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On December 14 2015 02:51 NukeD wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2015 00:54 c3rberUs wrote:On December 13 2015 15:13 KwarK wrote:
I think the entire Yoda fight was dumb. Yoda was fine as a spiritual figure and leader of the Jedi from a time that was mostly peaceful. It's fine to have him not also bounce around the screen like a cat chasing a laser pointer. His fight against the dark side was a spiritual one through leadership, moral guidance and visions. Yoda only fought when he had really had though. Do you mean it didn't make sense for him to step in to save Obi-wan and Anakin after they got horribly outclassed by Dooku? I mean no amount of leadership and guidance could have saved them from that guy's lightsaber. Or when they found out Palpatine was Sideous, wasn't it more wise to take him out there one on one. I don't think it would be good leadership if he had decided to hang back, let the galaxy suffer under Sideous and wait for decades for the rebellion to do the work. Yes it didn't make sense. The script didn't have to be written in the way so that Yoda had to fight. The whole thing is just retarded and unfaithfull to the OT. What I think is that Yoda should have been a really old spiritual guy that has authority for his wisdom. He should have been really fragile so that everyone could snap his neck. Prequells basically made every character the same empty headed sword swinging idiot driven by simple emotions. Only character in the prequells that managed to look at least a bit smart was Qui Gon Jin. Everyone else is a retard including Yoda.
I dunno, Qui Gon was pretty dumb too. The entire Tatooine problem (including rescuing Anakin) could have been solved any number of ways that didn't involve betting on a life-or-death podrace with Anakin. And one of the first things they do in the movie-riding on separate droid ships going down to the planet-is straight up incomprehensible.
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I agree he is dumb in the big picture but in a "scene to scene" way (like when he was actually on screen, talking) he did appear as kind of smart and authoritative.
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On December 14 2015 04:07 NukeD wrote:
I agree he is dumb in the big picture but in a "scene to scene" way (like when he was actually on screen, talking) he did appear as kind of smart and authoritative.
Actually I felt Qui Gon dumber than Yoda
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Point is everyone is dumb 
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The worst part about the preqeuls is that they turned R2D2 into an asshole, by having him being aware of so much stuff from Anakin being Luke's father, who Yoda was, what the force was, etc. and then not telling Luke at all..
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Wasn't it reprogrammed or lost memory ? Can't really remember if there was an explanation for R2D2.
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On December 14 2015 05:00 rezoacken wrote:
Wasn't it reprogrammed or lost memory ? Can't really remember if there was an explanation for R2D2.
They only wiped C3POs memory.
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That is the funny part. The R2D2 knows everything, but the only guy who understands him doesn't believe him and tells everyone he make up stories.
Ok, to be honest it is pretty stupid, but those movies are super dumb.
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On December 14 2015 05:10 Plansix wrote:
That is the funny part. The R2D2 knows everything, but the only guy who understands him doesn't believe him and tells everyone he make up stories.
Ok, to be honest it is pretty stupid, but those movies are super dumb.
By episode 5 Luke can understand R2D2.
And yep.
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United States44398 Posts
On December 14 2015 04:43 Chewbacca. wrote:
The worst part about the preqeuls is that they turned R2D2 into an asshole, by having him being aware of so much stuff from Anakin being Luke's father, who Yoda was, what the force was, etc. and then not telling Luke at all..
There were a lot of worst parts of the prequels. All of the references to things from the OT were just "hey, see this, you recognize this! Yeah! We're making Star Wars!".
Things that they could have expanded on like who Luke's adoptive parents were or why Alderaan being destroyed should make us sad were skipped in favour of "look, Anakin made C3P0, let's never develop that at all".
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Anakin is Jedi Jesus because he has no dad.
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There was a deleted scene that, although somewhat boring, introduced all of the important members of the Rebel Alliance. Those were the characters that they should have developed further rather than Jar Jar.
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United States44398 Posts
In the OT I got the idea Luke had no real clue what the ideological struggle between rebels and empire even was, he was just there because he was mad about his uncle. There is this huge galactic political struggle going on and he never really had any insight or understanding of any of it beyond his immediate personal motivations. If he had opinions on all of that, they were not shown. If he cared about the way the galaxy should be structured politically then he never mentioned it, he just wanted to kill, and then to save, his father because of his uncle and that old man he spent like a week with once.
I'm not going to go down the "empire was in the right" rabbit hole but from Luke's perspective it might as well have been. For a small individual caught up in the middle of a giant conflict it's impossible to have the necessary perspective on who is right or wrong. If you ask any given soldier in a firefight who the bad guys are then even if he's literally wearing Nazi uniform he'll still say it's the people shooting at him because within the context of the firefight that's what matters. I would have liked to have known more about the people who became the Rebel Alliance and why they were moral upstanding people etc.
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On December 14 2015 06:03 KwarK wrote:
In the OT I got the idea Luke had no real clue what the ideological struggle between rebels and empire even was, he was just there because he was mad about his uncle. There is this huge galactic political struggle going on and he never really had any insight or understanding of any of it beyond his immediate personal motivations. If he had opinions on all of that, they were not shown. If he cared about the way the galaxy should be structured politically then he never mentioned it, he just wanted to kill, and then to save, his father because of his uncle and that old man he spent like a week with once.
I'm not going to go down the "empire was in the right" rabbit hole but from Luke's perspective it might as well have been. For a small individual caught up in the middle of a giant conflict it's impossible to have the necessary perspective on who is right or wrong. If you ask any given soldier in a firefight who the bad guys are then even if he's literally wearing Nazi uniform he'll still say it's the people shooting at him because within the context of the firefight that's what matters. I would have liked to have known more about the people who became the Rebel Alliance and why they were moral upstanding people etc.
![[image loading]](http://1.media.dorkly.cvcdn.com/79/81/89a974435b8d4c029dfb79f8cca67f80.jpg)
I'd say seeing your uncle and aunt in this shape after having them deal with Imperial forces is quite a tell.
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United States44398 Posts
Not really. That shit happens all the time to innocents on both sides in war. But you're telling me Luke overthrew an empire governing hundreds of billions of people because he was mad about his uncle's death?
That's an issue. He was small picture idiot mainly carried by events outside of his knowledge, understanding or interest. He had no stake in the rebellion, he was a random backwater farmer just pissed about his uncle.
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On December 14 2015 08:10 KwarK wrote:
Not really. That shit happens all the time to innocents on both sides in war. But you're telling me Luke overthrew an empire governing hundreds of billions of people because he was mad about his uncle's death?
That's an issue. He was small picture idiot mainly carried by events outside of his knowledge, understanding or interest. He had no stake in the rebellion, he was a random backwater farmer just pissed about his uncle.
I think he over threw the government due to being fully aware it was run by an user of the dark side of the force. Although across the galaxy people are not aware of the "true nature" of the Emperor, Luke and the other members of the rebellion are. Yoda very clearly explains to him about Vader and the Emperor.
And when it came to him joining up, people tend to get mad a governments for killing their family because they bought droids. So he followed Ben after his family died and Ben explained to Luke about Vader. Your version of Luke motivations leaves out a lot of key facts.
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On December 14 2015 08:10 KwarK wrote:
Not really. That shit happens all the time to innocents on both sides in war. But you're telling me Luke overthrew an empire governing hundreds of billions of people because he was mad about his uncle's death?
That's an issue. He was small picture idiot mainly carried by events outside of his knowledge, understanding or interest. He had no stake in the rebellion, he was a random backwater farmer just pissed about his uncle.
Episode 4 he is driven by the death of his Uncle + Aunt, and wanting to save that sexy lady in the hologram.
Episode 5 he sticks around with Han and Leia because they are his only "family" at this point. He then goes for his training, and then is driven just from desperation to save his friends who have been taken hostage by the Empire.
By episode 6 the events of the previous two episodes have turned him to be against the Empire + He has a desire to save his father.
His motivation in the first episode his kind of lacking, but he finds legitimate motivation in the events that follows.
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First episode is mostly "well I guess my (adoptive) parents are dead so I'll follow this old guy and see if he leads me to this chick I want to bang".
He then ends up destroying a superweapon because he was there and all the cool kids were doing it. He's not interested in the political struggle or any of that shit, he's just trying to fit in with his new friends. He has no real agency or decision making, things happen and he responds. Mostly he's just lost, if someone gave him a lift back to the farm he'd probably go. Leia is the only one of the main cast who actually has an idea of what is at stake and what they're trying to achieve and she doesn't get an arc.
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So essentially Luke's story is one of redneck rage. It even has the incest.
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I wouldn't say he wanted to go back to the farm, but he did initially want to go to the Imperial academy. Seems like he has a mild disdain for the Empire ("I hate it but there's nothing I can do right now") and when he gets the opportunity to fight against it, he takes it.
Having his family killed by the Empire is also enough to seal the deal for any normal person.
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EPT
