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“I have a foreboding of an America in my children's or grandchildren's time -- when the United States is a service and information economy; when nearly all the manufacturing industries have slipped away to other countries; when awesome technological powers are in the hands of a very few, and no one representing the public interest can even grasp the issues; when the people have lost the ability to set their own agendas or knowledgeably question those in authority; when, clutching our crystals and nervously consulting our horoscopes, our critical faculties in decline, unable to distinguish between what feels good and what's true, we slide, almost without noticing, back into superstition and darkness...
The dumbing down of American is most evident in the slow decay of substantive content in the enormously influential media, the 30 second sound bites (now down to 10 seconds or less), lowest common denominator programming, credulous presentations on pseudoscience and superstition, but especially a kind of celebration of ignorance”
Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark
Written in 1995, couldn't be more relevant today.
It's hard to believe this was not done deliberately. To me, America (and by extension the western world) of today are a product of a white, christian nationalist project which has waged the war on science, education and intellectualism longer then I have been alive, the open alliance was inked in with Regan and they never looked back.
When they get a chance in between licking fascist boots and whatabouting around blatant gerrymandering and other anti-democratic shit that the fascists in power are now doing I'd love to hear from our resident right wingers how this is a good thing.
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You like A better, they like B better. It doesn't matter. Human rights, while ultimately something that are a nice framework to operate under, is something very plastic and not at all an inalienable right. The left deluded themselves this was what the West was all about. Seems like it was just another pillar in an ideology that was untennable. We can't even really fight for it, because look what's happening in the US. I wonder how long it'll take before it blows over to the EU... let's hope our institutions and people are stronger.
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I'm pretty confident that Trump could cancel/win the 2028 elections and most Democrats plan would be to win in 2032.
Democrats are demonstrably incapable of being a functional opposition to the US's march into fascism. If people don't grapple with that, they can't possibly successfully stop fascism.
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Can you go back to the funny trolling? This isn't nearly amusing enough for the amount of effort you're putting into it.
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I'm pretty sure I agree with GH here. We'll have to see in the upcoming years how far the MAGAs try to extend their power and how much the rest of the population resists. Because at this moment, it's not looking too good.
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It's not the opinion itself that's insane, just the "but her emails"-tier deflection to Democrats in literally every discussion.
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On August 06 2025 22:57 LightSpectra wrote:
It's not the opinion itself that's insane, just the "but her emails"-tier deflection to Democrats in literally every discussion.
It's kinda funny how he suddenly loves to punch down.
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I guess he want to keep you focused instead of being a gawking/ridiculing dem/lib/ilk. Keep your eyes on the prize: the fascist onion being peeled in real time, right in front of you.
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The time to stop the fascists was before they got into power. It's not like Trump was hiding what he was going to do.
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So you're saying they can't be stopped now? We can only weep while the onion's being peeled?
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By blaming democrats for everything Trump does? So... Victim blaming?
By blaming them for not starting a revolution? I tought that was his idea/job? I mean it's not like he would follow them...
If anyone is to blame, it's the american people. Or if you want to get a bit more abstract the american media enviroment that shaped the opinions of the people that has long lost any sort of accountability or integrity. So much that Trump now can dismantle it while a large part of the country is applauding him for it while exlusively consuming online slop thats even worse than legacy media.
How much it will take for the american people to actually get off their asses? I have no clue. My gut feeling is, that the French would have stormed the bastille by now if even half of that shit would be going on but i'm unsure how the Brits (never did a revolution), Germans (it's complicated), Swiss (direct democracy eases tensions) or Austrians (the actual funniest politics on the planet) would react. I can see how the americans react and the answer seems to be total apathy and prayers that the next elections will change stuff again.
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Fascism isn't sustainable in the long run. I utterly reject any and all insinuations that Trump is unstoppable. He's a geriatric moron that limped across the finish line because almost every incumbent party was kicked out of office in 2024 due to inflation malaise. He can't even make the Epstein scandal go away despite conservatives owning all the social media and cable news.
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On August 06 2025 23:29 Uldridge wrote:
So you're saying they can't be stopped now? We can only weep while the onion's being peeled?
I mean, when you give fascists power, their first step is to consolidate it. You are seeing that now in action.
It's not sustainable in the long-term, and I'd be surprised if Trump managed to live for more than another decade, so there's definitely an expiration date. We are all in for a wild ride now, though.
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The threat has less to do with Trump himself and more to do with the chaos that’ll follow his death. No one in the wings comes close to being a proper their and there’ll be all sorts of jockeying for position.
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On August 06 2025 23:29 Uldridge wrote:
So you're saying they can't be stopped now? We can only weep while the onion's being peeled?
The idea that the only way to fight back is violent revolution is what he's presenting. That we should just abandon democracy and let them kill what they're trying to kill.
Constantly discrediting and demeaning the people who are trying to fight back is what he's doing. He never talks about any of the solutions or ideals about what to do when he actually wins. He's just a dog chasing a car.
We are here because people thought this was the better option than Harris. We should be focused on the people who convinced them of this.
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I don't always like your choice of words here.
I prefer: We are here because more people thought this was the better option.
Your democracy is being dismantled in real time. You won't even have a moment to kill it yourself.
The people with teeth are far and few between. Dems seem to mostly roll over. Show me those "people who are fighting back" and what they're doing to this cabinet.
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On August 07 2025 00:16 Uldridge wrote:
I don't always like your choice of words here.
I prefer: We are here because more people thought this was the better option.
Your democracy is being dismantled in real time. You won't even have a moment to kill it yourself.
The people with teeth are far and few between. Dems seem to mostly roll over. Show me those "people who are fighting back" and what they're doing to this cabinet.
The response to people dismantling democracy isn't to destroy it with them. You're letting Maga win by letting them make you feel comfortable with authoritarianism and treating it like a normal response to setbacks. Being a child and throwing a tantrum to burn down all of society because things didn't go your way is not something I'm going to treat as legitimate.
The global war on terror was not a good response to 9/11. I don't know why you would be wanting to follow that example.
More people didn't think that this was the better option. Less people voted for Trump in 2024 than 2020. Even then it wasn't near a majority of the population. The vote for harris was depressed by many narratives compared to Joe Biden. If you want to make the case that kamala/walz was a worse ticket than biden/harris we can talk about that.
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More people voted for Trump tham Harris, no? Ok.
There's a guy stealing your house brick by brick and rebuilding it as a giant tower on the other side of the street with people who have guns to protect it. How do you proceed?
The response I've seen is: well they'll start to shoot each other once they see how small that room at the top actually is. Let's just wait it out.
But by then they've made that tower and you're left with nothing. You can start from scratch either way.
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Northern Ireland27200 Posts
On August 07 2025 01:02 Uldridge wrote:
More people voted for Trump tham Harris, no? Ok.
There's a guy stealing your house brick by brick and rebuilding it as a giant tower on the other side of the street with people who have guns to protect it. How do you proceed?
The response I've seen is: well they'll start to shoot each other once they see how small that room at the top actually is. Let's just wait it out.
But by then they've made that tower and you're left with nothing. You can start from scratch either way.
That’s not even remotely accurate as analogies go.
It’s more ‘Hey, this guy is stealing our bricks, any chance of a hand?’, ‘Yeah I know but I’m busy building my own artisan house right now. Also conventional house design is fucking stupid anyway.’
Then down the line one gets ‘Why did you let that guy steal your bricks? Why are you not stopping them stealing more bricks!’
People aren’t going to tend to respond to that well.
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EPT
