EPTMagic: The Gathering - Page 191
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Shotcoder
United States2316 Posts
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Durp
Canada3117 Posts
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Judicator
United States7270 Posts
Like Delver from the 100 or so games I have tested with the 19-land Japanese lists, does NOT want to be flooded at all. Tamiyo/Gideon/Sphinx is just bleh. There was never a situation where I really wanted any of those cards outside of being flooded. The only real decks you have to worry about is Pod/Zombies/Green/Mirror. You have positive sideboard options for any of the options. Like other players have already pretty much agreed the core is set at this point for Delver, there are about 3 or 4 cards you can move in and out to give you better Game 1s depending on the meta, namely the equipment. As for you list, I suggest you go up to 3 Dismembers and 3 Purges in the sideboard. Zombies/Green will be your toughest match-ups. You need to be able to remove Messengers/Crawlers permanently and you need to be able to kill other Angels and Archdruid. Play Geist over Splicer if you aren't going to play Angel, the Splicer is significantly worse without Angel. I don't like double S:WP and rather have a 1/1 split of Sword and Pike. Pike let's you slow roll your threats. Also that mana base looks atrocious to casting WW2 for Bladehold. | ||
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Durp
Canada3117 Posts
On August 11 2012 06:44 Judicator wrote: No point. Just play what Gindy played if you expect mirrors. Basically, he took out the Angel interactions and went Heroes of Bladehold since that will actually beat most Green decks if it sticks as opposed to working really hard with Angel. Like Delver from the 100 or so games I have tested with the 19-land Japanese lists, does NOT want to be flooded at all. Tamiyo/Gideon/Sphinx is just bleh. There was never a situation where I really wanted any of those cards outside of being flooded. The only real decks you have to worry about is Pod/Zombies/Green/Mirror. You have positive sideboard options for any of the options. Like other players have already pretty much agreed the core is set at this point for Delver, there are about 3 or 4 cards you can move in and out to give you better Game 1s depending on the meta, namely the equipment. As for you list, I suggest you go up to 3 Dismembers and 3 Purges in the sideboard. Zombies/Green will be your toughest match-ups. You need to be able to remove Messengers/Crawlers permanently and you need to be able to kill other Angels and Archdruid. Play Geist over Splicer if you aren't going to play Angel, the Splicer is significantly worse without Angel. I don't like double S:WP and rather have a 1/1 split of Sword and Pike. Pike let's you slow roll your threats. Also that mana base looks atrocious to casting WW2 for Bladehold. I like the angel interactions so I'm probably going to run the angel version over the giest version. I definitely can do the pike/swp instead of two s:wp's. I usually do cavern for human, so I haven't had too much of a problem casting the heros, with 9 white sources not including caverns. So you suggest pulling tamiyo, gideon and sphinx for the two extra dismembers and the one extra purge? | ||
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ODKStevez
Ireland1225 Posts
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Judicator
United States7270 Posts
On August 11 2012 09:22 Durp wrote: I like the angel interactions so I'm probably going to run the angel version over the giest version. I definitely can do the pike/swp instead of two s:wp's. I usually do cavern for human, so I haven't had too much of a problem casting the heros, with 9 white sources not including caverns. So you suggest pulling tamiyo, gideon and sphinx for the two extra dismembers and the one extra purge? Well ask yourself when you had 5 lands and realistically can cast Tamiyo or Gideon. If you expect ramp, then by all means play it. But its not like your MU against it is bad. If you go back to the Angel line keep in mind that your MU against Green is much worse since Angel does very little against competent pilots. | ||
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OoFuzer
Chile436 Posts
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cLAN.Anax
United States2847 Posts
On August 11 2012 10:16 ODKStevez wrote: I love magic, especially forest cards. Used to play Yu Gi Oh and Pokémon TCGs but now I am completely hooked on this game in the real world. Not a fan of it on computers though. Same. There's something about playing in real-life which makes it feel... "authentic" and special.  Still, it's nice to play with friends without having to drop hundreds of dollars into a deck, like online lets you do, lol. | ||
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Wegandi
United States2455 Posts
Obviously includes: Geist of Saint Traft Rancor Sublime Archangel Cavern of Souls War Cathedral (mana a little iffy...., but exalted...) Rancor Sigarda, Host of Herons That's just a base...so looking forward to RtR. Obviously needs some good counter/removals, which I am hoping RtR will provide. | ||
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Judicator
United States7270 Posts
On August 11 2012 23:57 Wegandi wrote: So, looking forward to RtR. Looking to bring back Bant in all its glory. Hopefully Birds is reprinted in RtR since...it was in Ravnica when it was excluded from the core set. Other than that, another Noble Hierarch type card would be swell :p Obviously includes: Geist of Saint Traft Rancor Sublime Archangel Cavern of Souls War Cathedral (mana a little iffy...., but exalted...) Rancor Sigarda, Host of Herons That's just a base...so looking forward to RtR. Obviously needs some good counter/removals, which I am hoping RtR will provide. Good removal and counters aren't usually provided in blocks, but rather Core sets. Wizards pretty much have said they do not like Mana Leak's design and we're never sniffing a 2 mana counter all ever again, nor will we see anything like Spell Pierce again, so yeah, chances of a good counter are pretty short. Deprive maybe the best thing we'll get. They're not letting Snapcaster co-exist with a solid counter spell in standard and I don't really blame them. | ||
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Risen
United States7927 Posts
On August 12 2012 03:28 Judicator wrote: Good removal and counters aren't usually provided in blocks, but rather Core sets. Wizards pretty much have said they do not like Mana Leak's design and we're never sniffing a 2 mana counter all ever again, nor will we see anything like Spell Pierce again, so yeah, chances of a good counter are pretty short. Deprive maybe the best thing we'll get. They're not letting Snapcaster co-exist with a solid counter spell in standard and I don't really blame them. I want spells like my favorite spell of all time spellsnare back :< | ||
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matiK23
United States963 Posts
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arioch
England403 Posts
On August 12 2012 05:41 matiK23 wrote: how does someone who is curious about MtG get started in this game? In my opinion the easiest way is to buy an intro deck, find a store close to you and play some Friday Night Magic... http://locator.wizards.com/#brand=magic Often stores will also run limited draft events weekly to help you build you collection. Paper magic is the best way to start and see if you like it cheaply for sure. Magic online is fun - But I use it more as a tool to get my magic fix now I am already a fan. I wouldn't recommend throwing a couple of hundred bucks at it for someone that doesn't know whether they want to carry on playing or not! Good Luck! | ||
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Judicator
United States7270 Posts
On August 12 2012 05:23 Risen wrote: I want spells like my favorite spell of all time spellsnare back :< That spell is interesting right now if you look at the all the notable 2 drops in standard that will survive rotation. I'd rather have Remand but that card plays a little too well with Delver and Tiago. Edit: As for the person asking how to start completely fresh in Magic, try out some of the video games like Duels of the Planeswalker to see if you actually enjoy the game itself. Then try out your local scene. The reason for this is to get a basic understanding of the game first so you have an idea of the terminology, basic rules, etc, so you are not overwhelmed at first in real life. | ||
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ThaZenith
Canada3116 Posts
On August 12 2012 05:45 arioch wrote: In my opinion the easiest way is to buy an intro deck, find a store close to you and play some Friday Night Magic... http://locator.wizards.com/#brand=magic Often stores will also run limited draft events weekly to help you build you collection. Paper magic is the best way to start and see if you like it cheaply for sure. Magic online is fun - But I use it more as a tool to get my magic fix now I am already a fan. I wouldn't recommend throwing a couple of hundred bucks at it for someone that doesn't know whether they want to carry on playing or not! Good Luck! He's just curious. IMO, best way to do that is to get a MTGO account for $10, and play planeswalker. Your account will come with enough planeswalker cards to experience deckmaking (over 399 cards!), and learning the technical aspects is easy there as well. And you can play/practice as long as you want to decide if you enjoy the game. (not to mention he would get to experience limited formats/learn how they work there for free as well, seeing as not everyone would necessarily enjoy them) Duels of the Planeswalkers (the steam game) is ok for this purpose as well, but there's no deckbuilding really, which is a fun part of magic. After that, if he enjoys the game itself, he can decide if paper would be a good investment of money/time. (or invest into actual online cards, if he prefers being able to play anytime) | ||
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Wegandi
United States2455 Posts
On August 12 2012 03:28 Judicator wrote: Good removal and counters aren't usually provided in blocks, but rather Core sets. Wizards pretty much have said they do not like Mana Leak's design and we're never sniffing a 2 mana counter all ever again, nor will we see anything like Spell Pierce again, so yeah, chances of a good counter are pretty short. Deprive maybe the best thing we'll get. They're not letting Snapcaster co-exist with a solid counter spell in standard and I don't really blame them. Perhaps, but we saw Path to Exile, Terminate, Blightning, Countersquall, Celestial Purge, Hindering Light, Martial Coup, Thought Hemorrhage, Meddling Mage, Qasali Pridemage, etc. all in one block. Stuff like Condemn also first showed up in Dissension block. Other than that, RtR should be interesting. | ||
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Judicator
United States7270 Posts
On August 12 2012 08:39 Wegandi wrote: Perhaps, but we saw Path to Exile, Terminate, Blightning, Countersquall, Celestial Purge, Hindering Light, Martial Coup, Thought Hemorrhage, Meddling Mage, Qasali Pridemage, etc. all in one block. Stuff like Condemn also first showed up in Dissension block. Other than that, RtR should be interesting. ?? What? None of those cards except Path is on the tier of Mana Leak/Doom Blade? They were all good cards in standard but their mana costs were restrictive unlike the removal/counters you would typically see in core sets. Edit: I should say Path is above both those cards in terms of power level. Condemn would be useful though. Edit2: More Judicator's Adventures on MWS + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/515/22496128.png/) Uploaded with ImageShack.us Accusing me of running a net deck, christ... | ||
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Wegandi
United States2455 Posts
On August 12 2012 08:54 Judicator wrote: ?? What? None of those cards except Path is on the tier of Mana Leak/Doom Blade? They were all good cards in standard but their mana costs were restrictive unlike the removal/counters you would typically see in core sets. Edit: I should say Path is above both those cards in terms of power level. Condemn would be useful though. Edit2: More Judicator's Adventures on MWS + Show Spoiler + Uploaded with ImageShack.us Accusing me of running a net deck, christ... You said 'good' removals were mostly Core-set material. Sometimes, yes, sometimes no. Lots of blocks have good removal/counter either in form of instant and sorceries or creature spells. I gave you one example of a relatively recent block that made my point. Never did I say anything about being on the power of mana leak or doom blade. Non-sequitur aside, I expect there to be useful and playable counters and removal in RtR, at least enough to somewhat make up for what we are losing. As far as restrictive costs for those cards....most of them are 2CMC cards, and easily accessible. Terminate is better than doom blade imho because it has more versatility even though yes, it costs R instead of 1, especially in sets like Alara and Ravnica where the standard deck is 3+ colors. Control isn't as good in this block due to things like Cavern of Souls, Hex proof, and all other sorts of hate against it. Snap caster is overrated to be honest. Yes, a good card, but not so broken as to destroy the power of all other instants and sorceries. | ||
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Judicator
United States7270 Posts
I know what you meant and I was clarifying what I meant. We have different definitions of good. As for Doom Blade versus Terminate, no, it really isn't even close, 1B is very different from RB and the drawback is something you can manage as a deck builder. As for control, no, caverns, hexproof, undying are wrecking the old ideas of control, not control in general. It requires much more work than throw a bunch of counterspells/kills and like 4 win cons to run control now (for the past year of standard). For the most part, it's not worth the time as it requires constant updating and tracking of the metagame, but if you get it right, you are really mostly untouchable for that particular tournament. | ||
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cLAN.Anax
United States2847 Posts
On August 12 2012 05:41 matiK23 wrote: how does someone who is curious about MtG get started in this game? I'm gonna go off of what ThaZenith said and emphasize an online game first, definitely either Magic Online or Duels of the Planeswalkers. I've not tried MO, but DotP is excellent for starters, in my opinion. The 2013 version is only 10 bucks on Steam, and the hints really help you understand what everything means and does. (this is coming from one who's played Magic for ~2 years now) It's true that you don't get much in the way of deck customization in DotP. So when you feel confident enough to jump to real-life, I recommend browsing Gatherer at cards you'd like to play with and reading through the comments; commenters are a great source for finding useful cards that combo with what you want. | ||
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