EPTForeigners Suck #3 - Page 2
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GMer[TOp]
Canada118 Posts
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Live2Win
United States6657 Posts
As for the post. Completely agree on the Korean/foreigner skill gap. Back in the days of Grrr/Elky were the days that foreigners had the best chance. Now the gap's just too insane to close. Even the chinese, who's outburst on the eSports scene is encouraging news that eSports is starting to go global (well I guess it has to jump continents before you can call it global) will have a hell of a time before they can consider themselves competitors to the Korean scene. | ||
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mayap
United States185 Posts
dont worry if estro is looking for a b- 80-70 rec terran who only gets in tourneys because of his name and the people he knows and thinks for some reason hes good(smuft story just popped into my head) ill make sure to email them so they pay closer attention your tourney reps | ||
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haduken
Australia8267 Posts
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SK.Testie
Canada11084 Posts
So when you see Chinese players, you know they are practiced and near the top of their game. | ||
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bine
United States2352 Posts
I certainly would agree (I think most would) that there is very little chance of the winner of this tournament going on to be an accomplished progamer, or being able to compete with top Koreans, or whatever. I don't know who Daniel is, but it sounds like you're trying to tell someone involved with the tournament that it's a bad idea, that they shouldn't do it, and so on, which is I think what artosis was responding to. In my opinion, arguing that this is a bad idea is incredibly naive and silly; clearly this is a promotional effort and seems clearly part of a corporate strategy that includes North America. Obviously this is not an attempt to cull the talent hiding abroad, it's in service of something else. It's clearly not a "terrible idea" unless somehow something this big was invented and carried out by an intern or something. So, you appearing to try to sabotage the tournament would obviously leave a bad taste in the mouth of a potential beneficiary of it. I don't know the history of how you came to be a progamer, so I can't speak to the quip about you lucking into your opportunity, but I didn't see anywhere in the quoted post artosis arguing that the North Americans would be able to be competitive with the Koreans, or anything like that. He was just chastising for you for what again appears to be a misguided attempt at deflating this tournament, which is an exciting prospect for the players involved and for North American fans. Unless you genuinely believe that eStro is stupid enough to be looking to North America for competitive talent, I'm having trouble understanding what your motivation is here. No one thinks foreigners are as good as Koreans. edit: just to spell out what should be clear in my post: I have no interest in the apparent personal thing with Rek and the group of American players these threads are usually about. I don't know anything about any of those politics. I'm just talking about this specific thing. | ||
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Artosis
United States2140 Posts
On October 13 2007 10:47 Rekrul wrote: In regards to StarCraft SuperStars tournament and artosis's post here: You are right I did get a 'free shot' at progaming because when I came to Korea the skill level among foreigners, whilst still having a huge gap between the skill level of koreans, was much closer to the koreans than modern day. I was indeed one of the top foreigners back then but I certainly wasn't the best. Now fast forward to modern day where the skill level of korean gamers is so fucking insane to a point where it is basically unattainable for non-koreans (if you think Draco got close to it you are ignorant, but he did get farther than any other non korean skill-wise imo). So here we have a korean community full of gamers so damn good and a non-korean community full of all the 4th rate newbies from the past when all the good players played. None of you have improved like the koreans. Your skill levels have stagnated and you have merely learned to copy some macro build orders invented by the new generations and learned to click faster (not you artosis ur the same as always, no offense..just a fact). Not only that, but this tournament doesn't even have the best foreign players from this day and age. It has a few good ones but the rest are 2nd and 3rd rate newbies even by today's foreigner standards. How exactly does winning a 16 man tournament full of trash players make you 'earn it' ?? You say this is going to make you earn it, whereas I got a 'free shot' by earning the respect of the whole Hexatron team and ElkY and Grrr (real progamers, who have a real sense of talent and skill, unlike you...who is a clueless newbie with a hopeless dream). Winning this tournament doesn't mean shit. It earns you nothing. It proves nothing. It only proves which one of the 2nd and 3rd rate newbies on the day of the tournament is playing the best and/or the luckiest. Whoever came up with this whole idea is doing you guys a huge favor giving you guys a chance at a little money and a chance at coming to Korea and having fun on a team. I know this is harsh and kind of mean seeing as how it is your dream to come to Korea and be a progamer. But get your facts straight. U blow. im a nice guy. i think every sc player who ever met me likes me. i try to help people out and have a good time. its a sad thing when a millionaire poker player in his 20's spends his free time stepping on my dreams and publicly degrading me. i just asked you on bnet to just leave me alone. to not talk to me or about me. if i have an "impossible" dream thats none of your business. its none of anyone's business. so what do you do? you come and make this post saying lots of negative shit about me. you can go around pretending that there is something special about all the old players or that all 300 korean progamers are "talented", and ill continue going around pretending that hard work will overcome innate ability. leave me alone now. | ||
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XCetron
5226 Posts
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IdrA
United States11541 Posts
On October 13 2007 10:47 Rekrul wrote: In regards to StarCraft SuperStars tournament and artosis's post here: You are right I did get a 'free shot' at progaming because when I came to Korea the skill level among foreigners, whilst still having a huge gap between the skill level of koreans, was much closer to the koreans than modern day. I was indeed one of the top foreigners back then but I certainly wasn't the best. Now fast forward to modern day where the skill level of korean gamers is so fucking insane to a point where it is basically unattainable for non-koreans (if you think Draco got close to it you are ignorant, but he did get farther than any other non korean skill-wise imo). So here we have a korean community full of gamers so damn good and a non-korean community full of all the 4th rate newbies from the past when all the good players played. None of you have improved like the koreans. Your skill levels have stagnated and you have merely learned to copy some macro build orders invented by the new generations and learned to click faster (not you artosis ur the same as always, no offense..just a fact). Not only that, but this tournament doesn't even have the best foreign players from this day and age. It has a few good ones but the rest are 2nd and 3rd rate newbies even by today's foreigner standards. How exactly does winning a 16 man tournament full of trash players make you 'earn it' ?? You say this is going to make you earn it, whereas I got a 'free shot' by earning the respect of the whole Hexatron team and ElkY and Grrr (real progamers, who have a real sense of talent and skill, unlike you...who is a clueless newbie with a hopeless dream). Winning this tournament doesn't mean shit. It earns you nothing. It proves nothing. It only proves which one of the 2nd and 3rd rate newbies on the day of the tournament is playing the best and/or the luckiest. Whoever came up with this whole idea is doing you guys a huge favor giving you guys a chance at a little money and a chance at coming to Korea and having fun on a team. I know this is harsh and kind of mean seeing as how it is your dream to come to Korea and be a progamer. But get your facts straight. U blow. why the fuck are you trying to shit on him for doing the EXACT SAME THING YOU DID. no one expects to win a fucking starleague. the whole point is going for a fun, unique experience. you're no more skilled than any of the people in contention for a spot and you went anyway. just because you're bitter you failed miserably doesnt mean you need to shittalk anyone else who wants to give it a shot. | ||
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Physician
United States4146 Posts
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Xeris
Iran17695 Posts
It would be the same for whoever gets to go from this tournament... I doubt any of them will expect to become a really good progamer, it's all about the experience. If Draco could not make it big there, no other foreigner will be able to either, but that isn't the point. The point is just for them to chase a dream and have fun while doing it. This tournament is great for the North American scene imo. | ||
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mayap
United States185 Posts
On October 13 2007 12:01 Artosis3 wrote: im a nice guy. i think every sc player who ever met me likes me. i try to help people out and have a good time. its a sad thing when a millionaire poker player in his 20's spends his free time stepping on my dreams and publicly degrading me. i just asked you on bnet to just leave me alone. to not talk to me or about me. if i have an "impossible" dream thats none of your business. its none of anyone's business. so what do you do? you come and make this post saying lots of negative shit about me. you can go around pretending that there is something special about all the old players or that all 300 korean progamers are "talented", and ill continue going around pretending that hard work will overcome innate ability. leave me alone now. if this is true you and ur crew wouldnt have loss to nyoken who plays phantom on east and who didnt play bw for 1 year or froz who quit bw 2 years ago and just plays 20 games to get prepared for wcg so he can show how much of a joke you guys are, while you and your friends play 24/7 with your korean friends and still cant do shit ok? there must be something more than practice if you still havnt achieved anything and no your not a nice guy(start by saying gg when you get raped because your not good enough to have that attitude) dont flatter yourself please if we make a poll of whos the most hated person/team on bw you guys would get a landslide win, are people really crazy to randomly target you if you didnt do anything wrong? | ||
Rekrul
Korea (South)17174 Posts
The point is its pretty sad that the one time they finally decide to do something good for the community like this they limit it to a bunch of newbies instead of the players who truly deserve the shot. Sure it's better than nothing but it still deserves criticism. And yes I do believe eStro is targetting North American players for pure marketting issues which I can't blame them but it's just laughable seeing the lineup for this tournament. I'm not trying to sabotage anything, I'm aware my opinion on this matter will have no impact on this event. Doesn't mean I can't voice it. Artosis and IdrA: You both are missing the entire point. There are more deserving candidates that would jump at this now. I'm not saying its bad. edit: Also IdrA I am not bitter or mad I fully support testie going to Korea and succeeding despite our past. He has the talent. I'm not saying you don't have the talent either IdrA...but Artosis and some of the other names in that lineup...god please replace them with the top europeans  | ||
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zobz
Canada2175 Posts
On October 13 2007 11:42 Steroid wrote: lol good points, just get over it. non koreans will never be good as koreans. even amateur korean players will trash any top foreign player 10-0 that's not true. amateur koreans vs amateur nonkoreans yes. but any player who can go 1-2 vs pro koreans, . | ||
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bine
United States2352 Posts
On October 13 2007 12:11 Rekrul wrote: Bine: The point is its pretty sad that the one time they finally decide to do something good for the community like this they limit it to a bunch of newbies instead of the players who truly deserve the shot. Sure it's better than nothing but it still deserves criticism. And yes I do believe eStro is targetting North American players for pure marketting issues which I can't blame them but it's just laughable seeing the lineup for this tournament. I'm not trying to sabotage anything, I'm aware my opinion on this matter will have no impact on this event. Doesn't mean I can't voice it. Artosis and IdrA: You both are missing the entire point. There are more deserving candidates that would jump at this now. I'm not saying its bad. So what you're saying then is that you'd prefer that the tournament be open to Europeans as well, or? | ||
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Rekrul
Korea (South)17174 Posts
On October 13 2007 12:16 bine wrote: So what you're saying then is that you'd prefer that the tournament be open to Europeans as well, or? I'd prefer the best foreigners got invited. I wonder who picked this line-up. I bet it was PeurtoRican LOL. | ||
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FuDDx
United States5008 Posts
Peace Love Unity Respect | ||
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mayap
United States185 Posts
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Equinox_kr
United States7395 Posts
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IdrA
United States11541 Posts
testie already has a better offer, mondragon has turned down offers (i think, and even if he hasnt he doesnt want to go), sen is inactive, draco tried and left. just about everyone else is inactive. you can make a case for people like white-ra and others who have more achievements and are still relatively active, but in terms of current ability they arent any better than the best players in this tournament. | ||
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