Heroes Large General Thread - Page 331

Add yourself in the TL Player list if you want to play with TL people, and /join teamliquid channel ingame. Also check out the new Heroes Liquipedia.

Wuster

1974 Posts

February 13 2015 01:00 GMT

#6601

On February 13 2015 09:45 deth2munkies wrote:

Show nested quote +

Illidan has The Hunt.

Oh ya, the Hunt. I guess that does get picked in QM huh? Swap out Ilidan for Jaina then. Anyways, it can happen (and not just rarely).

Of course, every non-Arthas warrior can interrupt Nazeebo. So if you do end up on a team that can't... chances are the match-maker screwed you guys over in more ways than one.

deth2munkies

United States4051 Posts

February 13 2015 01:23 GMT

#6602

On February 13 2015 10:00 Wuster wrote:

Show nested quote +

Honestly, I rarely see meta, and in any non-5 stack, I'd probably take The Hunt since people tend to be out of position quite often, and picking them off is very useful.

Blitzkrieg0

United States13132 Posts

February 13 2015 01:45 GMT

#6603

On February 13 2015 10:23 deth2munkies wrote:

Show nested quote +

Honestly, I rarely see meta, and in any non-5 stack, I'd probably take The Hunt since people tend to be out of position quite often, and picking them off is very useful.

If you aren't a five stack your opponents probably aren't a five stack and you can land 3+ man metas all game and laugh your way to victory.

Tenks

United States3104 Posts

February 13 2015 02:51 GMT

#6604

I'm watching the VOD of Town Hall Heroes and it frustrates me how closed minded the "pro" NA players are in every interview I hear. Whenever confronted with "What about building like this on this map with this comp?" Nooooo that would never work. EU is such a more enjoyable scene to watch than NA. They seem to have a deeper competency with heroes and they have a more open mind when it comes to trying out certain heroes and builds. NA may have Tempo but I'd love to see an EU vs NA. Because I suspect EU would absolutely wreck.

xDaunt

United States17988 Posts

February 13 2015 02:54 GMT

#6605

On February 13 2015 11:51 Tenks wrote:
I'm watching the VOD of Town Hall Heroes and it frustrates me how closed minded the "pro" NA players are in every interview I hear. Whenever confronted with "What about building like this on this map with this comp?" Nooooo that would never work. EU is such a more enjoyable scene to watch than NA. They seem to have a deeper competency with heroes and they have a more open mind when it comes to trying out certain heroes and builds. NA may have Tempo but I'd love to see an EU vs NA. Because I suspect EU would absolutely wreck.

As much as it pains me to admit it, I think you are right.

Tenks

United States3104 Posts

February 13 2015 03:04 GMT

#6606

I should note I almost always take stuff in these games with a grain of salt. It took me an eternity to believe that you simply had to open with ~6 Hellions TvZ. And even recently I'm starting to wonder if I couldn't get similar results out of 8 combat shield marines + 1 medivac! I believe people better than me at games are simply that -- they're better than me. They're not smarter players who have gone over every scenario and every opening. Even then going from BW to SC2 to now HotS I know how much the pro cult of personality can effect even low-level play.

deth2munkies

United States4051 Posts

February 13 2015 05:00 GMT

#6607

On February 13 2015 10:45 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:

Show nested quote +

If you aren't a five stack your opponents probably aren't a five stack and you can land 3+ man metas all game and laugh your way to victory.

Meh, most of the time he has to meta to get away or does it and dies immediately. Can say the same for The Hunt, but usually it's on a squishy that ends up dying too. In pubs, The Hunt is just better IMO.

Blitzkrieg0

United States13132 Posts

February 13 2015 05:04 GMT

#6608

On February 13 2015 14:00 deth2munkies wrote:

Show nested quote +

I'd say that is because most illidans are terrible rather than meta being a bad skill. You have to know when to go in with illidan. If you're going in and getting instagibbed then you didn't engage at a good timing with hunt or meta unless your sole purpose in the game is to trade 1:1 and then your team can cleanup.

deth2munkies

United States4051 Posts

February 13 2015 05:09 GMT

#6609

On February 13 2015 14:04 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:

Show nested quote +

Again, it's pubs, they're not good. Even if they were good, The Hunt is just better when facing bad carries.

[Phantom]

Mexico2170 Posts

February 13 2015 05:19 GMT

#6610

Yeah, Pro players aren't necessarily the most experienced or the people who has more knowledge. They know a lot about the game just by playing that much, but some are good at creating new strategies, some are not. Thats why usually a team has couches, and the coach, even if he can't win a the WCS/LCS/international, he knows way more than the average player. So yeah, while there are pro players that do know a lot about the game, a lot of them are simply very very good, or thats what i think.

Godwrath

Spain10142 Posts

February 13 2015 09:37 GMT

#6611

On February 13 2015 14:00 deth2munkies wrote:

Show nested quote +

I disagree. Illidan is a hero that wants to be on the back of your opponent, the difference is that in pubs you won't get the support when you do to be able to trade 1:1 and still be fine, hence why on the hunt is useless, and a tanky metamorphosis first aid + shield will let you get away with that much better.

But i do not know, even on QM i see a lot of teamfights, and not so much people going lone completely crazy. Well sometimes they do, but those are the times you are very likely to lose because your teammates are doing crazy stuff on then hunt or not.

Godwrath

Spain10142 Posts

February 13 2015 10:19 GMT

#6612

By the way, how were the games on ESL Major NA ? Is there any way to find VODs ? Khaldor uploads the EU ones into his youtube channel, does jakeGG do the same for NA ?

Markwerf

Netherlands3728 Posts

February 13 2015 10:19 GMT

#6613

The hunt is just terrible. The whole split pushing tactic etc. is nonexistant in HotS. Around lvl ~12 or so it just becomes moving as a group mostly and the hunt becomes pretty useless. Problem especially with it is that by not taking metamorphosis and using the hunt on someone there are many heroes that will just kill you 1 on 1 or if someone was just a bit out of sight you get killed 2v1 with no escape left.
Getting vision in the first place of someone by themselves that is separated so he can be picked off easily is hard already and if you constantly get that, for example a scrub is clearing lanes by themselves far from the pack lategame, you'll probably win using metamorphosis too.

Illidan's build is pretty much set in stone, first aid and metamorphosis just combines too well to go anything else. Giant killer vs sixth sense, blood for blood vs stoneskin and demonic form vs nexus blades vs bolt of the storm are the only real choices for him which depend a bit on the enemy composition.

Nexus blades is not all that exciting on him I think but could be useful but the metamorphosis upgrade is close usually. 20% faster attack and slowing effect or 10% faster attack, 50% reduction of disabling effects and permanent metamorphosis. I typically prefer the latter as getting disabled sucks quite a bit as illidan but if you don't need it a bit faster attack is nice to have as option. The slowing effect tends to be pretty redundant with illidan's chasing power already but it is nice.

Illidan is in a fine spot now, because thrall was nerfed to useless and kerrigan fell off a bit he get's picked more now. Especially as uther and tassadar are more popular to take which support him really well and the overall stun combo's have decreased. Before he could often just be erased quickly by double polymorph, kerrigan combo's, double muradin stuns but those don't happen untill level 20 now when he get's CC reduction if he needs. I expect him to see quite a bit of play this patch. The less burst there is in the metagame the better he becomes and many things just play into that (gathering power nerf for example is another one that benefits him). Sonya might rise for the same reason along with the tiny buff she got.

Godwrath

Spain10142 Posts

February 13 2015 10:23 GMT

#6614

The lvl 20 choice for me is just metamorphosis or blink. Nexus blades looks hot, but metamorphosis is just outright better imo since you get to permanently buff your attack speed to 30%, which is better for your cooldowns, and you also get the CC reduction permanently.

Big G

Italy835 Posts

February 13 2015 12:21 GMT

#6615

Tried Arthas for a few matches... it seems like he deals more damage than before, especially post-lv13 with Biting Cold. Army of the Dead has been butchered though, it's really hard to engage and survive for more than a few seconds now. Other warriors have been nerfed, so I have no idea what are the rankings right now besides Stitches being n.1. Maybe Muradin (even without rewind) and ETC have more utility than Arthas.

Markwerf

Netherlands3728 Posts

February 13 2015 12:34 GMT

#6616

well yeah arthas aura does very good damage now, even before level 13 the difference is substantial. Especially soloing the hard camp he is really solid now, as his aura takes that down quite quickly.
Army of the dead is useless now but sendrigosa while buffed still feels crap for the standard gameplay of focussing on teamfights. I think he can still be used well but you really need the team to use sendrigosa and push more. If you just start teampushing forts after level 10 it's quite a nice ability but in teamfights it stinks. Slow to cast, misses often and deals so little damage.
Stitches is still best though I prefer putrid bile on him usually now. The second spot really depends on your composition now I think. ETC is quite nice as he wasn't nerfed at all and already started creeping up, also autoattack boosts have gotten better I think with autoattack heroes and builds being slightly better. Also helps for ETC that tychus and brightwing are not neccesarily in every game anymore, if you're just up agianst uther for example his ultimate rocks. Basically most warriors are pretty close now and it depends a lot on your composition how it should be, I think you just want to wait in the draft now and see what you need.

MarlieChurphy

United States2065 Posts

February 13 2015 13:07 GMT

#6617

Not sure if this was posted. I watched it a couple of times to tears already