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Lalalaland34503 Posts
On June 25 2011 00:01 abominare wrote:http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=channel&channelID=3519CCP really needs to learn how to moderate forums. So much bitching over Aurum, a leaked internal discussion newsletter, and people mad about having a captains quarters. In PvP i quite look forward to the prospect of killing some ones bought with aurum but still incredibly failfit ship. Also Eve is apparently dying (again damn nine lives!) For those who are enjoying their first expansion in eve, it is a common ritual for the eve community to supposedly cancel all subs cry the sky is falling and eve is dead and complain that some one actually updated the game and thus broke it for eternity leading to eve dying.
The leaked .pdf was really disturbing. Buy useless clothes to look good? Fine. Buy useful things such as agent standings, special faction ammo, etc? Hell no, tyvm. CCP really needs to come clean about their intentions with microtransactions before they alienate their player base.
But as for QQing about captain's quarters... I don't get it. People can choose not to use it instead of whining, even if they (I included) have a few problems with the boring door backdrop. The only things that really annoys me about CQ itself is how slowly you walk around and the massive fps drop.
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I'm going to be all elitist and say my comp doesn't get fps drops in the Captains quarters because it's baller as fuck.
I don't ever want to leave my quarters in our home station when they put it in, massive in-corp troll fest. Hextuple lock and barricade your doors people
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United States7481 Posts
honestly i was against the idea of microtransactions that affect the game at first but then i realized that's been implemented for quite a while, officially, in eve, with PLEX
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I want to break into people's cabins and rearrange their stuff, every day for a month.
Then steal it
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yes but plex does not allow you to buy anything a normal player cannot. If MT trading allows you to but things that only aur can purchase- that is better than anything in game- then i am gong to have a problem.
If it is just for vanity items, then i really don't give a shit. I just hope that we can destroy vanity items by podding people 
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United States7481 Posts
On June 25 2011 00:44 Ramiel wrote:yes but plex does not allow you to buy anything a normal player cannot. If MT trading allows you to but things that only aur can purchase- that is better than anything in game- then i am gong to have a problem. If it is just for vanity items, then i really don't give a shit. I just hope that we can destroy vanity items by podding people
can't you buy aur with isk?
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On June 25 2011 00:33 Firebolt145 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2011 00:01 abominare wrote:http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=channel&channelID=3519CCP really needs to learn how to moderate forums. So much bitching over Aurum, a leaked internal discussion newsletter, and people mad about having a captains quarters. In PvP i quite look forward to the prospect of killing some ones bought with aurum but still incredibly failfit ship. Also Eve is apparently dying (again damn nine lives!) For those who are enjoying their first expansion in eve, it is a common ritual for the eve community to supposedly cancel all subs cry the sky is falling and eve is dead and complain that some one actually updated the game and thus broke it for eternity leading to eve dying. The leaked .pdf was really disturbing. Buy useless clothes to look good? Fine. Buy useful things such as agent standings, special faction ammo, etc? Hell no, tyvm. CCP really needs to come clean about their intentions with microtransactions before they alienate their player base. But as for QQing about captain's quarters... I don't get it. People can choose not to use it instead of whining, even if they (I included) have a few problems with the boring door backdrop. The only things that really annoys me about CQ itself is how slowly you walk around and the massive fps drop.
As far as the memo goes, it was definitely blown out of proportion, it was so over the top and tongue in cheek I got a few good laughs. It wasn't meant for the general public to read but if thats the worse they can do you people should read the stuff brokers/funds say behind closed doors. This was a discussion inside of the company, not a defined business plan, I would expect anyone in their position to be looking at all the options and variables.
That Said
I have factions standing of great than 7 for most of the core empire factions. I really wouldnt be bothered with people paying for them though, with the changes to how agents work faction/corp standings are silly easy to get, if you want them you can get them typically in a weekend.
I actually don't care if some one goes and buys supar dupar fancy ammo or a fancy special ship. The vast majority of the population in eve can barely breathe with their mouths closed. It'll literally be 99% of the time some one doing as stupid as a job as the recent 1 billion isk hurricane. It really no different to me than some one buy a plex selling it for isk and buying a dram with domination ammo. More lul kms and if the monocle has shown us anything these ships will not be cheap enough to flood the market anyways.
Can they actually screw the pooch and ruin the market and break eve, yes. However, if they've managed thus far without going under I think it'll be alright.
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Lalalaland34503 Posts
On June 25 2011 00:40 Antoine wrote:
honestly i was against the idea of microtransactions that affect the game at first but then i realized that's been implemented for quite a while, officially, in eve, with PLEX
That is different. If you use the PLEX to buy isk, you're still buying things made by other pilots: if you buy a nyx with that money, the nyx was made by characters in game. This new system will involve products from outside the EVE economy, if that makes sense (all the clothes are made by CCP rather than players).
Secondly, the clothes store isn't so bad because they are purely vanity items that have no real impact on the game. What most players are afraid of is when microtransactions move into the territory of buying special faction ammo or other special advantages.
edit @ abom: I agree with most of what you are saying. But where does it go from 'whatever this is just funny and a few minor things I can deal with' to, 'now I can't compete any more without spending money on AURUM'? It is an incredibly touchy subject that will not work unless CCP is completely transparent about their plans and takes care to listen to the community response. In this scenario, the document got leaked and the overall response was 'OMG CCP was doing this behind our backs!'
Also CCP's crisis management has left much to be desired. They ignored the leaked document for a few days before acknowledging it and responding. IMO the first thing they should have done was release a statement, first to confirm whether the document was real or fake, and what purpose the document actually had. The lack of communication after this event simply made the players even angrier.
edit2: For a company that has the following motto: "CCP encourages respect, dialog, interaction and cooperation on a deeper level between its employees and customers than is common in online games. By this and through this CCP provides a unique way for improving the quality of its products", CCP have obviously screwed up a lot here.
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On June 25 2011 00:51 Firebolt145 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2011 00:40 Antoine wrote:
honestly i was against the idea of microtransactions that affect the game at first but then i realized that's been implemented for quite a while, officially, in eve, with PLEX That is different. If you use the PLEX to buy isk, you're still buying things made by other pilots: if you buy a nyx with that money, the nyx was made by characters in game. This new system will involve products from outside the EVE economy, if that makes sense (all the clothes are made by CCP rather than players). Secondly, the clothes store isn't so bad because they are purely vanity items that have no real impact on the game. What most players are afraid of is when microtransactions move into the territory of buying special faction ammo or other special advantages.
I dont understand that fear. Its one thing to be afraid of that in a game where your gear is forever, like buying a super powerful sword you'll never lose and one shot people with.
In eve, everything dies. Jump into a gate camp? There goes your 60$ ship. Go buy a new one. Unless they're going to offer these ships at insanely cheap prices(like partial dollar cheap), this really shouldn't mess with market, and lets be honest with a 60$ monocle whats the likelihood of ships being cheap?
They probly should have responded quicker, but I understand them wanting to see if the shit blows over. Remember this is the internet, a few days ago people on the same forums were calling for peoples heads over the eve server being down during the ddos attack, now no one is even really talking about it and there was little acknowledgment from ccp.
As far as competing with people spending aurum, how do you compete with the people who buy plexes and bring their fancy faction stuff to oddeluff? I hear the hatchery has to stay docked whenever some one brings a faction fit tengu in the home system
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On June 25 2011 00:33 Firebolt145 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2011 00:01 abominare wrote:http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=channel&channelID=3519CCP really needs to learn how to moderate forums. So much bitching over Aurum, a leaked internal discussion newsletter, and people mad about having a captains quarters. In PvP i quite look forward to the prospect of killing some ones bought with aurum but still incredibly failfit ship. Also Eve is apparently dying (again damn nine lives!) For those who are enjoying their first expansion in eve, it is a common ritual for the eve community to supposedly cancel all subs cry the sky is falling and eve is dead and complain that some one actually updated the game and thus broke it for eternity leading to eve dying. The leaked .pdf was really disturbing. Buy useless clothes to look good? Fine. Buy useful things such as agent standings, special faction ammo, etc? Hell no, tyvm. CCP really needs to come clean about their intentions with microtransactions before they alienate their player base. But as for QQing about captain's quarters... I don't get it. People can choose not to use it instead of whining, even if they (I included) have a few problems with the boring door backdrop. The only things that really annoys me about CQ itself is how slowly you walk around and the massive fps drop.
Do you use Arch Angel ammo ?
Im pretty sure you dont, and im pretty sure that all in all it is the same principle as a super faction ammo bought through aurum...
On June 25 2011 00:44 Ramiel wrote:yes but plex does not allow you to buy anything a normal player cannot. If MT trading allows you to but things that only aur can purchase- that is better than anything in game- then i am gong to have a problem. If it is just for vanity items, then i really don't give a shit. I just hope that we can destroy vanity items by podding people
Yeah and people wont put their shiney new items bought with auror on the market 30 seconds after........ (just like what happened for monocle maybe ?)
same shit as buying plexes
just cause you have money doesnt mean you would put a cn invuln on your drake is it ? now why would you put that aurum invuln ?...
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And you guys actually got that thing to drop? That's impressive!
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I wonder how much isk you could make by "selling" aurum etc
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On June 25 2011 01:07 Body_Shield wrote:
I wonder how much isk you could make by "selling" aurum etc
Aurum is last years PI speculation. Instead of people buying huge stockpiles of robotics and electronics, plex is the market. Its a rather interesting field though since noble items are a gradual release, but I have a feeling without some serious manipulation the margins will be pretty slim.
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Lalalaland34503 Posts
With us in particular, yes we probably don't care what people buy what ships and lose it to us for lulz. But for people that play EVE for it being a sandbox where you can do anything without outside influences, this has a particularly large impact.
I'm still trying to find a post I read on the EO forums summarising all the major points...unfortunately there are 90 pages to sift through to find it. :/
edit: This is the best post I've found so far:
There's about 70 pages of decent posts and good old fashioned rage about the future of eve at this point, and I don't really feel i can add to that. I do support the demand that you guys at CCP need to answer whether microtransactions are going to be vanity only or not. If they are, as you've said for a long time, you guys need to develop a plan internally to stick to that and make sure that all actions regarding future offerings in the noble exchange stick to that. Every time you cross this line again, you lose more of your playerbase permanently from mistrust, and you lose thousands of potential subscribers from bad word-of-mouth. If, on the other hand, game-altering microtransactions are coming, it's been very nice playing your spaceship game and i wish you all the best, but i won't be bothering to play it any longer. as an aside, there is an important note I have to point out here regarding PLEX - I understand it's the opinion of many within CCP that PLEX are very definitely not a vanity-only item themselves, and that there should be no real reason why players of EVE are opposed to gamealtering microtransactions. IMHO, the real difference with PLEX is that value is created for everyone; the seller gets isk for rl cash, the buyer gets gametime for isk, CCP get more subs and combats RMT. Nowhere are items spawned out of nothing, and everyone is fairly happy. Meanwhile, for game-altering MTs like ships and ammo and standings, it cheapens the weight of gameplay and makes everyone feel like they have to pay double to compete; CCP are really the only ones who benefit.So, now that i've gotten all the stuff everyone else is concerned with out of the way, I did want to address some points here though: Originally by: CCP Pann Show nested quote +As I see it, the chief complaint is regarding the high cost of goods in the Noble Market. Second, many people are unhappy about the Captain’s Quarters. Third, there are some performance issues with Incarna. a) regarding the costs of items in the plex store, IMHO the best solution is to cut the prices drastically (maybe 50-100 AUR?) and make the items destructable when you're podded. Reimburse the players who have already bought monocles with some AUR. Having the items be indestructable sets a bad precedent for future iterations of the store ('why is my monocle indestructable but my ship's paint job isn't?'), and even from your perspective having the prices high and the items indestructable limits the market to the super rich (when it should really cater to everyone, if you're actually looking to make money) and hurts the long-term profitability (why sell half a dozen $70 monocles when you could sell thousands of $.20 monocles multiple times?) b) CQ. Make the loadin optional. I'm fine with even it being the default setting to load into CQ. The screenshot posted in this thread is perfect; i like the idea of having a feed from a camera drone in your hangar piped directly into your quarters viewscreen as an option, too. That way, everyone can spin ships, loadin/loadout easily, and still get that awesome sense of scale about the size of their ships when they want to. c)performance. I don't really have a lot to say, apart from moar optimizations are needed and that i'm glad you guys rolled this out incrementally. CQ makes my CPU very unhappy. Looking forward to the devblog later today, i can safely say this is the longest wall of text I've posted ever.
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The change is essentially cosmetic, that is: instead of buying and then selling game time for ingame money to buy stuff, you just buy stuff. All this mess derives from the idea that microtransactions = eve will become a facebook game.
yes but plex does not allow you to buy anything a normal player cannot. If MT trading allows you to but things that only aur can purchase- that is better than anything in game- then i am gong to have a problem.
![[image loading]](http://cdn1.eveonline.com/community/devblog/2011/currencyCycle_t.jpg)
We can buy aurum with ISK anyway.
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I mean, just call aurum ''isk 2'' and call the noble items ''meta 15'' and you quickly understand that it doesnt change much.
(except for the fact those items are created out of thin air, just like plex's)
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On June 25 2011 01:41 Soap wrote:+ Show Spoiler +The change is essentially cosmetic, that is: instead of buying and then selling game time for ingame money to buy stuff, you just buy stuff. All this mess derives from the idea that microtransactions = eve will become a facebook game. yes but plex does not allow you to buy anything a normal player cannot. If MT trading allows you to but things that only aur can purchase- that is better than anything in game- then i am gong to have a problem. We can buy aurum with ISK anyway.
It has been established before that there is more to it than that, maybe you go back and read Firebolt's posts again.
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Hyrule19208 Posts
I demand stupid clothes and monocles and implants on podmails.
DEMAND
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On June 25 2011 02:03 ain wrote:Show nested quote +On June 25 2011 01:41 Soap wrote:+ Show Spoiler +The change is essentially cosmetic, that is: instead of buying and then selling game time for ingame money to buy stuff, you just buy stuff. All this mess derives from the idea that microtransactions = eve will become a facebook game. yes but plex does not allow you to buy anything a normal player cannot. If MT trading allows you to but things that only aur can purchase- that is better than anything in game- then i am gong to have a problem. We can buy aurum with ISK anyway. It has been established before that there is more to it than that, maybe you go back and read Firebolt's posts again.
I really don't see that it has been established. See the two quotes from the "leaked" CCP document I posted before. Also, if I fit T2 fit a battle ship it is most likely a superior ship to a T1 fitted battleship. I have achieved superiority by having more capital. If I decide that I don't want to wait 12 months to reach a certain amount of SP and purchase a character from the character bazaar: I have achieved superiority by having more capital.
[edit]
Also, the stuff in the NEX store is shit. Seriously, even if it was 1/10 of the price it wouldn't be worth it for any reason. It kinda disappoints me that it was the best CCP could come up with, where is the ninja suit, the pirate outfit, the samurai warrior get up or whatever....pfft
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On June 25 2011 02:33 tofucake wrote:
I demand stupid clothes and monocles and implants on podmails.
DEMAND
Also the Clone Grade
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EPT
