|
Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up! NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious. Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action. |
On October 09 2017 11:25 ChristianS wrote:Show nested quote +On October 09 2017 11:14 zlefin wrote:On October 09 2017 11:08 xDaunt wrote:On October 09 2017 10:59 Slaughter wrote:On October 09 2017 10:53 xDaunt wrote:
Congressional republicans still haven't learned that they are the most despised and expendable people in Washington. You ever think there will come a time when they try to take Trump down with them? Some are already trying. It won't work though. The ideological and political bankruptcy of people like Corker, Ryan, and McConnell has been laid bear for all to see. Are there any non-bankrupt Repubs? And why doesn't Trump count as "intellectually bankrupt"?
Because you can't be intellectually bankrupt when you don't understand any of the issues and have no other ideology than your emotional insecurity. Trump isn't even lying anymore, he just makes stuff up as they come, without trying to be remotely coherent, and his hardcore supporters are such partisan bots they don't even care. We have a couple of those here. To paraphrase that journalist, Trump could take a dump on their desks, they would still defend him.
Ryan tries to appear like a wonk, and is a complete fraud. Trump is a clown, that doesn't even try to look like anything else.
|
I like how most presidents prefer to fade away from the public spotlight after they leave office. I have a feeling trump will never fade unfortunately, thanks to twitter and his followers. I'll be hard pressed to say we'll forget about him willfully 2-3 years after he's gone.
|
On October 09 2017 21:54 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:
I like how most presidents prefer to fade away from the public spotlight after they leave office. I have a feeling trump will never fade unfortunately, thanks to twitter and his followers. I'll be hard pressed to say we'll forget about him willfully 2-3 years after he's gone.
I just imagine the 'Previous Presidents Club' gathering will be a lot less chill lol
|
good to see the admin taking that high road they claimed with their moral victory about making racial equality protests about respecting the flag. complain about divisiveness on one hand and cause it with the other, at everyone’s expense.
i’d pretend to be indignant but i think that’s our conservative friends’ bailiwick these days. keep politics out of sports! lol
yep. just another monday.
|
On October 09 2017 10:53 xDaunt wrote:
Congressional republicans still haven't learned that they are the most despised and expendable people in Washington.
Corker won re-election with like 2/3 of the vote, so not exactly despised where it matters (there is a slight kink in that, because the Dem candidate got disavowed by his own party for association with a hate group). I met him briefly a couple times for work events in Nashville, pretty nice guy. As a Dem I certainly disagree with many of his policy positions, though there's actually bridges to be built with him versus others.
Marsha Blackburn will more than likely be his replacement - I've heard a couple of the top potential Dems pretty much say that the numbers just aren't there for them - which is a shame.
|
The question to ask is what can we realistically do about the current situation if we're not happy with it?
|
On October 09 2017 22:50 Ryzel wrote:
The question to ask is what can we realistically do about the current situation if we're not happy with it?
The answer to this question in a democracy is always the same:
1) Vote and
2) Be involved in politics
No matter how shitty your democratic system is, if you can convince a majority that something needs to be changed and to vote accordingly, stuff gets changed. The problem in the US is that half the people are fine with how shitty stuff is or see winning over the other side (due to shitty two party system) as more important than to fix the system.
2) Is especially important. If you want to change stuff, get involved in a party at a local level. In the US, that sadly means either republicans or democrats. Influence the local party. Don't expect to change everything from one moment to the next. If enough people get involved in their local party and change stuff, that means you can change stuff in the regional party, etc...
Don't expect to change everything, and don't expect to have a gigantic impact just by making a cross every 4 years for one of two options.
|
On October 09 2017 21:54 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:
I like how most presidents prefer to fade away from the public spotlight after they leave office. I have a feeling trump will never fade unfortunately, thanks to twitter and his followers. I'll be hard pressed to say we'll forget about him willfully 2-3 years after he's gone.
Nah, he will keep tweeting but the press will stop giving a shit after a while.
Once hes out of power he is just a rich crazy idiot rather then, you know, the President.
|
it also depends how he goes out. i don't see any sort of post-term image rehabilitation a la carter (or even nixon) though.
|
On October 09 2017 22:27 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:Show nested quote +On October 09 2017 21:54 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:
I like how most presidents prefer to fade away from the public spotlight after they leave office. I have a feeling trump will never fade unfortunately, thanks to twitter and his followers. I'll be hard pressed to say we'll forget about him willfully 2-3 years after he's gone. I just imagine the 'Previous Presidents Club' gathering will be a lot less chill lol
As if he'll even be invited. "Look, we left you alone, but no"
|
On October 09 2017 23:20 Mohdoo wrote:Show nested quote +On October 09 2017 22:27 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:On October 09 2017 21:54 ZerOCoolSC2 wrote:
I like how most presidents prefer to fade away from the public spotlight after they leave office. I have a feeling trump will never fade unfortunately, thanks to twitter and his followers. I'll be hard pressed to say we'll forget about him willfully 2-3 years after he's gone. I just imagine the 'Previous Presidents Club' gathering will be a lot less chill lol As if he'll even be invited. "Look, we left you alone, but no"
They aren't excluding me, they "asked" me to go and I said NO!
|
It is sort mind boggling that someone this fragile and petty has so much power. I can never tell if he use "cosmopolitan attitudes" with full knowledge of its anti Semitic roots or if he is just parroting garbage he was taught online.
|
replace ‘online’ with ‘jeff sessions’
but i’d probably give him the benefit of the doubt, being, yknow, jewish himself.
|
On October 09 2017 23:42 brian wrote:
replace ‘online’ with ‘jeff sessions’
but i’d probably give him the benefit of the doubt, being, yknow, jewish himself.
Giving people like Miller the benefit out of the doubt is how bad things happen. He has made it pretty clear he doesn't take that type of dog whistle speech seriously. Or assumes it won't be a problem.
|
United States43255 Posts
They had these beautiful, soft towels. Very good towels, and I came in, and there was a crowd of a lot of people. And they were screaming, and they were loving everything. I was having fun. They were having fun. They said, ‘Throw ‘em to me! Throw ‘em to me, Mr. President!’ - The President of the United States
|
On October 10 2017 00:55 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +They had these beautiful, soft towels. Very good towels, and I came in, and there was a crowd of a lot of people. And they were screaming, and they were loving everything. I was having fun. They were having fun. They said, ‘Throw ‘em to me! Throw ‘em to me, Mr. President!’ - The President of the United States
https://www.reddit.com/r/TrumpCriticizesTrump/
This entire subreddit.
|
Trump Ties Immigration Demands To DACA Deal, Including Border Wall
President Trump on Sunday sent Congress a list of sweeping immigration changes he says "must be included as part of any legislation addressing the status of Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) recipients."
Trump wants the border wall he campaigned on to be built, a crackdown on illegal immigration and to switch the U.S. legal immigration system from one that prioritizes family connections to one based on merit.
Trump has promoted these policies before, both during the campaign and as president. But what's new is demanding that they be included in the legislative fix for the DACA program.
"Without these reforms, illegal immigration and chain migration, which severely and unfairly burden American workers and taxpayers, will continue without end," Trump said in a letter to Congress.
Last month, concluding that the DACA program put into place by the Obama administration through executive action was illegal, Trump announced that he would end it in six months. He called on Congress to enshrine in law the protections for undocumented immigrants who were brought to the country as children. The approximately 700,000 DACA recipients are often referred to as DREAMers. Under the program, they temporarily avoid deportation and receive work permits.
Congress now has 6 months to legalize DACA (something the Obama Administration was unable to do). If they can't, I will revisit this issue!
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) September 6, 2017
Around that time, Trump had dinner at the White House with the two top congressional Democrats, House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi and Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer, and all emerged talking about the rough outlines of a deal. A major component of that agreement was President Trump's willingness to take funding the border wall off the table, when it came to DACA legislation.
After the apparent agreement with Pelosi and Schumer, conservatives vocalized their rage, accusing Trump of abandoning the hard-line immigration platform he campaigned on. Conservative commentator Ann Coulter said at the time, "If we're not getting a wall, I'd prefer President Pence."
"DACA now, and the wall very soon," Trump told reporters on the south lawn of the White House in mid-September. "But the wall will happen."
The White House immigration principles appear to be a departure from that earlier statement. White House documents call for "completing construction of a wall along the southern border of the United States" and ensuring "funding for the southern border wall and associated infrastructure."
Pelosi and Schumer say these proposals are a clear break with what they believe was agreed to during that dinner at the White House.
"We told the President at our meeting that we were open to reasonable border security measures alongside the DREAM Act, but this list goes so far beyond what is reasonable," Pelosi and Schumer said in a statement. "This proposal fails to represent any attempt at compromise."
Beyond the wall, the Democrats say the administration's list is "anathema to the Dreamers, to the immigrant community and to the vast majority of Americans."
Although Republicans control both chambers of Congress, they have a narrow majority in the Senate and have struggled to pass even top legislative priorities. And it's not clear that all, or even most, Republicans back what Trump is proposing on immigration. Passing a DACA fix is a top priority for Democrats, but they won't go along with Trump's long list of demands, meaning what once seemed like a bipartisan compromise in the works now looks more like another legislative standoff.
In his letter to Congress, Trump said the list of proposals was developed from the bottom up, working with law enforcement professionals on the front lines of America's immigration system.
"In response, they identified dangerous loopholes, outdated laws, and easily exploited vulnerabilities in our immigration system — current policies that are harming our country and our communities," his letter said.
These recommendations happen to also align nicely with Trump's campaign rhetoric.
Among the recommendations, as described by the White House:
Fund and complete construction of the southern border wall
Ensure the safe and expeditious return of Unaccompanied Alien Children and family units
End abuse of our asylum system by tightening standards, imposing penalties for fraud, and ensuring detention while claims are verified
Remove illegal border crossers quickly by hiring an additional 370 immigration judges and 1,000 ICE attorneys
Stop "sanctuary cities"
Strengthen law enforcement by hiring 10,000 more ICE officers and 300 federal prosecutors
End visa overstays by establishing reforms to ensure their swift removal
Protect U.S. workers by requiring E-Verify and strengthening laws to stop employment discrimination against U.S. workers
End extended-family chain migration by limiting family-based green cards to include spouses and minor children
Establish a points-based system for green cards to protect U.S. workers and taxpayers
Sen. Tom Cotton, R-Ark., quickly offered praise.
"The principles the president has put out show he understands what's broken in our immigration system and what's holding down wages for American workers," Cotton said in a statement. "I'm especially glad to see him call for ending chain migration and moving to a skills-based immigration system. These kinds of reforms are long overdue."
Cotton introduced a bill to create a skills-based immigration system earlier this year, and while Trump voiced support for it at a White House event, the bill has just one co-sponsor.
Source
Trump wants a deal on DACA. And buy deal, he wants to push to a shitty immigration bill that even the Republicans knew was dead in the water.
I also like how the law proposes to stop sanctuary cities, without addressing the fact that ICE is a garbage federal agency that fucks up all the time. And lies about its intent to get states to work with it.
|
On October 10 2017 00:55 KwarK wrote:Show nested quote +They had these beautiful, soft towels. Very good towels, and I came in, and there was a crowd of a lot of people. And they were screaming, and they were loving everything. I was having fun. They were having fun. They said, ‘Throw ‘em to me! Throw ‘em to me, Mr. President!’ - The President of the United States
It seriously reads like satire on one of those buffoon dictators.
Except its real.
That entire scene and his follow up comments could be in a Sacha Baron Cohen skit.
|
On October 10 2017 01:56 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +Trump Ties Immigration Demands To DACA Deal, Including Border Wall
President Trump on Sunday sent Congress a list of sweeping immigration changes he says "must be included as part of any legislation addressing the status of Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) recipients."
Trump wants the border wall he campaigned on to be built, a crackdown on illegal immigration and to switch the U.S. legal immigration system from one that prioritizes family connections to one based on merit.
Trump has promoted these policies before, both during the campaign and as president. But what's new is demanding that they be included in the legislative fix for the DACA program.
"Without these reforms, illegal immigration and chain migration, which severely and unfairly burden American workers and taxpayers, will continue without end," Trump said in a letter to Congress.
Last month, concluding that the DACA program put into place by the Obama administration through executive action was illegal, Trump announced that he would end it in six months. He called on Congress to enshrine in law the protections for undocumented immigrants who were brought to the country as children. The approximately 700,000 DACA recipients are often referred to as DREAMers. Under the program, they temporarily avoid deportation and receive work permits.
Congress now has 6 months to legalize DACA (something the Obama Administration was unable to do). If they can't, I will revisit this issue!
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) September 6, 2017
Around that time, Trump had dinner at the White House with the two top congressional Democrats, House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi and Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer, and all emerged talking about the rough outlines of a deal. A major component of that agreement was President Trump's willingness to take funding the border wall off the table, when it came to DACA legislation.
After the apparent agreement with Pelosi and Schumer, conservatives vocalized their rage, accusing Trump of abandoning the hard-line immigration platform he campaigned on. Conservative commentator Ann Coulter said at the time, "If we're not getting a wall, I'd prefer President Pence."
"DACA now, and the wall very soon," Trump told reporters on the south lawn of the White House in mid-September. "But the wall will happen."
The White House immigration principles appear to be a departure from that earlier statement. White House documents call for "completing construction of a wall along the southern border of the United States" and ensuring "funding for the southern border wall and associated infrastructure."
Pelosi and Schumer say these proposals are a clear break with what they believe was agreed to during that dinner at the White House.
"We told the President at our meeting that we were open to reasonable border security measures alongside the DREAM Act, but this list goes so far beyond what is reasonable," Pelosi and Schumer said in a statement. "This proposal fails to represent any attempt at compromise."
Beyond the wall, the Democrats say the administration's list is "anathema to the Dreamers, to the immigrant community and to the vast majority of Americans."
Although Republicans control both chambers of Congress, they have a narrow majority in the Senate and have struggled to pass even top legislative priorities. And it's not clear that all, or even most, Republicans back what Trump is proposing on immigration. Passing a DACA fix is a top priority for Democrats, but they won't go along with Trump's long list of demands, meaning what once seemed like a bipartisan compromise in the works now looks more like another legislative standoff.
In his letter to Congress, Trump said the list of proposals was developed from the bottom up, working with law enforcement professionals on the front lines of America's immigration system.
"In response, they identified dangerous loopholes, outdated laws, and easily exploited vulnerabilities in our immigration system — current policies that are harming our country and our communities," his letter said.
These recommendations happen to also align nicely with Trump's campaign rhetoric.
Among the recommendations, as described by the White House:
Fund and complete construction of the southern border wall
Ensure the safe and expeditious return of Unaccompanied Alien Children and family units
End abuse of our asylum system by tightening standards, imposing penalties for fraud, and ensuring detention while claims are verified
Remove illegal border crossers quickly by hiring an additional 370 immigration judges and 1,000 ICE attorneys
Stop "sanctuary cities"
Strengthen law enforcement by hiring 10,000 more ICE officers and 300 federal prosecutors
End visa overstays by establishing reforms to ensure their swift removal
Protect U.S. workers by requiring E-Verify and strengthening laws to stop employment discrimination against U.S. workers
End extended-family chain migration by limiting family-based green cards to include spouses and minor children
Establish a points-based system for green cards to protect U.S. workers and taxpayers
Sen. Tom Cotton, R-Ark., quickly offered praise.
"The principles the president has put out show he understands what's broken in our immigration system and what's holding down wages for American workers," Cotton said in a statement. "I'm especially glad to see him call for ending chain migration and moving to a skills-based immigration system. These kinds of reforms are long overdue."
Cotton introduced a bill to create a skills-based immigration system earlier this year, and while Trump voiced support for it at a White House event, the bill has just one co-sponsor.
SourceTrump wants a deal on DACA. And buy deal, he wants to push to a shitty immigration bill that even the Republicans knew was dead in the water. I also like how the law proposes to stop sanctuary cities, without addressing the fact that ICE is a garbage federal agency that fucks up all the time. And lies about its intent to get states to work with it.
A ridiculous list of demands that no one will ever agree to, probably made with the sole purpose of being able to shift blame away from himself for not accomplishing anything.
|
I've seen a good bill be poison pilled before. But this new tactic of pushing a complete shit bill and then blaming people for not doing anything is pretty bold. I doubt it is going to work out, but its bold.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
