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On March 16 2016 04:03 Nebuchad wrote:
You heard it here first, guys.
Someone who comes to an event to protest is actually against free speech.
Someone who tells his supporters that he will pay their legal fees if they punch protesters is not inciting violence, he's making a joke.
When you're not limited by reality, it's wonderfull all the things you can think.
Again, Trump supporters are not at their rallies obnoxiously standing up every single time Bernie tries to talk.
Trump supporters are not calling for open assassination on Bernie sanders. Though everyone's been making death threats at Hillary on both sides for a long time so I can't attest to that one.
If you disrupt an event that people go to, you're going to get on their nerves. But considering the fact that Bernies supporters have been FAR more violent, and far more oppressive, it's more than a little hilarious when they show up to Trumps rallies and Trump is almost always saying, "Get them outta here. Get them out, don't hurt them. Don't hurt him, get him out" etc.
The Chicago event literally had a tonne of people calling for his assassination, and two notorious black gangs were massively posting about how they'd shoot him.
Not to mention Bernie supporters have also staged false flags, stolen property destroyed property etc.
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Norway28742 Posts
On March 16 2016 03:57 SK.Testie wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2016 03:48 Liquid`Drone wrote:
Why would you assume that a billionaire businessman has a world of people that hates him? Of people he knows even? I mean what the fuck, that makes no sense testie. Obviously people are more likely to be positively inclined towards a billionaire friend.
It's also a very lenient qualifier - 'who knows the man' - everybody who 'knows me' loves me as well, that is, everyone who kinda knows me but doesn't love me just doesn't know me well enough. The media is intentionally doing massive character assassination. They've done multiple interviews intentionally trying to get people to say bad things about him. It hasn't worked, which was hilarious because when they found out it wasn't going to work they often tried to shut down the interview. The media is showing that they really are "bought and owned" and they are the ones doing all the inflammatory rhetoric. Trump says something true, and gets called racist. Should Presidents talk about those issues? Well, we know that Obama, Hillary, and Bernie would not only not talk about those issues but would say the opposite of what is true. Which is sad. Because I really like Obama. Here's the things he's said that are "racist". I don't believe he's a racist, nor do I think the things he's said are racist. Despite knowing friends of all colours, doing deals with people all over the world, and having hundreds of successful businesses employing a tonne of people. Illegals commit more crime. Rape, murder, and drugs. They are over-represented. - Very true Blacks commit more crime and are responsible for way more of their deaths than police, 92% to less than 1% - True Muslims should temporarily not be allowed into the country & Islam hates us - I'd very much argue that Islam is not your friend. And to pretend otherwise is kicking a can down the road for future generations. Build wall - Illegal immigration is a massive problem. In Mexico 99% of murders go unsolved and it's highly corrupt and full of shanty towns. There may be as much as 11 million to 30+ million Illegal immigrants. That's several small countries worth of people. He has literally not incited violence. Making a few jokes at his rallies to his supporters and having that blown up is stupid beyond belief. Trump protesters are not at other candidates rallies attempting to silence them. Trump protesters have been by far the most mature group except for one old man that clearly is not representative of his base. Trumps base thinks Trump is the best for the economy and resolving their social issues. The thing that Trump has said of everything which is "scariest" was his brief comment on maybe censoring certain things like the Internet. That's where my ears perked up and thought, "Oh hell no".
The issue here is one where you agree with Trump and you consider his statements statements of fact. I don't agree with Trump, and I consider him a liar. (Those two are independent of each other though, but I do find it likely that if I didn't think Trump was a liar, that I actually believed everything he states as fact, then I would be much more supportive towards his campaign. ) He cites statistics that are disproven - and frankly I think he willingly cites stats he knows are inaccurate if those stats have already been in circulation. (I'm too busy to do any digging now, but certainly one of his 'black people crime' stats fit exactly into this description.
Like, I don't like the Hitler comparisons myself. But what I do think Trump does is that he runs a Goebbels campaign. He doesn't care about the truth. He knows that by repeating a lie often enough, a significant amount of people will accept the lie as truth. Facts don't matter to him, convincing people that the US is a fucked up place and that he is the only one competent and capable enough to provide solutions, that's his entire game. Now, if I were to base my opinion on him on his ability to convince the disenfranchised and voiceless that he is their savior, I could find myself supportive, but in reality, I find his explosive rhetoric and authoritarian appeal dangerous, his suggested policies simplistic to the degree they are meaningless, and I cannot find any common ground with him in terms of values he pretends to espouse.
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On March 16 2016 04:05 Gorsameth wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2016 03:57 SK.Testie wrote:
He has literally not incited violence. Making a few jokes at his rallies to his supporters and having that blown up is stupid beyond belief. Trump protesters are not at other candidates rallies attempting to silence them. Trump protesters have been by far the most mature group except for one old man that clearly is not representative of his base. Trumps base thinks Trump is the best for the economy and resolving their social issues.
The thing that Trump has said of everything which is "scariest" was his brief comment on maybe censoring certain things like the Internet. That's where my ears perked up and thought, "Oh hell no". Show nested quote +So if you see somebody getting ready to throw a tomato, knock the crap out of them, would you? Seriously. Okay? Just knock the hell— I promise you, I will pay for the legal fees. I promise, I promise. Link with Source videoSorry but that counts as inciting violence and there is no way your going to spin that as anything else.
Yes, when people stand up cause a ruckus and try to cause a stir and come out swinging. I think it's fine if someone knocks the crap out of them. Bernie supporters are usually doing the first swings.
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This is the face of racist bigoted Trump. Literally fucking Hitler.
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On March 16 2016 03:57 SK.Testie wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2016 03:48 Liquid`Drone wrote:
Why would you assume that a billionaire businessman has a world of people that hates him? Of people he knows even? I mean what the fuck, that makes no sense testie. Obviously people are more likely to be positively inclined towards a billionaire friend.
It's also a very lenient qualifier - 'who knows the man' - everybody who 'knows me' loves me as well, that is, everyone who kinda knows me but doesn't love me just doesn't know me well enough. The media is intentionally doing massive character assassination. They've done multiple interviews intentionally trying to get people to say bad things about him. It hasn't worked, which was hilarious because when they found out it wasn't going to work they often tried to shut down the interview. The media is showing that they really are "bought and owned" and they are the ones doing all the inflammatory rhetoric. Trump says something true, and gets called racist. Should Presidents talk about those issues? Well, we know that Obama, Hillary, and Bernie would not only not talk about those issues but would say the opposite of what is true. Which is sad. Because I really like Obama. Here's the things he's said that are "racist". I don't believe he's a racist, nor do I think the things he's said are racist. Despite knowing friends of all colours, doing deals with people all over the world, and having hundreds of successful businesses employing a tonne of people. Illegals commit more crime. Rape, murder, and drugs. They are over-represented. - Very true Blacks commit more crime and are responsible for way more of their deaths than police, 92% to less than 1% - True Muslims should temporarily not be allowed into the country & Islam hates us - I'd very much argue that Islam is not your friend. And to pretend otherwise is kicking a can down the road for future generations. Build wall - Illegal immigration is a massive problem. In Mexico 99% of murders go unsolved and it's highly corrupt and full of shanty towns. There may be as much as 11 million to 30+ million Illegal immigrants. That's several small countries worth of people. He has literally not incited violence. Making a few jokes at his rallies to his supporters and having that blown up is stupid beyond belief. Trump protesters are not at other candidates rallies attempting to silence them. Trump protesters have been by far the most mature group except for one old man that clearly is not representative of his base. Trumps base thinks Trump is the best for the economy and resolving their social issues. The whole #disavow thing was ridiculous as well. Racists have supported other candidates in the past. Hillary was endorsed by https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Byrd before he died and spoke at his funeral. Disavow that endorsement Hillary! The thing that Trump has said of everything which is "scariest" was his brief comment on maybe censoring certain things like the Internet. That's where my ears perked up and thought, "Oh hell no".
I see the problem here. You are operating under the belief that Trump tells the truth. Quite the opposite is true in many instances. The man is a serial liar and will say whatever makes him the most popular at that given moment.
The media is assassinating his character because it deserves assassination. He is an unpredictable, vindictive, angry demagogue and should be run out of politics as quickly as humanly possible. I disagree with almost everything Cruz, Rubio, and (to a lesser extent) Kasich have to say, but at least they are civil and composed. I worry about what Ted Cruz will do to the civil liberties of my friends and family, but I don't worry about him having them assaulted or starting a war because a rival power insulted his hands.
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On March 16 2016 04:12 SK.Testie wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2016 04:05 Gorsameth wrote:On March 16 2016 03:57 SK.Testie wrote:
He has literally not incited violence. Making a few jokes at his rallies to his supporters and having that blown up is stupid beyond belief. Trump protesters are not at other candidates rallies attempting to silence them. Trump protesters have been by far the most mature group except for one old man that clearly is not representative of his base. Trumps base thinks Trump is the best for the economy and resolving their social issues.
The thing that Trump has said of everything which is "scariest" was his brief comment on maybe censoring certain things like the Internet. That's where my ears perked up and thought, "Oh hell no". So if you see somebody getting ready to throw a tomato, knock the crap out of them, would you? Seriously. Okay? Just knock the hell— I promise you, I will pay for the legal fees. I promise, I promise. Link with Source videoSorry but that counts as inciting violence and there is no way your going to spin that as anything else. Yes, when people stand up cause a ruckus and try to cause a stir and come out swinging. I think it's fine if someone knocks the crap out of them. Bernie supporters are usually doing the first swings.
When you are not limited by reality and think violence is the solution, anything is possible. You can justify any use of violence by claiming the other side is going to be violent too, because the reality of the situation doesn’t matter. Feels before reals.
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On March 16 2016 04:12 SK.Testie wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2016 04:05 Gorsameth wrote:On March 16 2016 03:57 SK.Testie wrote:
He has literally not incited violence. Making a few jokes at his rallies to his supporters and having that blown up is stupid beyond belief. Trump protesters are not at other candidates rallies attempting to silence them. Trump protesters have been by far the most mature group except for one old man that clearly is not representative of his base. Trumps base thinks Trump is the best for the economy and resolving their social issues.
The thing that Trump has said of everything which is "scariest" was his brief comment on maybe censoring certain things like the Internet. That's where my ears perked up and thought, "Oh hell no". So if you see somebody getting ready to throw a tomato, knock the crap out of them, would you? Seriously. Okay? Just knock the hell— I promise you, I will pay for the legal fees. I promise, I promise. Link with Source videoSorry but that counts as inciting violence and there is no way your going to spin that as anything else. Yes, when people stand up cause a ruckus and try to cause a stir and come out swinging. I think it's fine if someone knocks the crap out of them. Bernie supporters are usually doing the first swings.
Can we get an acknowledgement that "I think he was justified to incite violence" is different from the "he didn't incite violence" that you were pushing earlier? Do you think that would be fair?
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On March 16 2016 04:15 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2016 04:12 SK.Testie wrote:On March 16 2016 04:05 Gorsameth wrote:On March 16 2016 03:57 SK.Testie wrote:
He has literally not incited violence. Making a few jokes at his rallies to his supporters and having that blown up is stupid beyond belief. Trump protesters are not at other candidates rallies attempting to silence them. Trump protesters have been by far the most mature group except for one old man that clearly is not representative of his base. Trumps base thinks Trump is the best for the economy and resolving their social issues.
The thing that Trump has said of everything which is "scariest" was his brief comment on maybe censoring certain things like the Internet. That's where my ears perked up and thought, "Oh hell no". So if you see somebody getting ready to throw a tomato, knock the crap out of them, would you? Seriously. Okay? Just knock the hell— I promise you, I will pay for the legal fees. I promise, I promise. Link with Source videoSorry but that counts as inciting violence and there is no way your going to spin that as anything else. Yes, when people stand up cause a ruckus and try to cause a stir and come out swinging. I think it's fine if someone knocks the crap out of them. Bernie supporters are usually doing the first swings. When you are not limited by reality and think violence is the solution, anything is possible. You can justify any use of violence by claiming the other side is going to be violent too, because the reality of the situation doesn’t matter. Feels before reals.
Wait, you mean all the death threats against Trump aren't violent, and real?
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On March 16 2016 04:16 wei2coolman wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2016 04:15 Plansix wrote:On March 16 2016 04:12 SK.Testie wrote:On March 16 2016 04:05 Gorsameth wrote:On March 16 2016 03:57 SK.Testie wrote:
He has literally not incited violence. Making a few jokes at his rallies to his supporters and having that blown up is stupid beyond belief. Trump protesters are not at other candidates rallies attempting to silence them. Trump protesters have been by far the most mature group except for one old man that clearly is not representative of his base. Trumps base thinks Trump is the best for the economy and resolving their social issues.
The thing that Trump has said of everything which is "scariest" was his brief comment on maybe censoring certain things like the Internet. That's where my ears perked up and thought, "Oh hell no". So if you see somebody getting ready to throw a tomato, knock the crap out of them, would you? Seriously. Okay? Just knock the hell— I promise you, I will pay for the legal fees. I promise, I promise. Link with Source videoSorry but that counts as inciting violence and there is no way your going to spin that as anything else. Yes, when people stand up cause a ruckus and try to cause a stir and come out swinging. I think it's fine if someone knocks the crap out of them. Bernie supporters are usually doing the first swings. When you are not limited by reality and think violence is the solution, anything is possible. You can justify any use of violence by claiming the other side is going to be violent too, because the reality of the situation doesn’t matter. Feels before reals. Wait, you mean all the death threats against Trump aren't violent, and real?
Have you seen any of us defend death threats being made in this thread?
Is Bernie saying that he will cover the legal costs of the people who send death threats to Trump?
No?
Interesting.
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You can say Kissinger was (is) a bastard, but you can't deny he played a very real role in establishing American pre-eminence. I don't really see a problem with getting advice from him, or being friends with him. He's a real person, you know, like Antonin Scalia was. Frankly, the idea that you can't be friends with someone or that their perspective is worthless because of an ideological gap is pretty stupid. People were complaining that Hillary seemed to be on okay terms with Dubya at Nancy Reagan's funeral, geez.
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On March 16 2016 04:18 ticklishmusic wrote:
You can say Kissinger was (is) a bastard, but you can't deny he played a very real role in establishing American pre-eminence. I don't really see a problem with getting advice from him, or being friends with him. He's a real person, you know, like Antonin Scalia was. Frankly, the idea that you can't be friends with someone or that their perspective is worthless because of an ideological gap is pretty stupid. People were complaining that Hillary seemed to be on okay terms with Dubya at Nancy Reagan's funeral, geez.
Association = character assassination.
I mean, it should be pretty obvious by now, especially in this election cycle.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
idk about being more hawkish in this new era where american resources are more limited. you don't want to get into a sinkhole without actual returns. but as long as hillary doesn't escalate stuff in the middle east the hawkishness should help in other areas.
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On March 16 2016 04:11 Liquid`Drone wrote:
The issue here is one where you agree with Trump and you consider his statements statements of fact. I don't agree with Trump, and I consider him a liar. (Those two are independent of each other though, but I do find it likely that if I didn't think Trump was a liar, that I actually believed everything he states as fact, then I would be much more supportive towards his campaign. ) He cites statistics that are disproven - and frankly I think he willingly cites stats he knows are inaccurate if those stats have already been in circulation. (I'm too busy to do any digging now, but certainly one of his 'black people crime' stats fit exactly into this description.
I'm not too busy to do the digging. The statistics I mentioned were ones on crime & Islam. And they are actually out of proportion and under represented.
Like, I don't like the Hitler comparisons myself. But what I do think Trump does is that he runs a Goebbels campaign. He doesn't care about the truth. He knows that by repeating a lie often enough, a significant amount of people will accept the lie as truth. Facts don't matter to him, convincing people that the US is a fucked up place and that he is the only one competent and capable enough to provide solutions, that's his entire game. Now, if I were to base my opinion on him on his ability to convince the disenfranchised and voiceless that he is their savior, I could find myself supportive, but in reality, I find his explosive rhetoric and authoritarian appeal dangerous, his suggested policies simplistic to the degree they are meaningless, and I cannot find any common ground with him in terms of values he pretends to espouse.
Well the thing is: Literally every GoP establishment with maybe the exception of Rand Paul is way more dishonest and sleezier than he is. Ted Cruz is the creepiest mother fucker I've seen in politics. So this entire race the only one talking like an adult in the debates was Rand Paul but his voter block wanted him in the Senate and found him highly important there.
Hillary is notorious for lying.
Bernie is the most truthful, but he's an idealist that many people see as unrealistic. And many just think he's a communist Jew.
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Norway28742 Posts
On March 16 2016 04:18 ticklishmusic wrote:
You can say Kissinger was (is) a bastard, but you can't deny he played a very real role in establishing American pre-eminence. I don't really see a problem with getting advice from him, or being friends with him. He's a real person, you know, like Antonin Scalia was. Frankly, the idea that you can't be friends with someone or that their perspective is worthless because of an ideological gap is pretty stupid. People were complaining that Hillary seemed to be on okay terms with Dubya at Nancy Reagan's funeral, geez.
So if someone is friends with Hitler, that does not reflect poorly on them?
At what point on the Dubya (where I agree a friendship is unproblematic!) -Hitler scale does friendship become problematic?
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On March 16 2016 04:24 SK.Testie wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2016 04:11 Liquid`Drone wrote:
The issue here is one where you agree with Trump and you consider his statements statements of fact. I don't agree with Trump, and I consider him a liar. (Those two are independent of each other though, but I do find it likely that if I didn't think Trump was a liar, that I actually believed everything he states as fact, then I would be much more supportive towards his campaign. ) He cites statistics that are disproven - and frankly I think he willingly cites stats he knows are inaccurate if those stats have already been in circulation. (I'm too busy to do any digging now, but certainly one of his 'black people crime' stats fit exactly into this description.
I'm not too busy to do the digging. The statistics I mentioned were ones on crime & Islam. And they are actually out of proportion and under represented. Show nested quote +
Like, I don't like the Hitler comparisons myself. But what I do think Trump does is that he runs a Goebbels campaign. He doesn't care about the truth. He knows that by repeating a lie often enough, a significant amount of people will accept the lie as truth. Facts don't matter to him, convincing people that the US is a fucked up place and that he is the only one competent and capable enough to provide solutions, that's his entire game. Now, if I were to base my opinion on him on his ability to convince the disenfranchised and voiceless that he is their savior, I could find myself supportive, but in reality, I find his explosive rhetoric and authoritarian appeal dangerous, his suggested policies simplistic to the degree they are meaningless, and I cannot find any common ground with him in terms of values he pretends to espouse.
Well the thing is: Literally every GoP establishment with maybe the exception of Rand Paul is way more dishonest and sleezier than he is. Ted Cruz is the creepiest mother fucker I've seen in politics. So this entire race the only one talking like an adult in the debates was Rand Paul but his voter block wanted him in the Senate and found him highly important there. Hillary is notorious for lying. Bernie is the most truthful, but he's an idealist that many people see as unrealistic. And many just think he's a communist Jew.
if only a saviour figure came along that had an Endlösung for those communist jews causing all this ruckus....
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On March 16 2016 04:18 ticklishmusic wrote:
You can say Kissinger was (is) a bastard, but you can't deny he played a very real role in establishing American pre-eminence. I don't really see a problem with getting advice from him, or being friends with him. He's a real person, you know, like Antonin Scalia was. Frankly, the idea that you can't be friends with someone or that their perspective is worthless because of an ideological gap is pretty stupid. People were complaining that Hillary seemed to be on okay terms with Dubya at Nancy Reagan's funeral, geez.
It's not merely an ideological gap but the fact that he is responsible for the deaths of human beings. The context this came up in is that for some reason it's fashionable to hold Trump at "fault" because one white supremacist or another that before this election nobody (rightly) was paying any attention to or knew their names, complimented Trump. But there's no such scandal in the mass media. And Clinton actually likes Kissinger. There is apparently no reciprocal admiration between Trump and a white supremacist. This is the left, for fuck's sake. Kissinger, as in Vietnam, which is either the most unpopular war in US history or tied for it. It would be like a Democratic candidate in 30 years chatting with G.W. Bush and the mass media being filled with gossip about how some racist radio host in bumfuckville said he was voting for Robert Paul. The point is that there is an inconsistency or even hypocrisy going on.
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Three influential leaders in the conservative movement have summoned other top conservatives for a closed-door meeting this Thursday in Washington D.C. to talk about how to stop Donald Trump and, should he become the Republican nominee, how to run a third-party “true conservative” challenger in the fall.
The organizers of the meeting include Bill Wichterman, who was President George W. Bush’s liaison to the conservative movement, Bob Fischer, a South Dakota businessman and longtime conservative convener, and Erick Erickson, the outspoken Trump opponent and conservative activist who founded RedState.com.
"Please join other conservative leaders to strategize how to defeat Donald Trump for the Republican nomination,” the three wrote in an invitation obtained by POLITICO that recently went out to conservative leaders, "and if he is the Republican nominee for president, to offer a true conservative candidate in the general election."
The meeting is scheduled for Thursday, two days after winner-take-all Florida and Ohio vote in what many Republican operatives believe will determine whether Trump is on an unstoppable march to the nomination or is likely to stall out short of the 1,237 delegates he needs.
One person involved in the gathering described it as in the “embryonic” stages.“ It’s not like there’s a royal grand plan that’s going to be unfurled," this person said. "People aren’t giving up on the Republican Party yet."
Source
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Norway28742 Posts
How is Kasich more dishonest or sleazier than Trump? How was Jeb Bush more dishonest or sleazier? Hell, how about Lindsay Graham? Note that I have big problems on policy with all three of these - but when it comes to 'honesty' or 'non-sleaziness of character', they all vastly, vastly outperform Trump. I get Cruz, absolutely, and I can also understand that Rubio would give you those vibes, but you're generalizing to the point where your statements don't make sense.. Trump flat out lies whenever he wants to, with no remorse, no regret, no hesitation and without blinking an eye. Then, he combines this with being 'willing to say what nobody else wants to say out loud' and people consider him 'trustworthy' because of it. It's fucking mind-numbing.
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On March 16 2016 04:12 SK.Testie wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2016 04:05 Gorsameth wrote:On March 16 2016 03:57 SK.Testie wrote:
He has literally not incited violence. Making a few jokes at his rallies to his supporters and having that blown up is stupid beyond belief. Trump protesters are not at other candidates rallies attempting to silence them. Trump protesters have been by far the most mature group except for one old man that clearly is not representative of his base. Trumps base thinks Trump is the best for the economy and resolving their social issues.
The thing that Trump has said of everything which is "scariest" was his brief comment on maybe censoring certain things like the Internet. That's where my ears perked up and thought, "Oh hell no". So if you see somebody getting ready to throw a tomato, knock the crap out of them, would you? Seriously. Okay? Just knock the hell— I promise you, I will pay for the legal fees. I promise, I promise. Link with Source videoSorry but that counts as inciting violence and there is no way your going to spin that as anything else. Yes, when people stand up cause a ruckus and try to cause a stir and come out swinging. I think it's fine if someone knocks the crap out of them. Bernie supporters are usually doing the first swings.
Oh so not its ok when he advocates violence. Instead of never doing it. Well any progress is welcome I guess.
Have you read the quote? No where does it say someone is punching anyone else. Security told Trump someone might have some tomatoes and if the crowd saw anyone getting ready to throw one they should get punched out.
No one in this quote and its context is swinging fists at anyone other then Trump asking his supporters to do so.
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On March 16 2016 04:36 Gorsameth wrote:
Oh so not its ok when he advocates violence. Instead of never doing it. Well any progress is welcome I guess.
Have you read the quote? No where does it say someone is punching anyone else. Security told Trump someone might have some tomatoes and if the crowd saw anyone getting ready to throw one they should get punched out.
No one in this quote and its context is swinging fists at anyone other then Trump asking his supporters to do so.
It's actually illegal to protest in the vicinity of the secret service. I'm amazed people haven't died. Obama installed this law because I imagine it makes their job a lot harder.
On March 16 2016 04:34 Liquid`Drone wrote:
How is Kasich more dishonest or sleazier than Trump? How was Jeb Bush more dishonest or sleazier? Hell, how about Lindsay Graham? Note that I have big problems on policy with all three of these - but when it comes to 'honesty' or 'non-sleaziness of character', they all vastly, vastly outperform Trump. I get Cruz, absolutely, and I can also understand that Rubio would give you those vibes, but you're generalizing to the point where your statements don't make sense.. Trump flat out lies whenever he wants to, with no remorse, no regret, no hesitation and without blinking an eye. Then, he combines this with being 'willing to say what nobody else wants to say out loud' and people consider him 'trustworthy' because of it. It's fucking mind-numbing.
They are all completely bought and owned by corporate masters and they are all part of the "establishment". The people are so against the establishment (especially the Republican side) for their notorious lying history. All the people you mentioned are completely bought and owned.
Out of those Kasich might be more honest, but he grants amnesty to illegals. That ends this election. People simply do not want that. Hell, your own countries are getting more right wing because of the Migrant crisis. That's only 1.6 million Muslims so far compared to the 11-30 million Illegals. And your own media is being exposed as constant liars trying to suppress information which is REALLY disconcerting. That same thing has been happening in America for a long, long time. And people are saying, "We're really fucking tired of this". People dislike having foreign gangs in their lands.
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