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Talith, Datura is a very dangerous - potentially deadly - deliriant/hallucinogen.
In most people, it seems to bring on very frightening hallucinations.
Here it is worth distinguishing between the word hallucination and illusion. Psychedelics such as LSD and psilocybin primarily bring on illusions, which are changes in perception that are obviously not real. IE you might see the walls bending towards you or see pictures become animated, but you realize the whole time that these things aren't "really" happening. With a hallucination, you see things that aren't there, but you BELIEVE they are real. Hence the term "hallucinogen" being a misnomer for most "psychedelic" (psychedelic means "mind manifesting," by the way) drugs.
Datura is a hallucinogen. It seems to drive people bonkers, and because it is poisonous, it can kill you. The real danger lies in thinking you didn't take enough to "get off" (it takes awhile to kick in") and then taking more, ending up in overdose land.
Look it up on wikipedia - it is pretty interesting to read historical accounts of its use.
It is also known as Jimsom (or Jimson?) Weed. Stupid kids sometimes take it for a cheap high, since it grows wildly.
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In response to some other posts, I think "trip" experiences can be very relevant to "real life."
First of all, this whole discussion calls into question what is real. What is real? What is real is what we experience as being real. We make a big fuss about citing scientific sources and looking to scientists and science to tell us what is real and how reality works, but even science is based on perception - the perception of scientists.
Reality boils down to perception. Are you so sure that the way you see things is the way they are?
Another good question: do multiple people have to perceive the same thing for a given phenomenon to be "real" or "true?" If so, how can we be sure that multiple people really perceive the same thing? Can something be real or true if only one person perceives it?
Anyhow, I believe "altered" states can shed light on reality. I don't endorse the use of psychedelics for this end, nor can I really say I am against it. I've taken trips before (my salvia report in this thread being an example of one.)
Where I stand is basically this: kids should not use these drugs. You should wait until you have some life experiences before you go jumping off into psychedelics worlds. Furthermore, these drugs are not party drugs. These aren't for a "good time." They are very serious and they can throw your entire sense of everything into question, which can be both very beneficial and very horrifying/damaging.
Last of all, it is foolish to rely on drugs as a way to become wise or enlightened. Drugs like psilocybin can, as I said, shed light on certain things, but it is up to you to do the work to make the experience meaningful, and to apply the wisdom in the sober state (which absolutely should be the baseline state - shouldn't get high often at all, IMO). I've known many people who have tripped many times and are just as foolish and narrowminded as anyone else - sometimes more so. Look at the 60's revolution. Don't see a whole lot of enlightenment there... just a bunch of people who had a hell of a party for a few years and sold out a few years later, becoming the big businessmen under the Reagan era. So much for all that enlightenment...
Conversely,you look at people who spend their lives in deep, sober contemplation, and there you see wisdom and development. Development comes through contemplation and work. Not by dropping acid or smoking a bunch of bowls.
Drugs are very much a double edged sword. That is what I mean to say.
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Inky, I like your responses and thank you for them! In Arizona, substances as datura or dmt are pretty hard to come by. Peyote would be the closest thing I guess (besides LSD, and mushrooms), however Phoenix is known as pretty much a 'meth' city. I'll have to look that up, a lotta the more obscure plants I haven't taken the time to research them simply because I've never run into it in daily life, but it'll be a neat diversion from all the 'powders' I hear about all the time.
Datura sounds like DMT's wicked step sister almost. Are the effects comparable albeit more intense/disturbing?
Hahah, I gotta find more friends like ya! 
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Talith, thank you for saying so. Happy to discuss anything.
I don't know much about datura other than people seem to usually have bad experiences with it. Also, the trip is usually not remembered, whereas there is full recall with psilocybin or LSD. I don't believe datura is similar to the alkaloid psychedelics (ie LSD, psilocybin, mescalin, DMT...)
I once read that Ken Kesey (acid guru of the 60's and writer of One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest and other famous novels) had used Datura a few times. He volunteered for psychological experiments that involved various mind altering drugs. Apparently they would give him psilocybin, mescalin, LSD, or datura without telling him which drug he was going to get. He said he could always tell when he had datura, because his blanket would always turn very hot and he could feel thorns growing out of it and digging into his skin.
Incidentally, Ken Kesey developed the story of One Flew.. while working in a mental hospital at night and taking mescaline (the active in peyote).
Anyway, I've never done datura (never would, either) or DMT (probably wouldn't do DMT.) But my understanding is that the two are radically different. DMT is an alkaloid psychedelic, so it is more related to LSD, psilocybin, and mescalin. The thing with DMT is that it is known to be extremely powerful, especially when smoked. Infact, it is the strongest psychedelic drug there is, or at least in a tie with salvia. DMT, when smoked, is a full on hallucinogen, as it makes people enter a radically different world. People report experiencing strange dimensions, or communicating with utterly alien intelligences.
Terrence Mckenna reported meeting what he called "machine elves" under the influence of DMT. They were strange bouncing balls that would bounce into his body and back out again, and by singing (apparently they sang) they could call strange technologies into existence. Terrence McKenna says that the "after glow" (coming down from the trip) of a DMT trip is comparable to a 700 microgram LSD trip (an insane LSD dose). Maybe that is an indication of how powerful the drug is!
Until Timothy Leary got hold of DMT, most people seem to have reported very negative experiences with it, except, of course, the indigenous people who had been using it for shamanistic purposes for a very long time.
Anyhow, just to be clear, I really do not endorse the use of these drugs. In fact, I recommend against it. I think it is much better to find ways to enjoy yourself and gain wisdom in the sober state.
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i CANT WAIT TO SEE THIS BRO!
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Ill try LSD for the first time this weekend, wish me luck :D
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700 micrograms, WOW!! Interesting read.
and baal, enjoy! You going to do it with friends/trip setter? Let us know how ya like it!
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On February 13 2008 11:48 nA.Inky wrote:
Talith, Datura is a very dangerous - potentially deadly - deliriant/hallucinogen.
In most people, it seems to bring on very frightening hallucinations.
Here it is worth distinguishing between the word hallucination and illusion. Psychedelics such as LSD and psilocybin primarily bring on illusions, which are changes in perception that are obviously not real. IE you might see the walls bending towards you or see pictures become animated, but you realize the whole time that these things aren't "really" happening. With a hallucination, you see things that aren't there, but you BELIEVE they are real. Hence the term "hallucinogen" being a misnomer for most "psychedelic" (psychedelic means "mind manifesting," by the way) drugs.
Datura is a hallucinogen. It seems to drive people bonkers, and because it is poisonous, it can kill you. The real danger lies in thinking you didn't take enough to "get off" (it takes awhile to kick in") and then taking more, ending up in overdose land.
Look it up on wikipedia - it is pretty interesting to read historical accounts of its use.
It is also known as Jimsom (or Jimson?) Weed. Stupid kids sometimes take it for a cheap high, since it grows wildly.
so true about the difference between illusions and hallucinations...
when i smoke weed i get illusions..if its good shit
my salvia trip was total hallucination...gahhhh so tripppyyyyyyyy
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I've done DMT LSD and DOC there all very similar imo....tho LSD is more visual then the other 2
also I agree with the people who said if you younger and never done this stuff don't....it really does mess with you, Personally I don't sell it to young kids when it comes around and tell all my buddies to do the same.
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Is there such a thing as a good salvia trip?
seriously?
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Haaaaaaaaaaaaaa haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!
Gggoooooooooooddd Reeeeeeeeeeaaaaaad.
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On February 14 2008 09:53 Trainwreck wrote:
I've done DMT LSD and DOC there all very similar imo....tho LSD is more visual then the other 2
also I agree with the people who said if you younger and never done this stuff don't....it really does mess with you, Personally I don't sell it to young kids when it comes around and tell all my buddies to do the same.
You're mixing DMT up with something. DMT is the most powerful hallucinogen on the planet. LSD is pretty tame.
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On February 14 2008 09:28 Talith wrote:700 micrograms, WOW!! Interesting read. and baal, enjoy! You going to do it with friends/trip setter? Let us know how ya like it!
im giong to a rave with some girl i like, she said she would take care of me so i hope to connect with her.
There is some potential to bad trip since its a crowded area and she decides not to pay a lot of attention to me, however i plan to take a small dosage first.
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ooo first rave? Ya I react better in social situations with lsd than with mushrooms so at least ya got that goin for ya haha. light shows for the win ;D. Where you live at baal?
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haha man when i did that shitt the first time me and my homies were usin a 7 foot bong so they packed it n shitfor me....little did i know.....yea i was in my own little world i didnt know wtf hit me i was like rubbing the side of his bed and people kept punching me and it woudl take me like a minute to respond to it. fuckin weird shit
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On February 15 2008 02:19 Talith wrote:
ooo first rave? Ya I react better in social situations with lsd than with mushrooms so at least ya got that goin for ya haha. light shows for the win ;D. Where you live at baal?
Not even close actually im quite a sick degenerate party monster and raves are like home however ive always been kind of afraid of hallucinogens because of possible bad trips so i avoided them in the past.
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On February 15 2008 03:27 Kingsp4de20 wrote:
haha man when i did that shitt the first time me and my homies were usin a 7 foot bong so they packed it n shitfor me....little did i know.....yea i was in my own little world i didnt know wtf hit me i was like rubbing the side of his bed and people kept punching me and it woudl take me like a minute to respond to it. fuckin weird shit
how did you even know you were getting hit and that you responded to it a minute later? my mind had absolutely no contact with my body whatsoever until i crossed the street so i probably would not have even felt the punches..or they mightve felt like bullets every time i got hit or some crazy shit like that
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On February 12 2008 03:00 GeneralStan wrote:
By the way, you lucky bastard going to Bonnaroo. I should really try to make it out there this year. BB King and the Allman Brothers. Hellz yeah, old school style :O
Yea my cousin went to Bonnaroo. He said it was one of the best experiences of his life. But hes a nut too 
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oh and nA.Inky is officially the man
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On February 14 2008 10:52 intotherainx wrote:
Is there such a thing as a good salvia trip?
seriously?
Absolutely. A couple of my friends have done salvia extensively and most of them have never had a bad trip in there life.
I tried salvia for the first time yesterday, it was only 20X but i had a terrible trip and i dont ever want to do it again. I was sitting in a really nice chair at my dealers house, took in a nice deep toke and held it in for about 30 seconds.
The best part of my trip was when i exhaled, the horizontal axis that i was looking at cut in half and the top half melted/ half turned upside down into the bottom half. A really good buddy of mine was looking at me and when i looked at him and started laughing his face melted to his hands and he turned into a bowling pin on its side. Then it turned itself upright, multiplied itself thousands of times and the room started spinning. From then on my trip was terrible.
Everything seemed to be moving at an extremely fast speed to the left and i was being pulled into another universe where i would dissapear forever, before i could fully go, my friends in the room somehow broke through this wall of moving bowling pins and they were trying to save me from being lost forever.
From there its kind of blurry, i remember thinking that i needed to cry for some reason and that i needed someone to be holding onto one of my hands for the rest of my trip. I was also wishing that somehow my skeleton would be ripped from the inside of my body so that i could see what it looked like.
And then i started to come around, i realized i had taken a hit of salvia and that i was drugged but for some reason i couldn't stop feeling extremely depressed and confused. I needed a buddy of mine to - every couple of minutes - tell me that i have a girlfriend, i'm not drugged and that i'm actually sitting where i am sitting.
Sorry if it seems really jumbled and out of place but thats what my trip was like. I know for sure that i'm not going to be doing salvia again, but i would definatly recommend it to people who would like to try it.
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EPT
