EPTI am really encouraged by that scene because it means they are adding some depth to the lighsaber and how it is used. Rather than it being in this binary state.
Star Wars Episode VII: The Force Awakens - Page 99
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
I am really encouraged by that scene because it means they are adding some depth to the lighsaber and how it is used. Rather than it being in this binary state. | ||
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Redox
Germany24794 Posts
On December 11 2015 00:48 eviltomahawk wrote: The Empire should've invested in shotguns instead. They were pretty good in that one Order 66 mission in Battlefront 2, and it would make sense that a Jedi can't deflect several simultaneous projectiles being thrown at them at once. Or explosives like greades, good luck deflecting blast waves. Or they should use Lasers, because they have basically zero travel time so should be impossible to intercept. Honestly, we should not go into realism too much here. :D | ||
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Mafe
Germany5966 Posts
On December 11 2015 00:56 Plansix wrote: Building a melee weapon with some weight to it that could block a lightsaber also seems like a really good way deal with them. Lightsabers don’t weight anything, so it would be like swinging a bamboo stick into a sledge hammer. Sure they are fast, but blocking that thing would be a nightmare. I am really encouraged by that scene because it means they are adding some depth to the lighsaber and how it is used. Rather than it being in this binary state. On December 11 2015 01:04 Redox wrote: Or explosives like greades, good luck deflecting blast waves. Or they should use Lasers, because they have basically zero travel time so should be impossible to intercept. Honestly, we should not go into realism too much here. :D Related: http://www.nerfnow.com/comic/1439 | ||
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B.I.G.
3251 Posts
And did they forget Darth Vader as well? I mean here on earth hundreds of years later we still remember plenty of historical figures that were far less iconic. Or did I miss some explanation that makes the collective universal forgetfulness explainable? | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On December 11 2015 01:51 B.I.G. wrote: I just don't really understand how everyone supposedly forgot about the Jedi and Sith if it is such a relatively short time ago. I mean didn't anyone make any form of a record of the clone wars were easily a 100 Jedi with the help of millions of clones were destroying millions of droids? And did they forget Darth Vader as well? I mean here on earth hundreds of years later we still remember plenty of historical figures that were far less iconic. Or did I miss some explanation that makes the collective universal forgetfulness explainable? You assume the general public new about Darth Vader. He didn't hold political office, he was just a military commander that likely didn't do a lot of press. I joke, but seriously, how much camera time do you think Vader received. Same with Jedi. The Republic had Jedi, but they all died in a massive purge and there really were not a lot of them when compared to the population of the galaxy. It wouldn't take long for the Emperor to purge the records of Jedi or paint them as bad. Most people have never meet or seen a force user. People didn't know about Luke and Vader killing the Emperor, they assume he died in the Deathstar. And most people likely were not aware he could use the force. To the rest of the universe, Jedi are just this myth of Republic secret police that people claim had mystical powers. | ||
flamewheel
FREEAGLELAND26782 Posts
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palexhur
Colombia730 Posts
On December 11 2015 01:51 B.I.G. wrote: I just don't really understand how everyone supposedly forgot about the Jedi and Sith if it is such a relatively short time ago. I mean didn't anyone make any form of a record of the clone wars were easily a 100 Jedi with the help of millions of clones were destroying millions of droids? And did they forget Darth Vader as well? I mean here on earth hundreds of years later we still remember plenty of historical figures that were far less iconic. Or did I miss some explanation that makes the collective universal forgetfulness explainable? It made sense before the prequels, because we thought they were not many, but once you see hundreds of Jedis in Chapter II and talking about thousands, it made no sense anymore. | ||
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Roe
Canada6002 Posts
On December 11 2015 01:04 Redox wrote: Or explosives like greades, good luck deflecting blast waves. Or they should use Lasers, because they have basically zero travel time so should be impossible to intercept. Honestly, we should not go into realism too much here. :D I suppose they could force move the projectiles away from them, then again why don't they do that to the laser beams | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On December 11 2015 02:23 Roe wrote: I suppose they could force move the projectiles away from them, then again why don't they do that to the laser beams Star Wars doesn't make any sense. Why do ships have gravity? Why do space worms have gravity? Why did Han run out onto what he thought was an asteroid without a space suit on? Why does no one have space suits? How can ships be faster than other ships, its space? The only thing they would be limited by is the max acceleration before the crew died, so why do they have "top speeds"? | ||
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Coppermantis
United States845 Posts
On December 11 2015 02:21 palexhur wrote: It made sense before the prequels, because we thought they were not many, but once you see hundreds of Jedis in Chapter II and talking about thousands, it made no sense anymore. There are many jedi, but the galaxy is a big place. I imagine them a lot like the Space Marines in 40k - we as viewers see them a lot because they tend to be involved in the most exciting events, but most conflicts in the galaxy aren't worthy of their intervention, so people have probably heard of them, stories and rumours and such, but not seen them. Like, hell, even if there were a million jedi, that would be a relatively small number even on Earth today, 0.01% of the total population if my quick math is correct. | ||
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
On December 11 2015 00:48 eviltomahawk wrote: The Empire should've invested in shotguns instead. They were pretty good in that one Order 66 mission in Battlefront 2, and it would make sense that a Jedi can't deflect several simultaneous projectiles being thrown at them at once. Some of the source material suggests experienced Jedi can guide the trajectory of energy weapons using the force. You could also ask why Palpatine didn't just shoot around Mace Windu's lightsaber in Ep 3, and the answer is probably the same. The First Order Stormtroopers here seem to be elites rather than OT foot soldiers. It would make sense that they have more advanced weaponry. Also notable is that it's pretty clear that Jedi aren't one-man armies. They mostly excel at covert missions and Ep 2 shows their limitations in straight combat. On December 11 2015 01:04 Redox wrote: Or explosives like greades, good luck deflecting blast waves. Or they should use Lasers, because they have basically zero travel time so should be impossible to intercept. Honestly, we should not go into realism too much here. :D Force users can see into the future and predict where the blaster will hit. It's pretty obvious even in Luke's first training session with Ben Kenobi. On December 11 2015 02:36 Plansix wrote: Star Wars doesn't make any sense. Why do ships have gravity? Why do space worms have gravity? Why did Han run out onto what he thought was an asteroid without a space suit on? Why does no one have space suits? How can ships be faster than other ships, its space? The only thing they would be limited by is the max acceleration before the crew died, so why do they have "top speeds"? Future science. | ||
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Yoav
United States1874 Posts
On December 11 2015 01:51 B.I.G. wrote: I just don't really understand how everyone supposedly forgot about the Jedi and Sith if it is such a relatively short time ago. I mean didn't anyone make any form of a record of the clone wars were easily a 100 Jedi with the help of millions of clones were destroying millions of droids? And did they forget Darth Vader as well? I mean here on earth hundreds of years later we still remember plenty of historical figures that were far less iconic. Or did I miss some explanation that makes the collective universal forgetfulness explainable? Jedi were exceedingly rare. Yes, there were 1000s of them. But this is in a galaxy of trillions of sentient beings. + Show Spoiler + Up there for stupidest prequel error: the notion that a million Clones would matter a damn bit in such a galaxy. Remember, this is a galaxy many times the population of, say, Star Trek. On December 11 2015 02:36 Plansix wrote: Star Wars doesn't make any sense. Why do ships have gravity? Why do space worms have gravity? Why did Han run out onto what he thought was an asteroid without a space suit on? Why does no one have space suits? How can ships be faster than other ships, its space? The only thing they would be limited by is the max acceleration before the crew died, so why do they have "top speeds"? Ships have gravity because it's projected. Apparently it's an easy thing to do... notice that the Millenium Falcon has 3 seperate gravity planes (Gun Turrets have their own gravity planes, 90 degrees from deck plane). On the Space Worm, honestly, I got nothing (Something from the Falcon?) Stormtroopers are always wearing space suits. The speed thing presumes that Star Wars ships have non-newtonian (and possibly non-relativistic) drives even under sub-light speeds. In Ep IV our heroes fly their ships from a moon past a gas giant to attack a space station orbiting on the other side, then reduce speed to the point where they can engage that target. This would be a nearly impossible maneuver with Newtonian drive systems. They use some kind of warp drive distinct from hyperdrive. On December 11 2015 01:04 Redox wrote: Or explosives like greades, good luck deflecting blast waves. Or they should use Lasers, because they have basically zero travel time so should be impossible to intercept. Lasers might or might not work... Jedi precognition and all that. Explosive weaponry can be force-pushed. I loved it in Jedi Outcast when smart aleks tried to grenade me and ate their own grenades. Shotguns are a decent idea. Problems are that they involve limited range, which is dangerous against Jedi. More importantly, the Jedi are a handful of guys in an army... one to tens of thousands or millions. A shotgun fails hard against Stormtrooper armor. Lastly, and most crucially, a shotgun's mechanism of damage is lots of little pellets. Jedi are shown to be more resistant than others to most sources of damage (blasters normally fry the internal organs of whoever they hit, shooting flames out of their chests, but Luke and Vader both take blaster hits to their hands without slowing down much, and Leia survives a blaster to the shoulder). A Jedi might well shrug off quite a few shotgun hits. But it would still be one of your best bets for dedicated anti-Jedi work. I'd pair it with melee guys to slow the Jedi down and let you get in a few more shots. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain18302 Posts
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On December 10 2015 19:05 Redox wrote: ^ Thanks for multiple spoiler walls, I could literally only stop myself at the 3rd one from reading it. :D rofl this is hilarious because I was clicking it then stopped myself. God damn 7 days! | ||
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
On December 11 2015 05:55 Yoav wrote: Jedi were exceedingly rare. Yes, there were 1000s of them. But this is in a galaxy of trillions of sentient beings. + Show Spoiler + Up there for stupidest prequel error: the notion that a million Clones would matter a damn bit in such a galaxy. Remember, this is a galaxy many times the population of, say, Star Trek. There was actually a very good quote from Timothy Zahn's Hand of Thrawn duology that addresses this issue in a way that seems pretty reasonable. + Show Spoiler + It was part of a debate on the strength of the Empire. One of the characters mentioned that only a small part of the galaxy was actually involved in bringing down the Empire. Then someone else noted that only a small part of the Empire was actually fighting back - most of it was busy keeping the tribal rivalries of its star systems from escalating into active conflict. In that light, I could see how a million skilled soldiers as part of a Grand Army of the Republic, as opposed to regional military forces, could be significant. | ||
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
On December 11 2015 06:02 blade55555 wrote: rofl this is hilarious because I was clicking it then stopped myself. God damn 7 days! Abrams is a master of misdirection. I wouldn't put too much stock into it personally. | ||
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Manit0u
Poland17756 Posts
On December 11 2015 05:55 Yoav wrote: Jedi were exceedingly rare. Yes, there were 1000s of them. But this is in a galaxy of trillions of sentient beings. + Show Spoiler + Up there for stupidest prequel error: the notion that a million Clones would matter a damn bit in such a galaxy. Remember, this is a galaxy many times the population of, say, Star Trek. Ships have gravity because it's projected. Apparently it's an easy thing to do... notice that the Millenium Falcon has 3 seperate gravity planes (Gun Turrets have their own gravity planes, 90 degrees from deck plane). On the Space Worm, honestly, I got nothing (Something from the Falcon?) Stormtroopers are always wearing space suits. The speed thing presumes that Star Wars ships have non-newtonian (and possibly non-relativistic) drives even under sub-light speeds. In Ep IV our heroes fly their ships from a moon past a gas giant to attack a space station orbiting on the other side, then reduce speed to the point where they can engage that target. This would be a nearly impossible maneuver with Newtonian drive systems. They use some kind of warp drive distinct from hyperdrive. Lasers might or might not work... Jedi precognition and all that. Explosive weaponry can be force-pushed. I loved it in Jedi Outcast when smart aleks tried to grenade me and ate their own grenades. Shotguns are a decent idea. Problems are that they involve limited range, which is dangerous against Jedi. More importantly, the Jedi are a handful of guys in an army... one to tens of thousands or millions. A shotgun fails hard against Stormtrooper armor. Lastly, and most crucially, a shotgun's mechanism of damage is lots of little pellets. Jedi are shown to be more resistant than others to most sources of damage (blasters normally fry the internal organs of whoever they hit, shooting flames out of their chests, but Luke and Vader both take blaster hits to their hands without slowing down much, and Leia survives a blaster to the shoulder). A Jedi might well shrug off quite a few shotgun hits. But it would still be one of your best bets for dedicated anti-Jedi work. I'd pair it with melee guys to slow the Jedi down and let you get in a few more shots. Best anti-jedi weapon: ![[image loading]](https://www.yourprops.com/movieprops/original/yp516798cac2ca70.85711179/Red-Bomb-Vest-1.jpg) | ||
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ThomasjServo
15244 Posts
On December 11 2015 06:00 Acrofales wrote: Arguing science in star wars. Take that to the star trek thread. Next thing, you guys will start to talk about midichlorians Could Han make the Kessel Run in 12 parsecs if the MF was leaking plasma? | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On December 11 2015 06:00 Acrofales wrote: Arguing science in star wars. Take that to the star trek thread. Next thing, you guys will start to talk about midichlorians The only time I bring up science in Star Wars discussions is when people say “That NEW THING doesn’t make any sense at all!” If people want to talk about shit that doesn’t make sense, things that block laserswords is not where we start. | ||
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ZenithM
France15952 Posts
On December 10 2015 16:59 NukeD wrote: I get the impression from the trailers that the lightsaber fights wont be so flashy, jumpy and over the top as they were in prequels. Hopefully I am right as I hated the fights in the prequels. Yeah, it does seem like the lightsaber fights aren't all over the place in this one. Could also be because the fighters we've seen (the good guys at least) are newbies in swordfighting and can't Force-enhance their body movements yet. And they actually could argue that most of the acrobatics and sword forms were lost between the prequel and 4,5,6. Most of the Jedis died, and on the Sith side, Vader couldn't really move that well anymore so had no use for all that fancy shit :D. Luke learned only the basics from a very old Yoda and probably doesn't match the swordfighting skills of someone like Windu or even young Kenobi or Qui-gon. | ||
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