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On August 01 2011 19:35 Sufficiency wrote:
Any TLers here play WoW and sold WoW stuff before? I have some friends who were hardcore WoW players. I vaguely remember one of my friends said something about having played about 500 hours of WoW, quit, then sold his account for nearly 1000 dollars. I am not sure if this was real, but it was a lot of money.
If the same reward/hours ratio can be realized in D3, one can easily make a very profitable business out of this. 1-2 dollars per hour is very good wage in many countries, especially if the workers are getting paid playing video games.
Anyways, my point is that trading in-game currency against real money is evil. There has already been too much publications about some prisoners in China being forced to play WoW. Blizzard is promoting this kinds of things by legalizing trading in-game currency against real money; furthermore, Blizzard "tax" every dollar that is made this way.
Congratulations on Blizzard on figuring out how to exploit the poor and disadvantaged in such a smart and novel way.
exactly what this means
"Factories" of laborers making imaginary goods in third world countries. It's pretty silly but it already happens. D3 will just make it huge. Amazing that blizzard is supporting such massive waste of work force.
It's honestly disgusting that this is where gaming is going. To some sort of exploitation on pay to win /microtransactions with chinese farmers/botters creating hte goods and developers taxing the trades.
mmorpg/grind games becoming so disgusting.
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Anyone else beside me think that hardcore mode will become the norm for Diablo fans now and normal will become the "lol nub bought his way into the game lol".
I mean don't get me wrong people will still farm the shit out of normal for money,but i kinda see that a community split will happen kinda like the one HON is having right now,where people that paid for the game will look down upon everyone new that comes in now that the game is F2P.
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RM auction house wont be flooded because there are list fees. There will be some junk, but it wont be extreme. In my opinion RM auction is great. I wont use it besides free features, but I support it. If somebody is so stupid they want to have all items ASAP and they pay hundreds of dollars for it, okay. I dont care. Let them have it. I will have my fun gaining items cleaner way - gold auction, or drops. Its their fault they use it.
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On August 01 2011 19:23 Logros wrote:
I was angry at first too but you have to realize that all of this was happening in D2 as well just outside of the game. I'd rather have blizzard regulate it so there's less scamming going on.
Everybody knows RMT was going on, but those of us who frown upon the practice are rather delighted that people who buy stuff with real world money have the penalty that is the risk of being scammed.
Blizzard games' EULA banned both end of the RMT, and I just don't understand why they feel the need to protect one side of that transaction now... aside from their own profit potential that is.
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On August 01 2011 18:53 dacthehork wrote:
You will never as a real player make money off this auction house.
Simple economics. Labor in some countries is EXTREMELY cheap. If you can make 1 dollar an hour farming a endgame area. Guess what, there will be factories of cheap laborers farming that area.
Simple worldwide economics means 95% of the supply will be from cheap laborers. The main interaction Americans/first worlders would have is buying said goods. The supply will match the demand. If the demand for items is enough to sustain 5 dollars an hour, the market will be flooded by cheap laborers from third world/poor areas farming.
Basically from a supply/demand there is no way the average player will make more than like 20 cents an hour playing d3 constantly. If you could make more, a huge supply of cheap laborers would already be doing it and probably will flood the market.
I wouldnt be surprised if 60% of accounts are "farmers" aka cheap laborers from poor areas.
Also yes the chinese will use proxies to avoid bans. Now if botting/hacking becomes the norm like in D2 you could potentially make some cash botting/duping, but not legitly playing.
I'm sorry, it's not that easy. You can't just come up with random numbers. For example, the money you need to invest in order to set up for selling at $1/hour will feed a family for a few months. Anybody that can afford to buy multiple set ups will find much more profitable investment opportunities in, for example, sewing stuff. There are so many more things you didn't consider.
It's incredibly naive to assume that a billon dollar company would make such a decision without consulting real experts and taking appropriate counter measures to everything. They can't make a game which can possibly turn out the way you described, there's way too much at stake.
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I don't understand the issue people have with RMT auction house. Other players can already buy items for real money via third parties anyway, so what's the harm in making it official and risk-free for users? Let Blizzard get their cut on each auction, it is their game after all.
And PvP really is not what Diablo is about.
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On August 01 2011 19:44 Takyn wrote:
I don't understand the issue people have with RMT auction house. Other players can already buy items for real money via third parties anyway, so what's the harm in making it official and risk-free for users? Let Blizzard get their cut on each auction, it is their game after all.
And PvP really is not what Diablo is about.
I agree. People should really chill out.
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On August 01 2011 19:35 Sufficiency wrote:
Any TLers here play WoW and sold WoW stuff before? I have some friends who were hardcore WoW players. I vaguely remember one of my friends said something about having played about 500 hours of WoW, quit, then sold his account for nearly 1000 dollars. I am not sure if this was real, but it was a lot of money.
If the same reward/hours ratio can be realized in D3, one can easily make a very profitable business out of this. 1-2 dollars per hour is very good wage in many countries, especially if the workers are getting paid playing video games.
Anyways, my point is that trading in-game currency against real money is evil. There has already been too much publicity about some prisoners in China being forced to play WoW. Blizzard is promoting this kinds of things by legalizing trading in-game currency against real money; furthermore, Blizzard "tax" every dollar that is made this way.
Congratulations on Blizzard on figuring out how to exploit the poor and disadvantaged in such a smart and novel way.
are you kidding me?
1-2 per hour is slave labor lol.
Spending 500 hours on something for sheer profit of 1000 dollars is bad business.
Get a job, work a week, and you have 10 times thast amount in my country.
Lols
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I can't believe so many people are hating on this. Blizzard is taking a very smart approach to their troubles with gold farmers. Would you rather have them act like EA or Ubisoft and approach everyone like criminals until otherwise proven? (Whic, btw, they are doing in wow already). Why not just make it legal, and have it under their own control?
This is pretty much the best answer they could have provided, and while I probably wont be using it myself, I find it brilliant. I do fear, however, seeing as this is a singleplayer game (even if you have to be connected to play it) how they are going to stop farmbots. It seems to me it could be very easy to earn a few bucks by having D3 on in the background with a bot running around farming for you.
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On August 01 2011 19:46 MasterFischer wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2011 19:35 Sufficiency wrote:
Any TLers here play WoW and sold WoW stuff before? I have some friends who were hardcore WoW players. I vaguely remember one of my friends said something about having played about 500 hours of WoW, quit, then sold his account for nearly 1000 dollars. I am not sure if this was real, but it was a lot of money.
If the same reward/hours ratio can be realized in D3, one can easily make a very profitable business out of this. 1-2 dollars per hour is very good wage in many countries, especially if the workers are getting paid playing video games.
Anyways, my point is that trading in-game currency against real money is evil. There has already been too much publicity about some prisoners in China being forced to play WoW. Blizzard is promoting this kinds of things by legalizing trading in-game currency against real money; furthermore, Blizzard "tax" every dollar that is made this way.
Congratulations on Blizzard on figuring out how to exploit the poor and disadvantaged in such a smart and novel way. are you kidding me? 1-2 per hour is slave labor lol. Spending 500 hours on something for sheer profit of 1000 dollars is bad business. Get a job, work a week, and you have 10 times thast amount in my country. Lols
Difference is that this is your hobby, not your job. You enjoy it, and have fun all the way up to the point where you sell your items. A lot of people earn small amounts of money with their hobbies (Painters, jewelry making etc), but they enjoy doing it, so theres no harm in it.
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Wow, why the qq?
In my opinion the real money auction house is a great idea, it legalizes what would be going on anyway, protects players from scams, and profits sellers and Blizzard instead of the creator of d2jsp.
And if you don't like it, don't use it.
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On August 01 2011 19:35 Sufficiency wrote:
Any TLers here play WoW and sold WoW stuff before? I have some friends who were hardcore WoW players. I vaguely remember one of my friends said something about having played about 500 hours of WoW, quit, then sold his account for nearly 1000 dollars. I am not sure if this was real, but it was a lot of money.
If the same reward/hours ratio can be realized in D3, one can easily make a very profitable business out of this. 1-2 dollars per hour is very good wage in many countries, especially if the workers are getting paid playing video games.
Anyways, my point is that trading in-game currency against real money is evil. There has already been too much publicity about some prisoners in China being forced to play WoW. Blizzard is promoting this kinds of things by legalizing trading in-game currency against real money; furthermore, Blizzard "tax" every dollar that is made this way.
Congratulations on Blizzard on figuring out how to exploit the poor and disadvantaged in such a smart and novel way.
Man 1-2 dollars per hour is half the minimum wage in my country i think,and here the wages are pretty low in general.I don't see as too who would consider this as a good full time job.....
If you want a career in WoW,rather learn how to hack and steel peoples gold.
Both is illegal so....
On August 01 2011 19:49 Excludos wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2011 19:46 MasterFischer wrote:On August 01 2011 19:35 Sufficiency wrote:
Any TLers here play WoW and sold WoW stuff before? I have some friends who were hardcore WoW players. I vaguely remember one of my friends said something about having played about 500 hours of WoW, quit, then sold his account for nearly 1000 dollars. I am not sure if this was real, but it was a lot of money.
If the same reward/hours ratio can be realized in D3, one can easily make a very profitable business out of this. 1-2 dollars per hour is very good wage in many countries, especially if the workers are getting paid playing video games.
Anyways, my point is that trading in-game currency against real money is evil. There has already been too much publicity about some prisoners in China being forced to play WoW. Blizzard is promoting this kinds of things by legalizing trading in-game currency against real money; furthermore, Blizzard "tax" every dollar that is made this way.
Congratulations on Blizzard on figuring out how to exploit the poor and disadvantaged in such a smart and novel way. are you kidding me? 1-2 per hour is slave labor lol. Spending 500 hours on something for sheer profit of 1000 dollars is bad business. Get a job, work a week, and you have 10 times thast amount in my country. Lols Difference is that this is your hobby, not your job. You enjoy it, and have fun all the way up to the point where you sell your items.
If you ever played wow,earning gold is the most boring and repetative thing ever.I can't imagine one single person having fun doing it in the long run.....
Yea,if your good at the AH you can pull off some serious money,but still,I heard of cases in the past where blizzard closely monitored people that pulled off huge amounts of money from the AH,and many got their accounts banned,that tried to sell the gold...
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I'm actually kinda pissed the RMT AH is not included in Hardcore.. why play hardcore when you can make money in softcore - especially early on when rich nerds will pay LOADS for items like shako 2.0 or stormshield 2.0 ?
May as well play softcore to learn the game and learn the nasty areas where you can die as well as make a buck! then switch to HC later on...
and shutup all you naysayers d2jsp already exists and many other sites too... there is no difference..
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/off topic
@MasterFischer Thats actually quite okay, the cost of living is a lot cheaper here than in the west. for that salary in a month you can live pretty well. Even something as simple as a mineral water bottle costs 4 times the amount in the west than what it costs here. 500$/month is around the average salary a computer science graduate gets at one of the "big four". It's is not low, it's just everything else is less expensive too.
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On August 01 2011 19:49 TheKefka wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2011 19:35 Sufficiency wrote:
Any TLers here play WoW and sold WoW stuff before? I have some friends who were hardcore WoW players. I vaguely remember one of my friends said something about having played about 500 hours of WoW, quit, then sold his account for nearly 1000 dollars. I am not sure if this was real, but it was a lot of money.
If the same reward/hours ratio can be realized in D3, one can easily make a very profitable business out of this. 1-2 dollars per hour is very good wage in many countries, especially if the workers are getting paid playing video games.
Anyways, my point is that trading in-game currency against real money is evil. There has already been too much publicity about some prisoners in China being forced to play WoW. Blizzard is promoting this kinds of things by legalizing trading in-game currency against real money; furthermore, Blizzard "tax" every dollar that is made this way.
Congratulations on Blizzard on figuring out how to exploit the poor and disadvantaged in such a smart and novel way. Man 1-2 dollars per hour is half the minimum wage in my country i think,and here the wages are pretty low in general.I don't see as too who would consider this as a good full time job..... If you want a career in WoW,rather learn how to hack and steel peoples gold. Both is illegal so.... Show nested quote +On August 01 2011 19:49 Excludos wrote:On August 01 2011 19:46 MasterFischer wrote:On August 01 2011 19:35 Sufficiency wrote:
Any TLers here play WoW and sold WoW stuff before? I have some friends who were hardcore WoW players. I vaguely remember one of my friends said something about having played about 500 hours of WoW, quit, then sold his account for nearly 1000 dollars. I am not sure if this was real, but it was a lot of money.
If the same reward/hours ratio can be realized in D3, one can easily make a very profitable business out of this. 1-2 dollars per hour is very good wage in many countries, especially if the workers are getting paid playing video games.
Anyways, my point is that trading in-game currency against real money is evil. There has already been too much publicity about some prisoners in China being forced to play WoW. Blizzard is promoting this kinds of things by legalizing trading in-game currency against real money; furthermore, Blizzard "tax" every dollar that is made this way.
Congratulations on Blizzard on figuring out how to exploit the poor and disadvantaged in such a smart and novel way. are you kidding me? 1-2 per hour is slave labor lol. Spending 500 hours on something for sheer profit of 1000 dollars is bad business. Get a job, work a week, and you have 10 times thast amount in my country. Lols Difference is that this is your hobby, not your job. You enjoy it, and have fun all the way up to the point where you sell your items. If you ever played wow,earning gold is the most boring and repetative thing ever.I can't imagine one single person having fun doing it in the long run.....
If you read the original quoted post, you'd notice he was not gold farming. He was playing a game he enjoyed, and sold his character when he was finished..
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On August 01 2011 19:51 Phats wrote:
I'm actually kinda pissed the RMT AH is not included in Hardcore.. why play hardcore when you can make money in softcore - especially early on when rich nerds will pay LOADS for items like shako 2.0 or stormshield 2.0 ?
May as well play softcore to learn the game and learn the nasty areas where you can die as well as make a buck! then switch to HC later on...
and shutup all you naysayers d2jsp already exists and many other sites too... there is no difference..
Except one would allow blizzard to make money and the other not so.
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On August 01 2011 19:44 PepperoniPiZZa wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2011 18:53 dacthehork wrote:
You will never as a real player make money off this auction house.
Simple economics. Labor in some countries is EXTREMELY cheap. If you can make 1 dollar an hour farming a endgame area. Guess what, there will be factories of cheap laborers farming that area.
Simple worldwide economics means 95% of the supply will be from cheap laborers. The main interaction Americans/first worlders would have is buying said goods. The supply will match the demand. If the demand for items is enough to sustain 5 dollars an hour, the market will be flooded by cheap laborers from third world/poor areas farming.
Basically from a supply/demand there is no way the average player will make more than like 20 cents an hour playing d3 constantly. If you could make more, a huge supply of cheap laborers would already be doing it and probably will flood the market.
I wouldnt be surprised if 60% of accounts are "farmers" aka cheap laborers from poor areas.
Also yes the chinese will use proxies to avoid bans. Now if botting/hacking becomes the norm like in D2 you could potentially make some cash botting/duping, but not legitly playing. I'm sorry, it's not that easy. You can't just come up with random numbers. For example, the money you need to invest in order to set up for selling at $1/hour will feed a family for a few months. Anybody that can afford to buy multiple set ups will find much more profitable investment opportunities in, for example, sewing stuff. There are so many more things you didn't consider. It's incredibly naive to assume that a billon dollar company would make such a decision without consulting real experts and taking appropriate counter measures to everything. They can't make a game which can possibly turn out the way you described, there's way too much at stake.
On August 01 2011 19:46 MasterFischer wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2011 19:35 Sufficiency wrote:
Any TLers here play WoW and sold WoW stuff before? I have some friends who were hardcore WoW players. I vaguely remember one of my friends said something about having played about 500 hours of WoW, quit, then sold his account for nearly 1000 dollars. I am not sure if this was real, but it was a lot of money.
If the same reward/hours ratio can be realized in D3, one can easily make a very profitable business out of this. 1-2 dollars per hour is very good wage in many countries, especially if the workers are getting paid playing video games.
Anyways, my point is that trading in-game currency against real money is evil. There has already been too much publicity about some prisoners in China being forced to play WoW. Blizzard is promoting this kinds of things by legalizing trading in-game currency against real money; furthermore, Blizzard "tax" every dollar that is made this way.
Congratulations on Blizzard on figuring out how to exploit the poor and disadvantaged in such a smart and novel way. are you kidding me? 1-2 per hour is slave labor lol. Spending 500 hours on something for sheer profit of 1000 dollars is bad business. Get a job, work a week, and you have 10 times thast amount in my country. Lols
You are thinking too highly of Blizzard. Blizzard is a corporation whose goal is to make money. The system it is proposing makes money for Blizzard. I hardly think it cares about consequences besides itself making money.
Also, I am fairly sure that most people in the poorest countries in Africa live below the UN poverty line: which is 1.25 USD per day. I am not saying that sweat shops for this will immediately become a success, but with the legalization of RM trades, this is essentially what Blizzard is promoting. Also remember that these are not real labour jobs. In fact, these are kind of "fun" jobs that people can do.
There are obviously a lot of challenges I can think of:
1. Setup cost. The company needs to buy computers (probably needs 500 USD per machine), copies of D3 (Blizzard makes more money), a physical sweat shop, etc.
2. Training. A sweat shop worker needs to know how to play the game effectively. This is mitigated by the fact that D3 is a computer game that is designed to be "fun" to play, thus motivating the workers to learn to play the game.
3. Profit margins. This is a tough one. Compared to WoW's system, I suspect a lot more people will be selling items, but also because of its legality, a lot more players will buy items. To this end, I find it difficult to predict the profit margins of such operation, except I think it will be comparable to WoW.
Regardless, the worst thing about this is that Blizzard gets a share of the profit from these kinds of operations through listing fees, tax, etc.
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On August 01 2011 19:53 Excludos wrote:Show nested quote +On August 01 2011 19:49 TheKefka wrote:On August 01 2011 19:35 Sufficiency wrote:
Any TLers here play WoW and sold WoW stuff before? I have some friends who were hardcore WoW players. I vaguely remember one of my friends said something about having played about 500 hours of WoW, quit, then sold his account for nearly 1000 dollars. I am not sure if this was real, but it was a lot of money.
If the same reward/hours ratio can be realized in D3, one can easily make a very profitable business out of this. 1-2 dollars per hour is very good wage in many countries, especially if the workers are getting paid playing video games.
Anyways, my point is that trading in-game currency against real money is evil. There has already been too much publicity about some prisoners in China being forced to play WoW. Blizzard is promoting this kinds of things by legalizing trading in-game currency against real money; furthermore, Blizzard "tax" every dollar that is made this way.
Congratulations on Blizzard on figuring out how to exploit the poor and disadvantaged in such a smart and novel way. Man 1-2 dollars per hour is half the minimum wage in my country i think,and here the wages are pretty low in general.I don't see as too who would consider this as a good full time job..... If you want a career in WoW,rather learn how to hack and steel peoples gold. Both is illegal so.... On August 01 2011 19:49 Excludos wrote:On August 01 2011 19:46 MasterFischer wrote:On August 01 2011 19:35 Sufficiency wrote:
Any TLers here play WoW and sold WoW stuff before? I have some friends who were hardcore WoW players. I vaguely remember one of my friends said something about having played about 500 hours of WoW, quit, then sold his account for nearly 1000 dollars. I am not sure if this was real, but it was a lot of money.
If the same reward/hours ratio can be realized in D3, one can easily make a very profitable business out of this. 1-2 dollars per hour is very good wage in many countries, especially if the workers are getting paid playing video games.
Anyways, my point is that trading in-game currency against real money is evil. There has already been too much publicity about some prisoners in China being forced to play WoW. Blizzard is promoting this kinds of things by legalizing trading in-game currency against real money; furthermore, Blizzard "tax" every dollar that is made this way.
Congratulations on Blizzard on figuring out how to exploit the poor and disadvantaged in such a smart and novel way. are you kidding me? 1-2 per hour is slave labor lol. Spending 500 hours on something for sheer profit of 1000 dollars is bad business. Get a job, work a week, and you have 10 times thast amount in my country. Lols Difference is that this is your hobby, not your job. You enjoy it, and have fun all the way up to the point where you sell your items. If you ever played wow,earning gold is the most boring and repetative thing ever.I can't imagine one single person having fun doing it in the long run..... If you read the original quoted post, you'd notice he was not gold farming. He was playing a game he enjoyed, and sold his character when he was finished..
Oh sorry just read the second part of the post T.T.
Well still,the days where you can sell your account for such a high amount as 1k$ are over in wow Imo.
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I saw (what I thought were) fake in-game Chinese pictures of D3's auction house with real money prices. I told myself: "Haha, those Chinese sure are funny. Blizzard was always against character selling in WoW, real-money trading will never happen in D3".
I was so excited about D3, but this makes me sick to my stomach. I don't want to buy that game anymore.
First it kills the game so bad: "Oh you need a better sword but don't wanna wait ! Give some more of your money to Blizzard !: I always thought that paying with real-money for in-game items was so wrong, what ever the game is. You might never use it and that's fine, but everyone knows that really hardcore players will spend a ridiculous amount of real money just to be on the edge.
And before some people tell me : "Oh its great, you'll be able to make money !" I didn't wan't to play D3 to stress about my wallet, thanks.
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EPT
