on RTS because its a dead genre that just loses money a month or so before blizzcon. I posted in the team liquid thread that Void would get announced at Blizzcon and he posted that he'd be back to let me know how dumb I am for knowing nothing about Blizzard.
He never returned, but I saw him shortly after Blizzcon posting more drivel everywhere about blizzard not caring about X, RTS is dead, Heroes is a disaster.
Its kind of like the national enquirer...you might see a headline that sounds interesting, but its just all interpolation, smoke, and mirrors inside.
For the record though...hearthstone must be making mad cash, the pay for card back was in 7 out of 8 opponents decks before the expansion released. I'm sure that wasn't only me that was seeing that. I see the same thing in heroes...the founder's pack heroes with the skins running around. Blizzard games are making money.
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On April 08 2015 03:37 Eliezar wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2015 01:18 FeyFey wrote:
On Forums there are people that only jump in to renew their hate for something. They keep coming back even after they quit a game 10 years ago. So it helps if you check the author of a post first, it can really save your time. Yeah this is the guy who said that StarCraft 2 was an utter failure and that blizzard had given up on RTS because its a dead genre that just loses money a month or so before blizzcon. I posted in the team liquid thread that Void would get announced at Blizzcon and he posted that he'd be back to let me know how dumb I am for knowing nothing about Blizzard. He never returned, but I saw him shortly after Blizzcon posting more drivel everywhere about blizzard not caring about X, RTS is dead, Heroes is a disaster. Its kind of like the national enquirer...you might see a headline that sounds interesting, but its just all interpolation, smoke, and mirrors inside. For the record though...hearthstone must be making mad cash, the pay for card back was in 7 out of 8 opponents decks before the expansion released. I'm sure that wasn't only me that was seeing that. I see the same thing in heroes...the founder's pack heroes with the skins running around. Blizzard games are making money.
you are way off topic. i've never said many of the things you claim i've said.
here is the on-topic-place to discuss those things though
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/legacy-of-the-void/481796-archon-mode-may-very-well-be-the-magic-bullet?page=6#108
if u want to debate the declining RTS genre, SC2 and LotV that's a much better place.. the great thing is ... you're in that very thread....
back on topic.. offering a Founder's Pack for $40 and then removing it only 2 months later is bad business and will leave those buying it feeling a bit ripped off. Blizzard rarely makes mistakes. This is a mistake though.
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Why is it bad business?
I've not seen any backlash against the Founder's Pack other than when it was initially announced. Then people started buying it. Let me tell you, those first two weeks every quick match featured someone with a founder's pack hero/skin combination.
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you do not need an explicit back lash for it to be bad. it is only $40... and its the only time Blizzard has made this kind of error that i can recall. Unlike EA whose games drop in price faster than rocks.
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Mexico2170 Posts
So you are saying it is an error because they are making removing it now? They are removing it because frankly, it is pretty easy to get beta keys right now, and the game will be f2p, also they originally stated it would be for a limited time only.
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10 days after the $40 founder's pack came out ...me and a bunch of my friends got invites to play for nothing.
that was a bad move... and now its completely gone because of how prevalent free entry into the beta is.
had they slowly edged out the founder's pack over a series of months that would've been better.
combined with "the founder's pack only makes sense if you want guaranteed access to the beta"... it was a bad move by Blizzard to change things up so fast.
http://www.cinemablend.com/games/Heroes-Storm-Founder-Pack-Probably-Isn-t-Worth-Money-69571.html
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You keep saying error, but how is it an error? It's hard to follow your logic that selling early access for a limited time denotes failure.
I agree that it was weird how quickly they ramped up handing out keys relative to Founder's Pack launch, but how does that admit any mistake? The Founder's Pack was targeted at people who really wanted in, and they got in. I suspect the demand for something like this is more similar to movie releases where the norm is for box office receipts to drop off a cliff after a week or two.
I don't understand how you slowly edge out the founder's pack anyways? You mean lower the price and see how many people buy? I guess you can try to milk things longer, but I suspect the founder's pack and already served it's purpose (which 95% was not to sell copies of a F2P game, but rather kill off blackmarket key sellers and demonstrate general interest / audience for Heroes).
The last wave of invites was specifically talking about Team League and if you've played other (deader) games you know that a large player base is *crucial* to make queue times reasonable as well as allowing match-making to do it's job (both of which were major complaints still, but especially a month+ ago). I find it unlikely they could have filled the population adequately merely by selling access to a F2P game (no matter how much they lowered the price).
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On April 08 2015 07:44 Wuster wrote:
You keep saying error, but how is it an error? It's hard to follow your logic that selling early access for a limited time denotes failure.
http://www.cinemablend.com/games/Blizzard-Stop-Selling-Heroes-Storm-Beta-Keys-71126.html
if u r going to put up a pay wall to entry make it meaningful or don't do it at all.
"There's another unsaid reason: the open beta. Blizzard wants to stop selling Founder's Packs well before they start letting everyone into the beta. They don't want scores of outraged customers who paid $40 to get into the beta a day or week before beta access became free to all. "
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So heading off a PR nightmare is now an error? We all *knew* that you can't sell access forever. It's going to be F2P and out of closed beta eventually.
Dota2 sold access too, and after a while they flooded people with beta keys as well. So I still don't follow your logic.
Selling access is just something that happens. I play a lot of online TCGs, Hex, Infinity Wars, Solforge, Prismata all sold access to an eventually F2P game. I think people who are so against it are just behind the times. This is just how games are distributed now and whether or not you personally would pay, the recent history of kickstarter / steam early access / etc has proven that lots of people out there do pay.
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Pretty sure Blizzard got most of the people that wanted to buy into the beta in those first few days/weeks. People that had been waiting to get into Heroes since it had been announced, that for what ever reason never got access. After a few weeks everyone that was willing to spend money to get into Heroes had already done so. I don't think their timing was bad at all.
BTW if you really want to know Jimmy's back story you need to check out The NHL threads of years gone by.
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I was excited for the game untill i tried it.. ..
But then I realised its just a dumbed down copy of LoL and you have to pay for heroes to get unlocked.
Gonna stick with Dota 2 .
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I think the golem nerf on the mines map is a bit too much. Feel very unrewarding to get 60-70 skulls.
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On April 08 2015 23:27 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:
I think the golem nerf on the mines map is a bit too much. Feel very unrewarding to get 60-70 skulls.
I kinda agree. The first golem is almost meaningless.
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Its not like i have a big ping for delay,my FPS are great and my internet speed/connect are good but this game lags so hard. It runs smooth and every 3 or so minutes a 2-3 second skip then back to running smoothly. Any others experience this problem? Any potential solutions?
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On April 08 2015 23:33 xDaunt wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2015 23:27 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:
I think the golem nerf on the mines map is a bit too much. Feel very unrewarding to get 60-70 skulls. I kinda agree. The first golem is almost meaningless.
Wouldn't go that far. In a mines game after the patch we had a teammate who chatted that it would be more efficient to let the enemy team get 100 skulls for the first golem and that'd we go for all the mercs while the enemy team was busy in the mines.
Figured why not so we got all three merc camps and pushed the towers until they got 100 skulls.
Proceed to nearly lose the game to the first golem who nearly smashed down the Keep's gate with only some support from its team. They get a two level advantage and the next golem ends up being next to the core before going down.
Nearly lost the game on the third golem, only to lose it on the fourth.
Our mercs hadn't accomplished much of anything in return other than two towers and some minor damage on a Fort.
Get the skulls, even for the first golem.
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On April 08 2015 23:45 FreedomMurder wrote:
Its not like i have a big ping for delay,my FPS are great and my internet speed/connect are good but this game lags so hard. It runs smooth and every 3 or so minutes a 2-3 second skip then back to running smoothly. Any others experience this problem? Any potential solutions?
happened to me twice in 60 games, and my friend on skype was having the same issue at the exact same time. i think its server side.
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happened to me twice in 60 games, and my friend on skype was having the same issue at the exact same time. i think its server side.
Nah happens to me all the time....
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On April 08 2015 06:18 JimmyJRaynor wrote:10 days after the $40 founder's pack came out ...me and a bunch of my friends got invites to play for nothing. that was a bad move... and now its completely gone because of how prevalent free entry into the beta is. had they slowly edged out the founder's pack over a series of months that would've been better. combined with "the founder's pack only makes sense if you want guaranteed access to the beta"... it was a bad move by Blizzard to change things up so fast. http://www.cinemablend.com/games/Heroes-Storm-Founder-Pack-Probably-Isn-t-Worth-Money-69571.html
First off, Founder's pack was being sold in Janurary. You and your friends did not get invites 10 days later. The only people who got invites before were Alpha people who hit level 40 like last October-November.
The swarming of beta keys has only happened in the last month or so.
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Ever since they added innate CC reduction to the Plant Terror Garden has become the absolute worst map to play. The opponents getting a Terror basically comes down to playing grab ass everytime they plop down a pot for a second then continuing to chase the Terror around the map until the pot is off cool down. It used to be the Terror couldn't kite you everywhere because you could slow/root/stun it long enough to get some damage in but now CC lasts about a quarter second on the Terror it is just playing follow the plant for almost the entire duration. It is fucking terrible.
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EPT
