|
SPOILER WARNING If you only watch the show, this thread will spoil you of future events in HBO's Game of Thrones. Thread contains discussion of all books of the series A Song of Ice and FireClick Here for the spoiler-free thread. |
The battle had some pretty over the top parts, but it was still really well done.
I sort of get the Vale? It does make sense that you'd want to hide the numbers until Ramsy commits to the battle, but there's so many problems with the teleporting army.
I also think it's intended as a setup so we can start seeing Sansa become more like Littlefinger. Ultimately she's going to outwit him in the end, his lust for Sansa is eventually going to be his downfall.
Speaking of teleporting holy shit the Ironborn sail fast. It's one thing for some of the run of the mill westeros teleporting, but the Ironborn have to sail all the way around the western coast before they can cross the narrow sea. They did that incredibly fast.
For some of this stuff I don't see why they didn't just juggle around the episode progression, though I'm sure it's hard. Like have Theon and Asha set sail in one of the earlier episodes instead of dragging out the King's moot and setup for it across the first 1/2 of the season. That way it'd be way more believable when they arrive instead of sailing the whole distance in like 1-2 episodes.
|
I don't mind the Ironborn already showing up. There's nothing (other than common sense and good production) saying that the Ironborn scenes with the Kingsmoot had to take place at the same time as everything else that episode. Or how long it's been between episodes, since Jon's been galavanting around the north talking to every house, which we didn't see all of. It could have been 6 months since we've last seen the Greyjoys, which would make it at least a bit more realistic.
|
I suppose, but it feels out of sync with travel from the earlier seasons.
It's not that I mind seeing them leave the Iron Islands, then show up at Dany's court with nothing in between (actually I do a bit considering they magically show up right after the siege, but in general I don't). But it's more that the show never tries and sells the length of the journey. When they show them in the whore house the episode before they're just like there and all happy as if they had just gone down to the corner market.
That's more the problem I guess, the show isn't really selling distances like it used to. Even buying into the ambiguous timeline there's still a lot of problems with how travel is now portrayed. Doubly so because people are moving through hostile territory with impunity. Brianne, Jamie, and the entire Vale army all pass by each other more or less. Or like at the very least someone controls the neck and everyone has to pass by there because it's the only reasonable way in and out of the north.
Like Bolton, having defied the crown to marry Sansa, would be completely idiotic not to at least put someone at the neck to defend the north from potential retribution. So then having an entire army move through that spot, even when engineered by littlefinger, seems silly.
|
I'm a little mixed about this episode. The battle itself was breathtaking. The phalanx versus unruly mob sequence was very impressive. Ramsay's death was very satisfying. My disappointment is that the show is veering into standard Hollywood fare rather than being ASOIAF. Jon disregarded strategy, lost his cool and got extremely lucky with all the arrow shots. Then he got saved in the nick of time by the Vale.
Part of the appeal of ASOIAF for me is that doing stupid things doesn't get rewarded.
|
On June 20 2016 23:58 Logo wrote:
I suppose, but it feels out of sync with travel from the earlier seasons.
It's not that I mind seeing them leave the Iron Islands, then show up at Dany's court with nothing in between (actually I do a bit considering they magically show up right after the siege, but in general I don't). But it's more that the show never tries and sells the length of the journey. When they show them in the whore house the episode before they're just like there and all happy as if they had just gone down to the corner market.
That's more the problem I guess, the show isn't really selling distances like it used to. Even buying into the ambiguous timeline there's still a lot of problems with how travel is now portrayed. Doubly so because people are moving through hostile territory with impunity. Brianne, Jamie, and the entire Vale army all pass by each other more or less. Or like at the very least someone controls the neck and everyone has to pass by there because it's the only reasonable way in and out of the north.
Like Bolton, having defied the crown to marry Sansa, would be completely idiotic not to at least put someone at the neck to defend the north from potential retribution. So then having an entire army move through that spot, even when engineered by littlefinger, seems silly.
The main problem is that the way they sold distance before was by waiting episodes for people to arrive at places and having them meet endless complications on the way. It was a narrative device to allow for world building, context and texture. But that part of the show is over. We have very little to learn about the world. Also the shows glacial pace is one of its biggest weaknesses.
I do wish they would spend a bit more time showing how much time has passed. But the problem with that is the scenes don’t line up time line wise. The structure of the show, like the books, has characters moving out of sync. And a natural flaw of that story telling style is the story being a big disjointed once shit gets moving.
|
On June 21 2016 00:29 andrewlt wrote:
I'm a little mixed about this episode. The battle itself was breathtaking. The phalanx versus unruly mob sequence was very impressive. Ramsay's death was very satisfying. My disappointment is that the show is veering into standard Hollywood fare rather than being ASOIAF. Jon disregarded strategy, lost his cool and got extremely lucky with all the arrow shots. Then he got saved in the nick of time by the Vale.
Part of the appeal of ASOIAF for me is that doing stupid things doesn't get rewarded.
You are right, but Jon wasnt rewarded, He caused the death of almost all his army, He almost died, but you know dying twice in a short period of two seasons would be too much.
|
we actually saw Theon&Yara in Volantis in ep7 (maybe it was 6, dont remember) and now they show up in Mereen. Fair distance, but they had gotten all the way to Volantis from the Iron Islands in what... 1 or 2 episodes? And that's a fair bit longer, having to sail all the way around Westeros. I actually don't think the Vale travelling speed was out of place that much - LF and Robin said they wanted to help Sansa in what, episode 4, 5? Imo that's enough time to get the knights ready and onto Winterfell. Kinda stupid that the Neck wasn't guarded, etc etc and LF teleported to the Wall and back, but his army travel speed was fine in my book
|
this is a bit off topic but did Robb send the letter to Jon in the series??
|
Some other musings...
Is Varys going to go to Dorne, or are Kevan's days numbered?
What's the point of the Iron Bank arc now that Stannis is dead and no one is there to conquer the seven kingdoms that needs the Bank's help? The Starks aren't going to move south because of the white walker threat, and it's not like anyone else will overthrow the kingdoms. LF is the one that put the seven kingdom's into debt in the first place and Dany hardly needs the bank for anything (though it would be welcomed help). It just seems like that arc has lead no where despite being part of the show.
What purpose could Euron serve now as a character? It seems like his character is done and totally pointless now. Any fleet he builds can easily be crushed by Dany or probably even the royal fleet. At best it seems like he can do some raiding and be annoying.
The same goes for Sam now really. With the pace of the show and everything it already feels like and Oldtown stuff is going to be really rushed and he's basically going to have to run around quickly to make it in time to actually contribute back to the story. I think we're gearing up for a lot more teleporting in the next season.
|
On June 21 2016 02:05 Koerage wrote:
we actually saw Theon&Yara in Volantis in ep7 (maybe it was 6, dont remember) and now they show up in Mereen. Fair distance, but they had gotten all the way to Volantis from the Iron Islands in what... 1 or 2 episodes? And that's a fair bit longer, having to sail all the way around Westeros. I actually don't think the Vale travelling speed was out of place that much - LF and Robin said they wanted to help Sansa in what, episode 4, 5? Imo that's enough time to get the knights ready and onto Winterfell. Kinda stupid that the Neck wasn't guarded, etc etc and LF teleported to the Wall and back, but his army travel speed was fine in my book
Right, they were already in Volantis so it's not far-fetched that they would get to Mereen so quickly.
It's also not weird about the Vale Knights, seeing as they've been in the North for 3-4 episodes now. Remember when Littlefinger meets Sansa? He's already taken Moat Caillin, so the army's been chilling in the neck this entire time. I pointed it out back during that episode that it was a bit stupid to hand wave away that Moat Cailin is unconquerable from the South, but oh look, Littlefinger already got it. Although, the idea that the North always had this iron gate was kind of stupid anyways.
So, it looks like Littlejon doesn't get his at all, but Karstark did. Who cares about Karstark anyways, he didn't hand over Rickon. But actually the thing with Littlejon is double disappointing because it means no Northern Conspiracy in the show lol.
|
i think it would be much better maybe if they didnt have "sproink fasttravel entire continents for 5 minute scenes" and instead committed a single entire episode to each of the separate storylines . trying to clip between separate storylines with insanely separate time-lines is obviously working really really awfully
sansa dialogue at start of the ep was pretty terrible and khalessi dragon scene was extremely tired , there must be some other fucking way they can present the scene than the same up-nose hair waving dragon shot they've used 100 times in a row now
tyrion dialogue was great again at last
battle was seriously moving and beautiful
sansa insanely sexy
|
I agree that the standard structure of teh show lead to this season feeling really disjointed. If they had just done full episodes on each character or sets of characters, they could have taken a moment to show the passage of time. But I bet is all seemed fine in the writers room.
|
On June 21 2016 03:03 Wuster wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2016 02:05 Koerage wrote:
we actually saw Theon&Yara in Volantis in ep7 (maybe it was 6, dont remember) and now they show up in Mereen. Fair distance, but they had gotten all the way to Volantis from the Iron Islands in what... 1 or 2 episodes? And that's a fair bit longer, having to sail all the way around Westeros. I actually don't think the Vale travelling speed was out of place that much - LF and Robin said they wanted to help Sansa in what, episode 4, 5? Imo that's enough time to get the knights ready and onto Winterfell. Kinda stupid that the Neck wasn't guarded, etc etc and LF teleported to the Wall and back, but his army travel speed was fine in my book Right, they were already in Volantis so it's not far-fetched that they would get to Mereen so quickly. It's also not weird about the Vale Knights, seeing as they've been in the North for 3-4 episodes now. Remember when Littlefinger meets Sansa? He's already taken Moat Caillin, so the army's been chilling in the neck this entire time. I pointed it out back during that episode that it was a bit stupid to hand wave away that Moat Cailin is unconquerable from the South, but oh look, Littlefinger already got it. Although, the idea that the North always had this iron gate was kind of stupid anyways. So, it looks like Littlejon doesn't get his at all, but Karstark did. Who cares about Karstark anyways, he didn't hand over Rickon. But actually the thing with Littlejon is double disappointing because it means no Northern Conspiracy in the show lol.
Huh? It was Littlejon that died in the battle to Tormund.
Good point about Moat Caillin, that does make the time/travel make more sense, though it's a bit silly for LF to just openly start warring with the other kingdoms.
There's a weird disconnect with what went on in the North I feel like? We never get a sense of what King's Landing thinks of the Bolton's marriage, and if that translates into a new war or what.
|
They could definitely have used more establishing shots for padding between scenes to make them feel less "jumpy", but I think the storyline is simply too condensed to properly show the passage of time regardless of episode structure.
|
On June 21 2016 04:08 Logo wrote:
Huh? It was Littlejon that died in the battle to Tormund.
Oh really? I guess I got them confused. Also, I kept getting Tormund and his Uncle(? the other red bearded wildling) confused lol so I guess I need to pay more attention next time.
|
im just here for the grils
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/56jESiA.jpg)
|
On June 21 2016 04:18 Wuster wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2016 04:08 Logo wrote:
Huh? It was Littlejon that died in the battle to Tormund.
Oh really? I guess I got them confused. Also, I kept getting Tormund and his Uncle(? the other red bearded wildling) confused lol so I guess I need to pay more attention next time.
Tormund is the only red-bearded wildling I can think of. And he doesn't have an uncle. What are you even talking about?
|
On June 21 2016 06:12 Requizen wrote:Show nested quote +On June 21 2016 04:18 Wuster wrote:On June 21 2016 04:08 Logo wrote:
Huh? It was Littlejon that died in the battle to Tormund.
Oh really? I guess I got them confused. Also, I kept getting Tormund and his Uncle(? the other red bearded wildling) confused lol so I guess I need to pay more attention next time. Tormund is the only red-bearded wildling I can think of. And he doesn't have an uncle. What are you even talking about?
My own nickname for him. He has zero lines but looks like Tormund's older relative:
+ Show Spoiler +
IIRC he gets stabbed by a pike pretty early on and Tormund pulls him back. During the fight at the dead bodies, I could have sworn I saw him fighting there, but they did a lot of jump cuts / crap on screen so it was probably just muddled shots of Tormund.
That's all I meant.
|
Man, that look by Lady Mormont. Priceless.
![[image loading]](http://socialnewsdaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/giphy-3.gif)
What a bad ass.
|
lawl
hope they dont burn the next loli to death .........
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
