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On December 27 2012 22:35 samscraft wrote:
But back to the main issues, KESPA, have had plenty of years to deal with this issue, doing research into setting up a SC2 scene for themselfs and provide english casters even if it was a minimal back-stage situation to get people trained up and get that duo partnership that people like to see, such as TB + apollo, day9 + Kaelaris, Tastosis, and all other good combinations.
I do agree with Tyler when he said kespa took far to long, this game is well over 2 years old now, and its far to late for kespa to be joining espeically if it does cause such issues like all the ones highlighted in these threads.
Sorry but blaming Kespa for not leaving their warm and comfortable home so called broodwar, doesn't help at all tbh.
As TB mentioned in one of his blogs a few months back SC2 is still not that popular in Korea and players still suffer from low wages, bad training conditions etc. There was simply no reason to put their business concept which evolved around broodwar on the line.
The task now should be to support them wherever we can, because Proleague and whatever else comes after that has to work and must not "fall flat on it's arse". Even tho they were hibernating in their cave way too long.
I mean just look on the players, teams and more importantly the sponsors under their banner. We, the little fanboys and ambassdors of eSport, must not risk to lose them.
I don't want to see multiple organizations who have their own tournaments, leagues and championships. This reminds me of the current situation in boxing. Each organization (WBO, WBA, IBF...whatever) each crown their champions, which is just silly.
cheers
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Really not sure what the point of arguing for established casters is when circumstance makes it impossible. On-site casters are preferable to remote and you can't expect kespa to opt for remote casters long-term. That's not how a broadcast is run. Esports is big and all but the circumstance of this league being on the other side of the world in a foreign culture kinda makes it tough for your favorite caster to be the one casting lol.
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8748 Posts
On December 27 2012 23:27 nitzwerk wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2012 22:35 samscraft wrote:
But back to the main issues, KESPA, have had plenty of years to deal with this issue, doing research into setting up a SC2 scene for themselfs and provide english casters even if it was a minimal back-stage situation to get people trained up and get that duo partnership that people like to see, such as TB + apollo, day9 + Kaelaris, Tastosis, and all other good combinations.
I do agree with Tyler when he said kespa took far to long, this game is well over 2 years old now, and its far to late for kespa to be joining espeically if it does cause such issues like all the ones highlighted in these threads. Sorry but blaming Kespa for not leaving their warm and comfortable home so called broodwar, doesn't help at all tbh.
I don't think it's reasonable to assume that people would be volunteering help for them. There wasn't any point when this forum became a place for brainstorming on behalf of SC2 eSports businesses. PL can pay for what they need or die trying. I was just pointing out that PL chose this path. And even though they're finding themselves in a sort of difficult situation for English broadcasting, they didn't get screwed in any way. In fact, they should be thankful for this opportunity. The rest of the world rose up all around them while they contributed nothing to SC2. They've never had such a good opportunity to profit from non-Korean fans of StarCraft. We've cultivated an audience that they can come in and steal if they are good enough. In this way, we've gone back-and-forth, because if it wasn't for KeSPA making SC:BW such a legendary eSports title in Korea, the rest of the world wouldn't have had such an easy time making SC2 a successful eSports title.
I really think all of this is going to matter very little in the long run. KeSPA is going to be carried by its players as long as it can survive long enough for all their hard work to start paying off. I don't think KeSPA is missing any huge opportunity now in the twilight of Wings. They've got some time to hone their craft and I'm sure they will eventually show everyone how awesome Proleague can be.
P.S. When you consider that KeSPA has meanwhile lost a ton of its Korean SC fans (mostly to League of Legends afaik), the cultivation of fans in the rest of the world is all the more valuable. To see such disorganization from them when presenting themselves to non-Korean fans does seem all the more insulting and disappointing.
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On December 28 2012 02:18 Liquid`NonY wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2012 23:27 nitzwerk wrote:On December 27 2012 22:35 samscraft wrote:
But back to the main issues, KESPA, have had plenty of years to deal with this issue, doing research into setting up a SC2 scene for themselfs and provide english casters even if it was a minimal back-stage situation to get people trained up and get that duo partnership that people like to see, such as TB + apollo, day9 + Kaelaris, Tastosis, and all other good combinations.
I do agree with Tyler when he said kespa took far to long, this game is well over 2 years old now, and its far to late for kespa to be joining espeically if it does cause such issues like all the ones highlighted in these threads. Sorry but blaming Kespa for not leaving their warm and comfortable home so called broodwar, doesn't help at all tbh. I really think all of this is going to matter very little in the long run. KeSPA is going to be carried by its players as long as it can survive long enough for all their hard work to start paying off. I don't think KeSPA is missing any huge opportunity now in the twilight of Wings. They've got some time to hone their craft and I'm sure they will eventually show everyone how awesome Proleague can be.
That paragraph there about sums it up, kespa has some very big names, who are well supported / respected (how-ever you wish to view it), It is sad news so many are moving to LoL but I believe with a bit of work they can make it, support grows week in, week out for PL, as it always hits stable viewers during both live streaming and re-broadcast streams.
It will be good to see how they change / become part of the world wide community over the next few months due to HOTS coming out, and will also be great to watch the kespa players grow into beasty SC2 players (allthough i think the majority of them are all-ready at such a high level).
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On December 28 2012 02:18 Liquid`NonY wrote:Show nested quote +On December 27 2012 23:27 nitzwerk wrote:On December 27 2012 22:35 samscraft wrote:
But back to the main issues, KESPA, have had plenty of years to deal with this issue, doing research into setting up a SC2 scene for themselfs and provide english casters even if it was a minimal back-stage situation to get people trained up and get that duo partnership that people like to see, such as TB + apollo, day9 + Kaelaris, Tastosis, and all other good combinations.
I do agree with Tyler when he said kespa took far to long, this game is well over 2 years old now, and its far to late for kespa to be joining espeically if it does cause such issues like all the ones highlighted in these threads. Sorry but blaming Kespa for not leaving their warm and comfortable home so called broodwar, doesn't help at all tbh. I don't think it's reasonable to assume that people would be volunteering help for them. There wasn't any point when this forum became a place for brainstorming on behalf of SC2 eSports businesses. PL can pay for what they need or die trying. I was just pointing out that PL chose this path. And even though they're finding themselves in a sort of difficult situation for English broadcasting, they didn't get screwed in any way. In fact, they should be thankful for this opportunity. The rest of the world rose up all around them while they contributed nothing to SC2. They've never had such a good opportunity to profit from non-Korean fans of StarCraft. We've cultivated an audience that they can come in and steal if they are good enough. In this way, we've gone back-and-forth, because if it wasn't for KeSPA making SC:BW such a legendary eSports title in Korea, the rest of the world wouldn't have had such an easy time making SC2 a successful eSports title. I really think all of this is going to matter very little in the long run. KeSPA is going to be carried by its players as long as it can survive long enough for all their hard work to start paying off. I don't think KeSPA is missing any huge opportunity now in the twilight of Wings. They've got some time to hone their craft and I'm sure they will eventually show everyone how awesome Proleague can be. P.S. When you consider that KeSPA has meanwhile lost a ton of its Korean SC fans (mostly to League of Legends afaik), the cultivation of fans in the rest of the world is all the more valuable. To see such disorganization from them when presenting themselves to non-Korean fans does seem all the more insulting and disappointing.
I don't always agree with Tyler, but here he is right on point. This entire debacle raises large questions as to the business savvy or motivation of KESPA. Either they do not understand how to cater to and listen to a foreign audience, something they simply must do if gaming popularity trends continue as they are in Korea, or they do not care and are willing to hire unproven casters, give them shit casting tools, and put out a sub-par stream out of sheer laziness. Either option seems quite troubling, but hopefully there is indeed enough time for something positive and cohesive to come out of KESPA. Though to be fair, the PL matches, even when streamed in a sub-par fashion, have been positive.
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On December 28 2012 04:02 farvacola wrote:Show nested quote +On December 28 2012 02:18 Liquid`NonY wrote:On December 27 2012 23:27 nitzwerk wrote:On December 27 2012 22:35 samscraft wrote:
But back to the main issues, KESPA, have had plenty of years to deal with this issue, doing research into setting up a SC2 scene for themselfs and provide english casters even if it was a minimal back-stage situation to get people trained up and get that duo partnership that people like to see, such as TB + apollo, day9 + Kaelaris, Tastosis, and all other good combinations.
I do agree with Tyler when he said kespa took far to long, this game is well over 2 years old now, and its far to late for kespa to be joining espeically if it does cause such issues like all the ones highlighted in these threads. Sorry but blaming Kespa for not leaving their warm and comfortable home so called broodwar, doesn't help at all tbh. I don't think it's reasonable to assume that people would be volunteering help for them. There wasn't any point when this forum became a place for brainstorming on behalf of SC2 eSports businesses. PL can pay for what they need or die trying. I was just pointing out that PL chose this path. And even though they're finding themselves in a sort of difficult situation for English broadcasting, they didn't get screwed in any way. In fact, they should be thankful for this opportunity. The rest of the world rose up all around them while they contributed nothing to SC2. They've never had such a good opportunity to profit from non-Korean fans of StarCraft. We've cultivated an audience that they can come in and steal if they are good enough. In this way, we've gone back-and-forth, because if it wasn't for KeSPA making SC:BW such a legendary eSports title in Korea, the rest of the world wouldn't have had such an easy time making SC2 a successful eSports title. I really think all of this is going to matter very little in the long run. KeSPA is going to be carried by its players as long as it can survive long enough for all their hard work to start paying off. I don't think KeSPA is missing any huge opportunity now in the twilight of Wings. They've got some time to hone their craft and I'm sure they will eventually show everyone how awesome Proleague can be. P.S. When you consider that KeSPA has meanwhile lost a ton of its Korean SC fans (mostly to League of Legends afaik), the cultivation of fans in the rest of the world is all the more valuable. To see such disorganization from them when presenting themselves to non-Korean fans does seem all the more insulting and disappointing. I don't always agree with Tyler, but here he is right on point. This entire debacle raises large questions as to the business savvy or motivation of KESPA. Either they do not understand how to cater to and listen to a foreign audience, something they simply must do if gaming popularity trends continue as they are in Korea, or they do not care and are willing to hire unproven casters, give them shit casting tools, and put out a sub-par stream out of sheer laziness. Either option seems quite troubling, but hopefully there is indeed enough time for something positive and cohesive to come out of KESPA. Though to be fair, the PL matches, even when streamed in a sub-par fashion, have been positive.
I wouldn't assume that you know better than Kespa what is in their business interest. It's quite possible that 1) the unproven casters were their only choice because established casters turned down offers to move to Korea and they need on-site casters, 2) the foreign viewership is a small fraction of the Korean viewership, and 3) paying for established casters wouldn't yield a worthwhile increase on viewers anyway. You know next to nothing about those 3 points, and those are critical questions to answer before claiming that Kespa is making a bad business decision.
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On December 28 2012 04:35 Doodsmack wrote:Show nested quote +On December 28 2012 04:02 farvacola wrote:On December 28 2012 02:18 Liquid`NonY wrote:On December 27 2012 23:27 nitzwerk wrote:On December 27 2012 22:35 samscraft wrote:
But back to the main issues, KESPA, have had plenty of years to deal with this issue, doing research into setting up a SC2 scene for themselfs and provide english casters even if it was a minimal back-stage situation to get people trained up and get that duo partnership that people like to see, such as TB + apollo, day9 + Kaelaris, Tastosis, and all other good combinations.
I do agree with Tyler when he said kespa took far to long, this game is well over 2 years old now, and its far to late for kespa to be joining espeically if it does cause such issues like all the ones highlighted in these threads. Sorry but blaming Kespa for not leaving their warm and comfortable home so called broodwar, doesn't help at all tbh. I don't think it's reasonable to assume that people would be volunteering help for them. There wasn't any point when this forum became a place for brainstorming on behalf of SC2 eSports businesses. PL can pay for what they need or die trying. I was just pointing out that PL chose this path. And even though they're finding themselves in a sort of difficult situation for English broadcasting, they didn't get screwed in any way. In fact, they should be thankful for this opportunity. The rest of the world rose up all around them while they contributed nothing to SC2. They've never had such a good opportunity to profit from non-Korean fans of StarCraft. We've cultivated an audience that they can come in and steal if they are good enough. In this way, we've gone back-and-forth, because if it wasn't for KeSPA making SC:BW such a legendary eSports title in Korea, the rest of the world wouldn't have had such an easy time making SC2 a successful eSports title. I really think all of this is going to matter very little in the long run. KeSPA is going to be carried by its players as long as it can survive long enough for all their hard work to start paying off. I don't think KeSPA is missing any huge opportunity now in the twilight of Wings. They've got some time to hone their craft and I'm sure they will eventually show everyone how awesome Proleague can be. P.S. When you consider that KeSPA has meanwhile lost a ton of its Korean SC fans (mostly to League of Legends afaik), the cultivation of fans in the rest of the world is all the more valuable. To see such disorganization from them when presenting themselves to non-Korean fans does seem all the more insulting and disappointing. I don't always agree with Tyler, but here he is right on point. This entire debacle raises large questions as to the business savvy or motivation of KESPA. Either they do not understand how to cater to and listen to a foreign audience, something they simply must do if gaming popularity trends continue as they are in Korea, or they do not care and are willing to hire unproven casters, give them shit casting tools, and put out a sub-par stream out of sheer laziness. Either option seems quite troubling, but hopefully there is indeed enough time for something positive and cohesive to come out of KESPA. Though to be fair, the PL matches, even when streamed in a sub-par fashion, have been positive. I wouldn't assume that you know better than Kespa what is in their business interest. It's quite possible that 1) the unproven casters were their only choice because established casters turned down offers to move to Korea and they need on-site casters, 2) the foreign viewership is a small fraction of the Korean viewership, and 3) paying for established casters wouldn't yield a worthwhile increase on viewers anyway. You know next to nothing about those 3 points, and those are critical questions to answer before claiming that Kespa is making a bad business decision.
Why do they "need" on-site casters? Especially when on-site English casters aren't given any of the tools that come with that benefit? And you are right, I do not know the precise answers to those questions, instead I am left to go off of what KESPA presents, and as of now that is a pretty shitty product when compared to that of any other major content providers.
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Every thing KeSPA does is bad and evil, this is the mindset of most teamliquiders. If those casters are hired by EG, much less shit will be thrown at them. Some of the "famous" guys on TL are responsible for this problem.
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On December 27 2012 13:14 SweetNJoshSauce wrote:
Im loving this whole thing, but what is up with the god awful buffering on Twitch tv? It's seriously almost unwatchable
I've hit this a number of times as well, it's bad. You have to basically refresh the page the moment you see any stutter on the VOD. It sometimes takes 3-5 tries, but eventually I get a stream that does not stop&buffer.
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United States1967 Posts
closing this thread as it's gone off topic now.
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EPT
