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On March 30 2012 06:55 Quotidian wrote:beyond the fact that the ending of ME3 is just bad from a structural point of view, I think the biggest problem with it is + Show Spoiler + that it basically negates any post-Shepherd story to be told in the ME universe where you could travel across the entire universe. The end of ME3 basically set the entire universe back into the stone age as far as interstellar travel goes. So I guess that means that any new ME game has to be a prequel or concurrent with the events of the Shepherd trilogy. ..which I think sucks.
Oh I'm sure George Lucas can come out of retirement and make a prequel trilogy or something.
I actually think it's great that it's ended. Shepard's legacy has concluded, and we don't need a sequel to everything just because it's good, especially if it's already complete.
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On March 30 2012 05:41 sick_transit wrote:
I personally think ME3 is a masterpiece of storytelling, I'm content with the ending, and the mere fact that anyone can criticize it shows how far RPG video games have come in the last 30 years.
Once upon a time there was Wizardry/Bard's Tale/Ultima/Space Quest etc. You meandered around a dungeon, town, world or even a galaxy, and then worked your way up to killing the ultimate baddie in order to save the world (so to speak). Games improved but the concept from a storytelling standpoint more or less remained the same until Baldur's Gate 2 Shadows of Amn (BioWare), which revolutionized the the whole concept of a video RPG by introducing relationships with NPCs as a major factor in the game. This new concept allowed game developers to engage players more deeply in games and also to tell stories that at least began to look like what you would expect from a good novel or movie. (Think about it--would you want to see the movie/read the novel of Wizardry or Rogue?)
I would say Knights of the Old Republic marked a major high point in this new trend--until ME3 I would have said this was hands down the best story ever told in a video game.
However, ME2 and ME3 have taken the concept to a new level. I could write on about the myriad of aspects in which these stories shine but suffice to say that the two of them stand up on their own terms as a fairly credible, in fact excellent, epic sci-fi movie or novel, something that I don't think can be said about anything that has come before.
Which brings me to the ending. It had to be epic and not just "blow up the big spaceship/robot and collect a medal." Believe me, that ending would have felt cheap. For those who invoked the explosion of the Death Star in A New Hope, remember that the emotional heart of those films is in the closing moments of Return, when Anakin finally reemerges and sacrifices himself to save his son. In ME3 BioWare is trying evoke the same powerful tropes of sacrifice and transformation. The cut scenes after don't matter much to me; much like I never cared a whole lot about the ewoks dancing for joy or fireworks going off on Coruscant--although you do need those moments to bring the story to a close.
In short, I wouldn't change a thing, and I hope they don't.
Except in this analogy of yours, "Darth vader" is harbinger ? or the illusive man? It's certainly not the star-child who arguably takes over Shepard role as the protagonist in the last 5 minutes of this ending.
Him allowing Shepard to do the "heroic sacrifice" is practically an act of charity on his part. He doesn't even tell you what any of those choices mean. The way i see it. They either kill the starchild now when they have the chance and vocal fan support. Or they will forever doom their own franchise to the hands of those that don't care about story.
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United States7483 Posts
On March 30 2012 11:25 Mobius_1 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2012 06:55 Quotidian wrote:beyond the fact that the ending of ME3 is just bad from a structural point of view, I think the biggest problem with it is + Show Spoiler + that it basically negates any post-Shepherd story to be told in the ME universe where you could travel across the entire universe. The end of ME3 basically set the entire universe back into the stone age as far as interstellar travel goes. So I guess that means that any new ME game has to be a prequel or concurrent with the events of the Shepherd trilogy. ..which I think sucks. Oh I'm sure George Lucas can come out of retirement and make a prequel trilogy or something. I actually think it's great that it's ended. Shepard's legacy has concluded, and we don't need a sequel to everything just because it's good, especially if it's already complete.
Well, from a story perspective it's really obnoxious that this happened. I'm in the process of writing a Mass Effect pencil and paper RPG (been in production for a year now =p), and now campaigns in the game can't be run after the events of ME3. There's literally no stories to be told anymore.
They can't write books about what happens after. There won't be comics. The IP had so much more potential, but they've limited themselves to what happens before and during ME3.
It'd be like if Forgotten Realms got hit by a planet sized nuclear warhead and all life dies, or if some villain in star wars developed a super weapon that hit the galaxy with another galaxy and annihilated everything.
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On March 30 2012 11:39 Whitewing wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2012 11:25 Mobius_1 wrote:On March 30 2012 06:55 Quotidian wrote:beyond the fact that the ending of ME3 is just bad from a structural point of view, I think the biggest problem with it is + Show Spoiler + that it basically negates any post-Shepherd story to be told in the ME universe where you could travel across the entire universe. The end of ME3 basically set the entire universe back into the stone age as far as interstellar travel goes. So I guess that means that any new ME game has to be a prequel or concurrent with the events of the Shepherd trilogy. ..which I think sucks. Oh I'm sure George Lucas can come out of retirement and make a prequel trilogy or something. I actually think it's great that it's ended. Shepard's legacy has concluded, and we don't need a sequel to everything just because it's good, especially if it's already complete. Well, from a story perspective it's really obnoxious that this happened. I'm in the process of writing a Mass Effect pencil and paper RPG (been in production for a year now =p), and now campaigns in the game can't be run after the events of ME3. There's literally no stories to be told anymore. They can't write books about what happens after. There won't be comics. The IP had so much more potential, but they've limited themselves to what happens before and during ME3. It'd be like if Forgotten Realms got hit by a planet sized nuclear warhead and all life dies, or if some villain in star wars developed a super weapon that hit the galaxy with another galaxy and annihilated everything.
Well, maybe they can from the "Earth saved" with high enough War Asset ending, but no, it won't involve Shepard, and it won't have Mass Relays, still, a lot of the Star Wars stuff out there don't have Luke and Leia and Han in them, don't see why aspiring ME'ers can't emulate.
TBH I think there's still the whole galaxy out there, but we are so in love with Shep and her crew (yes, her) anyone doing anything in the ME universe but without Shepard is going to have his/her work cut out.
(Also I don't know what Forgotten Realms is... Googling now...)
PS I don't think it's going to be "possible" for BioWare to make a ME4 even if Shepard lives. I mean, you get 3 drastically different colours of galaxy-waves that may not look different in the ending cutscene but will lead to hugely different settings for sequels. The technology isn't there yet.
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United States7483 Posts
On March 30 2012 11:58 Mobius_1 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2012 11:39 Whitewing wrote:On March 30 2012 11:25 Mobius_1 wrote:On March 30 2012 06:55 Quotidian wrote:beyond the fact that the ending of ME3 is just bad from a structural point of view, I think the biggest problem with it is + Show Spoiler + that it basically negates any post-Shepherd story to be told in the ME universe where you could travel across the entire universe. The end of ME3 basically set the entire universe back into the stone age as far as interstellar travel goes. So I guess that means that any new ME game has to be a prequel or concurrent with the events of the Shepherd trilogy. ..which I think sucks. Oh I'm sure George Lucas can come out of retirement and make a prequel trilogy or something. I actually think it's great that it's ended. Shepard's legacy has concluded, and we don't need a sequel to everything just because it's good, especially if it's already complete. Well, from a story perspective it's really obnoxious that this happened. I'm in the process of writing a Mass Effect pencil and paper RPG (been in production for a year now =p), and now campaigns in the game can't be run after the events of ME3. There's literally no stories to be told anymore. They can't write books about what happens after. There won't be comics. The IP had so much more potential, but they've limited themselves to what happens before and during ME3. It'd be like if Forgotten Realms got hit by a planet sized nuclear warhead and all life dies, or if some villain in star wars developed a super weapon that hit the galaxy with another galaxy and annihilated everything. Well, maybe they can from the "Earth saved" with high enough War Asset ending, but no, it won't involve Shepard, and it won't have Mass Relays, still, a lot of the Star Wars stuff out there don't have Luke and Leia and Han in them, don't see why aspiring ME'ers can't emulate. TBH I think there's still the whole galaxy out there, but we are so in love with Shep and her crew (yes, her) anyone doing anything in the ME universe but without Shepard is going to have his/her work cut out. (Also I don't know what Forgotten Realms is... Googling now...) PS I don't think it's going to be "possible" for BioWare to make a ME4 even if Shepard lives. I mean, you get 3 drastically different colours of galaxy-waves that may not look different in the ending cutscene but will lead to hugely different settings for sequels. The technology isn't there yet.
Well, the issue is the mass relays, it's really hard to have a mass effect setting story without such an iconic feature of the IP. Once those are gone, a huge amount of the Mass Effect feeling is gone, and even if they have some kind of 'we developed better FTL engines and fuel so we can travel the galaxy again without them' fix, it won't feel like ME.
Of course you can have stories with other characters, but the problem is the Mass Relays being gone.
Only way I can see them making it work would be for them to recover more prothean data from Mars and figure out how to build Mass Relays (remember, the Protheans figured out how to build Mass Relays, remember the conduit from ME1?)
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On March 30 2012 12:04 Whitewing wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2012 11:58 Mobius_1 wrote:On March 30 2012 11:39 Whitewing wrote:On March 30 2012 11:25 Mobius_1 wrote:On March 30 2012 06:55 Quotidian wrote:beyond the fact that the ending of ME3 is just bad from a structural point of view, I think the biggest problem with it is + Show Spoiler + that it basically negates any post-Shepherd story to be told in the ME universe where you could travel across the entire universe. The end of ME3 basically set the entire universe back into the stone age as far as interstellar travel goes. So I guess that means that any new ME game has to be a prequel or concurrent with the events of the Shepherd trilogy. ..which I think sucks. Oh I'm sure George Lucas can come out of retirement and make a prequel trilogy or something. I actually think it's great that it's ended. Shepard's legacy has concluded, and we don't need a sequel to everything just because it's good, especially if it's already complete. Well, from a story perspective it's really obnoxious that this happened. I'm in the process of writing a Mass Effect pencil and paper RPG (been in production for a year now =p), and now campaigns in the game can't be run after the events of ME3. There's literally no stories to be told anymore. They can't write books about what happens after. There won't be comics. The IP had so much more potential, but they've limited themselves to what happens before and during ME3. It'd be like if Forgotten Realms got hit by a planet sized nuclear warhead and all life dies, or if some villain in star wars developed a super weapon that hit the galaxy with another galaxy and annihilated everything. Well, maybe they can from the "Earth saved" with high enough War Asset ending, but no, it won't involve Shepard, and it won't have Mass Relays, still, a lot of the Star Wars stuff out there don't have Luke and Leia and Han in them, don't see why aspiring ME'ers can't emulate. TBH I think there's still the whole galaxy out there, but we are so in love with Shep and her crew (yes, her) anyone doing anything in the ME universe but without Shepard is going to have his/her work cut out. (Also I don't know what Forgotten Realms is... Googling now...) PS I don't think it's going to be "possible" for BioWare to make a ME4 even if Shepard lives. I mean, you get 3 drastically different colours of galaxy-waves that may not look different in the ending cutscene but will lead to hugely different settings for sequels. The technology isn't there yet. Well, the issue is the mass relays, it's really hard to have a mass effect setting story without such an iconic feature of the IP. Once those are gone, a huge amount of the Mass Effect feeling is gone, and even if they have some kind of 'we developed better FTL engines and fuel so we can travel the galaxy again without them' fix, it won't feel like ME. Of course you can have stories with other characters, but the problem is the Mass Relays being gone. Only way I can see them making it work would be for them to recover more prothean data from Mars and figure out how to build Mass Relays (remember, the Protheans figured out how to build Mass Relays, remember the conduit from ME1?)
Yeah, that loud ZOOOOOOM is every time you go through one is quite incredible. I guess it would be interesting to hear about the galaxy's recovery and rebuilding after they are destroyed.
That said I'll read/watch/play anything with hot blue chicks.
Which reminds me + Show Spoiler +I'm Commander Shepard and the Joker vs Liara conversation about Asari "hair" is the funniest in the galaxy.
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On March 30 2012 12:17 Mobius_1 wrote:That said I'll read/watch/play anything with hot blue chicks. Which reminds me + Show Spoiler +I'm Commander Shepard and the Joker vs Liara conversation about Asari "hair" is the funniest in the galaxy.
I'm pro Liara too but thats not even remotly close.
+ Show Spoiler [This is the funniest] +
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My favorite ME3 related thing was Marauder Shields.
+ Show Spoiler +He died trying to save Shepard from seeing a crappy ending!
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Ok, everybody needs to do this at least once hehe. in MP mode use a Turian Solider, Tempest SMG w/ Heat Sink V and Extended Magazine V. Max out Marksman taking the fire rate talent, duration talent and fire rate + accuracy tallent. then Fitness taking just sheild and hp boosts.
Use marksman. spray the fuck out of everything. It was a total blast just shooting for a minute straight. You'd think the Tempest would chew ammo but it doesn't and you littery get like 600+ rounds when you go from full ammo to empty.
SOOOOO much fun
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There is no end to the story because even if all the mass relays are broken they still have reaper pieces and tech they can study and derive from.
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Just started playing this game a couple of days ago, wanted to wait before I started to play because I've been playing way to much Starcraft 2 to enjoy other games. And I gotta say I love the game atmosphere. Still feels like mass effect which is awesame. But I didnt really enjoy the Spectre status being reinstated without any completion of some missions. Doesn't feel as deserved as it did in the other games.
But the story so far is great! 
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On March 30 2012 18:46 NeWeNiyaLord wrote:Just started playing this game a couple of days ago, wanted to wait before I started to play because I've been playing way to much Starcraft 2 to enjoy other games. And I gotta say I love the game atmosphere. Still feels like mass effect which is awesame. But I didnt really enjoy the Spectre status being reinstated without any completion of some missions. Doesn't feel as deserved as it did in the other games. But the story so far is great!
In case you haven't seen the rest of this thread or haven't read any Mass Effect 3 news to avoid spoilers:
+ Show Spoiler +
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Lalalaland34507 Posts
The game is much less centred around becoming a Spectre than ME1 was.
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On March 30 2012 09:33 Praetorial wrote:
Okay, I just want to say that the soundtrack for this game is amazing.
No matter its flaws, Sam Hulick really delivered in lieu of Clint Mansell.
Have to agree. One of the only games I've ever played where the music itself could invoke such emotional responses in me. Generally I just don't really care about the music so long as it's in the way but it is so well done in ME3 it wouldn't be the same game without it.
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United Kingdom16710 Posts
I still think ME1's soundtrack was the best. I wish Jack Wall had stayed to finish what he started.
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On March 30 2012 20:14 Telcontar wrote:
I still think ME1's soundtrack was the best. I wish Jack Wall had stayed to finish what he started.
I felt like it was always a bit too intrusive into the game, that the game's shooting sequences were more motivated by music than by the gameplay.
Virmire was atrocious.
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Lalalaland34507 Posts
I've redownloaded ME1, gonna replay it soon
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I started my ME1 replay about 12 hours (game time) ago. I really like the story, and the universe just feels a lot bigger than 2 and 3. Unfortunately, the combat sucks. During the first 30 levels, you can't hit anything with your assault rifle... Then you become OP. Such a great game.
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On March 30 2012 12:37 Orcasgt24 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2012 12:17 Mobius_1 wrote:That said I'll read/watch/play anything with hot blue chicks. Which reminds me + Show Spoiler +I'm Commander Shepard and the Joker vs Liara conversation about Asari "hair" is the funniest in the galaxy. I'm pro Liara too but thats not even remotly close. + Show Spoiler [This is the funniest] +http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LcPgoNGhPxg
No
+ Show Spoiler +Its drunk Tali and Javik conversation: Still the best line in the series is EDI's from ME2: Its too bad they had to make her TnG Data naive-amusing rather than darkly funny. It was kinda a cop out to make her completely benign. Oh well.
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On March 30 2012 23:14 ghost_403 wrote:
I started my ME1 replay about 12 hours (game time) ago. I really like the story, and the universe just feels a lot bigger than 2 and 3. Unfortunately, the combat sucks. During the first 30 levels, you can't hit anything with your assault rifle... Then you become OP. Such a great game.
That sounds a lot like people complaining about Terran micro. 
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/270/924/839.jpg)
