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US Politics Mega-thread - Page 3328

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Read the rules in the OP before posting, please.

In order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a re-read to refresh your memory! The vast majority of you are contributing in a healthy way, keep it up!

NOTE: When providing a source, explain why you feel it is relevant and what purpose it adds to the discussion if it's not obvious.
Also take note that unsubstantiated tweets/posts meant only to rekindle old arguments can result in a mod action.
Doodsmack
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7224 Posts
March 15 2016 20:28 GMT
#66541
On March 16 2016 05:26 ErectedZenith wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 16 2016 05:23 Gorsameth wrote:
On March 16 2016 05:22 Doodsmack wrote:
The upside to Trump explicitly justifying violence (and let's not pretend he's saying "only use violence if they swing first") is that the other candidates walked back their unconditional support of the Republican nominee. I really want to see three candidates in the general.

I would laugh like never before if the GOP runs someone 3e party just to torpedo Trump.

God that would be so funny.


They can't.

Trump have leaked all of their resources without spending much himself.

Its the nature of the beast.


What?
Liquid`Drone
Profile Joined September 2002
Norway28795 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-15 20:31:00
March 15 2016 20:29 GMT
#66542
Testie, I've never said that Trump is stupid. I say he is a liar. You said he was telling the truth, I say he makes up stuff. He inflates every number that makes himself or his message seem positive and deflates every number that makes someone else look positive or himself or his policies look negative. And they don't all do this. Yes Ted Cruz, and okay, if your argument is that 'Trump is better than Cruz' then fuck it, I'm not gonna bother arguing.

Just look at this
http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/03/trump-fact-check-errors-exaggerations-falsehoods-213730#_ga=1.9616181.163558985.1391020600

Guy is incapable of speaking for 5 minutes without making something up. I'm not attacking his competence, I'm not even attacking his policies (but I really disagree with him on nearly everything). I'm attacking, vehemently so, the notion that he is honest and trustworthy. It's a lie that he has said so many times that people have started believing it, and it's terrifying to me.
Moderator
ZasZ.
Profile Joined May 2010
United States2911 Posts
March 15 2016 20:30 GMT
#66543
On March 16 2016 04:51 Mohdoo wrote:
Things I'm looking forward to today:

Bernie falling further behind

Things I'm not looking forward to today:

"Bernie Sanders manages AMAZING upset by only falling 10 points further behind! Can you say WHITE HOUSE? Say goodbye to the 1% and click here to see HOW Sanders is CHANGING modern day politics and destroying OLIGARCHY"


What exactly is your personal problem with Bernie Sanders? I get that you support Hillary Clinton, but what did he do to you to make you hate him so?
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
March 15 2016 20:30 GMT
#66544
On March 16 2016 05:28 Doodsmack wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 16 2016 05:26 ErectedZenith wrote:
On March 16 2016 05:23 Gorsameth wrote:
On March 16 2016 05:22 Doodsmack wrote:
The upside to Trump explicitly justifying violence (and let's not pretend he's saying "only use violence if they swing first") is that the other candidates walked back their unconditional support of the Republican nominee. I really want to see three candidates in the general.

I would laugh like never before if the GOP runs someone 3e party just to torpedo Trump.

God that would be so funny.


They can't.

Trump have leaked all of their resources without spending much himself.

Its the nature of the beast.


What?

Reality does not apply. He theorizes that Trump can outspend the GOP, which is only works if you believe the fantasy that Trump has spent nothing his campaign.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
GreenHorizons
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States23932 Posts
March 15 2016 20:30 GMT
#66545
I wonder who's paying more attention to the US elections right now, American's or everyone else?

I bet we could get better voter participation rates from several European countries in OUR election than we are in many places across this country.
"People like to look at history and think 'If that was me back then, I would have...' We're living through history, and the truth is, whatever you are doing now is probably what you would have done then" "Scratch a Liberal..."
Lord Tolkien
Profile Joined November 2012
United States12083 Posts
March 15 2016 20:32 GMT
#66546
On March 16 2016 05:30 GreenHorizons wrote:
I wonder who's paying more attention to the US elections right now, American's or everyone else?

I bet we could get better voter participation rates from several European countries in OUR election than we are in many places across this country.

Primaries are not really elections so uh.
"His father is pretty juicy tbh." ~WaveofShadow
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15743 Posts
March 15 2016 20:32 GMT
#66547
On March 16 2016 05:30 ZasZ. wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 16 2016 04:51 Mohdoo wrote:
Things I'm looking forward to today:

Bernie falling further behind

Things I'm not looking forward to today:

"Bernie Sanders manages AMAZING upset by only falling 10 points further behind! Can you say WHITE HOUSE? Say goodbye to the 1% and click here to see HOW Sanders is CHANGING modern day politics and destroying OLIGARCHY"


What exactly is your personal problem with Bernie Sanders? I get that you support Hillary Clinton, but what did he do to you to make you hate him so?


I think he's a legitimately terrible candidate who has managed to gather a lot of youth support by telling them exactly what they want to hear, in an angry way. It's just our version of the tea party.
Monochromatic
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
United States998 Posts
March 15 2016 20:33 GMT
#66548
On March 16 2016 05:01 Mohdoo wrote:

I think Bernie will win all the states that he is slightly to somewhat behind in. I think Clinton will handily win Florida and that she will continue to have the dominance she needs, while still not having much more.

I think this elections is just straight up different. People won't coalesce around a candidate until another drops out. I expect Clinton to get the nomination with 105% of the needed delegates.

Edit: As I have said before, this is our country's first 4 party election. However, it is being run as a 4 person tournament. Winner of the "left" election faces the winner of the "right" election, but they are actual full on elections. Not just feeling out who seems good and then calling it.

Edit #2: Not that it means much, but my mom has been a Bernie nut up until a couple days ago. She said Bernie officially went too insane and isn't actually making sense. She appreciates his message, but finally said he's just too far out there. My conversations with her went similar to my conversations with GH until now.


This is not the USA's first four party election.
MC: "Guys I need your support! iam poor make me nerd baller" __________________________________________RIP Violet
Liquid`Drone
Profile Joined September 2002
Norway28795 Posts
March 15 2016 20:36 GMT
#66549
Norwegian media arguably gives the american election better coverage than the norwegian election (with the exception of tv debates). This is partially because Norwegian politicians are actually competent politicians, with the side effect that following Norwegian politics is a boring chore, and partially because people are legitimately afraid of President Trump. If this was an election between Kasich and Clinton, there would still be a fair amount of coverage, but it's largely just Trump. Sanders got a lot of coverage early on, because we were both shocked to find an actual social democrat in the running and flattered that the greatest country on earth saw that our policies were better than theirs in several ways, but he hasn't been getting much as of late. Trump still on the front page of my goto-online newspaper though.
Moderator
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15743 Posts
March 15 2016 20:36 GMT
#66550
On March 16 2016 05:33 Monochromatic wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 16 2016 05:01 Mohdoo wrote:

I think Bernie will win all the states that he is slightly to somewhat behind in. I think Clinton will handily win Florida and that she will continue to have the dominance she needs, while still not having much more.

I think this elections is just straight up different. People won't coalesce around a candidate until another drops out. I expect Clinton to get the nomination with 105% of the needed delegates.

Edit: As I have said before, this is our country's first 4 party election. However, it is being run as a 4 person tournament. Winner of the "left" election faces the winner of the "right" election, but they are actual full on elections. Not just feeling out who seems good and then calling it.

Edit #2: Not that it means much, but my mom has been a Bernie nut up until a couple days ago. She said Bernie officially went too insane and isn't actually making sense. She appreciates his message, but finally said he's just too far out there. My conversations with her went similar to my conversations with GH until now.


This is not the USA's first four party election.


lol, fair point. First modern 4 party election!
oBlade
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States6111 Posts
March 15 2016 20:37 GMT
#66551
On March 16 2016 05:30 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 16 2016 05:28 Doodsmack wrote:
On March 16 2016 05:26 ErectedZenith wrote:
On March 16 2016 05:23 Gorsameth wrote:
On March 16 2016 05:22 Doodsmack wrote:
The upside to Trump explicitly justifying violence (and let's not pretend he's saying "only use violence if they swing first") is that the other candidates walked back their unconditional support of the Republican nominee. I really want to see three candidates in the general.

I would laugh like never before if the GOP runs someone 3e party just to torpedo Trump.

God that would be so funny.


They can't.

Trump have leaked all of their resources without spending much himself.

Its the nature of the beast.


What?

Reality does not apply. He theorizes that Trump can outspend the GOP, which is only works if you believe the fantasy that Trump has spent nothing his campaign.

The point is that, if money were the issue, Jeb Bush would already be a 3-term president.

You should be very happy that this election is showing the path to the White House can't be easily bought.
"I read it. You know how to read, you ignorant fuck?" - Andy Dufresne
SK.Testie
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
Canada11084 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-03-15 21:09:37
March 15 2016 20:37 GMT
#66552
On March 16 2016 05:26 Doodsmack wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 16 2016 05:11 SK.Testie wrote:
I think Trump's most definitely lying for political gain, but they all are proven liars...It's just what issues are most important to Americans right now.


It seems your argument has a tendency to change in response to the counter points from others. Before you said the others were decidedly sleazier than Trump. It appears to me you have such a preconceived opinion against the establishment and media that Trump is an outlet for people like you to just be defiant. In the process, as an informed political activist you make incredible sacrifices in the quality of your candidate (assuming you support Trump) in order to fight against the establishment and media.


It's not preconceived. It's from just living life listening to them for the last 15 years. You can literally tell when they go on the news and when they are openly lying. There's a long list of lies in the attacks on Trump and the really genuine set-up to paint him as something he's not very often. The people voting for him are the ones seeing through that.

On March 16 2016 05:29 Liquid`Drone wrote:
Testie, I've never said that Trump is stupid. I say he is a liar. You said he was telling the truth, I say he makes up stuff. He inflates every number that makes himself or his message seem positive and deflates every number that makes someone else look positive or himself or his policies look negative. And they don't all do this. Yes Ted Cruz, and okay, if your argument is that 'Trump is better than Cruz' then fuck it, I'm not gonna bother arguing.

Just look at this
http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/03/trump-fact-check-errors-exaggerations-falsehoods-213730#_ga=1.9616181.163558985.1391020600

Guy is incapable of speaking for 5 minutes without making something up. I'm not attacking his competence, I'm not even attacking his policies (but I really disagree with him on nearly everything). I'm attacking, vehemently so, the notion that he is honest and trustworthy. It's a lie that he has said so many times that people have started believing it, and it's terrifying to me.


The honesty angle comes from his base. Which are hyper informed reactionaries that believe capitalism isn't perfect but it's the best we've got so far. He speaks his mind, he doesn't talk like other politicians, he's talked about issues they are simply too afraid to even admit, let alone tackle.

Where does the honesty angle comes from? Because they see him as speaking a lot of truth and then they see that truth misrepresented and distorted by the media. So they rally even closer to him. There's some really choice examples that are really great for this.

As soon as way too many people compared him to Hitler, those people lost the publics trust and that trust was thrown more into Trump.
[image loading]
Social Justice is a fools errand. May all the adherents at its church be thwarted. Of all the religions I have come across, it is by far the most detestable.
ErectedZenith
Profile Joined January 2016
325 Posts
March 15 2016 20:45 GMT
#66553
On March 16 2016 05:37 oBlade wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 16 2016 05:30 Plansix wrote:
On March 16 2016 05:28 Doodsmack wrote:
On March 16 2016 05:26 ErectedZenith wrote:
On March 16 2016 05:23 Gorsameth wrote:
On March 16 2016 05:22 Doodsmack wrote:
The upside to Trump explicitly justifying violence (and let's not pretend he's saying "only use violence if they swing first") is that the other candidates walked back their unconditional support of the Republican nominee. I really want to see three candidates in the general.

I would laugh like never before if the GOP runs someone 3e party just to torpedo Trump.

God that would be so funny.


They can't.

Trump have leaked all of their resources without spending much himself.

Its the nature of the beast.


What?

Reality does not apply. He theorizes that Trump can outspend the GOP, which is only works if you believe the fantasy that Trump has spent nothing his campaign.

The point is that, if money were the issue, Jeb Bush would already be a 3-term president.

You should be very happy that this election is showing the path to the White House can't be easily bought.


P6 is having a hard time believing this which is funny to witness.
Seuss
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States10536 Posts
March 15 2016 20:59 GMT
#66554
On March 16 2016 05:37 oBlade wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 16 2016 05:30 Plansix wrote:
On March 16 2016 05:28 Doodsmack wrote:
On March 16 2016 05:26 ErectedZenith wrote:
On March 16 2016 05:23 Gorsameth wrote:
On March 16 2016 05:22 Doodsmack wrote:
The upside to Trump explicitly justifying violence (and let's not pretend he's saying "only use violence if they swing first") is that the other candidates walked back their unconditional support of the Republican nominee. I really want to see three candidates in the general.

I would laugh like never before if the GOP runs someone 3e party just to torpedo Trump.

God that would be so funny.


They can't.

Trump have leaked all of their resources without spending much himself.

Its the nature of the beast.


What?

Reality does not apply. He theorizes that Trump can outspend the GOP, which is only works if you believe the fantasy that Trump has spent nothing his campaign.

The point is that, if money were the issue, Jeb Bush would already be a 3-term president.

You should be very happy that this election is showing the path to the White House can't be easily bought.


Depends.

It's been proven that money isn't the only thing you need to win, but it is something you need. There isn't a single candidate who made it past Iowa and NH who didn't have money. Even Kasich had millions of dollars in his pocket plus support from Super PACs. His Hail Mary strategy of "Fight over a select group of states and pray" wouldn't be possible if he had Jill Stein, Jim Gilmore, or Lincoln Chafee's funds (even combined!).

As nice as it is to know that money can't outright buy an election, the barrier for entry is still ridiculously high (unless you casually have $20+ million sitting around).
"I am not able to carry all this people alone, for they are too heavy for me." -Moses (Numbers 11:14)
ticklishmusic
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States15977 Posts
March 15 2016 21:03 GMT
#66555
A more tongue-in-cheek example is that Bernie has outspent (by a lot) and outraised (by a decent amount) Hillary in the last few months and is 200+ delegates behind.
(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
frazzle
Profile Joined June 2012
United States468 Posts
March 15 2016 21:03 GMT
#66556
On March 16 2016 04:20 wei2coolman wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 16 2016 04:18 ticklishmusic wrote:
You can say Kissinger was (is) a bastard, but you can't deny he played a very real role in establishing American pre-eminence. I don't really see a problem with getting advice from him, or being friends with him. He's a real person, you know, like Antonin Scalia was. Frankly, the idea that you can't be friends with someone or that their perspective is worthless because of an ideological gap is pretty stupid. People were complaining that Hillary seemed to be on okay terms with Dubya at Nancy Reagan's funeral, geez.

Association = character assassination.

I mean, it should be pretty obvious by now, especially in this election cycle.

Exactly. Which is why neither she nor the Republicans ever made a stink about Obama being on the same board as Bill Ayers once, or going to Reverend Wright's church.
Mohdoo
Profile Joined August 2007
United States15743 Posts
March 15 2016 21:06 GMT
#66557
On March 16 2016 06:03 ticklishmusic wrote:
A more tongue-in-cheek example is that Bernie has outspent (by a lot) and outraised (by a decent amount) Hillary in the last few months and is 200+ delegates behind.


Link/source?
CannonsNCarriers
Profile Joined April 2010
United States638 Posts
March 15 2016 21:06 GMT
#66558
On March 16 2016 05:29 Liquid`Drone wrote:
Testie, I've never said that Trump is stupid. I say he is a liar. You said he was telling the truth, I say he makes up stuff. He inflates every number that makes himself or his message seem positive and deflates every number that makes someone else look positive or himself or his policies look negative. And they don't all do this. Yes Ted Cruz, and okay, if your argument is that 'Trump is better than Cruz' then fuck it, I'm not gonna bother arguing.

Just look at this
http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/03/trump-fact-check-errors-exaggerations-falsehoods-213730#_ga=1.9616181.163558985.1391020600

Guy is incapable of speaking for 5 minutes without making something up. I'm not attacking his competence, I'm not even attacking his policies (but I really disagree with him on nearly everything). I'm attacking, vehemently so, the notion that he is honest and trustworthy. It's a lie that he has said so many times that people have started believing it, and it's terrifying to me.


But he speaks his mind and says what I am feeling but cannot say ...
Dun tuch my cheezbrgr
Kipsate
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Netherlands45349 Posts
March 15 2016 21:07 GMT
#66559
On March 16 2016 05:36 Liquid`Drone wrote:
Norwegian media arguably gives the american election better coverage than the norwegian election (with the exception of tv debates). This is partially because Norwegian politicians are actually competent politicians, with the side effect that following Norwegian politics is a boring chore, and partially because people are legitimately afraid of President Trump. If this was an election between Kasich and Clinton, there would still be a fair amount of coverage, but it's largely just Trump. Sanders got a lot of coverage early on, because we were both shocked to find an actual social democrat in the running and flattered that the greatest country on earth saw that our policies were better than theirs in several ways, but he hasn't been getting much as of late. Trump still on the front page of my goto-online newspaper though.

In Netherlands we have the the PVV but honestly

The drama
The "extreme" views
The Donald
The anti-establishment canidates
The money
The merchandise
The american flags being waved everywhere.
There is even a race on a state per state basis so you can gradually see how the competition unfolds.

American politics hella entertaining compared to Dutch ones, we are too nice and don't have enough cash to throw around.
WriterXiao8~~
oneofthem
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
March 15 2016 21:09 GMT
#66560
On March 16 2016 06:03 ticklishmusic wrote:
A more tongue-in-cheek example is that Bernie has outspent (by a lot) and outraised (by a decent amount) Hillary in the last few months and is 200+ delegates behind.

maybe he'd be 400 behind if he didn't spend.
We have fed the heart on fantasies, the heart's grown brutal from the fare, more substance in our enmities than in our love
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