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On October 16 2012 08:27 Deadlyhazard wrote:
Vanilla PvP was best but only because world pvp was extremely common and people couldn't entirely escape a situation by just flying up high in the air. You could always find someone.
Sooooooooooo much agreement with this. World PvP in Vanilla made some of my funnest, infuriating and satisfying moments in WoW. Surviving took skill, escaping took skill, all around it was the most gratifying PvP experience ever. As convenient as flying is, part of me really wishes we couldn't.
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On October 16 2012 09:27 deth2munkies wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 09:06 Serejai wrote:On October 16 2012 08:29 deth2munkies wrote:On October 16 2012 06:45 Serejai wrote:On October 16 2012 06:26 deth2munkies wrote:On October 16 2012 06:23 AimlessAmoeba wrote:
Pretty sure I'm going blind from running dailies... And once you hit revered with GL/Klax they give you MOAR. MOAR I SAY. And they say that you "only have to do what you want to do" but if you want to get geared to raid with your guild you have no choice -_-
MoP has only been out for a couple weeks and I already feel as though I'm burning out.
Look at it this way: It beats farming mobs for random drops while wearing a shitty trinket (fuck you Argent Dawn). Disagree on this. In theory the quests should be more enjoyable because they rotate and whatnot but in reality they're so poorly designed that they're actually more tedious and boring than simply grinding mobs is. Disregarding that there's another major flaw; Grinding was at my own pace. If I wanted to knock out an entire rep in a single day I could. I could set aside ten hours, turn some music on, stack my desk with drink and chips then go to town. At the end of the day I got what I wanted and never had to do it again. With dailies you can't do that. If I have ten hours in a day and I want to grind my rep up for Enchanting patterns or VP gear or even a mount... I can't. I'm limited to about 15-30 minutes per day and after I finish I get to sit on my ass in Org and wait until they reset. This forced gating tends to make dailies stressful for a lot of people (myself included). I'm all for rep grinds - I want the game to take effort again like it did in vanilla and TBC. However, I don't want Blizzard telling me how much effort I can put it at a time. That just annoys me and makes things feel repetitive. One of the selling points for MoP was that Blizzard was going to make the content less linear and provide more methods to reach the same goals. They failed terribly at this and in actuality did the exact opposite. So I completely agree with the first post. If I do ten hours of grinding in a day I feel much, much, much less burnt out that when I'm being forced to split it up into 15 minutes a day over the span of a month (and yes, the daily quests are literally just grinding with some "lore" attached). I just wholeheartedly disagree. I cannot stand sitting in a particular place killing mobs for no real reason other than hope for random drops. I burned myself out on that during Vanilla and just couldn't do it after a bit of BC. The thing I DID like was that there were little neat "mini dungeons" you could explore. Slaughterhouses in Plaguelands usually had some sort of elite/rare/quest mob at the bottom that you could fight your way to. I enjoyed setting those little challenges for myself, exploring looking for challenging mobs. The rise of Thottbott/alakazam/wowwiki/wowhead kinda took a lot of that out of the equation, but it's still something that you COULD do before dailies became the norm. The good part about dailies is that you can plot out exactly how long it's going to take you to do something so you're on a more regular "reward schedule" and it doesn't feel like an endless grind where you can get shat on by the RNG and only get 20 scourgestones in 2 hours. I don't have MoP, but I recall from cata, 25 dailies took 2-2 1/2 hours to beat per day (including competition for/respawning mobs, travel times, and having a suboptimal PvE farming spec because you're raid spec), it could be significantly faster or slower depending on a few factors. I'd rather do that once a day while chatting on Vent or listening to music or something then be able to make my own fun by raiding/PvP/doing SOMETHING and know that by doing it for X days I'll be done, rather than spending those 2 hours grinding random mobs hoping I scrounge up enough random drops to make the time worth it and not knowing how much longer it will take. Well see that's the problem. I would rather spend 10 hours at once to grind my rep and you would rather spend an hour at a time spread over ten sessions to do the same. Now, that's the fundamental issue with MoP. Blizzard claimed this expansion was all about choices and being open and yet it's extremely linear. Players like myself are forced to do dailies we don't want to do. Why not have rep tabards for people who want to grind heroics? Why not have a Runecloth-style repeatable quest for people who want to grind their rep? Mists of Pandaria is pretty much the exact opposite of what vanilla was. While vanilla catered to hardcore/grinding players who could get ahead by spending more time upfront doing something Mists of Pandaria caters to people who want to take it slow and steady and break up their playtime into chunks. Again, there's nothing wrong with how dailies currently are in the expansion if you look at them as a standalone feature. What makes them a terrible design decision is that they are forced on players who don't want to do them. For an expansion that's all about choice and multiple paths... this part of the game is 100% no choice and linear. They need to add alternative options for Charms (since these are basically required to raid) and to a lesser extent rep and tradeskill recipes (since these are optional but still something most people will need to an extent). Not having rep tabards is pretty damn indefensible after Cata. That was what made the grind bearable, you could always be getting several things done at once. It shouldn't be a surprise that casuals are retaining their place as the main focus of the expansion, though, as it's been that way since WotLK when Blizz realized that the massive majority of the playerbase played less than 4 hours a week.
It's perfectly defensible, and especially so after Cata. Please understand the meaning of words before you use them.
Blizzard SPECIFICALLY cited the existence of tabards of most every rep back in Cata as the reason they're not included in MoP. They wanted players out and doing things in the world instead of loitering in hubs waiting for dungeon queues to pop.
Also, I don't see how that is related in any way to "casuals...retaining their place as the main focus". They want the game as a whole to move away from sitting around in sw/org, which is fine, and is something I like. No, I don't like having to grow veggies on a half a dozen toons on top of doing dailies for 1.5-2 hours a day to keep up for raiding, but that's largely a separate issue.
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United States22883 Posts
On October 16 2012 10:11 PH wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 09:27 deth2munkies wrote:On October 16 2012 09:06 Serejai wrote:On October 16 2012 08:29 deth2munkies wrote:On October 16 2012 06:45 Serejai wrote:On October 16 2012 06:26 deth2munkies wrote:On October 16 2012 06:23 AimlessAmoeba wrote:
Pretty sure I'm going blind from running dailies... And once you hit revered with GL/Klax they give you MOAR. MOAR I SAY. And they say that you "only have to do what you want to do" but if you want to get geared to raid with your guild you have no choice -_-
MoP has only been out for a couple weeks and I already feel as though I'm burning out.
Look at it this way: It beats farming mobs for random drops while wearing a shitty trinket (fuck you Argent Dawn). Disagree on this. In theory the quests should be more enjoyable because they rotate and whatnot but in reality they're so poorly designed that they're actually more tedious and boring than simply grinding mobs is. Disregarding that there's another major flaw; Grinding was at my own pace. If I wanted to knock out an entire rep in a single day I could. I could set aside ten hours, turn some music on, stack my desk with drink and chips then go to town. At the end of the day I got what I wanted and never had to do it again. With dailies you can't do that. If I have ten hours in a day and I want to grind my rep up for Enchanting patterns or VP gear or even a mount... I can't. I'm limited to about 15-30 minutes per day and after I finish I get to sit on my ass in Org and wait until they reset. This forced gating tends to make dailies stressful for a lot of people (myself included). I'm all for rep grinds - I want the game to take effort again like it did in vanilla and TBC. However, I don't want Blizzard telling me how much effort I can put it at a time. That just annoys me and makes things feel repetitive. One of the selling points for MoP was that Blizzard was going to make the content less linear and provide more methods to reach the same goals. They failed terribly at this and in actuality did the exact opposite. So I completely agree with the first post. If I do ten hours of grinding in a day I feel much, much, much less burnt out that when I'm being forced to split it up into 15 minutes a day over the span of a month (and yes, the daily quests are literally just grinding with some "lore" attached). I just wholeheartedly disagree. I cannot stand sitting in a particular place killing mobs for no real reason other than hope for random drops. I burned myself out on that during Vanilla and just couldn't do it after a bit of BC. The thing I DID like was that there were little neat "mini dungeons" you could explore. Slaughterhouses in Plaguelands usually had some sort of elite/rare/quest mob at the bottom that you could fight your way to. I enjoyed setting those little challenges for myself, exploring looking for challenging mobs. The rise of Thottbott/alakazam/wowwiki/wowhead kinda took a lot of that out of the equation, but it's still something that you COULD do before dailies became the norm. The good part about dailies is that you can plot out exactly how long it's going to take you to do something so you're on a more regular "reward schedule" and it doesn't feel like an endless grind where you can get shat on by the RNG and only get 20 scourgestones in 2 hours. I don't have MoP, but I recall from cata, 25 dailies took 2-2 1/2 hours to beat per day (including competition for/respawning mobs, travel times, and having a suboptimal PvE farming spec because you're raid spec), it could be significantly faster or slower depending on a few factors. I'd rather do that once a day while chatting on Vent or listening to music or something then be able to make my own fun by raiding/PvP/doing SOMETHING and know that by doing it for X days I'll be done, rather than spending those 2 hours grinding random mobs hoping I scrounge up enough random drops to make the time worth it and not knowing how much longer it will take. Well see that's the problem. I would rather spend 10 hours at once to grind my rep and you would rather spend an hour at a time spread over ten sessions to do the same. Now, that's the fundamental issue with MoP. Blizzard claimed this expansion was all about choices and being open and yet it's extremely linear. Players like myself are forced to do dailies we don't want to do. Why not have rep tabards for people who want to grind heroics? Why not have a Runecloth-style repeatable quest for people who want to grind their rep? Mists of Pandaria is pretty much the exact opposite of what vanilla was. While vanilla catered to hardcore/grinding players who could get ahead by spending more time upfront doing something Mists of Pandaria caters to people who want to take it slow and steady and break up their playtime into chunks. Again, there's nothing wrong with how dailies currently are in the expansion if you look at them as a standalone feature. What makes them a terrible design decision is that they are forced on players who don't want to do them. For an expansion that's all about choice and multiple paths... this part of the game is 100% no choice and linear. They need to add alternative options for Charms (since these are basically required to raid) and to a lesser extent rep and tradeskill recipes (since these are optional but still something most people will need to an extent). Not having rep tabards is pretty damn indefensible after Cata. That was what made the grind bearable, you could always be getting several things done at once. It shouldn't be a surprise that casuals are retaining their place as the main focus of the expansion, though, as it's been that way since WotLK when Blizz realized that the massive majority of the playerbase played less than 4 hours a week. It's perfectly defensible, and especially so after Cata. Please understand the meaning of words before you use them. Blizzard SPECIFICALLY cited the existence of tabards of most every rep back in Cata as the reason they're not included in MoP. They wanted players out and doing things in the world instead of loitering in hubs waiting for dungeon queues to pop.
I agree with this and the overall sentiment but the problem still occurs that 1) rep grinds suck and 2) people still loiter in hubs. The rep grind is only benefiting world PvP temporarily, and I think there's much better ways they could've improved world PvP without that much grind.
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United States4051 Posts
On October 16 2012 10:11 PH wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 09:27 deth2munkies wrote:On October 16 2012 09:06 Serejai wrote:On October 16 2012 08:29 deth2munkies wrote:On October 16 2012 06:45 Serejai wrote:On October 16 2012 06:26 deth2munkies wrote:On October 16 2012 06:23 AimlessAmoeba wrote:
Pretty sure I'm going blind from running dailies... And once you hit revered with GL/Klax they give you MOAR. MOAR I SAY. And they say that you "only have to do what you want to do" but if you want to get geared to raid with your guild you have no choice -_-
MoP has only been out for a couple weeks and I already feel as though I'm burning out.
Look at it this way: It beats farming mobs for random drops while wearing a shitty trinket (fuck you Argent Dawn). Disagree on this. In theory the quests should be more enjoyable because they rotate and whatnot but in reality they're so poorly designed that they're actually more tedious and boring than simply grinding mobs is. Disregarding that there's another major flaw; Grinding was at my own pace. If I wanted to knock out an entire rep in a single day I could. I could set aside ten hours, turn some music on, stack my desk with drink and chips then go to town. At the end of the day I got what I wanted and never had to do it again. With dailies you can't do that. If I have ten hours in a day and I want to grind my rep up for Enchanting patterns or VP gear or even a mount... I can't. I'm limited to about 15-30 minutes per day and after I finish I get to sit on my ass in Org and wait until they reset. This forced gating tends to make dailies stressful for a lot of people (myself included). I'm all for rep grinds - I want the game to take effort again like it did in vanilla and TBC. However, I don't want Blizzard telling me how much effort I can put it at a time. That just annoys me and makes things feel repetitive. One of the selling points for MoP was that Blizzard was going to make the content less linear and provide more methods to reach the same goals. They failed terribly at this and in actuality did the exact opposite. So I completely agree with the first post. If I do ten hours of grinding in a day I feel much, much, much less burnt out that when I'm being forced to split it up into 15 minutes a day over the span of a month (and yes, the daily quests are literally just grinding with some "lore" attached). I just wholeheartedly disagree. I cannot stand sitting in a particular place killing mobs for no real reason other than hope for random drops. I burned myself out on that during Vanilla and just couldn't do it after a bit of BC. The thing I DID like was that there were little neat "mini dungeons" you could explore. Slaughterhouses in Plaguelands usually had some sort of elite/rare/quest mob at the bottom that you could fight your way to. I enjoyed setting those little challenges for myself, exploring looking for challenging mobs. The rise of Thottbott/alakazam/wowwiki/wowhead kinda took a lot of that out of the equation, but it's still something that you COULD do before dailies became the norm. The good part about dailies is that you can plot out exactly how long it's going to take you to do something so you're on a more regular "reward schedule" and it doesn't feel like an endless grind where you can get shat on by the RNG and only get 20 scourgestones in 2 hours. I don't have MoP, but I recall from cata, 25 dailies took 2-2 1/2 hours to beat per day (including competition for/respawning mobs, travel times, and having a suboptimal PvE farming spec because you're raid spec), it could be significantly faster or slower depending on a few factors. I'd rather do that once a day while chatting on Vent or listening to music or something then be able to make my own fun by raiding/PvP/doing SOMETHING and know that by doing it for X days I'll be done, rather than spending those 2 hours grinding random mobs hoping I scrounge up enough random drops to make the time worth it and not knowing how much longer it will take. Well see that's the problem. I would rather spend 10 hours at once to grind my rep and you would rather spend an hour at a time spread over ten sessions to do the same. Now, that's the fundamental issue with MoP. Blizzard claimed this expansion was all about choices and being open and yet it's extremely linear. Players like myself are forced to do dailies we don't want to do. Why not have rep tabards for people who want to grind heroics? Why not have a Runecloth-style repeatable quest for people who want to grind their rep? Mists of Pandaria is pretty much the exact opposite of what vanilla was. While vanilla catered to hardcore/grinding players who could get ahead by spending more time upfront doing something Mists of Pandaria caters to people who want to take it slow and steady and break up their playtime into chunks. Again, there's nothing wrong with how dailies currently are in the expansion if you look at them as a standalone feature. What makes them a terrible design decision is that they are forced on players who don't want to do them. For an expansion that's all about choice and multiple paths... this part of the game is 100% no choice and linear. They need to add alternative options for Charms (since these are basically required to raid) and to a lesser extent rep and tradeskill recipes (since these are optional but still something most people will need to an extent). Not having rep tabards is pretty damn indefensible after Cata. That was what made the grind bearable, you could always be getting several things done at once. It shouldn't be a surprise that casuals are retaining their place as the main focus of the expansion, though, as it's been that way since WotLK when Blizz realized that the massive majority of the playerbase played less than 4 hours a week. It's perfectly defensible, and especially so after Cata. Please understand the meaning of words before you use them. Blizzard SPECIFICALLY cited the existence of tabards of most every rep back in Cata as the reason they're not included in MoP. They wanted players out and doing things in the world instead of loitering in hubs waiting for dungeon queues to pop. Also, I don't see how that is related in any way to "casuals...retaining their place as the main focus". They want the game as a whole to move away from sitting around in sw/org, which is fine, and is something I like. No, I don't like having to grow veggies on a half a dozen toons on top of doing dailies for 1.5-2 hours a day to keep up for raiding, but that's largely a separate issue.
That just makes them retarded then. Again, I haven't read shit about WoW since right before Firelands came out, so I didn't know that was their reasoning. I do know that the blizzcon talks were all about people doing what they want (dungeons/dailies/PvP) and getting rewarded for it. Tabards helped that. If they were so against people hanging out waiting for queues to pop, maybe they shouldn't have made the fucking dungeon/raid finders in the first place. That completely killed any social aspect the game still retained after cross-realm battlegrounds came out.
Gathering professions and daily quests keep people out of cities just fine anyway, and they can't pretend they gave 2 shits about making compelling max level content outside of raids. If they did, we'd be seeing more world bosses, world PvP objectives, and the like. Everything is too controlled, even stuff like Wintergrasp/Tol Barad was too controlled. I remember when you had to fight just to turn in quests on your alt in goddamn Tarren Mill, that sure kept people out of the cities.
Casuals are people that play the game a couple hours every week. Putting arbitrary time limits on how far you can progress in a given day keeps them much more caught up to hardcore people. Add to it the ability (seemingly again I don't have it) to get raid gear via those daily grinds, all of the veggie growing/pet shit that hardcore guys don't care about, and yeah, I feel fine calling this a casual friendly expansion.
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On October 16 2012 06:38 Serejai wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 06:29 NotAPro wrote:
Why would you bother with GL/Klaxxi past revered? Plus all the VP gear will be irrelevant when the next raid comes out. You'll still be doing those dailies, even a year from now. You're forced to grind them for the Elder Charms unless you want to gimp yourself and your raid group.
You can only get 3 charms a week. I have like 300 unspent charms in my bag...
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I don't see how killing the same few mogu mobs over and over and over and over on a daily basis is any better than grinding out dungeons.
I believe the two factions can coexist: those who want to do dailies can continue to do dailies. If you rather play with friends in dungeoning then allow them to earn rep that way. No need to deny one side or another.
There have been multiple rep grinds in the past with enchants: remember sons of hodir whom barely anyone bothered with alts except for the hardcore?
Argent tournament dailies were quite popular even though all rewards are mostly cosmetic/pets/mousnts etc: what is wrong with that?
Right now in MoP there are players like myself: ex-progression raiders who quit cata along with the rest of the guild who came back. We are no able to raid (due to small svr+numbers), but we are all skilled players and would like to do instances (and not dailies) while still acquiring "similar rewards".
Right now there is no need for us to do any dungeons: dailies alone will valor cap us (esp when we have the +50% valor buff). Blizzard said dungeons are rewarding enough: but that is false as none of us really need any heroic gear anymore. If dungeons are truly rewarding then you will not have people leave the dungeon after the boss they need have been killed.
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On October 16 2012 12:34 Hikari wrote:...There have been multiple rep grinds in the past with enchants: remember sons of hodir...
Which is funny because the reason for the current system is because Blizzard said they didn't like the idea of people having to grind for vital things (like head and shoulder enchants).
They got part of this right by moving shoulder enchants to scribes but then someone there developed Down Syndrome overnight and came to work the next morning with the bright idea of "Hey guys, how about we force raiders to do these dailies for their raid loot? How about we also make JP gear lower level than Heroic gear but only drop JP in heroics so people have to grind heroics in order to buy gear to grind heroics with! Oh, and let's make everything require Revered rep as well... and these two require Revered in another faction before you can even start them!"
And for whatever reason everyone else was like "Hey, wow! That completely solves the issue of grinds being mandatory that we sought to correct!" and the rest was history.
It's not that the system in itself is terrible. It's that it goes completely against what Blizzard promised to deliver with this expansion and also offers no alternatives at all.
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Australia7069 Posts
i dunno it's not that bad. the jp gear can be used to fill holes or just buy heirlooms. the jp stuff is usually honoured pretty easy to get.
with the vp cap at 1k it means that you basically have to do like, one faction of dailies every second day or so to still be able to efficiently spend you VP on an epic when you get to the next cap the following week. this means that the grind is definetly not neccesary. however hardcore players can still grind all their reps to aim for specific epics at specific times to fill holes in their gear or shoot for a non-heroic BIS piece (i know some of the shadopan trinkets are great for some classes) etc etc.
i'm not saying i'm sold on how meh JP is right now, but i think the JP stuff is aimed at casuals who run a few dailies each week and run some heroics but still have holes that could easily be filled by a 458 piece until a 463 drops
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Observations in general - first part more torwards Hikari.
So if you don't raid, what do you need your VP for then. Sure there are some mediocre epics right now (who are obsolete two weeks from now), but since you don't raid and don't do dungeons either - whoat do you need them for? In the future, you use VP to upgrade the iLVL of your raid items - but then again, you don't raid. Or run dungeons. All you do in the game is do dailies and complain that there is nothing else to do.
And then I read "but I need it all to raid I'm professional DPS" - are you kidding me? There are a shitton of guilds out there clearing most heroic bosses without that gear that you so desperatly farm. One thing that struck me during the last week: US guilds SUCK. On the grand scale, obv there are some guilds who somewhat know how to push buttons. But even then - with one day advantage and double the loot - beaten by Method? Come on. I don't know if more gear can salvage that (it didn't help BL/vodka/all the others). So if you're stuck doing progress for weeks on end without success, you can as well kick back and relax and don't stress out so fucking much. It's a fucking game, and as long as you don't play for the World Firsts acting all hadcore and serious kinda makes you look... not good.
If you are one of those few raiders who are in it for the competition - well, sucks to be you but you have to put in the time to get ahead. And you should not find that bad because it will give you a competetive edge.
Also, Klaxxi and Golden Lotus are less than an hour, with luck less than 45 minutes of work (combined) with a good 5 man group. Which you should have since you are all serious raiders and shit.
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On October 16 2012 20:25 Celial wrote:If you are one of those few raiders who are in it for the competition - well, sucks to be you but you have to put in the time to get ahead. And you should not find that bad because it will give you a competetive edge.
This is the exact problem, though. I'm one of those raiders who are in it for the competition and Blizzard is telling me how much time and effort I'm allowed to put into the game. And not just competitive raiders, but any player that wants to bring 100% to their raid is in the same position.
Need Revered rep with a faction to spend my Valor points on an upgrade? Sure, I'll put in the effort to grind that out because I want to do the best I can in my raid. However it becomes a major problem when Blizzard tells me I'm putting in too much effort and I need to slow down... a lot.
So it really has nothing at all to do with people complaining that they have to put in effort to get something. The complaint is that Blizzard is telling us when and where we're allowed to put in said effort in an expansion that was marketed as being all about choices and non-linearity.
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The problem is simply put that people still play this game "hardcore", when it's so apparent that it's meant to be played casually.
Once you realize that you get the exact same experience playing an hour a day as you would playing five a day, you'll enjoy it much more. Fuck hardmodes, fuck endless repitition, play the game like you're watching an interactive movie and you'll be much happier for it.
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Anyone knows a decent vanilla server? My friends and I are looking for a populated, not so buggy one to fuck around on.
Don't worry, we all are playing MOP at the moment and giving blizzard dolla.
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United States4051 Posts
On October 16 2012 22:16 DownOnMyNiece wrote:
The problem is simply put that people still play this game "hardcore", when it's so apparent that it's meant to be played casually.
Once you realize that you get the exact same experience playing an hour a day as you would playing five a day, you'll enjoy it much more. Fuck hardmodes, fuck endless repitition, play the game like you're watching an interactive movie and you'll be much happier for it.
While I agree with you, why the fuck would I ever want to pay $15 a month for that, when I can just string 4-5 F2P games over that month and get the same or better experience?
@Zam: Google's your best bet, I played a TBC server for a while. Vanilla is not all it's cracked up to be, though. There's plenty of reasons I don't want to go back, most of them being just straight convenience stuff.
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On October 16 2012 22:16 DownOnMyNiece wrote:
The problem is simply put that people still play this game "hardcore", when it's so apparent that it's meant to be played casually.
Once you realize that you get the exact same experience playing an hour a day as you would playing five a day, you'll enjoy it much more. Fuck hardmodes, fuck endless repitition, play the game like you're watching an interactive movie and you'll be much happier for it.
All smart hardcore players quit after Ulduar. There came absolutly nothing good after ulduar. PvP is terrible since CasualKing and PvE is a joke with this "Hardmode" (aka +HP/+DMG Mode).
People who still pay for such a bad game only do this out of habit or "my friends blablablabla..."
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On October 16 2012 22:40 Sophia wrote:Show nested quote +On October 16 2012 22:16 DownOnMyNiece wrote:
The problem is simply put that people still play this game "hardcore", when it's so apparent that it's meant to be played casually.
Once you realize that you get the exact same experience playing an hour a day as you would playing five a day, you'll enjoy it much more. Fuck hardmodes, fuck endless repitition, play the game like you're watching an interactive movie and you'll be much happier for it. All smart hardcore players quit after Ulduar. There came absolutly nothing good after ulduar. PvP is terrible since CasualKing and PvE is a joke with this "Hardmode" (aka +HP/+DMG Mode). People who still pay for such a bad game only do this out of habit or "my friends blablablabla..."
I still play it, whenever a new addon comes out my brother and I share the cost of the addon and two months worth of playtime, and each time we have blast leveling up, seeing the new zones, playing through the new heroics and so on.
You have a point about it sucking for Hardcore-Players, but if you only play it for a short period of time, it's enormously entertaining. The quest-design is really well done, the quest descriptions are ofttimes hilarious and the different zones are fascinatingly well designed.
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I was wondering if those who already experienced a bit of Pandaria could share their opinions with me, as I'm pondering whether or not to return to the game.
A bit on my history: I played WoW since launch with the occasional break in between. Raids were where I spent most of my time, ultimately leading a hardcore 10man throughout all of WotLK's content. I took a very long break after ICC due to work related reasons and lacking spare time; resubbed shortly for Cataclysm but cancelled again after only a month.
The reason why I ultimately left the game was that I felt that it had gone nowhere, still heavily relying on grinding reputation, advancing too much of its content through daily quests, and not having replaced the annoying cycle of having to get new gear with each major PVE/PVP patch. Additionally, I felt that the random dungeons made the game feel more and more like a single player experience, especially the random raids. What I did enjoy was the questing and the zones (Vashjir was amazing), and fluff like transmogrification.
Currently, my SO is playing casually and from what I've seen on her screen, the new zones are beautifully done. She mentions that the quests are great and so is the writing, and apparently the new pet battles aren't as bad as I had initially thought (at least she's enjoying herself).
As I'm pretty sure that my CV in WoW isn't that unique, I hope that some people can relate, and ultimately share their 2 ct on Pandaria with me, and whether or not it'd be worth it for me.
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On October 16 2012 23:50 Shockk wrote:
I was wondering if those who already experienced a bit of Pandaria could share their opinions with me, as I'm pondering whether or not to return to the game.
A bit on my history: I played WoW since launch with the occasional break in between. Raids were where I spent most of my time, ultimately leading a hardcore 10man throughout all of WotLK's content. I took a very long break after ICC due to work related reasons and lacking spare time; resubbed shortly for Cataclysm but cancelled again after only a month.
The reason why I ultimately left the game was that I felt that it had gone nowhere, still heavily relying on grinding reputation, advancing too much of its content through daily quests, and not having replaced the annoying cycle of having to get new gear with each major PVE/PVP patch. Additionally, I felt that the random dungeons made the game feel more and more like a single player experience, especially the random raids. What I did enjoy was the questing and the zones (Vashjir was amazing), and fluff like transmogrification.
Currently, my SO is playing casually and from what I've seen on her screen, the new zones are beautifully done. She mentions that the quests are great and so is the writing, and apparently the new pet battles aren't as bad as I had initially thought (at least she's enjoying herself).
As I'm pretty sure that my CV in WoW isn't that unique, I hope that some people can relate, and ultimately share their 2 ct on Pandaria with me, and whether or not it'd be worth it for me.
MoP imo is a great improvement over the lackluster Cata expansion. I honestly had low expectations coming into the expansion, but Blizzard has a done a great job with the leveling and storyline. I think a casual player like yourself will really enjoy the expansion. Though grinding for the best PvE gear is gonna take some time to get for raids, the pre-raid/LFR gear is easily obtainable. LFR is still a joke however. PvP is the same... nothing to look out for there. The 10-man raids I've been doing have been a lot of fun.
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On October 16 2012 23:50 Shockk wrote:
I was wondering if those who already experienced a bit of Pandaria could share their opinions with me, as I'm pondering whether or not to return to the game.
A bit on my history: I played WoW since launch with the occasional break in between. Raids were where I spent most of my time, ultimately leading a hardcore 10man throughout all of WotLK's content. I took a very long break after ICC due to work related reasons and lacking spare time; resubbed shortly for Cataclysm but cancelled again after only a month.
The reason why I ultimately left the game was that I felt that it had gone nowhere, still heavily relying on grinding reputation, advancing too much of its content through daily quests, and not having replaced the annoying cycle of having to get new gear with each major PVE/PVP patch. Additionally, I felt that the random dungeons made the game feel more and more like a single player experience, especially the random raids. What I did enjoy was the questing and the zones (Vashjir was amazing), and fluff like transmogrification.
Currently, my SO is playing casually and from what I've seen on her screen, the new zones are beautifully done. She mentions that the quests are great and so is the writing, and apparently the new pet battles aren't as bad as I had initially thought (at least she's enjoying herself).
As I'm pretty sure that my CV in WoW isn't that unique, I hope that some people can relate, and ultimately share their 2 ct on Pandaria with me, and whether or not it'd be worth it for me.
Based on your positives and negatives listed above my recommendation would be to avoid buying this expansion for the reasons below;
- Reputation grinding is very prevalent (more-so than the last two expansions by far)
- Daily quests are required for pretty much everything from secondary professions to progression raiding
- Gear progression is worse than ever due to LFR and Heroic raids. Each tier now comes with four different ilvls (LFR, T14, T14H/T14.5, T14.5H) so most gear will last you about two or three raids before being replaced again. Personally I feel this is a GOOD thing as I dislike using the same gear for months on end but ultimately it's not what you're looking for so I included it on this list
- Game feels very single-player which is a trend Blizzard has been pushing for a while now (Cataclysm, BNet 2.0, Diablo III). The only reason to leave a city is to grind your rep/dailies and after a few months when those are finished you won't have any reason to leave anymore due to being able to queue for everything from Battlegrounds to Raids
- Quests are as bland, boring, and annoying as ever (especially all the ones that force you to roleplay as a Panda). The lore is passable if you're into that kind of thing but overall the quests aren't innovative and are basically the same ones you've done a thousand times before
- Zones are ok. Much better than the Cataclysm zones but Pandaria really feels like Outland 2.0 for various reasons (with an asian theme, of course). Normally I'd say this is a good thing because I loved Outland but it doesn't have the same effect seeing it for a second time. I think you'd enjoy the zones, though
- I'm not sure if you did the Uldum zone in Cataclysm but it was literally one giant (and terrible) Indiana Jones joke. Pandaria is very similar. There are dozens of poop quests, lots of "humor" involving poop, a dungeon boss that tells you he wants to have anal sex with you, a quest NPC that keeps offering his "banana" to an underage girl, and etc. It's very immature and crude overall and gets old/annoying very fast
- Pet battles are much better than I expected, however they're extremely unbalanced at the moment and the amount of players doing them seems to have drastically reduced (went from 5 second queues to 3+ minute queues). I expect good things to come of this in the future (maybe patch 5.2) but it's pretty lackluster right now with the Blizzard Store pets being far superior to all other pets.
The raids are very enjoyable so far. Everything else... not so much. The game is also very buggy and in all honesty it feels like it should still be in beta. There are many, many balance issues, bugs, and just poor design choices that really should have been tested better.
I really don't think you'll enjoy MoP at present but I think it might be something to reconsider when 5.1 or 5.2 launches. Of course this is all just opinion as you asked for so I'm sure someone else here will feel differently. Ultimately you may want to just watch some streams on Twitch or something and see if it looks enjoyable to you.
You could also check the official forums and browse over some of the popular threads. There are a LOT of complaints about the Daily Quests, Rep grinding, PvP balance, spawn timers on world bosses, etc. If you're unsure about a specific part of the game I have no doubt you could find hundreds, if not thousands, of people on the forums voicing their opinions about it. Far more than you'll find here on TL, to say the least.
That being said... I play MoP because I enjoy playing it with my wife, despite the fact that I dislike most aspects of it aside from the raids. If you enjoy playing with your significant other then it shouldn't really matter what you think of the game as an individual - you'll have fun if she is.
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Well you could atleast resub for a while to do all the quests on Pandaria. Because the zones and quests are amaaaaaaaaaaaazing.
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I play MoP because I enjoy playing it with my wife
Thats exactly why 99% of people outside of china still play this game. I bet there are no people at all who play because the PvE or PvP is so great. And seriously... Question is just the worst reason to pay 15$/month. If you like Solo-Questing, SWTOR is way better for Solo-Questing.
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