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On May 21 2011 06:52 Klive5ive wrote:
To suggest that Vettel is the best is incredibly short-sighted. It's basically all from this years hype which is just the fastest car running away from the field.
Last year he barely beat Mark Webber, who is incredibly inconsistent and can't be considered a top driver anymore.
Look at what Jenson did to win his title, he beat Barichello and ran away with it. Not many would argue that Jenson was the best driver in the world because of that.
Given the chance Vettel has had many drivers could have won last year with ease and be just as far ahead this year.
In terms of raw pace and ability I think Hamilton is probably the best in F1.
He beat Alonso in his first year, an incredibly feat, and now he's making Jenson button look slow.
That's 2 world champions that can't keep up with him.
I agree with klive, Vettel has been utterly prone to mistakes in F1 and he has struggled at times to out-pace Webber who is not top tier at all. The only people who have come close to Hamilton and Alonso are each other.
As for this weekend, based on todays practice i think McLaren have made a step. Still not on the pace of the Red Bull but maybe enough for Hamilton to atleast get inbetween the two and maybe get another win. This track is clearly Red Bull favoured too, so it bodes well for the rest of the year for McLaren. Ofcourse nobody can predict who will be the worst affected by the FIA's decision to limit throttle usage over the blown diffuser. That could change everything.
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On May 21 2011 07:04 Aristodemus wrote:Show nested quote +On May 21 2011 06:52 Klive5ive wrote:
To suggest that Vettel is the best is incredibly short-sighted. It's basically all from this years hype which is just the fastest car running away from the field.
Last year he barely beat Mark Webber, who is incredibly inconsistent and can't be considered a top driver anymore.
Look at what Jenson did to win his title, he beat Barichello and ran away with it. Not many would argue that Jenson was the best driver in the world because of that.
Given the chance Vettel has had many drivers could have won last year with ease and be just as far ahead this year.
In terms of raw pace and ability I think Hamilton is probably the best in F1.
He beat Alonso in his first year, an incredibly feat, and now he's making Jenson button look slow.
That's 2 world champions that can't keep up with him. I agree with klive, Vettel has been utterly prone to mistakes in F1 and he has struggled at times to out-pace Webber who is not top tier at all. The only people who have come close to Hamilton and Alonso are each other. As for this weekend, based on todays practice i think McLaren have made a step. Still not on the pace of the Red Bull but maybe enough for Hamilton to atleast get inbetween the two and maybe get another win. This track is clearly Red Bull favoured too, so it bodes well for the rest of the year for McLaren. Ofcourse nobody can predict who will be the worst affected by the FIA's decision to limit throttle usage over the blown diffuser. That could change everything.
McLaren said they will be affected. But if I recall correctly, didn't they copy a lot of design elements from that area of the car off of Red Bull?
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Everyone will be affected, its just how badly. With an system like that too all you can really copy is the concept not the actual design. Much like last years F-Duct.
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I think Red Bull are the ones that started using the concept and has the most experience running it so I think it would hurt them the most. The thing is though, how the hell will the FIA prove if someone is using it? The only way of know is by going thru the engine mappings very carefully and I doubt any FIA official would even understand what each settign does in each of the diffrent type of engine.
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On May 21 2011 07:39 Zalman wrote:
I think Red Bull are the ones that started using the concept and has the most experience running it so I think it would hurt them the most. The thing is though, how the hell will the FIA prove if someone is using it? The only way of know is by going thru the engine mappings very carefully and I doubt any FIA official would even understand what each settign does in each of the diffrent type of engine.
Yeah it is quite simple to prove through telemetry, they can enforce it no problem. Not like team orders.
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btw, today Kimi Raikönnen (2007 f1 champion) will race in a nascar race for the first time
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Germany1287 Posts
Apparantly, the new hard Pirelli compound is complete rubbish.
Nico Hulkenberg talks about 'zero grip', and Alonso just smiled: "About these tyres, I'd rather not say anything".
Sauber estimated the soft tyre as 2.4 seconds (!!) quicker than the new 'super hard' compound.
When Hamilton used them the first time, he thought that something on his car was broken (!), but then found out that the tyres were just 'catastrophical', Button agreed and said the tyres are 'shockingly bad'. Both Rosberg and Massa, too, confirmed they couldn't get them working, Vettel just described them as 'extremely hard', and Webber says that, due to these tyres, on the longruns they are about as quick as the GP2-series (!).
For comparison: Yesterday's GP2 times were ranging in the 1:30s to 1:31s, and seeing that yesterday's HRT times were ranging from 1:29s to 1:32s, I'd say that Webber's estimation could indeed be quite accurate. Drivers and teams are talking about 3-4 pitstops in the race , and Hembrey, the Pirelli guy, is furious about it and accuses the teams of not testing the tyre properly; he is looking at his data and expects 1-2 stop strategies. Oh, the drama, lovely :D
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On May 21 2011 17:11 zere wrote:
Apparantly, the new hard Pirelli compound is complete rubbish.
Nico Hulkenberg talks about 'zero grip', and Alonso just smiled: "About these tyres, I'd rather not say anything".
Sauber estimated the soft tyre as 2.4 seconds (!!) quicker than the new 'super hard' compound.
When Hamilton used them the first time, he thought that something on his car was broken (!), but then found out that the tyres were just 'catastrophical', Button agreed and said the tyres are 'shockingly bad'. Both Rosberg and Massa, too, confirmed they couldn't get them working, Vettel just described them as 'extremely hard', and Webber says that, due to these tyres, on the longruns they are about as quick as the GP2-series (!).
For comparison: Yesterday's GP2 times were ranging in the 1:30s to 1:31s, and seeing that yesterday's HRT times were ranging from 1:29s to 1:32s, I'd say that Webber's estimation could indeed be quite accurate. Drivers and teams are talking about 3-4 pitstops in the race , and Hembrey, the Pirelli guy, is furious about it and accuses the teams of not testing the tyre properly; he is looking at his data and expects 1-2 stop strategies. Oh, the drama, lovely :D
Yeah it could even reach the absurd. Imagine if each driver only does 1 lap on them :p
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51574 Posts
On May 21 2011 07:56 AntiLegend wrote:
btw, today Kimi Raikönnen (2007 f1 champion) will race in a nascar race for the first time
following the path of jp montoya? sigh, i wonder if he'll actually come back to f1.
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On May 21 2011 18:47 GTR wrote:Show nested quote +On May 21 2011 07:56 AntiLegend wrote:
btw, today Kimi Raikönnen (2007 f1 champion) will race in a nascar race for the first time following the path of jp montoya? sigh, i wonder if he'll actually come back to f1.
he finished rank 15 of 36 cars. sounds like a respectable placement for someone who has never raced a stock car on such a course. i don't think he'll do nascar "fulltime". this was just the nascar truck series (pickup cars). i guess he just wanted to try out a different form of racing and had some time between ralleyes.
i'd love to see him back at f1, as he is by far my favourite driver. maybe there's a chance Webber gets replaced by him
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Kimi stopped caring about F1 when ferrari gave him the $30m pa contract, its a shame because at McLaren and Sauber he was really good. He wont come back now.
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lost interest in F1 when Iceman left....
i really hope he comes back
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About the tires..
It's a bit unfair to call them rubbish, since they were designed to be worse than they could be. It doesn't seem like an easy task to design a tire that will degrade and gradually lose grip over such a short distance.
They can and would have designed a highgripping compound that would last an entire race, but then the teams wouldn't have a reason to pit since they carry fuel for the entire race.
But I guess we'll see new tires developed and the current ones improved during the season, since Pirelli won't like the negative publicity.
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Well, race day.
We are in Spain and nothing extraordinary seems to be going on. New for this season is that overtaking will actually be possible, meaning that less emphasis was put upon qualifying. Hamilton even stated that he was very happy with his P3 (cleanside) and hoped to be P1 come first corner.
Nothing to shocking happened in qualifiers, Nick Heidfeld could unfortunately not get out onto the track after his unfortunate fire-accident in practice 3 but the stewards are expected to let him race after watching his practice times.
Mark Webber took his first P1 of this season in front of teammate Sebastian Vettel. They are not-so-closely followed by Hamilton, Alonso and Button. Alonso did an amazing drive in P3, managing to split up the two McLarens despite having some problems with his car.
I think the race is going to be really exiting today, especially the fight between Mark Webber and Lewis Hamilton. If Webber beats Hamilton today he will pass him in the standings.
Another thing to watch out for are both the Ferrari drivers. Alonso did a terrific qualifier and after Turkey he is looking more and more like a real contender to the McLarens. Massa is not showing as good form but he has consistently placed in the top 8 of every race and if he can just get his car in top shape he could be a contender, perhaps not for the podium but well for the somewhat struggling Button.
Now, tires.
Tires are the talk of the season and ohh do they create interesting races. With the hard-tires being worse then the options but not lasting any longer there have been a significant switch in strategies from the teams for this season.
Here in Spain, Pirelli has come out with a new version of the hard tire, an even worse version. Or well, that depends on how you look at it, because this will most certainly be entertaining for the fans!
With drivers quoted as saying that the hard tire adds two seconds or more per lap we can expect the team to utilize some exiting strategies. Making those soft tires last for as long as possible will be crucial, perhaps even to the point where the drivers can't drive aggressively due to tire-wear?
Anyway, the 2011 F1 season is still young but tension is already in the air. Can someone stop the reign of the Red Bulls? Will we see more than two teams competing for the top positions?
Today's going to be an exiting race, that's for sure 
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51574 Posts
holy shit, alonso just FLEW off the starting grid.
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Vettel was to busy blocking Hamilton to block Alonso, and Webber was just to slow to respond. Wow.
Hiedfeld jumped from 24th to 17th in the start as well!
And poor Kobayashi had to pit, feel like something fuck up for him every race even though he has such a nice mindset and is so talanted
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Germany1287 Posts
Very good start from Alonso, Webber wasn't up to par at the start, really.
Trulli and Kovalainen are keeping up with Maldonado/di Resta, pulling away from Heidfeld/Sutil, wow!
Lotus lap time 1:32.8, Heidfeld with no traffic 1:33.3, Sutil no traffic 1:34.0
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can't believe red bull keep pitting webber with alonso. there is no logic in this.
*edit* herp derp, third time. :/
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hehe, can't feel very good for Petrov to be passed by teammate Hiedfeld. Petrov started P6, Heidfeld started P24.
Most of the drivers seem to be running a very long last stint? Is the hard tire perhaps pretty durable?
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This fight between Vettel and Hamilton is shaping up to be really exiting, Vettel just seems to have a lower pace than Hamilton. Hopefully he can make a clean pass and get away, but more exiting would be an epic overtaking series all the way to the finish line
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EPT
