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On November 29 2011 16:15 travis wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2011 14:59 Nitrogen wrote:On November 29 2011 14:36 travis wrote:On November 29 2011 13:21 Syben wrote:
I don't think that the United States Air Force Pararescue has been given enough credit in this thread. They have the highest fail rate of any U.S Special Forces branch and are utilized by all other special forces branches for missions. If anything it could be argued the PJs are more elite than seals what is this i don't even wow, what an impressive argument you have presented Show nested quote +On November 29 2011 15:07 Nitrogen wrote:On November 29 2011 15:04 Timurid wrote:On November 29 2011 14:57 xAPOCALYPSEx wrote:On November 29 2011 13:21 Syben wrote:
I don't think that the United States Air Force Pararescue has been given enough credit in this thread. They have the highest fail rate of any U.S Special Forces branch and are utilized by all other special forces branches for missions. Isn't that a bad thing? xD but yeah PJs are badass Im confused about that statement too. a school's difficulty is usually determined by the % of people that fail/quit. did you know that PJs have a higher dropout rate than navy seals oh, thats what ur saying huh
i want to point this out to everyone in the thread
SEALs =/= DEVGRU (aka seal team 6)
st6 operators come from normal seal teams. they are the most experienced of the seals. just like how delta operators come from sf/rangers usually.
i could walk into an air force recruiting office right now and say "hey, i wanna be a pj" and they could set me up to be one. now try walking into a navy/army recruiting office and say "hey, i wanna be in st6/delta." it won't work out so well. delta and st6 take the most experienced, physically and mentally tough people from sf, rangers and seals.
go read the book inside delta force and compare it to pj training. just from the mere amount of training you could say delta is more "elite," and that's not even including the years delta operators have had in rangers and sf.
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On November 30 2011 08:32 Nitrogen wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2011 16:15 travis wrote:On November 29 2011 14:59 Nitrogen wrote:On November 29 2011 14:36 travis wrote:On November 29 2011 13:21 Syben wrote:
I don't think that the United States Air Force Pararescue has been given enough credit in this thread. They have the highest fail rate of any U.S Special Forces branch and are utilized by all other special forces branches for missions. If anything it could be argued the PJs are more elite than seals what is this i don't even wow, what an impressive argument you have presented On November 29 2011 15:07 Nitrogen wrote:On November 29 2011 15:04 Timurid wrote:On November 29 2011 14:57 xAPOCALYPSEx wrote:On November 29 2011 13:21 Syben wrote:
I don't think that the United States Air Force Pararescue has been given enough credit in this thread. They have the highest fail rate of any U.S Special Forces branch and are utilized by all other special forces branches for missions. Isn't that a bad thing? xD but yeah PJs are badass Im confused about that statement too. a school's difficulty is usually determined by the % of people that fail/quit. did you know that PJs have a higher dropout rate than navy seals oh, thats what ur saying huh i want to point this out to everyone in the thread SEALs =/= DEVGRU (aka seal team 6) st6 operators come from normal seal teams. they are the most experienced of the seals. just like how delta operators come from sf/rangers usually. i could walk into an air force recruiting office right now and say "hey, i wanna be a pj" and they could set me up to be one. now try walking into a navy/army recruiting office and say "hey, i wanna be in st6/delta." it won't work out so well. delta and st6 take the most experienced, physically and mentally tough people from sf, rangers and seals. go read the book inside delta force and compare it to pj training. just from the mere amount of training you could say delta is more "elite," and that's not even including the years delta operators have had in rangers and sf.
oh ok
well thats interesting info
i was just talking about seals and pjs in general
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I'm not sure what they're called but the Israeli Special Forces sound pretty awesome from what I've heard from my professor. My history professor was apparently involved in U.S. Special Forces in Africa and he said he had dealings with Israeli Special Forces guys and they were the best of the best. One of his stories was the U.S. needed a USSR plane schematic so they asked the Israelis to get the blueprints. The agent they sent came back and landed the actual plane for them xD.
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Clearly there is only one way to settle this. All the worlds most elites SF are sent to the....coliseum to do battle and finally put this question to rest!
But really this a fun thread but in no way shape or form will you get a solid answer
The best way is probably to hold a Poll that would give you an opinion bias which wouldn't be terrible.
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seals hands down no contest
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MARSOC 
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SEALS have to go through some of the most intense training ever...not to mention the sniper training...
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Well if an acquaintance who was a ranger is right, I would go with black ops operatives.
He said he knows they're out there and they won't acknowledge you even exist and may kill you off if necessary but they exist. I would have to assume black ops types are trained in political coercion and assassination along with a similar training to what SEALs do. Yes I know "black ops" refers to the operation itself but I think it would be pretty logical in order to participate in one you'd have to receive even further training then what is already provided in say the DELTA Force or SEAL program.
Just speculation though.
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The most bad ass one is the one we don't know about.
If there is a video or documentary about them. They are not the most bad ass. The most bad ass unit has people that have trained and were former members or those units but the most bad ass were hand selected for another unit we don't know about. I could be getting to hollywood (maybe these units don't even exist) but if they do exist... THOSE GUYS.
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Delta Force, just on the knowledge that most of the time the toughest Seals join Delta.
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On November 30 2011 10:38 Beren wrote:
The most bad ass one is the one we don't know about.
If there is a video or documentary about them. They are not the most bad ass. The most bad ass unit has people that have trained and were former members or those units but the most bad ass were hand selected for another unit we don't know about. I could be getting to hollywood (maybe these units don't even exist) but if they do exist... THOSE GUYS.
Like.. Why would they be kept a secret? Give me one reason.
Bragging about your special forces is an excellent way to give your country political power, and prohibit attacks.
Ofcourse you can't endanger identeties, but keeping the operation a secret makes no sence (unless it's illegal ofcourse).
If you're talking about black ops stuff, you not only have to be an extremely skilled solider, but also a brainwashed nationalist. For instance when democratical leaders are assassinated by the CIA.
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There was a show on TV about elite forces to counter terrorism acts in various contries.
DEVGRU was like #3 and tghere were 2 units on top of it. The #1 was a unit called cobra that acted in Europe. These guys were the most elite forces in the world. Trying to find a link or pictures of it might be a though one! 
Edit : I recal #2 was Israeli Special Units
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On December 01 2011 04:49 Euronyme wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2011 10:38 Beren wrote:
The most bad ass one is the one we don't know about.
If there is a video or documentary about them. They are not the most bad ass. The most bad ass unit has people that have trained and were former members or those units but the most bad ass were hand selected for another unit we don't know about. I could be getting to hollywood (maybe these units don't even exist) but if they do exist... THOSE GUYS. Like.. Why would they be kept a secret? Give me one reason. Bragging about your special forces is an excellent way to give your country political power, and prohibit attacks. Ofcourse you can't endanger identeties, but keeping the operation a secret makes no sence (unless it's illegal ofcourse). If you're talking about black ops stuff, you not only have to be an extremely skilled solider, but also a brainwashed nationalist. For instance when democratical leaders are assassinated by the CIA.
Because information is the most powerful weapon of war. Even more so for special operations which often deal with highly sensitive and probably covert operations. The less anyone knows about such operations, the higher the chance of success.
Intelligence agencies will probably be monitoring all military movements and known units, especially if they are capable of carrying out special tasks. Again, if no one knows about the unit, it can't be monitored (or infiltrated).
If nothing else, the most elite unit of all will definitely be first in line for black ops. Having an unknown unit will greatly aid in deniability if the mission fails.
If you want military might for deterrence and political power, you need a strong standing army and advanced technologies. Having a strong special ops unit doesn't help that much. Especially if you brag about their capabilities, then you're just giving the enemy opportunities to prepare lol.
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On December 01 2011 05:03 thesideshow wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2011 04:49 Euronyme wrote:On November 30 2011 10:38 Beren wrote:
The most bad ass one is the one we don't know about.
If there is a video or documentary about them. They are not the most bad ass. The most bad ass unit has people that have trained and were former members or those units but the most bad ass were hand selected for another unit we don't know about. I could be getting to hollywood (maybe these units don't even exist) but if they do exist... THOSE GUYS. Like.. Why would they be kept a secret? Give me one reason. Bragging about your special forces is an excellent way to give your country political power, and prohibit attacks. Ofcourse you can't endanger identeties, but keeping the operation a secret makes no sence (unless it's illegal ofcourse). If you're talking about black ops stuff, you not only have to be an extremely skilled solider, but also a brainwashed nationalist. For instance when democratical leaders are assassinated by the CIA. Because information is the most powerful weapon of war. Even more so for special operations which often deal with highly sensitive and probably covert operations. The less anyone knows about such operations, the higher the chance of success. Intelligence agencies will probably be monitoring all military movements and known units, especially if they are capable of carrying out special tasks. Again, if no one knows about the unit, it can't be monitored (or infiltrated). If nothing else, the most elite unit of all will definitely be first in line for black ops. Having an unknown unit will greatly aid in deniability if the mission fails. If you want military might for deterrence and political power, you need a strong standing army and advanced technologies. Having a strong special ops unit doesn't help that much. Especially if you brag about their capabilities, then you're just giving the enemy opportunities to prepare lol.
See, now we're talking in usefulness, whereas the thread was about which the most 'elite' or skilled team would be.
My point is that being in a black ops team requires a lot more than skill. It requires a national fanatism that isn't quite necessary to the same level in spec ops.
Look for instance at the SEALS, the SAS etc etc. That's special forces that are well known, and held up high in national media.
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The most elite force is Delta
Only the top SEALS, Green Berets, Marine Recon, etc can be apart of it
Marine recruiter told me they can use whatever weapons they want, dress however they want, and can be almost anyone, you'd never know they were even there, but if you get caught the US government will disenengage any knowledge of your existence as a soldier or even a US citizen.
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Spanish "Boinas verdes" are also a must here and should be taken into consideration.
It should be also adressed that the first special forces ever made were "Tercios" who were the ones who pioneered the activities which we nowadays know as "special forces"
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On December 01 2011 05:10 Euronyme wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2011 05:03 thesideshow wrote:On December 01 2011 04:49 Euronyme wrote:On November 30 2011 10:38 Beren wrote:
The most bad ass one is the one we don't know about.
If there is a video or documentary about them. They are not the most bad ass. The most bad ass unit has people that have trained and were former members or those units but the most bad ass were hand selected for another unit we don't know about. I could be getting to hollywood (maybe these units don't even exist) but if they do exist... THOSE GUYS. Like.. Why would they be kept a secret? Give me one reason. Bragging about your special forces is an excellent way to give your country political power, and prohibit attacks. Ofcourse you can't endanger identeties, but keeping the operation a secret makes no sence (unless it's illegal ofcourse). If you're talking about black ops stuff, you not only have to be an extremely skilled solider, but also a brainwashed nationalist. For instance when democratical leaders are assassinated by the CIA. Because information is the most powerful weapon of war. Even more so for special operations which often deal with highly sensitive and probably covert operations. The less anyone knows about such operations, the higher the chance of success. Intelligence agencies will probably be monitoring all military movements and known units, especially if they are capable of carrying out special tasks. Again, if no one knows about the unit, it can't be monitored (or infiltrated). If nothing else, the most elite unit of all will definitely be first in line for black ops. Having an unknown unit will greatly aid in deniability if the mission fails. If you want military might for deterrence and political power, you need a strong standing army and advanced technologies. Having a strong special ops unit doesn't help that much. Especially if you brag about their capabilities, then you're just giving the enemy opportunities to prepare lol. See, now we're talking in usefulness, whereas the thread was about which the most 'elite' or skilled team would be. My point is that being in a black ops team requires a lot more than skill. It requires a national fanatism that isn't quite necessary to the same level in spec ops. Look for instance at the SEALS, the SAS etc etc. That's special forces that are well known, and held up high in national media.
Arguably the most nationally fanatistic (I don't know what I typed there) operatives will devote most of their lives to training making them the most well trained.
The most secret specops unit also be given the most advanced technologies and most experimental training techniques, making them the most "elite" in terms of capabilities.
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EPT
