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Bill307
Canada9103 Posts
On April 26 2010 19:07 MCMcEmcee wrote:
Cody is solid. Dunno why you're listing "option selects" that are unsafe on block ;p Doesn't have many good ways to land his ultra yet, which is problematic. Doubt he'll end up being as amazing as you think. He'll be solid enough, though.
Makoto seems pretty good. Has issues with fireballs (maybe pick U2 for that) but grab -> U1 is easy big damage, and s.strong is really good. Needs some work figuring out how to optimize damage off stuff to make her mixup really scary, but having a command grab that can be combo'd off of is always nice. She probably won't be super great because of fireball characters... kinda like Honda I guess.
Pinwheel is unsafe last I looked (and that mixup doesn't even make sense in the first place, as they can just late tech if they don't see you pinwheel)! Juri has a lot of tools to work with though so she's looking like she'll be good, possibly the best of the new characters if some things pan out for her. We'll see how the matchups evolve once people get used to playing against her.
Obviously you wouldn't use that Cody "option-select" when you're in cr.lp range, since it is unsafe on block.  It's useful when you can stuff their pokes with cr.lp outside of its range. The trick with Cody is to use lp+mk to stop his ruffian kick from coming out on whiff due to negative edge.
The point of the Juri mixup is to do either:
- throw
- cr.lk throw
- cr.lk cr.lk kara-throw
- cr.lk cr.lk cr.lk (hit-confirm) EX-pinwheel
Since it's so difficult to tech throws while crouching, the opponent can choose to either stand-up to tech one of the throw and possibly eat the combo, or stay crouch-blocking but risk being thrown. The only ways to avoid guessing are to tech the throws while crouching, or to be able to stand and tech on reaction to Juri standing up and throwing you. (or mash out a reversal DP, as long as you don't need to leave crouch )
Makoto has some really good tools, but her slow walking speed and lack of a good reversal (EX-orochi is not a good reversal =P) makes it easy for other characters to zone her out or rush her down, whichever they prefer. At least in 3s she could either jump-in tsurugi, which traded with anti-airs in her favour, or dash-in. Now she just has to slowly walk forward, or maybe use a command normal or an instant-air tsurugi and hope that the opponent isn't able to punish them on whiff.
I'm sure Cody's not as good as he seems right now, and Makoto's not as bad as she seems, either. But I do know that I'm winning 10 times as many games with a briefly-practiced Cody than with a 3-days-of-hard-practice Makoto. Winning with him is just FAR easier. Juri is probably in-between: I didn't really use her much.
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its not hard to tech throws crouching at all
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installing... zzzzzzz
Add me on xbl: The Evil Tree PSN: TheEvilTree
Bill, that situation sounds pretty generic to any character and not all that scary. Maybe itll make more sense as I play her though. what's her kara?
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On April 27 2010 05:38 InfeSteD wrote:thats some funny shit right there sung moon lol... @Kingkosi... u should of seen daigo playing Hakan, would change ur mind about putting him last in your list... Hakan oiled up is kinda broken hahaha.. Oh man I had so much watching daigo playing all these random characters, I really wonder who he is going to main
I was actually thinking about that today while playing him. I would probably put him under T.Hawk fersure. A friend told me he heard that when he is oiled up he is a top 3 character? I don't know about that but he definitely does a lot of damage.
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On April 27 2010 15:40 Trumpet wrote:
installing... zzzzzzz
Add me on xbl: The Evil Tree
Bill, that situation sounds pretty generic to any character and not all that scary. Maybe itll make more sense as I play her though. what's her kara?
s.mp is her kara
she has j.lk crossups that hit in the way that beats all autocorrect dp like gief d+lk knees do though
j.hp does this in the corner too
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I'm watching Hakan play... what the hell does oil up do?
nvm: figured out after more watching that it gives some range and some moves additional properties? something like that.
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Bill307
Canada9103 Posts
On April 27 2010 15:28 anotak wrote:
its not hard to tech throws crouching at all
Assuming that's true, I'm pretty sure the window to do this is small enough that you can't do it on reaction to being thrown (since it's a kara-throw there's no walk-up to react to). Which means you just have to press/mash it when you think you'll be thrown. But if they delay their throw by even a little bit, cr.lk will come out and you'll get thrown instead.
But I never successfully crouch-tech so what do I know. 
Trumpet: yeah a number of characters have this ability to some extent.
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just got it
too much stuff to figure out/assimilate lol
great game thou so far ahaha
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On April 28 2010 02:27 Bill307 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 27 2010 15:28 anotak wrote:
its not hard to tech throws crouching at all Assuming that's true, I'm pretty sure the window to do this is small enough that you can't do it on reaction to being thrown (since it's a kara-throw there's no walk-up to react to). Which means you just have to press/mash it when you think you'll be thrown. But if they delay their throw by even a little bit, cr.lk will come out and you'll get thrown instead. But I never successfully crouch-tech so what do I know. Trumpet: yeah a number of characters have this ability to some extent.
if they delay their throw by a little bit c.lk will come out and beat your throw because the kara adds extra startup frames (maybe 1-3, not sure the exact number)
not saying that your mixup is bad, but its the generic tick throw mixup every character does, it is just relatively better because the kara throw making her reach farther. ken had this on vanilla sf4, except his kara is even better plus he has the threat of random fire shoryu because he is ci ci's pizza eating ken.
this kind of mixup being unsatisfactory is the exact problem everyone had with throws on vanilla, and in 6 months everyone will probably bitch about it again they just forgot for now because the new chars.
however you can delay a 2nd crouching short to catch them trying to tech and then combo off it.
after the 2nd short when you're out of normal throw range you can do the f.mk overhead that should still reach and it hops throws and most people's crouch tech normal... if you have u1 active you can combo off the overhead too. this is pretty seeable they made sure her overhead is not that great. also if you do the overhead from too close it is jab punishable and jab leads to ultra for most chars. it is spinning piledriver punishable from all ranges.
i think you can throw tiger knee'd divekicks into this situation to deal with crouch tech in which case this mixup becomes extremely good, but i can't do that yet since i didn't play the characters that had that shit on vanilla and its sure as hell nothing like the input for AHVB x whatev or trijumps so my experience off other game isnt helping either.
this really depends on if up close tiger knee'd divekicks are safe? do they hit the person's feet.. haven't seen enough people do them.
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burning question..
Sagat and Akuma still top 2?
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On April 28 2010 05:03 broz0rs wrote:
burning question..
Sagat and Akuma still top 2?
why is this what matters to you
somebody will be top tier...
doubtful its sagat to me they took away safe tiger knee doing damage (it does about as much damage on hit as chip damage now so you might as well get hit to get out of it if sagat is the agressor on the other hand if he's trying to get you out with it feel free to block still) and max range on cancelling s.lk. his new ultra doesnt do much his old one didn't, tiger uppercut range is nerfed, tiger uppercut does very little damage now, ex fireball moves same speed as rh fireball (no more ex fireball as a footsie tool), f+rh no longer hits tall people standing, s.rh his worse
he does walk faster and s.mk is highly improved though. hes not fucked in the ass about footsies like removing cancellable s.lk implied to me, they gave him this stuff to fix that. but he's no sf4 shitting all over everything sagat. hes probably still really good though. if he ends up tops its because everyone else sucks
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Just picked this up for my x-box, enjoying so far.
Question.
My Akuma and some other characters are covered in little black lines from time to time, very strange looking, can't be right. Has anyone seen this bug on x-box or know whats up? It's not all the time... I am very confused.
edit: Answer --- shitty color 12 -_- /facepalm
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did you pick shitty looking color 12 because thats what color 12 is
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On April 28 2010 05:55 anotak wrote:
did you pick shitty looking color 12 because thats what color 12 is
Thank you... not sure how long that would have taken me to figure out lol.
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those 11-12 colors give me headaches no lie
cant get enough of akuma ultra 2 thou ahah
also guess they took away the original ex dreadkicks crumple stun ultra. was trying to do it today and didnt work no more even in corner
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yeah color 12 looks like a broke tv or something
also is it just me or is everyone that picks juri is also picking makoto theres a huge overlap in the posters in the srk character forums
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Bill307
Canada9103 Posts
On April 28 2010 04:29 anotak wrote:if they delay their throw by a little bit c.lk will come out and beat your throw because the kara adds extra startup frames (maybe 1-3, not sure the exact number)
not saying that your mixup is bad, but its the generic tick throw mixup every character does, it is just relatively better because the kara throw making her reach farther. ken had this on vanilla sf4, except his kara is even better plus he has the threat of random fire shoryu because he is ci ci's pizza eating ken.
this kind of mixup being unsatisfactory is the exact problem everyone had with throws on vanilla, and in 6 months everyone will probably bitch about it again they just forgot for now because the new chars.
however you can delay a 2nd crouching short to catch them trying to tech and then combo off it.
after the 2nd short when you're out of normal throw range you can do the f.mk overhead that should still reach and it hops throws and most people's crouch tech normal... if you have u1 active you can combo off the overhead too. this is pretty seeable they made sure her overhead is not that great. also if you do the overhead from too close it is jab punishable and jab leads to ultra for most chars. it is spinning piledriver punishable from all ranges.
i think you can throw tiger knee'd divekicks into this situation to deal with crouch tech in which case this mixup becomes extremely good, but i can't do that yet since i didn't play the characters that had that shit on vanilla and its sure as hell nothing like the input for AHVB x whatev or trijumps so my experience off other game isnt helping either.
this really depends on if up close tiger knee'd divekicks are safe? do they hit the person's feet.. haven't seen enough people do them.
I can see why people would complain about the low/throw mixup being unsatisfactory. Ideally you want to have a wide variety of mixups at your disposal, but often in SF4 there's only a handful of threats up-close. The game definitely puts more emphasis on other means of getting damage, like footsies and fireballs. (Whether that's good or bad depends on what one prefers to do more. )
An instant air lk divekick with Juri might hit their feet at point-blank, but I'm certain an hk divekick won't. I think you'd be left at frame disadv. either way.
Sucks that her overhead is punishable on block by SPD. But I think she can do pretty well against grapplers with her projectiles, anyway.
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i'm loving chun's ultra 2. shit is so sick.
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hey can someone help me w/ rufus's dive kick > l.kick > h.punch > tornado
Although I seem to have gotten the "plinking" down with the l.kick into the h.punch, i cant seem to link the dive kick into the short kick 
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EPT
