You get more damage from orb off points on aura than points in orb. Orb max after aura is only good if you wanna nuke with your ult since you can stack int a lot quicker. I think that regardless of skill build imprison at level 1 is a must, it just has so much utility and use in lane.

LennX

4556 Posts

January 05 2016 04:20 GMT

#142

I tried leveling up prision. The lower cooldown does seems better. I can prison maybe 2 or more people in a long teamfight.

Main skill build will be Q,E,E,Q,E,Q,E,Q against a non int enemy mid. Level 1 in prison if against an int hero. Having said that, I typically save skill points depending on how it goes. Aura or orb will be leveled depending if I get runes and RNGeus favouring my mana.

Belisarius

Australia6232 Posts

January 05 2016 06:29 GMT

#143

....why does prison care whether you're against an int or not?

You nearly always want a value point in W at 1-3. It's invaluable for saving you from ganks, setting up ganks, and just plain old screwing with the other guy's lasthits.

LennX

4556 Posts

January 05 2016 11:19 GMT

#144

At my low MMR level, I find right clicking them is more efficient. I never had the chance to use my prison much but I do save a skill point for it.

Deleted User 261926

960 Posts

January 05 2016 13:03 GMT

#145

This is not about the level you play at. 1 point in prison is just way better. I find the best for it in a 1v1 situation is when your creep wave is pushing to the enemy tower and you use your prison to completely ruin the opponent's last hits. It can also be used to setup ganks etc.

ahswtini

Northern Ireland22208 Posts

January 05 2016 13:48 GMT

#146

4 seconds of not being able to cs or deny is incredibly annoying

Comeh

United States18919 Posts

January 05 2016 17:18 GMT

#147

On January 05 2016 22:48 ahswtini wrote:
4 seconds of not being able to cs or deny is incredibly annoying

level 1 imprison is 100% the way you skill this hero - you dont have the mana to use Q, and leveling E is pointless at level 1. Leveling the w will help you lane the first wave, can stop a gank, helps you secure 0:00 bounty rune, and you want at least one point in the w to help gank mid (with the 4 second imprison)

but mostly you get it so you can deny / secure 2-4 creeps so yeah please level this skill at level 1. its honestly a no brainer.

fourthirds

Canada132 Posts

February 01 2016 21:25 GMT

#148

Looking at datdota stats, drums is a very popular pickup. I don't understand why veil is never picked up instead. It's roughly the same cost but gives OD armour and regen that he doesn't normally get and the active synergizes with the nukers that take advantage of his aura. Even though OD's damage is mostly phys/pure, veil boosted ult is not to be neglected.

I've played OD a few times recently with treads/wand/atos/veil and it feels very good - useful stats and good buildup.

TheYango

United States47024 Posts

February 01 2016 21:36 GMT

#149

It's the same old problem of OD really wanting Attack Speed to even out his orb DPS but having very few reasonable sources of Attack Speed until quite late.

MS/AS are much higher priority stats than Armor/Regen.

Comeh

United States18919 Posts

February 01 2016 21:53 GMT

#150

Veil isn't super good either - it doesn't super help his orbs which are a significant source of his damage.

OD needs HP, MS, AS, and a general stat item around that time anyways, and it helps when he hits 9 (a major point of power for him) in terms of timing, so its just good. The timing is reason #1 i'd say

ahswtini

Northern Ireland22208 Posts

February 01 2016 22:28 GMT

#151

why would u buy veil when ur only source of magic dmg is sanitys eclipse, which is hardly a spammable spell

fourthirds

Canada132 Posts

February 01 2016 23:12 GMT

#152

On February 02 2016 07:28 ahswtini wrote:
why would u buy veil when ur only source of magic dmg is sanitys eclipse, which is hardly a spammable spell

Because you don't just buy it for the active. Veil stats are great - it adds 45 damage to your orb attacks, double that of drums. The active is mostly for your teammates nukes, but that said, veil+SE ruins teamfights if you have someone else to control the enemy team and set you up.

TheYango

United States47024 Posts

February 01 2016 23:24 GMT

#153

Armor + Regen aren't "great". They're not worthless, but again, MS/AS/all stats are way more valuable at that point. At the 2k gold item timing, incoming physical damage is way lower than magical except in the case of a few heroes. When cores are level 9-11, rank 4 nukes and rank 1-2 ultis are mostly what kill people, not autoattack damage, so pure armor really doesn't get much mileage.

The difference in Int is mostly just the difference in cost (9 more Int for 420 more gold is essentially a Robe of the Magi), and the combination of other stats largely favors Drums.

BluemoonSC

SoCal8910 Posts

February 02 2016 01:33 GMT

#154

I'd say an item like force is more valuable than a veil bc the mobility will save you more often than the extra armor at the timing/price.

TheGlitchMob

Canada61 Posts

February 02 2016 02:34 GMT

#155

is s&y any good on him? i've seen it a few times and it seems decent in theory - gives stats that let him be more aggressive and stack up orb hits

yookstah

Australia655 Posts

February 02 2016 04:30 GMT

#156

It's alright but I don't think it's very efficient.

BluemoonSC

SoCal8910 Posts

February 02 2016 06:25 GMT

#157

On February 02 2016 13:30 yookstah wrote:
It's alright but I don't think it's very efficient.

why not?

WolfintheSheep

Canada14127 Posts

February 02 2016 07:54 GMT

#158

On February 02 2016 15:25 BluemoonSC wrote:

Show nested quote +

why not?

Less tank than Mek, less damage than Atos (or even Force Staff), less utility than any of those or Blink...

And basically twice as expensive as those.

TheYango

United States47024 Posts

February 02 2016 08:09 GMT

#159

S&Y is basically a +All Stats item that has the Int shaved off to make it line up better than actual +All Stats items for heroes that don't use Intel enough to want to pay for it. OD is a hero that uses Intel.

For Str or Agi heroes, S&Y has a straight stat advantage over Silver Edge, but since OD is not a Str or Agi hero, that advantage is actually really questionable, so even if you wanted that specific stat combination, it's not a given that S&Y would be the best way for OD to get it.