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On July 04 2010 07 begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 04 2010 07 end_of_the_skype_highlighting:53 redtooth wrote:
i am officially maining pirate.
that guy is too good.
rofl, yeah he actually is, almost everyone plays him wrong but as long as you know how to deny and control your lane, you can build him in almost any way and he'll work really well if you know what you're doing. Although I'm not sure if he's worth maining completely~~
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just bought yi this morning. 7-0  pretty fun
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On July 04 2010 07:06 Mogwai wrote:
NuNu is fucking amazing at laning. I totally don't get why people bother with jungling with him.
p.s. I love NuNu, I plan on playing him when I don't feel like playing panth anymore. It's really a shame he's not a real tank or a real nuker or a real support. End game just feels like such a hodgepodge and if your team isn't on point, all your little benefits just go to waste.
Step 1: Build tank
Step 2: ???
Step 3: Run in the middle of the team fight and cast ult
Step 4: Profit
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step 3.5 get silecned
but reall i just played fiddle amnuu nunu and it rapes
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ugh i went into this week with saved up IP intending on buying blitz to start really maining him. and not im having boatloads of fun with morg and pirate >_< i just like too many champs.
oh and had my first carry as heimer today. i forget what the enemy comp was but they could do NOTHING to me. pushed down every thing so freakin fast.
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I have to agree. Nunu is fucking boss.
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really? ive always been underwhelmed by nunus. i mean they serve the tank role okay, but id rather have an amumu.
although i giggle abit when nunus just eat heimer turrets.
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On July 04 2010 06:52 Southlight wrote:
Except I routinely have Taric games where the game ends with me having Ring, GA, and Treads. Bask in the glory of my 2nd or 3rd tank item.
Edit:
And obviously rushing MR items is not ideal, I've been pretty clear over time about how I prefer to get stuff like Sunfires to get HP first. But if there's a fed AP hero and there's an emergency MR requirement then that's how I'd go about business. Incidentally rushing GA on Taric is pretty standard now, so that's another tank hero that goes about getting HP/MR in different ways. Thus, no "standard" tanking build order.
I find that Chalice/Mercs is usually sufficient unless they have more than 1 big nuker (like Annie and Ryze on the same team, but then they have other problems) and Shatter is sufficient for armor as long as you aren't the only one that doesn't die in 2 seconds. Your ult should keep you up through most anything with a self heal or 2 on top.
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Soo, DPS Evelynn feels like it could be better than the standard AP Evelynn. Trinity Force has no cooldown and hence procs off every single hate spike, in addition to that the extra movespeed from the ulti and the lifedreain on kill, plus the standard stealth and ability stun should make her more useful. Thoughts?
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On July 04 2010 09:53 Shikyo wrote:
Soo, DPS Evelynn feels like it could be better than the standard AP Evelynn. Trinity Force has no cooldown and hence procs off every single hate spike, in addition to that the extra movespeed from the ulti and the lifedreain on kill, plus the standard stealth and ability stun should make her more useful. Thoughts?
I've often thought this was reasonable, but it doesn't solve the problem -- Evelyn is fine sneaking up on people, but poo if there's more than one opponent, which is the majority of the game. You might be able to get away with Trinity -> Frozen Mallet -> tank items (sunfire?), but I doubt it.
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On July 04 2010 09 begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 04 2010 09 end_of_the_skype_highlighting:59 oberon wrote:Show nested quote +On July 04 2010 09:53 Shikyo wrote:
Soo, DPS Evelynn feels like it could be better than the standard AP Evelynn. Trinity Force has no cooldown and hence procs off every single hate spike, in addition to that the extra movespeed from the ulti and the lifedreain on kill, plus the standard stealth and ability stun should make her more useful. Thoughts? I've often thought this was reasonable, but it doesn't solve the problem -- Evelyn is fine sneaking up on people, but poo if there's more than one opponent, which is the majority of the game. You might be able to get away with Trinity -> Frozen Mallet -> tank items (sunfire?), but I doubt it.
Lifesteal helps a lot with that, and she'd function just like any other melee carry. Just join the fight when you would with Master Yi, and it's fine. And yeah just tested it, I think Trinity Force has 1 sec cooldown or no cooldown at all.
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Trinity force or DFG, trinity force or DFG...
:S
Killing people out of streath in 1 second is fun too.
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The reason AD Evelynn fails is that she lacks the supreme spike damage she needs to be useful in team fights. If you can not force kills quickly with Sprint(or flash)+Ulti into ravage+hit you will get shut out by most decent teams with Oracles/Wards.
AP Evelynn is way underrated though, while she is probably not top tier she is much better than typically given credit for.
The gist of Playing Evelynn: Get Armour pen marks/quints and your choice of glyphs/seals (I prefer mana/5 per lvl). For summoner skills get Ghost and depending on team/personal play style Flash/Exhaust/Cleanse/Ignite. Personally I skill 21/0/9 skipping the crit damage in off tree.
For skills go Ravage[E]-> Shadow Walk[W]->E->W->E->Malice and Spite[R]->E->Hate Spike[Q]->E then following a priority of R->Q->W.
For items go Doran's Ring->Boots/Mejas->Lichbane and if the game doesn't end then go Zhonyas->whatever you feel like.
Start out strong in the game (if possible attempt FB @lvl1, Ganks @lvl 3 etc to put your opponents into defensive mode or make them buy wards), be cautious not to innitiate teamfights unless you are sure there is no stealth detect available and your allies have control options to save your ass, but once contact has been made be bold and Ghost+Ult in to pick at someone whos out of position or/low or generally squishy.
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nah, evelynn is terrible, just like everyone says
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On the whole Solo Que discussion. I'm a huge fan of Solo que's, in fact, I exclusively solo que or 2 man que with an irl friend of mine.
Solo que can be really frustrating because you do great and you have a feeder(s) that loses you games but that's fine, you should be proud of doing good. Ever since i started exclusively solo queing I've seen huge improvement in my play, at the cost of a good w/l (196/181 now).
My goal is to become good enough to be at high elo so I play with a minimal number of noobs, but for now i'll just carry and improve
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On July 04 2010 11 begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 04 2010 11 end_of_the_skype_highlighting begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 04 2010 11 end_of_the_skype_highlighting begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 04 2010 11 end_of_the_skype_highlighting begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 04 2010 11 end_of_the_skype_highlighting:02 Juicyfruit wrote:
Trinity force or DFG, trinity force or DFG...
:S
Killing people out of streath in 1 second is fun too.
Deathfire grasp is awfully crappy in my opinion. I just played a practice game where I had 920 AP as Kassadin and deathfire grasp only did like 30% of the Sivir's hp and she only had chalice. I don't think it's worth it at all, on just about anything unless you have some tank stacking armor and no mres. However, even in that case I'd get something useful and just use my normal abilities.
EDIT: I guess if they're massing HP without any mres, something like mass RoA singed, then it'd be useful. Otherwise, I think the item sucks.
On July 04 2010 11 begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 04 2010 11 end_of_the_skype_highlighting:04 Nafaltar wrote:
The reason AD Evelynn fails is that she lacks the supreme spike damage she needs to be useful in team fights. If you can not force kills quickly with Sprint(or flash)+Ulti into ravage+hit you will get shut out by most decent teams with Oracles/Wards.
AP Evelynn is way underrated though, while she is probably not top tier she is much better than typically given credit for.
The gist of Playing Evelynn: Get Armour pen marks/quints and your choice of glyphs/seals (I prefer mana/5 per lvl). For summoner skills get Ghost and depending on team/personal play style Flash/Exhaust/Cleanse/Ignite. Personally I skill 21/0/9 skipping the crit damage in off tree.
For skills go Ravage[E]-> Shadow Walk[W]->E->W->E->Malice and Spite[R]->E->Hate Spike[Q]->E then following a priority of R->Q->W.
For items go Doran's Ring->Boots/Mejas->Lichbane and if the game doesn't end then go Zhonyas->whatever you feel like.
Start out strong in the game (if possible attempt FB @lvl1, Ganks @lvl 3 etc to put your opponents into defensive mode or make them buy wards), be cautious not to innitiate teamfights unless you are sure there is no stealth detect available and your allies have control options to save your ass, but once contact has been made be bold and Ghost+Ult in to pick at someone whos out of position or/low or generally squishy.
With nothing but a Trinity Force and Inf edge, Eve can find 2 isolated people and do a hate spike double stun -> hit -> ravage -> hit combo on one of them, and even if it doesn't kill them right away... well it really should, but even if it doesn't you should have some teammates around. With 100 extra aspd and 30% movespeed she should be able to accomplish quite a bit, assuming she indeed does come out when she's supposed to.
Oh also, AP Eve is only able to spike properly when her Ravage is up, AD is able to always. When you don't have Ravage AP Eve is borderling useless. Also, DPS Eve plays like a chaser, she's not an initiator at all but she can hold her own a lot better than an AP Eve since as said, she completely relies on her Ravage to have any acceptable burst. With triforce proccing at least twice as often a Lich Bane and with more damage until you have Zhonya, her DPS is a lot better as well. The oracles and whatever don't matter at all if you play her properly, your Master Yi isn't invisible when he runs it and it's not such a huge deal. Not to mention that with the build you do with her, Trinity Force actually makes her do more spike damage until AP Eve has a Zhonya's, unless you think the first 600 spike from the Ravage + Lich Bane are enough.
@gkfjgjdh something person: just keep playing your janna and ezreal if you think it's fun
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On July 04 2010 11:22 Shikyo wrote:Show nested quote +On July 04 2010 11 begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 04 2010 11 end_of_the_skype_highlighting begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 04 2010 11 end_of_the_skype_highlighting begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 04 2010 11 end_of_the_skype_highlighting begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 04 2010 11 end_of_the_skype_highlighting:02 Juicyfruit wrote:
Trinity force or DFG, trinity force or DFG...
:S
Killing people out of streath in 1 second is fun too. Deathfire grasp is awfully crappy in my opinion. I just played a practice game where I had 920 AP as Kassadin and deathfire grasp only did like 30% of the Sivir's hp and she only had chalice. I don't think it's worth it at all, on just about anything unless you have some tank stacking armor and no mres. However, even in that case I'd get something useful and just use my normal abilities. EDIT: I guess if they're massing HP without any mres, something like mass RoA singed, then it'd be useful. Otherwise, I think the item sucks. Show nested quote +On July 04 2010 11 begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 04 2010 11 end_of_the_skype_highlighting:04 Nafaltar wrote:
The reason AD Evelynn fails is that she lacks the supreme spike damage she needs to be useful in team fights. If you can not force kills quickly with Sprint(or flash)+Ulti into ravage+hit you will get shut out by most decent teams with Oracles/Wards.
AP Evelynn is way underrated though, while she is probably not top tier she is much better than typically given credit for.
The gist of Playing Evelynn: Get Armour pen marks/quints and your choice of glyphs/seals (I prefer mana/5 per lvl). For summoner skills get Ghost and depending on team/personal play style Flash/Exhaust/Cleanse/Ignite. Personally I skill 21/0/9 skipping the crit damage in off tree.
For skills go Ravage[E]-> Shadow Walk[W]->E->W->E->Malice and Spite[R]->E->Hate Spike[Q]->E then following a priority of R->Q->W.
For items go Doran's Ring->Boots/Mejas->Lichbane and if the game doesn't end then go Zhonyas->whatever you feel like.
Start out strong in the game (if possible attempt FB @lvl1, Ganks @lvl 3 etc to put your opponents into defensive mode or make them buy wards), be cautious not to innitiate teamfights unless you are sure there is no stealth detect available and your allies have control options to save your ass, but once contact has been made be bold and Ghost+Ult in to pick at someone whos out of position or/low or generally squishy. With nothing but a Trinity Force and Inf edge, Eve can find 2 isolated people and do a hate spike double stun -> hit -> ravage -> hit combo on one of them, and even if it doesn't kill them right away... well it really should, but even if it doesn't you should have some teammates around. With 100 extra aspd and 30% movespeed she should be able to accomplish quite a bit, assuming she indeed does come out when she's supposed to. Oh also, AP Eve is only able to spike properly when her Ravage is up, AD is able to always. When you don't have Ravage AP Eve is borderling useless. Also, DPS Eve plays like a chaser, she's not an initiator at all but she can hold her own a lot better than an AP Eve since as said, she completely relies on her Ravage to have any acceptable burst. With triforce proccing at least twice as often a Lich Bane and with more damage until you have Zhonya, her DPS is a lot better as well. The oracles and whatever don't matter at all if you play her properly, your Master Yi isn't invisible when he runs it and it's not such a huge deal. Not to mention that with the build you do with her, Trinity Force actually makes her do more spike damage until AP Eve has a Zhonya's, unless you think the first 600 spike from the Ravage + Lich Bane are enough. @gkfjgjdh something person: just keep playing your janna and ezreal if you think it's fun
hold on there, u use deathfire on sivir? @_@
it is an anti-tanker item and you should use it on high HP tanker like Cho or garen or panth... Not even saying sivir might just spell block that shit.
to kill quishy, buy gunfire
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Yeah damage evelyn works fine in those scenarios but her spike damage is lower than AP Evelynn by a decent margin so while she might be as strong or even stronger in small 1v2/2v2 etc fights she suffers more in 5v5 fights. Also Trinity force+Inf Edge is very costly compared to mejas+Lichbane.(~8k vs ~4.3k). Plus Trinity force only applies to base attack damage: which for Evelynn is between 59 and just over a hundred off the top of my head.130% of that still isn't that huge a spike unless you also crit it. Plus your ravage does not benefit from AD. AP scales 1:1 for Both Ravage and Lichbane (-MR and Armor ofc) And Hate Spike itself does massive damage if you have 8k worth of ability power items(basically thats Mejas/lichbane/zhonyas). Also if the game does go Late Zhonyas is godly for team battles thanks to the on use (I do agree that DFG is a bad choice for Evelynn pre last slot).
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What happens when you lane Soraka + Kassadin vs. Morgana + Tryndamere?
+ Show Spoiler +
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On July 04 2010 11 begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 04 2010 11 end_of_the_skype_highlighting:43 Nafaltar wrote:
Yeah damage evelyn works fine in those scenarios but her spike damage is lower than AP Evelynn by a decent margin so while she might be as strong or even stronger in small 1v2/2v2 etc fights she suffers more in 5v5 fights. Also Trinity force+Inf Edge is very costly compared to mejas+Lichbane.(~8k vs ~4.3k). Plus Trinity force only applies to base attack damage: which for Evelynn is between 59 and just over a hundred off the top of my head.130% of that still isn't that huge a spike unless you also crit it. Plus your ravage does not benefit from AD. AP scales 1:1 for Both Ravage and Lichbane (-MR and Armor ofc) And Hate Spike itself does massive damage if you have 8k worth of ability power items(basically thats Mejas/lichbane/zhonyas). Also if the game does go Late Zhonyas is godly for team battles thanks to the on use (I do agree that DFG is a bad choice for Evelynn pre last slot).
No, it's exactly the opposite. AP Evelynn is better in a ganking situation like 2v1 or something, but because of AD Eve's better sustained damage and survivability through lifesteal, she's better in larger battles.
And I was just talking about trinity force vs mejai + lich bane, then Zhonya vs inf edge. Sure it's a bit more costy, but dps eve farms a lot better anyway.
Evelynn's Trinity Force increases her damage by a bit over 100, which is pretty huge considering how often it procs, it's almost like having a maxed Sword of the Occult. That isn't even the only reason to get it, since the slow, the extra hp and mana and movespeed are all useful, as well as the extra AP, dmg and everything else, AD Eve can use it all.
Ravage has such a long cooldown that while AD Eve's Ravage isn't too awesome, AP Eve pretty much only has burst vs a single target, and in fights with multiple enemies she can't burst properly because of the reliance on Ravage's damage and its relatively long cooldown.
About hate spike... if you think 100 dmg is "massive damage" I agree, unless you assume you'll have a full mejai's, which is a really silly thing to assume in every case. Then I can assume DPS Eve has a full occult and in that case her damage is really crazy.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://img594.imageshack.us/img594/6196/sorakakass.jpg)
