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On September 20 2011 03:27 zeru wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 03:25 Rubber wrote:On September 20 2011 03:21 mTw|NarutO wrote:On September 20 2011 03:18 Rubber wrote:On September 20 2011 03:12 mTw|NarutO wrote:On September 20 2011 03:09 DoomsVille wrote:On September 20 2011 03:05 mTw|NarutO wrote:
Not taking any side here, but I think backing off from a contract within 14 days even without explanation is valid and even if it would not be the case, the best thing coL could probably do is just accept the wishes of Stephano and let him stay at Millenium because the last thing you want is 'forcing' a player to your team if he doesn't actually want it.
I could understand that they want him to keep his word and stay to what he signed, but in my opinion it would be better to accept that he changed his mind and let him stay at M.
However it goes, glhf. Both teams are great. I sincerely doubt Complexity has any intention of forcing a player to play for them. They certainly didn't force Destiny to. Legal action on their part will probably seek some form of compensation for a broken contract with complexity. And they should be justified in seeking it if Stephano/Mill are in fact breaking a contract with them (which appears to be the case). I didn't say they will, I said they shouldn't ;-)! I was not saying they are planning to. In my opinion they should not take any action at all as a gesture of goodwill. Kind of like Sony repairing your TV if it breaks 1 day after the warranty expires etc. :-) Why the hell would they not pursue some sort of compensation? You got your analogy all wrong. In this case, complexity is the customer, and Sony stole back a TV after it was already bought. "Goodwill" doesn't apply to this situation. The money they can get out of this does stand in no relation to the effort and trouble they would have to go through, because I'm pretty sure if they want to have money from Millenium they would need to go and take this to court... which is way too much of a hassle to even start it. Also, it would probably cost them more than get them something :o If it were me, I'd pursue the case with the knowledge that Mil would lose out more than I would (court fees + the compensation). There needs to be a precedent of repercussions set for breaches of contract. Why would you want to hurt your own and another organization who are both working towards growing esports and becoming bigger...? Going to court over pretty much anything esports related isn't worth it in any way.
Because you cant let players and teams just do this kind of shit whenever they want. If you really want E-sports to grow you want it to grow in the right direction. Do you want people just doing what ever they want? Joining teams leaving teams when ever they decide breaking contracts like its nothing? NO that would lead to total chaos and no companies want to financially support E-sports if it looks like a huge RISK.
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On September 20 2011 03:26 aristarchus wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 03:21 mTw|NarutO wrote:On September 20 2011 03:18 Rubber wrote:On September 20 2011 03:12 mTw|NarutO wrote:On September 20 2011 03:09 DoomsVille wrote:On September 20 2011 03:05 mTw|NarutO wrote:
Not taking any side here, but I think backing off from a contract within 14 days even without explanation is valid and even if it would not be the case, the best thing coL could probably do is just accept the wishes of Stephano and let him stay at Millenium because the last thing you want is 'forcing' a player to your team if he doesn't actually want it.
I could understand that they want him to keep his word and stay to what he signed, but in my opinion it would be better to accept that he changed his mind and let him stay at M.
However it goes, glhf. Both teams are great. I sincerely doubt Complexity has any intention of forcing a player to play for them. They certainly didn't force Destiny to. Legal action on their part will probably seek some form of compensation for a broken contract with complexity. And they should be justified in seeking it if Stephano/Mill are in fact breaking a contract with them (which appears to be the case). I didn't say they will, I said they shouldn't ;-)! I was not saying they are planning to. In my opinion they should not take any action at all as a gesture of goodwill. Kind of like Sony repairing your TV if it breaks 1 day after the warranty expires etc. :-) Why the hell would they not pursue some sort of compensation? You got your analogy all wrong. In this case, complexity is the customer, and Sony stole back a TV after it was already bought. "Goodwill" doesn't apply to this situation. The money they can get out of this does stand in no relation to the effort and trouble they would have to go through, because I'm pretty sure if they want to have money from Millenium they would need to go and take this to court... which is way too much of a hassle to even start it. Also, it would probably cost them more than get them something :o That's definitely true. If they go to court, however, it's not the desire for money that's doing it. It's the desire to keep other teams/players from doing this to them constantly. And frankly, even the fact that they force Stephano/Millenium to spend money/time defending themselves in court accomplishes that goal, win or lose the case itself.
I get what you are saying. I think both coL and Mil want eSports to rise so I'm not sure what exactly the right action is. Make eSports more serious, more professional and takes it to the court OR just quit it and don't waste eSports money on something like that.
I will quit the discussion here as it will not lead to anything. We both understand each others point of view, but I think we might have different opinions about it^^!
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On September 20 2011 03:09 gulati wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 03:07 Otolia wrote:On September 20 2011 03:02 mki wrote:
Usually the organization states which country the contract is in. If not it's a poorly written contract. I'd imagine coL uses United States (California) law. At most, coL could force Stephano to be arrested in the US for whatever law there is. In Europe, he is virtually untouchable because the french law applies to all french citizen and inhabitants and it's above everything else except the EU Court and the EU parlament. You can rest assured that no professional gaming organization with corporate sponsors and a supremely large fanbase will ever arrest a player. That is corporate suicide; no player wants to be strong-armed - it's the companies that will be fighting over legal work. The player is whom they are fighting over, so he should not be harmed.
Breaking a contract is not a criminal offense that would warrant arrest. (Well, unless you happen to take a broad reading of what the Computer Abuse Act says but even that is getting fixed via a Senate bill introduced recently - but that's a total aside). Choice of law is sometimes a complex field so without seeing the contract, I wouldn't venture an opinion on it (and I would recommend that no one else can, either, without seeing the contract - I am a lawyer although this does not constitute legal advice).
I am curious to see what coL can do though - as far as I know, this might prove interesting in figuring out how one calculates expected value / damages from a player signing.
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You can rest assured that no professional gaming organization with corporate sponsors and a supremely large fanbase will ever arrest a player.
LOL.
That's the most hilarious thing I've ever pictured in my head.
Imagine Sir Scoots or Hotbid cuffing some nerd baller. 
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http://www.ufe.org/etudiants/le-contrat-de-travail-international
Si vous êtes un salarié de nationalité française, la compétence sera donnée au tribunal français même si le contrat est conclu et exécuté à l'étranger.
Translation:
If you are working for a foreign company and you are french, only a french court is able to legislate.
And according to the french law, Stephano had one month to make up his mind.
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Just to make sure I read things correctly, he has officially signed the contract with Complexity, but only agreed to terms with millennium? If this is the case, then a contract is legally binding and all parties must honor that contract. I guess we'll let the courts decide for sure...but somebody let me know if I am misunderstanding something here.
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Wonder at what page this ends up to be blamed on IdrA? Around page 50 I would guess :D
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This entire situation is a complete mess. No matter what either side does from this point on, all parties look extremely unprofessional and will feel the effects of negative PR. Similarly, crap like this reflects poorly on eSports as a whole.
I mostly feel bad for complexity.. it would appear, from preliminary data, that they are the victims in this situation. It's going to make them look bad to seek legal action, but they really don't have a choice. Like one of the previous posters said, teams need to respect contract law.
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Well... it eventually had to happen. We could almost taste it when Huk joined EG.
To be fair, it's the best proof that e-sport is healthier than ever and continuing to grow.
Two teams fighting over a player? That's a dream come true! Now professional gamers can just wait until the last team stands with the best offer
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I support Col 100% in this matter
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On September 20 2011 03:42 5ukkub wrote:Well... it eventually had to happen. We could almost taste it when Huk joined EG. To be fair, it's the best proof that e-sport is healthier than ever and continuing to grow. Two teams fighting over a player? That's a dream come true! Now professional gamers can just wait until the last team stands with the best offer
What? HuK joining EG was probably the cleanest player transfer ever to be made.
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I'm sososo confused. And i'm not going to try and guess what it is going to happen/could happen either.
I'll wait for the next press releases before i draw a true opinion.
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On September 20 2011 03:34 mTw|NarutO wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 03:26 aristarchus wrote:On September 20 2011 03:21 mTw|NarutO wrote:On September 20 2011 03:18 Rubber wrote:On September 20 2011 03:12 mTw|NarutO wrote:On September 20 2011 03:09 DoomsVille wrote:On September 20 2011 03:05 mTw|NarutO wrote:
Not taking any side here, but I think backing off from a contract within 14 days even without explanation is valid and even if it would not be the case, the best thing coL could probably do is just accept the wishes of Stephano and let him stay at Millenium because the last thing you want is 'forcing' a player to your team if he doesn't actually want it.
I could understand that they want him to keep his word and stay to what he signed, but in my opinion it would be better to accept that he changed his mind and let him stay at M.
However it goes, glhf. Both teams are great. I sincerely doubt Complexity has any intention of forcing a player to play for them. They certainly didn't force Destiny to. Legal action on their part will probably seek some form of compensation for a broken contract with complexity. And they should be justified in seeking it if Stephano/Mill are in fact breaking a contract with them (which appears to be the case). I didn't say they will, I said they shouldn't ;-)! I was not saying they are planning to. In my opinion they should not take any action at all as a gesture of goodwill. Kind of like Sony repairing your TV if it breaks 1 day after the warranty expires etc. :-) Why the hell would they not pursue some sort of compensation? You got your analogy all wrong. In this case, complexity is the customer, and Sony stole back a TV after it was already bought. "Goodwill" doesn't apply to this situation. The money they can get out of this does stand in no relation to the effort and trouble they would have to go through, because I'm pretty sure if they want to have money from Millenium they would need to go and take this to court... which is way too much of a hassle to even start it. Also, it would probably cost them more than get them something :o That's definitely true. If they go to court, however, it's not the desire for money that's doing it. It's the desire to keep other teams/players from doing this to them constantly. And frankly, even the fact that they force Stephano/Millenium to spend money/time defending themselves in court accomplishes that goal, win or lose the case itself. I get what you are saying. I think both coL and Mil want eSports to rise so I'm not sure what exactly the right action is. Make eSports more serious, more professional and takes it to the court OR just quit it and don't waste eSports money on something like that. I will quit the discussion here as it will not lead to anything. We both understand each others point of view, but I think we might have different opinions about it^^!
Probably the best resolution would be Millennium compensating Complexity in some way. Both organizations save face and esports contracts are upheld.
Anything else is going to have serious ramifications.
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LOL, nope!, Chuck Testa !
User was warned for this post
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If the teams dont come to an agreement (probably over compensation rather than Stephano playing for coL), they might be able to stop Stephano from playing in the US. Cease and desist type of thing. And even if not, then I could see MLG/IPL disqualifying Stephano basically since they want eSports to have professional and reliable contracts.
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On September 20 2011 03:43 ellirc wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 03:42 5ukkub wrote:Well... it eventually had to happen. We could almost taste it when Huk joined EG. To be fair, it's the best proof that e-sport is healthier than ever and continuing to grow. Two teams fighting over a player? That's a dream come true! Now professional gamers can just wait until the last team stands with the best offer What? HuK joining EG was probably the cleanest player transfer ever to be made.
You could almost "touch the drama cloud" while reading the mysterious announcment of an announcment thread 
And the comments of fans and even those affiliated with TL team made my room tremble, like from hordes of drummers constantly playing this thrilling tone over and over again... That's how i felt then and now it comes again
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On September 20 2011 03:50 5ukkub wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 03:43 ellirc wrote:On September 20 2011 03:42 5ukkub wrote:Well... it eventually had to happen. We could almost taste it when Huk joined EG. To be fair, it's the best proof that e-sport is healthier than ever and continuing to grow. Two teams fighting over a player? That's a dream come true! Now professional gamers can just wait until the last team stands with the best offer What? HuK joining EG was probably the cleanest player transfer ever to be made. You could almost "touch the drama cloud" while reading the mysterious announcment of an announcment thread And the comments of fans and even those affiliated with TL team made my room tremble, like from hordes of drummers constantly playing this thrilling tone over and over again... That's how i felt then and now it comes again
What the hell are you talking about
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On September 20 2011 02:46 jlake02 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 20 2011 02:43 Agathon wrote:On September 20 2011 02:41 Sandro wrote:
Oh my god did that just seriously happen? Yeah ! I think CoL made the annoucement a bit soon  We have a fully executed (signed) contract, so there was no early announcement.
So you have had overnight a contract signed on real paper and sent to you ?
If not it is not legal in France, and according to the French law you have to put in the contract a probationary period (don't remember the exact modalities) during which eqch side can break the contract.
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On September 20 2011 03:00 jlake02 wrote:
For Mr. Page to insinuate we improperly "disoriented" a young player is an outright lie. We have spent weeks negotiating with Stephano and countering offers made by Millennium. This was no quick pressure situation.
We will take a step back and analyze the situation but I hope Millennium honors the rule of contract law and does not disrespect it in eSports. Doing so would set a precedent that would undermine all we are collectively trying to accomplish.
We will evaluate our options but I do not see a way we can allow this blatant disrespect for the contractual process to go unanswered. We will be contacting legal counsel in France and investigating courses of action.
Class act. Jason Lake 2012.
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EPT
