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goody153
44255 Posts
On December 01 2013 04:48 Lucumo wrote: No idea. Had that problem this week as well, only DotA 2 streams were affected though. oh thats too bad .i think this is twitch thing. i had this problem just today on all kinds of stream.. that includes broodwar pretty weird. | ||
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pellejohnson
United States1931 Posts
Yea it is. Just got home from a walk and turned out the tv on the usual channel and this was one. A nice surprise even though it looks pretty poor on the TV compared on the computer | ||
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Testuser
6469 Posts
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SKC
Brazil18828 Posts
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ymir233
United States8275 Posts
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Noya
Uruguay11223 Posts
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DDie
Brazil2369 Posts
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Faruko
Chile34173 Posts
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teddyoojo
Germany22369 Posts
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SKC
Brazil18828 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On December 01 2013 04:53 SKC wrote: Fixing a sympton is fine. Plenty of heroes received no changes and were suddenly overpowered or underpowered because of changes to the gameplay. They were often nerfed/buffed to compensate. The question should be whether the change that made Midas so good was good for the game and whether there is a good change to the game that can also help fixing Midas. If that's not the case, there is no reason why you cannot nerf an item that became good because of how the gameplay developed. There is nothing inheremtly wrong with fixing symptons. Well, no, because if what makes Midas boring is that lull in the action that promotes its use (an item being boring by itself makes no sense, only the gameplay associated with it can be boring), nerfing Midas won't fix that. An item is just an object, its not actual gameplay. So if nerfing a symptom does not change the gameplay then there's no point in nerfing it. | ||
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WindWolf
Sweden11767 Posts
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GGTeMpLaR
United States7226 Posts
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SKC
Brazil18828 Posts
On December 01 2013 04:57 TheYango wrote: Well, no, because if what makes Midas boring is that lull in the action that promotes its use (an item being boring by itself makes no sense, only the gameplay associated with it can be boring), nerfing Midas won't fix that. The question is whether you can easily fix that lull in the action. It's mostly because of the increase in difficulty of pushing into higher tiers of towers, requiring the winning team to play passive and prepare better before pushing. A change that promotes pushing your advantage immediatly may also cause the game to be more snowbally and diminish the defenders advantage that creates amazing comebacks and great games. Changing Midas is a easier and less impactfull choice than changing the core of how the game is played, specially so soon after a major patch. It's a safer choice and I really wouldn't be surprised to see it nerfed. This passivity has always somewhat existed in Dota, so nerfing Midas obviously won't help. But going Midas wasn't common even if you knew you didn't have to fight for 10mins. | ||
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OrchidThief
Denmark2298 Posts
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Faruko
Chile34173 Posts
On December 01 2013 05:00 OrchidThief wrote: Picking up a midas or not should be an interesting choice, and it should limits you some other way, it should make your early game far more volatile, and give the opponents a major timing to run you over, but right now it seems like people are getting away with it, mostly without much risk. But eh, it means more farmed supports which I'm ok with. Last game was completely won because NaVi could read that Fnatic were going full midas without a single utility big item | ||
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ymir233
United States8275 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On December 01 2013 05:00 SKC wrote: The question is whether you can easily fix that lull in the action. It's mostly because of the increase in difficulty of pushing into higher tiers of towers, requiring the winning team to play passive and prepare better before pushing. A change that promotes pushing your advantage immediatly may also cause the game to be more snowbally and diminish the defenders advantage that creates amazing comebacks and great games. Changing Midas is a easier and less impactfull choice than changing the core of how the game is played, specially so soon after a major patch. It's a safer choice and I really wouldn't be surprised to see it nerfed. The causal relationship is important here. Seeing 5 Midases in a game is not what's boring. Seeing 5 Midases and people farming for 5-10 minutes with them (or alternatively just losing the game when they can't win a fight) is boring. But the question is, are people farming for 5-10 minutes because they're buying Midas because it's too strong? Or are they buying Midas because some other factor compels them to farm for 5-10 minutes, and Midas is naturally the item to buy for that? Because if it's the latter, nerfing Midas won't stop people from farming for 5-10 minutes, which is the real gameplay problem that bothers people. It's not that I think fixing the symptom is worse--I think fixing the symptom doesn't do ANYTHING. Nerfing or removing Midas doesn't alter the need for a farming phase to build up a larger item advantage before pushing. In fact, without a tool to accelerate farm from an advantage, it's actually possible that the farming phase could be even more drawn out. | ||
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OrchidThief
Denmark2298 Posts
On December 01 2013 05:02 Faruko wrote: Last game was completely won because NaVi could read that Fnatic were going full midas without a single utility big item Be that as it may, there's as many games where it goes the other way, people get away with it, and not for the lack of trying. It's not a big enough risk as it is. | ||
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WindWolf
Sweden11767 Posts
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