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Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting! NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.
Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source.If you have any questions, comments, concern, or feedback regarding the USPMT, then please use this thread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/website-feedback/510156-us-politics-thread |
On February 24 2022 08:36 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2022 08:18 Doc.Rivers wrote:Some interesting news about the NY state investigation into trump here. I suspected the media had overly hyped the case (almost goes without saying). Wonder if there will be any public statements from the departed prosecutors. Prosecutors Leading Trump Fraud Investigation in NY Resign https://nyti.ms/3HewK1bThe two prosecutors leading the Manhattan district attorney’s investigation into former President Donald J. Trump and his business practices abruptly resigned on Wednesday amid a monthlong pause in their presentation of evidence to a grand jury, according to people with knowledge of the matter. The stunning development comes not long after the high-stakes inquiry appeared to be gaining momentum, and throws its future into serious doubt.
The prosecutors, Carey R. Dunne and Mark F. Pomerantz, submitted their resignations after the new Manhattan district attorney, Alvin Bragg, indicated to them that he had doubts about moving forward with a case against Mr. Trump, the people said. You see an overhyped investigation, others see a DA trying to protect Trump and prosecutors resigning in protest. You know, the whole 'the rich don't get punished for breaking the law'. I find it hard to believe there is no evidence of tax fraud when his accounting firm just retracted a decades worth of financial statements.
I find it hard to believe that the DA in question, Alvin Bragg, is covering for Trump. He is a Democrat and ran for election for District Attorney as the Democratic candidate.
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On February 24 2022 12:41 gobbledydook wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2022 08:36 Gorsameth wrote:On February 24 2022 08:18 Doc.Rivers wrote:Some interesting news about the NY state investigation into trump here. I suspected the media had overly hyped the case (almost goes without saying). Wonder if there will be any public statements from the departed prosecutors. Prosecutors Leading Trump Fraud Investigation in NY Resign https://nyti.ms/3HewK1bThe two prosecutors leading the Manhattan district attorney’s investigation into former President Donald J. Trump and his business practices abruptly resigned on Wednesday amid a monthlong pause in their presentation of evidence to a grand jury, according to people with knowledge of the matter. The stunning development comes not long after the high-stakes inquiry appeared to be gaining momentum, and throws its future into serious doubt.
The prosecutors, Carey R. Dunne and Mark F. Pomerantz, submitted their resignations after the new Manhattan district attorney, Alvin Bragg, indicated to them that he had doubts about moving forward with a case against Mr. Trump, the people said. You see an overhyped investigation, others see a DA trying to protect Trump and prosecutors resigning in protest. You know, the whole 'the rich don't get punished for breaking the law'. I find it hard to believe there is no evidence of tax fraud when his accounting firm just retracted a decades worth of financial statements. I find it hard to believe that the DA in question, Alvin Bragg, is covering for Trump. He is a Democrat and ran for election for District Attorney as the Democratic candidate.
Hasn't he stated publicly that he doesn't think he should prosecute a former president? Presidents are above the law apparently for crimes that happened before they were even a candidate.
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On February 24 2022 12:54 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2022 12:41 gobbledydook wrote:On February 24 2022 08:36 Gorsameth wrote:On February 24 2022 08:18 Doc.Rivers wrote:Some interesting news about the NY state investigation into trump here. I suspected the media had overly hyped the case (almost goes without saying). Wonder if there will be any public statements from the departed prosecutors. Prosecutors Leading Trump Fraud Investigation in NY Resign https://nyti.ms/3HewK1bThe two prosecutors leading the Manhattan district attorney’s investigation into former President Donald J. Trump and his business practices abruptly resigned on Wednesday amid a monthlong pause in their presentation of evidence to a grand jury, according to people with knowledge of the matter. The stunning development comes not long after the high-stakes inquiry appeared to be gaining momentum, and throws its future into serious doubt.
The prosecutors, Carey R. Dunne and Mark F. Pomerantz, submitted their resignations after the new Manhattan district attorney, Alvin Bragg, indicated to them that he had doubts about moving forward with a case against Mr. Trump, the people said. You see an overhyped investigation, others see a DA trying to protect Trump and prosecutors resigning in protest. You know, the whole 'the rich don't get punished for breaking the law'. I find it hard to believe there is no evidence of tax fraud when his accounting firm just retracted a decades worth of financial statements. I find it hard to believe that the DA in question, Alvin Bragg, is covering for Trump. He is a Democrat and ran for election for District Attorney as the Democratic candidate. Hasn't he stated publicly that he doesn't think he should prosecute a former president? Presidents are above the law apparently for crimes that happened before they were even a candidate.
It's a decent argument, it's why Obama didn't pursue Bush or his people for war crimes. Obama knew that could come back to bite him. Especially when we're talking about selective prosecution (charging the trump org with failing to pay taxes on a company car). My bet though is that they needed Weisellberg to flip to get trump, and that's not happening.
On February 24 2022 12:59 plasmidghost wrote:
The moment we've been dreading for a while is here. Solidarity with Ukraine.
Although it's not the United States' war to fight, certainly hoping for minimal casualties and hoping the people who post in thus very thread are okay. Almost seems safe to say that Ukraine is no more.
I do support the harshest of sanctions on Russia, I just don't hold any delusions about it being for a purpose other than preserving and expanding US power.
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United States44288 Posts
Ukraine had plenty of warning, if Russia successfully blitzkriegs them that would be the most successful military campaign since 1940.
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At the risk of digression from the main tragedy, I am baffled that an US Senator can't even spell capital city correctly. No wonder your politics is such a shit show.
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United States44288 Posts
On February 24 2022 13:34 calh wrote:
At the risk of digression from the main tragedy, I am baffled that an US Senator can't even spell capital city correctly. No wonder your politics is such a shit show.
It’s the Ukrainian spelling.
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I'll give the U.S. IC credit on this one, they nailed their assessment of how Russia would conduct this invasion, despite all the attacks that they were jumping the gun or spreading CIA lies. On a less amused note, I can only feel horror, anger, and consternation at what is happening, and my sympathies are with Ukraine and its people.
Europe will be a vastly different place after this. It sounds like the U.S. and its allies will be coordinating unprecedented sanctions on Russia, but as Russia's foreign minister basically said: You'll be sanctioning us anyways. Based on what I've read, Russia was anticipating sanctions and the heads are indifferent to it, so don't expect miracles here. Neighbouring NATO Baltic states and eastern countries like Poland are going to be terrified, and Sweden and Finland might make serious applications for NATO as well. Relations with the West and Russia will probably plummet to the lowest since the Cold War.
But in the end, no one will come to save Ukraine but itself and I fear that very soon, it will be run by a puppet government. We live in interesting times right now.
On February 24 2022 13:34 calh wrote:
At the risk of digression from the main tragedy, I am baffled that an US Senator can't even spell capital city correctly. No wonder your politics is such a shit show.
Kyiv is a viable spelling for Kiev.
The place name Kyiv is standardized in the authoritative database of Ukraine's toponyms maintained by Ukraine's mapping agency Derzhheokadastr. It has also been adopted by the United Nations GEGN Geographical Names Database,[39] the United States Board on Geographic Names,[40][41][42][43] the International Air Transport Association,[44][45] the European Union,[46] English-speaking foreign diplomatic missions[47] and governments,[48] several international organizations,[49] and the Encyclopædia Britannica. Some English-language news sources have adopted Kyiv in their style guides, including the AP,[50][51] CP,[52] Reuters,[53][54] and AFP[55] news services, media organizations in Ukraine,[56] and some media organizations in Canada,[52][57][58] the United Kingdom,[59][60][61] and the United States,[62][63][64] despite more resistance to the spelling change compared to others, like Beijing and Mumbai.[65]
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Nations can/have requested their various cities, and nations names be referred to a specific way by other governments. The czeck republic now being called Czechia and turkey trying to be called Türkiye in the future as recent examples.
any nation bordering russia has to be considering joining NATO or signing a firm defense pact with someone that has nuclear weapons this morning. Finland 100% will be applying by the end of the year.
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On February 24 2022 14:07 plasmidghost wrote:
Getting my updates from Reuters. What about y'all? Trying to keep up with everything
Watching the livethread on reddit.
https://www.reddit.com/live/18hnzysb1elcs
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On February 24 2022 13:54 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2022 13:34 calh wrote:
At the risk of digression from the main tragedy, I am baffled that an US Senator can't even spell capital city correctly. No wonder your politics is such a shit show. It’s the Ukrainian spelling.
They're referring to "capitol city". It's "capital".
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Yeah CNN saying troops have crossed the border from Belarus and there have been airstrikes.
On February 24 2022 11:45 Husyelt wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2022 08:51 TheTenthDoc wrote:On February 24 2022 08:07 Doc.Rivers wrote:On February 24 2022 04:08 JimmiC wrote:On February 24 2022 03:21 Doc.Rivers wrote:On February 24 2022 03:00 JimmiC wrote:On February 24 2022 02:32 Doc.Rivers wrote:On February 24 2022 00:57 Gorsameth wrote:And while I'm in some fashion these groups all talk to each other things are probably moving fast enough to can't get all their ducks in a row to seem unified in their response. Different people have different opinions, as it turns out. I'm not sure that it's notable to find different people on Fox saying things that are not in agreement. There are reasonable grounds for disagreement. You think its reasonable that Trump can both be "trolling" with his love of Putin and not? They are the opposite. Does he love him and think putin is right in what he doing or not? I take it that it is not the same person saying both that Trump is trolling and Trump is not trolling. If it was the same person, that would certainly be a self contradiction. If it is two different people, what's the issue? The issues is voters should know if Trump specifically, and the Republicans support Putins expansionism or not. It is a pretty keystone issue. When you start adding "trolling" to the mix, basically he and they can say just kidding at any point. How do you trust anything they say? And also there are pages and pages of Trump quotes saying the opposite things. And as pointed oit above, having a different veiw on say Jan 6th gets you censured. This should be a real easy one. You might disagree on exactly what action. But whether its OK or not is simple. Well, now the voters know that the more traditional Republicans are adamantly against it, while others are willing to acknowledge that Russia is basically acting like the US does on the world stage. On this and basically all other issues, there are varying opinions within the party, and the public knows that. As it turns out, only about a third of voters see russia's actions in Ukraine as a serious issue. 33% of dems and 23% of Republicans. How much do people have to huff the whataboutism fumes to believe that Russia's actions in Ukraine are "basically acting like the US does on the world stage"? The US did and still does lots of shitty and abhorrent things when it comes to foreign policy, but in the 21st century the invasion of Iraq and drone strikes are not geopolitically comparable to Russia's invasion and annexation of Crimea and current operations to seize more territory from Ukraine by fomenting separatists and "recognizing their independence." To be fair, we abandoned Afghanistan, and the Kurds in horrific fashion. We don't have much moral highground here. And the whole torture thing.
The onset of this crisis seems like an unfitting time to be preoccupied with moral high ground. I assume most can agree that a highly immoral invasion is currently proceeding.
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On February 24 2022 13:55 PhoenixVoid wrote:I'll give the U.S. IC credit on this one, they nailed their assessment of how Russia would conduct this invasion, despite all the attacks that they were jumping the gun or spreading CIA lies. On a less amused note, I can only feel horror, anger, and consternation at what is happening, and my sympathies are with Ukraine and its people. Europe will be a vastly different place after this. It sounds like the U.S. and its allies will be coordinating unprecedented sanctions on Russia, but as Russia's foreign minister basically said: You'll be sanctioning us anyways. Based on what I've read, Russia was anticipating sanctions and the heads are indifferent to it, so don't expect miracles here. Neighbouring NATO Baltic states and eastern countries like Poland are going to be terrified, and Sweden and Finland might make serious applications for NATO as well. Relations with the West and Russia will probably plummet to the lowest since the Cold War. But in the end, no one will come to save Ukraine but itself and I fear that very soon, it will be run by a puppet government. We live in interesting times right now. Show nested quote +On February 24 2022 13:34 calh wrote:
At the risk of digression from the main tragedy, I am baffled that an US Senator can't even spell capital city correctly. No wonder your politics is such a shit show. Kyiv is a viable spelling for Kiev. Show nested quote +The place name Kyiv is standardized in the authoritative database of Ukraine's toponyms maintained by Ukraine's mapping agency Derzhheokadastr. It has also been adopted by the United Nations GEGN Geographical Names Database,[39] the United States Board on Geographic Names,[40][41][42][43] the International Air Transport Association,[44][45] the European Union,[46] English-speaking foreign diplomatic missions[47] and governments,[48] several international organizations,[49] and the Encyclopædia Britannica. Some English-language news sources have adopted Kyiv in their style guides, including the AP,[50][51] CP,[52] Reuters,[53][54] and AFP[55] news services, media organizations in Ukraine,[56] and some media organizations in Canada,[52][57][58] the United Kingdom,[59][60][61] and the United States,[62][63][64] despite more resistance to the spelling change compared to others, like Beijing and Mumbai.[65]
Every single thing the intelligence community said was accurate, pretty amazing. My understanding is that this was a pretty global IC effort, though, it wasn't just the US, which is probably a large part of why the preliminary action was coordinated and the attempts at negotiation were so desperate. Thank god everything went public, we can only pray that the ~week of extra time that was bought helped save some lives.
Fuck every sack of garbage public figure who said that this was scaremongering, warmongering, and "red scare" overreacting to poor widdle Putin. Hope they take a second to realize how poor their perception of reality is and how easily they bought into the narrative of monsters (the ones who were paid to do so deserve another fate entirely).
I'd say fuck Trump too but I think that goes without saying. In a sane world his praise of Putin immediately before an invasion we were all told was coming would end his political career but we haven't lived in a sane world for a long time.
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I guess that puts to rest the notion that Putin is not that bad and will make all the whataboutism when we mention Russia stop, though I’m not too sure about that.
I think it will cost dear to various far right in Europe who are invariably aligned - when not firectly supported - by the Kremlin.
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Shit this is absolutely surreal. Stay safe Ukraine TLers <3
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Unconfirmed reports are that Putin recorded the declaration of war a few days ago.
Also apparently they are not using precision guided missiles and what they are using are hitting population centres, not just military targets.
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When does foreign military intervention come into play here, it feels that if Russia just gets to have Ukraine they’re going to start bitching about Russia being so close to NATO and start annexing everything around them.
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On February 24 2022 16:57 Zambrah wrote:
When does foreign military intervention come into play here, it feels that if Russia just gets to have Ukraine they’re going to start bitching about Russia being so close to NATO and start annexing everything around them.
I don't think Putin wants a full scale war with the west.
I think he's going to push at the boundary until it looks like a response is going to happen and then stop and claim victimhood.
edit: Also nice to see Trump hailing Putin as a 'genius' for his war on Ukraine.
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EPT
