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I agree with govie, the real start of the EU was the start of the European Coal and Steel Corporation, specifically the EU really started with the "Schuman Declaration" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Coal_and_Steel_Community). But of course long lasting peace was also one of the main goals.
..get worse and worse and supposed EU success of preventing war will become its biggest failure...
I actually think it's ridiculous to assume that we're going to end up in a war. Especially not between the bigger European countries. Sure Merkel and Hollande aren't exactly de Gaulle and Adenauer, but they sure as hell don't want to start a war, same goes for basically every other government in the EU. What i'm more worried about is the rise of right-wing & protest parties in the smaller countries. I think it's way more likely that some countries are, in the worst case, eventually going to "implode" as opposed to carrying their political problems across their borders.
Also the people are actually way smarter than 80 years before and basically we all just want to live our lives and not shoot other persons. Also most people won't buy the ridiculous propaganda that people were exposed to in WW I and WW II , so there's really no point to make comparisons.
Too bad there doesn't seem to be Poll numbers regarding Merkel herself and her austerity plans over time.
Well if you're talking about popularity, here in Germany Merkel is still very popular, in fact she's way more popular than her party (the CDU). Most people here seem to think she's dealing with the European crisis in a reasonable way, but that's mainly be cause we aren't really affected by the austerity measures(yet. I personally wonder who we're going to sell all our stuff to if no other country has any economy left).
Regarding other European countries, especially the southern ones, Merkel's and the austerity policies popularity has basically taken a nosedive and hit zero, especially after the Cyprus debt crisis, and after unemployment rates went up. Also Merkel/Hitler - caricatures seem to be quite popular and i personally think that's really unnecessary and totally over the top.
Although i of course can understand that the austerity measures have driven many people into poverty.
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Thanks govie, my history knowledge of the EU (and EEC before it) is embarrassingly small.
I echo Nyxisto's observations about Merkel's popularity in Germany. None of the austerity measures have really kicked in yet in Germany and it's economy hasn't been great but is doing well in the things that matter to people. Unemployment is low, and so is inflation. Those seem to be the main concerns in Germany. I think German media doesn't do a good job of representing how bad it is in other countries either, so Merkel is seen as doing well and protecting German interests from the lazy countries. That's not what I think, but there is this attitude in Germany that the German economy is stronger because Germans work(ed) harder and that workers in countries like Spain are overpaid and too demanding.
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Portugal plans to avoid the threat of needing another bailout by making another $6.3bn in cuts over the next three years, with measures including raising the retirement age by one year to 66 and laying off around 30,000 government workers, the prime minister has said.
Pedro Passos Coelho announced the proposals on Friday in a prime-time televised address to the nation. Portugal received a $102bn euro rescue in 2011 after overspending, heavy debts and weak growth left it close to bankruptcy amid the eurozone's financial crisis.
Passos Coelho warned the country couldn't expect the rest of Europe to throw it another financial lifeline and said Portugal must honour the terms of the three-year bailout agreement, which demands deep cuts in spending.
Some wealthier northern European countries have shown signs of bailout fatigue as the continent's southern nations, like Portugal, Spain and Greece, have gone to them for help.
With the eurozone financial crisis appearing far from over amid a broad European economic slowdown, asking for more money could aggravate political problems.
“The idea that Europe will always come to our aid is wrong,'' Passos Coelho said.
He added Portugal must show “our European partners that they have no reason to doubt our commitment'' to repairing the country's public finances.
The center-right coalition government will likely have a hard time, however, selling its latest austerity measures to a disgruntled public.
Source
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I wonder if greece will ever be able to get out of their crisis, because it looks pretty bad from what i've heard. That being said, im just happy that norway isn't a victim quite yet.
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On May 05 2013 01:40 Jan1997 wrote:
I wonder if greece will ever be able to get out of their crisis, because it looks pretty bad from what i've heard. That being said, im just happy that norway isn't a victim quite yet.
In the current state, Greece is pretty much stuck. They can limp along for quite a while, however, so that's what they'll be stuck doing. They're in a nasty place because of a whole lot of things: previous government overspending & overpromising, bad economic regulations, special interests powerful enough to stop useful changes, lots of graft, unpopular governments without enough power to actually change anything important, exterior control over their money supply, exterior political directives and a whole host of other tiny issues. It doesn't make for a fun situation.
Or you can think about it like most of the rest of the modern economies: the easiest way to "skip" dealing with a problem? Spend someone "else's" money. Works great... until you run out of that money. Which is where pretty much everyone but Japan & the USA are right now. Japan because all of their borrowing is from inside the country (effectively, the government owes the banks, which owes the Japanese population) and the USA because it seems the only "safe" place for large scale investors. (And it's also bad for us, as our politicians aren't really any better at keeping a budget)
So, Greece and the "PIIGS" limp along. They'll keep limping until Germany or France hits a nasty recession. Once the EU can't exert enough control on one of the countries, they'll split from the monetary union. When that happens, there will likely be a cascade effect, even if the Euro is almost effectively just a larger version of the deutsche mark already.
Oh, and war really isn't on the table, especially in the nuclear age. War takes Money, Men and Motivation. All 3 of which anyone in Europe currently lacks. Mass rioting and the collapse of some government systems is the more likely outcome. The one thing about the welfare state is that it eats apart any military budget, so there's not material to really mount a full scale war, especially in the modern sense.
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On May 05 2013 01:34 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Show nested quote +Portugal plans to avoid the threat of needing another bailout by making another $6.3bn in cuts over the next three years, with measures including raising the retirement age by one year to 66 and laying off around 30,000 government workers, the prime minister has said.
Pedro Passos Coelho announced the proposals on Friday in a prime-time televised address to the nation. Portugal received a $102bn euro rescue in 2011 after overspending, heavy debts and weak growth left it close to bankruptcy amid the eurozone's financial crisis.
Passos Coelho warned the country couldn't expect the rest of Europe to throw it another financial lifeline and said Portugal must honour the terms of the three-year bailout agreement, which demands deep cuts in spending.
Some wealthier northern European countries have shown signs of bailout fatigue as the continent's southern nations, like Portugal, Spain and Greece, have gone to them for help.
With the eurozone financial crisis appearing far from over amid a broad European economic slowdown, asking for more money could aggravate political problems.
“The idea that Europe will always come to our aid is wrong,'' Passos Coelho said.
He added Portugal must show “our European partners that they have no reason to doubt our commitment'' to repairing the country's public finances.
The center-right coalition government will likely have a hard time, however, selling its latest austerity measures to a disgruntled public. Source
30,000... that's just insane. There has to be a more productive way in solving the current crisis..
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On May 05 2013 02:30 maartendq wrote:Show nested quote +On May 05 2013 01:34 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Portugal plans to avoid the threat of needing another bailout by making another $6.3bn in cuts over the next three years, with measures including raising the retirement age by one year to 66 and laying off around 30,000 government workers, the prime minister has said.
Pedro Passos Coelho announced the proposals on Friday in a prime-time televised address to the nation. Portugal received a $102bn euro rescue in 2011 after overspending, heavy debts and weak growth left it close to bankruptcy amid the eurozone's financial crisis.
Passos Coelho warned the country couldn't expect the rest of Europe to throw it another financial lifeline and said Portugal must honour the terms of the three-year bailout agreement, which demands deep cuts in spending.
Some wealthier northern European countries have shown signs of bailout fatigue as the continent's southern nations, like Portugal, Spain and Greece, have gone to them for help.
With the eurozone financial crisis appearing far from over amid a broad European economic slowdown, asking for more money could aggravate political problems.
“The idea that Europe will always come to our aid is wrong,'' Passos Coelho said.
He added Portugal must show “our European partners that they have no reason to doubt our commitment'' to repairing the country's public finances.
The center-right coalition government will likely have a hard time, however, selling its latest austerity measures to a disgruntled public. Source 30,000... that's just insane. There has to be a more productive way in solving the current crisis..
Roughly 0.3% of the population.
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On May 05 2013 02:23 Taf the Ghost wrote:Show nested quote +On May 05 2013 01:40 Jan1997 wrote:
I wonder if greece will ever be able to get out of their crisis, because it looks pretty bad from what i've heard. That being said, im just happy that norway isn't a victim quite yet. In the current state, Greece is pretty much stuck. They can limp along for quite a while, however, so that's what they'll be stuck doing. They're in a nasty place because of a whole lot of things: previous government overspending & overpromising, bad economic regulations, special interests powerful enough to stop useful changes, lots of graft, unpopular governments without enough power to actually change anything important, exterior control over their money supply, exterior political directives and a whole host of other tiny issues. It doesn't make for a fun situation. Or you can think about it like most of the rest of the modern economies: the easiest way to "skip" dealing with a problem? Spend someone "else's" money. Works great... until you run out of that money. Which is where pretty much everyone but Japan & the USA are right now. Japan because all of their borrowing is from inside the country (effectively, the government owes the banks, which owes the Japanese population) and the USA because it seems the only "safe" place for large scale investors. (And it's also bad for us, as our politicians aren't really any better at keeping a budget) So, Greece and the "PIIGS" limp along. They'll keep limping until Germany or France hits a nasty recession. Once the EU can't exert enough control on one of the countries, they'll split from the monetary union. When that happens, there will likely be a cascade effect, even if the Euro is almost effectively just a larger version of the deutsche mark already. Oh, and war really isn't on the table, especially in the nuclear age. War takes Money, Men and Motivation. All 3 of which anyone in Europe currently lacks. Mass rioting and the collapse of some government systems is the more likely outcome. The one thing about the welfare state is that it eats apart any military budget, so there's not material to really mount a full scale war, especially in the modern sense.
Well, while I think you are pretty correct about most, the question of limping along is going to be possible for a far longer time after Greece had some of their privately owned debt defaulted earlier this year. The current european estimate for a change in Greece is about 10 years in the future with current plans. However, there is a growing support for stimulus as opposed to only austerity in the EU-circles to combat some of the unemployment so I guess you will see some investments in the future to at least boost the numbers for a while. The breakup of the EURO is not gonna happen any time soon since Germany has 2 very strong defenders of it as candidates for their election. Also, there is a belief that the market will start to blossom on its own with enough deregulation, so I am pretty sure it will take close to the full 10 years before we see true growth since reducing paperwork is the opposite of deregulation from EUs POV (deregulation means more overview to compensate for the loss of legal control in many cases so instead of spotinspections the companies has to document that things are being done legally!).
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On May 05 2013 02:23 Taf the Ghost wrote:Show nested quote +On May 05 2013 01:40 Jan1997 wrote:
I wonder if greece will ever be able to get out of their crisis, because it looks pretty bad from what i've heard. That being said, im just happy that norway isn't a victim quite yet. In the current state, Greece is pretty much stuck. They can limp along for quite a while, however, so that's what they'll be stuck doing. They're in a nasty place because of a whole lot of things: previous government overspending & overpromising, bad economic regulations, special interests powerful enough to stop useful changes, lots of graft, unpopular governments without enough power to actually change anything important, exterior control over their money supply, exterior political directives and a whole host of other tiny issues. It doesn't make for a fun situation. Or you can think about it like most of the rest of the modern economies: the easiest way to "skip" dealing with a problem? Spend someone "else's" money. Works great... until you run out of that money. Which is where pretty much everyone but Japan & the USA are right now. Japan because all of their borrowing is from inside the country (effectively, the government owes the banks, which owes the Japanese population) and the USA because it seems the only "safe" place for large scale investors. (And it's also bad for us, as our politicians aren't really any better at keeping a budget)So, Greece and the "PIIGS" limp along. They'll keep limping until Germany or France hits a nasty recession. Once the EU can't exert enough control on one of the countries, they'll split from the monetary union. When that happens, there will likely be a cascade effect, even if the Euro is almost effectively just a larger version of the deutsche mark already. Oh, and war really isn't on the table, especially in the nuclear age. War takes Money, Men and Motivation. All 3 of which anyone in Europe currently lacks. Mass rioting and the collapse of some government systems is the more likely outcome. The one thing about the welfare state is that it eats apart any military budget, so there's not material to really mount a full scale war, especially in the modern sense.
And the UK, Israel, India, and Brazil. These countries are fine as well. The interest rate issues (and ultimately debt as well) stem from not being in control of their own currency. It has very little to do with debt levels. In a way, you're right though, the problem is that they're running out of money. However, that problem can and should be solved by a central bank.
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On May 05 2013 02:30 maartendq wrote:Show nested quote +On May 05 2013 01:34 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Portugal plans to avoid the threat of needing another bailout by making another $6.3bn in cuts over the next three years, with measures including raising the retirement age by one year to 66 and laying off around 30,000 government workers, the prime minister has said.
Pedro Passos Coelho announced the proposals on Friday in a prime-time televised address to the nation. Portugal received a $102bn euro rescue in 2011 after overspending, heavy debts and weak growth left it close to bankruptcy amid the eurozone's financial crisis.
Passos Coelho warned the country couldn't expect the rest of Europe to throw it another financial lifeline and said Portugal must honour the terms of the three-year bailout agreement, which demands deep cuts in spending.
Some wealthier northern European countries have shown signs of bailout fatigue as the continent's southern nations, like Portugal, Spain and Greece, have gone to them for help.
With the eurozone financial crisis appearing far from over amid a broad European economic slowdown, asking for more money could aggravate political problems.
“The idea that Europe will always come to our aid is wrong,'' Passos Coelho said.
He added Portugal must show “our European partners that they have no reason to doubt our commitment'' to repairing the country's public finances.
The center-right coalition government will likely have a hard time, however, selling its latest austerity measures to a disgruntled public. Source 30,000... that's just insane. There has to be a more productive way in solving the current crisis..
The "funny"/sad part is by firing 30.000 people you now have 30.000 more who cannot pay there loans and have no money so spend on the economy. All your doing as a government by firing people is delay the problem another week and making more people suffer.
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On May 05 2013 04:07 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On May 05 2013 02:30 maartendq wrote:On May 05 2013 01:34 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Portugal plans to avoid the threat of needing another bailout by making another $6.3bn in cuts over the next three years, with measures including raising the retirement age by one year to 66 and laying off around 30,000 government workers, the prime minister has said.
Pedro Passos Coelho announced the proposals on Friday in a prime-time televised address to the nation. Portugal received a $102bn euro rescue in 2011 after overspending, heavy debts and weak growth left it close to bankruptcy amid the eurozone's financial crisis.
Passos Coelho warned the country couldn't expect the rest of Europe to throw it another financial lifeline and said Portugal must honour the terms of the three-year bailout agreement, which demands deep cuts in spending.
Some wealthier northern European countries have shown signs of bailout fatigue as the continent's southern nations, like Portugal, Spain and Greece, have gone to them for help.
With the eurozone financial crisis appearing far from over amid a broad European economic slowdown, asking for more money could aggravate political problems.
“The idea that Europe will always come to our aid is wrong,'' Passos Coelho said.
He added Portugal must show “our European partners that they have no reason to doubt our commitment'' to repairing the country's public finances.
The center-right coalition government will likely have a hard time, however, selling its latest austerity measures to a disgruntled public. Source 30,000... that's just insane. There has to be a more productive way in solving the current crisis.. The "funny"/sad part is by firing 30.000 people you now have 30.000 more who cannot pay there loans and have no money so spend on the economy. All your doing as a government by firing people is delay the problem another week and making more people suffer.
On the "bright" side, soon we will be able to move our production facilities to Portugal/Spain/Greece instead of China. Manual labour will be just as cheap, and it's a lot closer to the target markets. Blue collar workers will be all that's left since everyone with a degree will have migrated to other parts of Europe or South America.
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On May 05 2013 01:34 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Show nested quote +Portugal plans to avoid the threat of needing another bailout by making another $6.3bn in cuts over the next three years, with measures including raising the retirement age by one year to 66 and laying off around 30,000 government workers, the prime minister has said.
Pedro Passos Coelho announced the proposals on Friday in a prime-time televised address to the nation. Portugal received a $102bn euro rescue in 2011 after overspending, heavy debts and weak growth left it close to bankruptcy amid the eurozone's financial crisis.
Passos Coelho warned the country couldn't expect the rest of Europe to throw it another financial lifeline and said Portugal must honour the terms of the three-year bailout agreement, which demands deep cuts in spending.
Some wealthier northern European countries have shown signs of bailout fatigue as the continent's southern nations, like Portugal, Spain and Greece, have gone to them for help.
With the eurozone financial crisis appearing far from over amid a broad European economic slowdown, asking for more money could aggravate political problems.
“The idea that Europe will always come to our aid is wrong,'' Passos Coelho said.
He added Portugal must show “our European partners that they have no reason to doubt our commitment'' to repairing the country's public finances.
The center-right coalition government will likely have a hard time, however, selling its latest austerity measures to a disgruntled public. Source
They needed to be given 102bn, yet they only make 6.3bn over three years in cuts? Don't these number not seem to work?
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On May 05 2013 04:38 maartendq wrote:Show nested quote +On May 05 2013 04:07 Gorsameth wrote:On May 05 2013 02:30 maartendq wrote:On May 05 2013 01:34 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Portugal plans to avoid the threat of needing another bailout by making another $6.3bn in cuts over the next three years, with measures including raising the retirement age by one year to 66 and laying off around 30,000 government workers, the prime minister has said.
Pedro Passos Coelho announced the proposals on Friday in a prime-time televised address to the nation. Portugal received a $102bn euro rescue in 2011 after overspending, heavy debts and weak growth left it close to bankruptcy amid the eurozone's financial crisis.
Passos Coelho warned the country couldn't expect the rest of Europe to throw it another financial lifeline and said Portugal must honour the terms of the three-year bailout agreement, which demands deep cuts in spending.
Some wealthier northern European countries have shown signs of bailout fatigue as the continent's southern nations, like Portugal, Spain and Greece, have gone to them for help.
With the eurozone financial crisis appearing far from over amid a broad European economic slowdown, asking for more money could aggravate political problems.
“The idea that Europe will always come to our aid is wrong,'' Passos Coelho said.
He added Portugal must show “our European partners that they have no reason to doubt our commitment'' to repairing the country's public finances.
The center-right coalition government will likely have a hard time, however, selling its latest austerity measures to a disgruntled public. Source 30,000... that's just insane. There has to be a more productive way in solving the current crisis.. The "funny"/sad part is by firing 30.000 people you now have 30.000 more who cannot pay there loans and have no money so spend on the economy. All your doing as a government by firing people is delay the problem another week and making more people suffer. On the "bright" side, soon we will be able to move our production facilities to Portugal/Spain/Greece instead of China. Manual labour will be just as cheap, and it's a lot closer to the target markets. Blue collar workers will be all that's left since everyone with a degree will have migrated to other parts of Europe or South America.
Except Poland, which is a financially stable EU nation, is a far better place to set up cheap production. Free education and high unemployment make Poland far superior in this area, no?
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They have to make those cuts over three years, but those cuts aren't being made to pay back the loan, they are being made to show the country can manage its finances responsibly and therefore be left with the loan.
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On May 05 2013 05:51 Lonyo wrote:
They have to make those cuts over three years, but those cuts aren't being made to pay back the loan, they are being made to show the country can manage its finances responsibly and therefore be left with the loan.
No, I mean if they needed a 102bn bailout package, shouldn't their deficit be far more than 6bn over 3 years? Therefore don't they need to make bigger cuts than that? It just seems rather small compared to the bailout they got.
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On May 05 2013 05:54 nitram wrote:Show nested quote +On May 05 2013 05:51 Lonyo wrote:
They have to make those cuts over three years, but those cuts aren't being made to pay back the loan, they are being made to show the country can manage its finances responsibly and therefore be left with the loan. No, I mean if they needed a 102bn bailout package, shouldn't their deficit be far more than 6bn over 3 years? Therefore don't they need to make bigger cuts than that? It just seems rather small compared to the bailout they got.
Their banks are being bailed out, not the country. Their total government budget is in the 45bn Euro range.
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On May 05 2013 05:50 nitram wrote:Show nested quote +On May 05 2013 04:38 maartendq wrote:On May 05 2013 04:07 Gorsameth wrote:On May 05 2013 02:30 maartendq wrote:On May 05 2013 01:34 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Portugal plans to avoid the threat of needing another bailout by making another $6.3bn in cuts over the next three years, with measures including raising the retirement age by one year to 66 and laying off around 30,000 government workers, the prime minister has said.
Pedro Passos Coelho announced the proposals on Friday in a prime-time televised address to the nation. Portugal received a $102bn euro rescue in 2011 after overspending, heavy debts and weak growth left it close to bankruptcy amid the eurozone's financial crisis.
Passos Coelho warned the country couldn't expect the rest of Europe to throw it another financial lifeline and said Portugal must honour the terms of the three-year bailout agreement, which demands deep cuts in spending.
Some wealthier northern European countries have shown signs of bailout fatigue as the continent's southern nations, like Portugal, Spain and Greece, have gone to them for help.
With the eurozone financial crisis appearing far from over amid a broad European economic slowdown, asking for more money could aggravate political problems.
“The idea that Europe will always come to our aid is wrong,'' Passos Coelho said.
He added Portugal must show “our European partners that they have no reason to doubt our commitment'' to repairing the country's public finances.
The center-right coalition government will likely have a hard time, however, selling its latest austerity measures to a disgruntled public. Source 30,000... that's just insane. There has to be a more productive way in solving the current crisis.. The "funny"/sad part is by firing 30.000 people you now have 30.000 more who cannot pay there loans and have no money so spend on the economy. All your doing as a government by firing people is delay the problem another week and making more people suffer. On the "bright" side, soon we will be able to move our production facilities to Portugal/Spain/Greece instead of China. Manual labour will be just as cheap, and it's a lot closer to the target markets. Blue collar workers will be all that's left since everyone with a degree will have migrated to other parts of Europe or South America. Except Poland, which is a financially stable EU nation, is a far better place to set up cheap production. Free education and high unemployment make Poland far superior in this area, no?
The cynic in me thinks that Olli Rehn and Merkel will find a solution to that problem as well. I've lost every shred of hope that the EU will find a way to solve this crisis that does not include the impoverishing huge parts of its population. I had always believed that solidarity was one of the Union's bigger strenghts, but apparently I was wrong. The EU is completely divided between north and south now.
I don't get all the praise for Germany either. Their system that employs people at a fixed salary of 400 EUR / month for working fulltime jobs is humiliating for the people working there. Needless to say, companies like Zalando and Amazon love to make use of that.
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On May 05 2013 06:50 maartendq wrote:Show nested quote +On May 05 2013 05:50 nitram wrote:On May 05 2013 04:38 maartendq wrote:On May 05 2013 04:07 Gorsameth wrote:On May 05 2013 02:30 maartendq wrote:On May 05 2013 01:34 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Portugal plans to avoid the threat of needing another bailout by making another $6.3bn in cuts over the next three years, with measures including raising the retirement age by one year to 66 and laying off around 30,000 government workers, the prime minister has said.
Pedro Passos Coelho announced the proposals on Friday in a prime-time televised address to the nation. Portugal received a $102bn euro rescue in 2011 after overspending, heavy debts and weak growth left it close to bankruptcy amid the eurozone's financial crisis.
Passos Coelho warned the country couldn't expect the rest of Europe to throw it another financial lifeline and said Portugal must honour the terms of the three-year bailout agreement, which demands deep cuts in spending.
Some wealthier northern European countries have shown signs of bailout fatigue as the continent's southern nations, like Portugal, Spain and Greece, have gone to them for help.
With the eurozone financial crisis appearing far from over amid a broad European economic slowdown, asking for more money could aggravate political problems.
“The idea that Europe will always come to our aid is wrong,'' Passos Coelho said.
He added Portugal must show “our European partners that they have no reason to doubt our commitment'' to repairing the country's public finances.
The center-right coalition government will likely have a hard time, however, selling its latest austerity measures to a disgruntled public. Source 30,000... that's just insane. There has to be a more productive way in solving the current crisis.. The "funny"/sad part is by firing 30.000 people you now have 30.000 more who cannot pay there loans and have no money so spend on the economy. All your doing as a government by firing people is delay the problem another week and making more people suffer. On the "bright" side, soon we will be able to move our production facilities to Portugal/Spain/Greece instead of China. Manual labour will be just as cheap, and it's a lot closer to the target markets. Blue collar workers will be all that's left since everyone with a degree will have migrated to other parts of Europe or South America. Except Poland, which is a financially stable EU nation, is a far better place to set up cheap production. Free education and high unemployment make Poland far superior in this area, no? I don't get all the praise for Germany either. Their system that employs people at a fixed salary of 400 EUR / month for working fulltime jobs is humiliating for the people working there. Needless to say, companies like Zalando and Amazon love to make use of that.
What? 400 € (it's 450 € now) is what you can make tax free without affecting either your unemployment benefits, your basic welfare or your "student salary". If you consider 45 hours a month (10 € an hour seems to be the standard for work that doesn't require any experience, at least here in the south) a fulltime job, I'd love to live in Belgium.
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On May 05 2013 07:04 kafkaesque wrote:Show nested quote +On May 05 2013 06:50 maartendq wrote:On May 05 2013 05:50 nitram wrote:On May 05 2013 04:38 maartendq wrote:On May 05 2013 04:07 Gorsameth wrote:On May 05 2013 02:30 maartendq wrote:On May 05 2013 01:34 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:Portugal plans to avoid the threat of needing another bailout by making another $6.3bn in cuts over the next three years, with measures including raising the retirement age by one year to 66 and laying off around 30,000 government workers, the prime minister has said.
Pedro Passos Coelho announced the proposals on Friday in a prime-time televised address to the nation. Portugal received a $102bn euro rescue in 2011 after overspending, heavy debts and weak growth left it close to bankruptcy amid the eurozone's financial crisis.
Passos Coelho warned the country couldn't expect the rest of Europe to throw it another financial lifeline and said Portugal must honour the terms of the three-year bailout agreement, which demands deep cuts in spending.
Some wealthier northern European countries have shown signs of bailout fatigue as the continent's southern nations, like Portugal, Spain and Greece, have gone to them for help.
With the eurozone financial crisis appearing far from over amid a broad European economic slowdown, asking for more money could aggravate political problems.
“The idea that Europe will always come to our aid is wrong,'' Passos Coelho said.
He added Portugal must show “our European partners that they have no reason to doubt our commitment'' to repairing the country's public finances.
The center-right coalition government will likely have a hard time, however, selling its latest austerity measures to a disgruntled public. Source 30,000... that's just insane. There has to be a more productive way in solving the current crisis.. The "funny"/sad part is by firing 30.000 people you now have 30.000 more who cannot pay there loans and have no money so spend on the economy. All your doing as a government by firing people is delay the problem another week and making more people suffer. On the "bright" side, soon we will be able to move our production facilities to Portugal/Spain/Greece instead of China. Manual labour will be just as cheap, and it's a lot closer to the target markets. Blue collar workers will be all that's left since everyone with a degree will have migrated to other parts of Europe or South America. Except Poland, which is a financially stable EU nation, is a far better place to set up cheap production. Free education and high unemployment make Poland far superior in this area, no? I don't get all the praise for Germany either. Their system that employs people at a fixed salary of 400 EUR / month for working fulltime jobs is humiliating for the people working there. Needless to say, companies like Zalando and Amazon love to make use of that. What? 400 € (it's 450 € now) is what you can make tax free without affecting either your unemployment benefits, your basic welfare or your "student salary". If you consider 45 hours a month (10 € an hour seems to be the standard for work that doesn't require any experience, at least here in the south) a fulltime job, I'd love to live in Belgium.
Try 450€ a month at a maximum of 15 hours a week. That works out to just under 7€ an hour.
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EPT
