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On December 10 2011 04:34 Kimaker wrote:
"There is nothing inhumane or animalistic about the death penalty. The concept of holding one responsible and delivering punishment for an act that is not in the immediacy of its occurrence is intrinsically human for its hindsight and attention to the past and its influence on the future. However, this does not make it right or good but simply, and most assuredly, human."- anonymous
There is no separation between human and "animalistic", we are evolved animals after all. That does not mean we should embrace everything that is in our nature.
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On December 10 2011 04:40 Noro wrote:
WTB Vigilante justice..
As I said, it's a Dexter case.
If only he were real...
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What an awkwardly racist start to the thread in 2007. Certainly a lot of ignorance of news trends and basic logic.
Murder and rape are terrible things, but they happen a lot the world. If you're disturbed so deeply by this to want to kill the people, how exactly do you view all the terrible things that go on throughout the world every day? Arbitrarily picking out one particularly sensational story and making it some sort of exception isn't reasonable.
The idea of wanting to kill the accused, or these fantasies of causing them pain, I don't think are acceptable. I myself don't believe in retribution in general. I don't understand what sick drives cause people to crave the death of those who cause pain and I don't know what they imagine to be the benefit of it.
People are just products of their society/upbringing and their genes. Punishing people for the sake of retribution because of their genetics and childhood doesn't seem productive. We certainly want to discourage their appalling behavior and help them change their behavior, but just wanting to go out and kill them or torture them? For what purpose? To satisfy the irrational, ignorant, vindictive, violent drives of the average person? I oppose that.
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On December 10 2011 04:27 logikly wrote:
If they are indeed found to be guilty then they should be put to death.
Horrible death for both of them. I've read many cases like this and this is, by far, one of the worst I've ever seen. And I've read a lot since I study in law.
I don't believe death sentence is the appropriate one... I mean, for what they have done, they deserve to be condemned for life imprisonment.
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How fucked up. Some people don't deserve to live.
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On December 10 2011 04:42 HeisHere wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2011 04:27 logikly wrote:
If they are indeed found to be guilty then they should be put to death. Horrible death for both of them. I've read many cases like this and this is, by far, one of the worst I've ever seen. And I've read a lot since I study in law. I don't believe death sentence is the appropriate one... I mean, for what they have done, they deserve to be condemned for life imprisonment.
Yeeeeah but do people really want their tax dollars to be going to keep this scum alive?
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Holy shit this is the most brutal thing I've ever read i think wtf.
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Our justice system is worthless. Criminals do this kind of shit because they know punishment is minimal and the absolute worst is execution which they won't feel anyway. We need to bring back eye for an eye punishment. You rape someone? Your punishment is rape. You horribly torture and murder someone? That someones family and loved ones get to do the same to you. This would deter so much more crime, and people like this would be scared shitless rather than not giving a shit, it's just sickening. If I had my way and a couple hours alone with these people (the ones who did this) I would have them wish they were never born, hell I'd have them wishing they WERE the people they did this TO.
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The amount of racism in this threads early years really makes my stomach turn.
What happened to these people was pretty fucked up and those people who did this deserve to be punished and probably killed for what they did.
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Cant believe I read this.. so extreme its making me sick.
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On December 10 2011 04:37 Phisk wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2011 04:24 OmiDeLta wrote:On December 10 2011 04:19 Maenander wrote:On December 10 2011 04:16 JudicatorHammurabi wrote:
It's one thing for some crazy jackasses to just murder some random person. But all that other stuff they did as well? What the hell is wrong with them. The fact that there's a retrial, (or rather, the fact that on day 1 of the first trial, the verdict was anything but immediate execution), is just disgusting. Consciously and deliberately doing something like that is practically inhuman. The only resolution is execution. I don't care if people are going to flame me for having said that, but this is one of the most fucked up things I've heard about, and it's not like it's made-up or exaggerated at that. wtf It's only natural to feel thirst for revenge, why should anyone flame you for it? Revenge has no place in the justice system, however. It's true. But what they did is unforgivable. I don't even think it's so much about revenge. Justice would be these people (I say people but they've lost the right to even be CALLED people, ne?) experiencing the same pain that they inflicted on that poor couple - although you may call me hypocritical; as much as I say this I would never have the stomach to brutalize someone like that unless I saw the crime happening in front of me...aie, I hope something like that never happens... Justice is that they experience the same pain? That type of "an eye for an eye"-justice worked in the dark ages, its hardly something that can be applied in any civilized society. If we did the same to them, how are we any better?
Yes. In my mind, it is justice. What would make us better? The reason for doing it. It's all about motive. But you are right. We cannot apply that in a civilized society.
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On December 10 2011 04:40 Maenander wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2011 04:34 Kimaker wrote:
"There is nothing inhumane or animalistic about the death penalty. The concept of holding one responsible and delivering punishment for an act that is not in the immediacy of its occurrence is intrinsically human for its hindsight and attention to the past and its influence on the future. However, this does not make it right or good but simply, and most assuredly, human."- anonymous
There is no separation between human and "animalistic", we are evolved animals after all. That does not mean we should embrace everything that is in our nature.
I look at it like this: Is a human an animal? Yes. Is an animal a human? No.
So to me, there is a distinction. I'm not really using it in a scientific sense, but in a descriptive sense as a way to demonstrate that we are different from most animals.
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If there was any crime in the world to use the insanity defense on..... oh wait Dahmer, pedophilia / cannibalism. But still...
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The amount of hatred that must have went into this crime is staggering. I'd really like to know what could possibly be so wrong with someone's mind that would make them want to do things like this to fellow Human-beings?
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Wow, that is incredibly disturbing. Just dump them in a hole to rot away or put an end to them and forget about this mess.
And now I checked the date the news came up. Four years? Holy shit, can't even imagine how terrible the families must feel to have to go through the trials again.
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On December 10 2011 04:42 Befree wrote:
What an awkwardly racist start to the thread in 2007. Certainly a lot of ignorance of news trends and basic logic.
Murder and rape are terrible things, but they happen a lot the world. If you're disturbed so deeply by this to want to kill the people, how exactly do you view all the terrible things that go on throughout the world every day? Arbitrarily picking out one particularly sensational story and making it some sort of exception isn't reasonable.
The idea of wanting to kill the accused, or these fantasies of causing them pain, I don't think are acceptable. I myself don't believe in retribution in general. I don't understand what sick drives cause people to crave the death of those who cause pain and I don't know what they imagine to be the benefit of it.
People are just products of their society/upbringing and their genes. Punishing people for the sake of retribution because of their genetics and childhood doesn't seem productive. We certainly want to discourage their appalling behavior and help them change their behavior, but just wanting to go out and kill them or torture them? For what purpose? To satisfy the irrational, ignorant, vindictive, violent drives of the average person? I oppose that.
And I thought hipsters were pretentious. The only way you could genuinely not understand is by being a fucking psychopath that doesn't even know emotion; otherwise you're just acting like a stuck up, morally superior cunt.
Fuck you for trying to gain moral e-cred on this subject, by the way.
User was temp banned for this post.
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On December 10 2011 04:51 HoldenR wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2011 04:42 Befree wrote:
What an awkwardly racist start to the thread in 2007. Certainly a lot of ignorance of news trends and basic logic.
Murder and rape are terrible things, but they happen a lot the world. If you're disturbed so deeply by this to want to kill the people, how exactly do you view all the terrible things that go on throughout the world every day? Arbitrarily picking out one particularly sensational story and making it some sort of exception isn't reasonable.
The idea of wanting to kill the accused, or these fantasies of causing them pain, I don't think are acceptable. I myself don't believe in retribution in general. I don't understand what sick drives cause people to crave the death of those who cause pain and I don't know what they imagine to be the benefit of it.
People are just products of their society/upbringing and their genes. Punishing people for the sake of retribution because of their genetics and childhood doesn't seem productive. We certainly want to discourage their appalling behavior and help them change their behavior, but just wanting to go out and kill them or torture them? For what purpose? To satisfy the irrational, ignorant, vindictive, violent drives of the average person? I oppose that. And I thought hipsters were pretentious. The only way you could genuinely not understand is by being a fucking psychopath that doesn't even know emotion; otherwise you're just acting like a stuck up, morally superior cunt. Fuck you for trying to gain moral e-cred on this subject, by the way.
Though crudely delivered, I agree with your point. It's natural to feel anger and to wish that the offenders would feel pain. If you don't feel sickened by this, I believe you would have to be completely apathetic. Nobody should be trying to take the moral high ground here. There are people out there who have completely lost every shred of humanity...and these criminals are of that sort.
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On December 10 2011 04:55 OmiDeLta wrote:Show nested quote +On December 10 2011 04:51 HoldenR wrote:On December 10 2011 04:42 Befree wrote:
What an awkwardly racist start to the thread in 2007. Certainly a lot of ignorance of news trends and basic logic.
Murder and rape are terrible things, but they happen a lot the world. If you're disturbed so deeply by this to want to kill the people, how exactly do you view all the terrible things that go on throughout the world every day? Arbitrarily picking out one particularly sensational story and making it some sort of exception isn't reasonable.
The idea of wanting to kill the accused, or these fantasies of causing them pain, I don't think are acceptable. I myself don't believe in retribution in general. I don't understand what sick drives cause people to crave the death of those who cause pain and I don't know what they imagine to be the benefit of it.
People are just products of their society/upbringing and their genes. Punishing people for the sake of retribution because of their genetics and childhood doesn't seem productive. We certainly want to discourage their appalling behavior and help them change their behavior, but just wanting to go out and kill them or torture them? For what purpose? To satisfy the irrational, ignorant, vindictive, violent drives of the average person? I oppose that. And I thought hipsters were pretentious. The only way you could genuinely not understand is by being a fucking psychopath that doesn't even know emotion; otherwise you're just acting like a stuck up, morally superior cunt. Fuck you for trying to gain moral e-cred on this subject, by the way. Though crudely delivered, I agree with your point. It's natural to feel anger and to wish that the offenders would feel pain. If you don't feel sickened by this, I believe you would have to be completely apathetic. Nobody should be trying to take the moral high ground here. There are people out there who have completely lost every shred of humanity...and these criminals are of that sort.
Some people realise that the justice system is more important then the emotional whims at the sight of such injustice.
Feeling emotions is different from being a slave to your emotions.
I can feel angry about this story but i can control myself and understand that violent payback is not what is called for here.
The difference as such isn't between one side feeling and another not. It's one side being dominated by their emotions and another remaining in control of themselves despite their emotions.
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On December 10 2011 04:42 Befree wrote:
What an awkwardly racist start to the thread in 2007. Certainly a lot of ignorance of news trends and basic logic.
Murder and rape are terrible things, but they happen a lot the world. If you're disturbed so deeply by this to want to kill the people, how exactly do you view all the terrible things that go on throughout the world every day? Arbitrarily picking out one particularly sensational story and making it some sort of exception isn't reasonable.
The idea of wanting to kill the accused, or these fantasies of causing them pain, I don't think are acceptable. I myself don't believe in retribution in general. I don't understand what sick drives cause people to crave the death of those who cause pain and I don't know what they imagine to be the benefit of it.
People are just products of their society/upbringing and their genes. Punishing people for the sake of retribution because of their genetics and childhood doesn't seem productive. We certainly want to discourage their appalling behavior and help them change their behavior, but just wanting to go out and kill them or torture them? For what purpose? To satisfy the irrational, ignorant, vindictive, violent drives of the average person? I oppose that.
If you can't hold someone accountable for their actions, then what do you do? Nothing? If someone is in the process of murdering someone and I have a gun am I not supposed to shoot them since we cannot hold them accountable?
This sort of logic floors me because of the issues it causes when applied to other areas of peoples lives. We can never praise someone for doing good, we cannot judge people for doing bad. Essentially all of our value judgments get throw out the window. Where does that leave society?
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EPT
