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We are extremely close to shutting down this thread for the same reasons the PUA thread was shut down. While some of the time this thread contains actual discussion with people asking help and people giving nice advice, it often gets derailed by rubbish that should not be here. The moderation team will be trying to steer this thread in a different direction from now on.

Posts of the following nature are banned:
1) ANYTHING regarding PUA. If your post contains the words 'alpha' or 'beta' or anything of that sort please don't hit post.
2) Stupid brags. You can tell us about your nice success stories with someone, but posts such as 'lol 50 Tinder matches' are a no-no.
3) Any misogynistic bullshit, including discussion about rape culture.
4) One night stands and random sex. These are basically brags that invariably devolve into gender role discussions and misogynistic comments.

Last chance, guys. This thread is for dating advice and sharing dating stories. While gender roles, sociocultural norms, and our biological imperative to reproduce are all tangentially related, these subjects are not the main purpose of the thread. Please AVOID these discussions. If you want to discuss them at length, go to PMs or start a blog. If you disagree with someone's ideologies, state that you disagree with them and why they won't work from a dating standpoint and move on. We will not tolerate any lengthy derailments that aren't directly about dating.
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States46620 Posts
March 20 2019 11:13 GMT
#20861
On March 20 2019 06:41 MysteryMeat1 wrote:
Signing a new lease with the gf the end of this week. I need to bring up the kids issue again before we have a 12 month lease together. Currently I'm on the fence with kids when she wants to be a full-time sahm with three kids. I'm closer to 1 maybe in a couple of years and if that goes very very well maybe maybe 2... I'll be turning 25 and she 24 for context.

I'd also eventually like to move back to Seattle while she never wants to go back.

I think my lack of wanting to have kids stem from the following:
1. Being young and having a hard time imagining having kids
2. Lack of free time having kids, affordability
3. No strong desire to have kids at the current time


I definitely agree with you that you and she should have that talk. Maybe these end up not being decisions that you and she need to act upon over the next year, but you definitely don't want to end up in a fight halfway through that lease about two of the biggest decisions in a relationship (whether or not to have children, and whether or not to significantly relocate).
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
bloodwhore~
Profile Joined September 2014
1010 Posts
March 20 2019 11:19 GMT
#20862
On March 20 2019 06:41 MysteryMeat1 wrote:
Signing a new lease with the gf the end of this week. I need to bring up the kids issue again before we have a 12 month lease together. Currently I'm on the fence with kids when she wants to be a full-time sahm with three kids. I'm closer to 1 maybe in a couple of years and if that goes very very well maybe maybe 2... I'll be turning 25 and she 24 for context.

I'd also eventually like to move back to Seattle while she never wants to go back.

I think my lack of wanting to have kids stem from the following:
1. Being young and having a hard time imagining having kids
2. Lack of free time having kids, affordability
3. No strong desire to have kids at the current time


I feel like the question if you should get a lease together is the least of your problems? She wants to have 3 kids AND be SAHM now? Shouldn't the question be if you're compatible long term or not?

Would you like for her to be a SAHM? Do you want to be the only one having a real job?
When do you think will be well of financially to support that?
Do you even want 3 kids? Can you budge on your current ideas?
When is the earliest time you want to have a child? How does that match up with her latest time?

I feel like if you don't decide now you might just end up a few years with your gf and decide to part ways later. Of course, maybe neither of you mind that for a few years. Something I would heavily consider though
"Allahu akbar" - Techies.
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18870 Posts
March 20 2019 11:20 GMT
#20863
On March 20 2019 06:41 MysteryMeat1 wrote:
Signing a new lease with the gf the end of this week. I need to bring up the kids issue again before we have a 12 month lease together. Currently I'm on the fence with kids when she wants to be a full-time sahm with three kids. I'm closer to 1 maybe in a couple of years and if that goes very very well maybe maybe 2... I'll be turning 25 and she 24 for context.

I'd also eventually like to move back to Seattle while she never wants to go back.

I think my lack of wanting to have kids stem from the following:
1. Being young and having a hard time imagining having kids
2. Lack of free time having kids, affordability
3. No strong desire to have kids at the current time

I don't see why you'd need to reach any sort of consensus on those big questions in order to enter into a 12 month lease. Based on my recollection, your take on having kids seems to be softening, so in that sense, it seems reasonable to expect that your mind might continue to change as time progresses.

Have you lived with her in similar circumstances already, or is this the largest living together commitment you'll have entered into? Do you feel any self-pressure to look elsewhere for someone who more closely aligns with your desires? How much do you like her? Those are some questions that might impact the how and why you want to push the kids issue before entering into the lease, because on its face, living with someone for 12 months under a contract has relatively little to do with future children concerns.
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
Acrofales
Profile Joined August 2010
Spain18487 Posts
March 20 2019 12:10 GMT
#20864
On March 20 2019 20:20 farvacola wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 20 2019 06:41 MysteryMeat1 wrote:
Signing a new lease with the gf the end of this week. I need to bring up the kids issue again before we have a 12 month lease together. Currently I'm on the fence with kids when she wants to be a full-time sahm with three kids. I'm closer to 1 maybe in a couple of years and if that goes very very well maybe maybe 2... I'll be turning 25 and she 24 for context.

I'd also eventually like to move back to Seattle while she never wants to go back.

I think my lack of wanting to have kids stem from the following:
1. Being young and having a hard time imagining having kids
2. Lack of free time having kids, affordability
3. No strong desire to have kids at the current time

I don't see why you'd need to reach any sort of consensus on those big questions in order to enter into a 12 month lease. Based on my recollection, your take on having kids seems to be softening, so in that sense, it seems reasonable to expect that your mind might continue to change as time progresses.

Have you lived with her in similar circumstances already, or is this the largest living together commitment you'll have entered into? Do you feel any self-pressure to look elsewhere for someone who more closely aligns with your desires? How much do you like her? Those are some questions that might impact the how and why you want to push the kids issue before entering into the lease, because on its face, living with someone for 12 months under a contract has relatively little to do with future children concerns.

Future, sure. But if she sees this as a significant step towards having a first child in the short-term, and quitting her job to be a SAHM, then clearly they aren't on the same page even now, and they probably shouldn't be together if her next step is "settle down and get pregnant" and his next step is "DINK to earn good money and then move back to Seattle"
farvacola
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States18870 Posts
March 20 2019 12:48 GMT
#20865
Indeed, if she is looking to make those moves soon, the concerns are warranted. However, if they’re floating goals subject to change, there’s much less of an issue, and I think it’s worthwhile to consider whether both MM1 and his gal might change their minds as they live together, which is why I’m curious as to the scope of their prior living arrangements.
"when the Dead Kennedys found out they had skinhead fans, they literally wrote a song titled 'Nazi Punks Fuck Off'"
GoTuNk!
Profile Blog Joined September 2006
Chile4591 Posts
March 20 2019 14:39 GMT
#20866
On March 20 2019 21:48 farvacola wrote:
Indeed, if she is looking to make those moves soon, the concerns are warranted. However, if they’re floating goals subject to change, there’s much less of an issue, and I think it’s worthwhile to consider whether both MM1 and his gal might change their minds as they live together, which is why I’m curious as to the scope of their prior living arrangements.


I wanna know that and their financial situations, so we can determine if they can afford it

As an aside, SAHM is great if you can afford it, dropping babies at day care when they are 2 years old is not the best for them.
IgnE
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7684 Posts
March 20 2019 15:28 GMT
#20867
2 year olds dropped at day care are probably better socialized than those staying at home driving their SAHM crazy
It is terrible to die of thirst at sea. Must you so salt your truth that it will no longer even slake thirst?
Excludos
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Norway8281 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-03-20 15:35:53
March 20 2019 15:35 GMT
#20868
On March 20 2019 23:39 GoTuNk! wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 20 2019 21:48 farvacola wrote:
Indeed, if she is looking to make those moves soon, the concerns are warranted. However, if they’re floating goals subject to change, there’s much less of an issue, and I think it’s worthwhile to consider whether both MM1 and his gal might change their minds as they live together, which is why I’m curious as to the scope of their prior living arrangements.


I wanna know that and their financial situations, so we can determine if they can afford it

As an aside, SAHM is great if you can afford it, dropping babies at day care when they are 2 years old is not the best for them.


Kindergarten starts when you're 1 year old here. Kids like to socialise as well you know.
GoTuNk!
Profile Blog Joined September 2006
Chile4591 Posts
March 20 2019 17:53 GMT
#20869
On March 21 2019 00:35 Excludos wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 20 2019 23:39 GoTuNk! wrote:
On March 20 2019 21:48 farvacola wrote:
Indeed, if she is looking to make those moves soon, the concerns are warranted. However, if they’re floating goals subject to change, there’s much less of an issue, and I think it’s worthwhile to consider whether both MM1 and his gal might change their minds as they live together, which is why I’m curious as to the scope of their prior living arrangements.


I wanna know that and their financial situations, so we can determine if they can afford it

As an aside, SAHM is great if you can afford it, dropping babies at day care when they are 2 years old is not the best for them.


Kindergarten starts when you're 1 year old here. Kids like to socialise as well you know.


Kids socializing =/= abandoning toddlers for the entire day in a place with a strong chance they will get both abused and neglected.


Artisreal
Profile Joined June 2009
Germany9235 Posts
March 20 2019 18:01 GMT
#20870
I'm not sure what kind of experiences but anecdotal you base your statement on, but sometimes it is wise to not judge the whole world based on a single perspective
passive quaranstream fan
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
March 20 2019 18:06 GMT
#20871
Yeah, I don't know what kind of shit daycare they have around him, but that isn't how it is where I am from or how it was when I was growing up. And I grew up in the wild and crazy time known as the 1980s, when playgrounds were made of concrete and cautionary tales. When they sold the toy known as lawn darts, the finest natural selection had to offer.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
GoTuNk!
Profile Blog Joined September 2006
Chile4591 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-03-20 18:16:36
March 20 2019 18:14 GMT
#20872
On March 21 2019 03:01 Artisreal wrote:
I'm not sure what kind of experiences but anecdotal you base your statement on, but sometimes it is wise to not judge the whole world based on a single perspective


Yeah every public service here sucks (except emergency health, I would say), people from the first world have no idea how government works outside their very functional government bubble. Even private daycares are bad.

That said, for a kid that young, being separated from their mom for a few hours at a young age is terrible trauma and should be avoided.

Couple that with being thrown in a place where they compete with 10+ other kids for the attention of a few if not one adult, and where if they receive any kind of abuse they can't comunicate it and it's def something I will not expose my kids to.

They will not be out of my or my wives sight until they can at least talk and we have bonded enough that they feel safe without us. They can perfectly socialize under supervision until then.


Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
March 20 2019 18:17 GMT
#20873
Man, I killed it in day care and loved it, so this is super weird. Kids are adaptable little people and are not getting enough credit for how resilient they are in this discussion(quality of day care not taken into account).
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
GoTuNk!
Profile Blog Joined September 2006
Chile4591 Posts
March 20 2019 18:19 GMT
#20874
On March 21 2019 03:17 Plansix wrote:
Man, I killed it in day care and loved it, so this is super weird. Kids are adaptable little people and are not getting enough credit for how resilient they are in this discussion(quality of day care not taken into account).


Would you say that is a universal experience for kids? You remember killing it at 1 years old?

Edit: I would not put my children on a government daycare under any circumstance. Private COULD be an option; first world countries could be different, here they are flat out dangerous.
Artisreal
Profile Joined June 2009
Germany9235 Posts
March 20 2019 18:23 GMT
#20875
I mean, I'm all for taking care of your kid yourself, especially in the early years, I'm basically close to your opinion. But I think some of your posts could use a little more scope. A slight hint that you're talking about a subset, not the whole.

I could let prejudice talk and figure from your TL location how the public services are, but I don't, cause that's not what people should do.
We should, in my humble opinion, differentiate and not generalise so often. So without providing the context, which was given in your last post, its a rather general statement that, due to the nature of our complex world, cannot apply everywhere.

Makes for easier constatation if you include what circumstances you're actually drawing your opinion from.

passive quaranstream fan
evilfatsh1t
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia8940 Posts
March 20 2019 18:30 GMT
#20876
the vast majority of newborns around me absolutely lose their shit if their parents arent with them so i cannot fathom how youd send your 1-2yr old to day care. i personally would wait at least until 3
GoTuNk!
Profile Blog Joined September 2006
Chile4591 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-03-20 18:35:53
March 20 2019 18:35 GMT
#20877
On March 21 2019 03:23 Artisreal wrote:
I mean, I'm all for taking care of your kid yourself, especially in the early years, I'm basically close to your opinion. But I think some of your posts could use a little more scope. A slight hint that you're talking about a subset, not the whole.

I could let prejudice talk and figure from your TL location how the public services are, but I don't, cause that's not what people should do.
We should, in my humble opinion, differentiate and not generalise so often. So without providing the context, which was given in your last post, its a rather general statement that, due to the nature of our complex world, cannot apply everywhere.

Makes for easier constatation if you include what circumstances you're actually drawing your opinion from.


I'm from latin america, expecting government services to be sub par is not prejudice, is reality. My country is the most developed in our region there are tons of good things about it, just not government daycares or child services in general (there was a huge scandal about it here, that over thousand of kids have been sexually abused, or killed over the last 20 years in government child service facilities)

That said, separating 1-2 year old toddlers from their parents for extended periods of time is def not good for them in any context. Morever, abusers exist everywhere and your kid being able to at least talk and trust you enough, is a must to me before you can leave him alone anywhere.
I'm not talking only about sexual abuse, I mean in daycares there is usually 1-2 adult in charge of many kids and they will ignore them or beat them up a non negligible percentage of the time. Sometimes even kids pick up on each other and 1 adult simply can't be on top of everything.

Edit: Also what poster above said.
IgnE
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7684 Posts
March 20 2019 18:42 GMT
#20878
i wonder how hunter-gatherers raised their children
It is terrible to die of thirst at sea. Must you so salt your truth that it will no longer even slake thirst?
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
March 20 2019 18:52 GMT
#20879
On March 21 2019 03:42 IgnE wrote:
i wonder how hunter-gatherers raised their children

Poorly? Not in a way that modern parents should model without careful research and thought?
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
IgnE
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7684 Posts
March 20 2019 19:36 GMT
#20880
You think they raised kids badly? Why is that?
It is terrible to die of thirst at sea. Must you so salt your truth that it will no longer even slake thirst?
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