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On September 09 2011 12:08 Torte de Lini wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 12:04 matjlav wrote:On September 09 2011 12:03 Torte de Lini wrote:On September 09 2011 12:01 RockIronrod wrote:On September 09 2011 11:59 Torte de Lini wrote:
In the end, tough luck. It's my child and I get to decide if he gets a circumcised penis or not.
Selfish? You bet?
Bullshit? Uh-huh.
Completely repulsive? Ask his future girlfriend(s)
Unfair? Ha, maybe.
Bad parenting? Yes, let's define the entirety of my potential in parenting based on a decision I took away from a barely conscious child.
I'm sure every one of you hate seeing your penis have a head. ):
I gave my rationale, even from the outer perspective its irrational, but I don't care, neither will the child (very likely) and nor will the world because no one will see it (in some rare occasion, they will). You know those rednecks who give their baby's tattoos or piercings and everyone is disgusted by them? You're unabashedly one of those now. Congratulations, here's your complimentary Insane Clown Posse shirt and "Half-dicked baby on board" car sticker. Thank you. I'm glad you're able to label someone based on one dimension of their decisions or views. You've done very well being equally as understanding as they very person you're bashing. Just because there is more than that one aspect to your parenting philosophy, that does not mean that this one given aspect is not incredibly stupid. It's like how I think it's incredibly wrong and stupid to bring children up believing that there's a God who will send them to Hell if they don't believe in him. I still know plenty of people who do that and are otherwise great parents. People have flaws. It's people who recognize these flaws and say "Yeah, I know it's a flaw, but fuck it" that I don't understand. Especially when that flaw is affecting other people around you. The flaw is minor in the grand scheme of things. You guys exaggerate and distort it heavily with general descriptions! YOURE CUTTING OFF A PART OF HIS PENIS Yeah, foreskin that plays no actual or significant role in the function of the body YOURE SO SHALLOW FOR DOING IT FOR COSMETIC REASON etc etc etc
Yes, it's minor in the grand scheme of things. It's still a flaw. Why not correct it when this correction takes absolutely no effort on your part?
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On September 09 2011 12:08 Torte de Lini wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 12:04 matjlav wrote:On September 09 2011 12:03 Torte de Lini wrote:On September 09 2011 12:01 RockIronrod wrote:On September 09 2011 11:59 Torte de Lini wrote:
In the end, tough luck. It's my child and I get to decide if he gets a circumcised penis or not.
Selfish? You bet?
Bullshit? Uh-huh.
Completely repulsive? Ask his future girlfriend(s)
Unfair? Ha, maybe.
Bad parenting? Yes, let's define the entirety of my potential in parenting based on a decision I took away from a barely conscious child.
I'm sure every one of you hate seeing your penis have a head. ):
I gave my rationale, even from the outer perspective its irrational, but I don't care, neither will the child (very likely) and nor will the world because no one will see it (in some rare occasion, they will). You know those rednecks who give their baby's tattoos or piercings and everyone is disgusted by them? You're unabashedly one of those now. Congratulations, here's your complimentary Insane Clown Posse shirt and "Half-dicked baby on board" car sticker. Thank you. I'm glad you're able to label someone based on one dimension of their decisions or views. You've done very well being equally as understanding as they very person you're bashing. Just because there is more than that one aspect to your parenting philosophy, that does not mean that this one given aspect is not incredibly stupid. It's like how I think it's incredibly wrong and stupid to bring children up believing that there's a God who will send them to Hell if they don't believe in him. I still know plenty of people who do that and are otherwise great parents. People have flaws. It's people who recognize these flaws and say "Yeah, I know it's a flaw, but fuck it" that I don't understand. Especially when that flaw is affecting other people around you. The flaw is minor in the grand scheme of things. You guys exaggerate and distort it heavily with general descriptions! YOURE CUTTING OFF A PART OF HIS PENIS Yeah, foreskin that plays no actual or significant role in the function of the body YOURE SO SHALLOW FOR DOING IT FOR COSMETIC REASON etc etc etc
You're doing a potentially dangerous surgery for no reason on a "useless" body part (something very wrong by the way), because fuck it why not? If it's perfectly fine beforehand, why not cut it off and open up an array of potential horrors?
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On September 09 2011 12:09 matjlav wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 12:08 BigLighthouse wrote:On September 09 2011 12:02 gogogadgetflow wrote:
I'm cut but not for religious reasons.
So after doing some research I found out that based on the preponderance of the evidence both for and against, no esteemed health organization in the world suggests routine infant circumcision. Even in the socially conservative, mostly-circumcised US, the American Pediatric Association did not come out in favor of circumcision.
With that in mind I decided that I would let my kid decide for himself if and when he wanted what basically amounts to genital cosmetic surgery.
My girlfriend is appalled, however. She said she would not find my cock nearly as sexy uncircumcised (insult or flattery?), and that she would in fact have been very shocked and halfway disgusted to find an uncircumcised one. In short, she wants her kid to look 'normal' like me.
Now I have to re-evaluate my position: if the health pros/cons are even, can I make a cosmetic decision for my kid? I still lean to no. I think what you do is slap your gf for being such a shallow idiot really haha! I mean halfway disgusted?? Jesus im never ever ever going near an american girl if they freak out over this kind of stuff. Seriously. Do you really want your son dating vapid bitches who will dump him because of his non-mutilation?
I dont think you meant to quote me
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I wouldn't consider it a flaw, I'd consider it a -- in my case -- medical decision.
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On September 09 2011 12:09 matjlav wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 12:08 Torte de Lini wrote:On September 09 2011 12:04 matjlav wrote:On September 09 2011 12:03 Torte de Lini wrote:On September 09 2011 12:01 RockIronrod wrote:On September 09 2011 11:59 Torte de Lini wrote:
In the end, tough luck. It's my child and I get to decide if he gets a circumcised penis or not.
Selfish? You bet?
Bullshit? Uh-huh.
Completely repulsive? Ask his future girlfriend(s)
Unfair? Ha, maybe.
Bad parenting? Yes, let's define the entirety of my potential in parenting based on a decision I took away from a barely conscious child.
I'm sure every one of you hate seeing your penis have a head. ):
I gave my rationale, even from the outer perspective its irrational, but I don't care, neither will the child (very likely) and nor will the world because no one will see it (in some rare occasion, they will). You know those rednecks who give their baby's tattoos or piercings and everyone is disgusted by them? You're unabashedly one of those now. Congratulations, here's your complimentary Insane Clown Posse shirt and "Half-dicked baby on board" car sticker. Thank you. I'm glad you're able to label someone based on one dimension of their decisions or views. You've done very well being equally as understanding as they very person you're bashing. Just because there is more than that one aspect to your parenting philosophy, that does not mean that this one given aspect is not incredibly stupid. It's like how I think it's incredibly wrong and stupid to bring children up believing that there's a God who will send them to Hell if they don't believe in him. I still know plenty of people who do that and are otherwise great parents. People have flaws. It's people who recognize these flaws and say "Yeah, I know it's a flaw, but fuck it" that I don't understand. Especially when that flaw is affecting other people around you. The flaw is minor in the grand scheme of things. You guys exaggerate and distort it heavily with general descriptions! YOURE CUTTING OFF A PART OF HIS PENIS Yeah, foreskin that plays no actual or significant role in the function of the body YOURE SO SHALLOW FOR DOING IT FOR COSMETIC REASON etc etc etc Yes, it's minor in the grand scheme of things. It's still a flaw. Why not correct it when this correction takes absolutely no effort on your part?
Because I don't feel it'll be a problem for the child.
I'm trying to really hard to see where a child might be bothered.
That we made a decision for him? Yeah, so? We do that for a lot of things?
That we took away a part of his penis? I have mine taken away too. It's also a part he's never seen or recognized as significant to be troubled over.
That our intentions do not reflect his own? Mm, yes. This is true, but we had good intentions and given the above, I don't see why he'd throw a fit or tantrum.
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On September 09 2011 12:11 BigLighthouse wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 12:09 matjlav wrote:On September 09 2011 12:08 BigLighthouse wrote:On September 09 2011 12:02 gogogadgetflow wrote:
I'm cut but not for religious reasons.
So after doing some research I found out that based on the preponderance of the evidence both for and against, no esteemed health organization in the world suggests routine infant circumcision. Even in the socially conservative, mostly-circumcised US, the American Pediatric Association did not come out in favor of circumcision.
With that in mind I decided that I would let my kid decide for himself if and when he wanted what basically amounts to genital cosmetic surgery.
My girlfriend is appalled, however. She said she would not find my cock nearly as sexy uncircumcised (insult or flattery?), and that she would in fact have been very shocked and halfway disgusted to find an uncircumcised one. In short, she wants her kid to look 'normal' like me.
Now I have to re-evaluate my position: if the health pros/cons are even, can I make a cosmetic decision for my kid? I still lean to no. I think what you do is slap your gf for being such a shallow idiot really haha! I mean halfway disgusted?? Jesus im never ever ever going near an american girl if they freak out over this kind of stuff. Seriously. Do you really want your son dating vapid bitches who will dump him because of his non-mutilation? I dont think you meant to quote me
I did; I was agreeing with you.
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On September 09 2011 12:12 matjlav wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 12:11 BigLighthouse wrote:On September 09 2011 12:09 matjlav wrote:On September 09 2011 12:08 BigLighthouse wrote:On September 09 2011 12:02 gogogadgetflow wrote:
I'm cut but not for religious reasons.
So after doing some research I found out that based on the preponderance of the evidence both for and against, no esteemed health organization in the world suggests routine infant circumcision. Even in the socially conservative, mostly-circumcised US, the American Pediatric Association did not come out in favor of circumcision.
With that in mind I decided that I would let my kid decide for himself if and when he wanted what basically amounts to genital cosmetic surgery.
My girlfriend is appalled, however. She said she would not find my cock nearly as sexy uncircumcised (insult or flattery?), and that she would in fact have been very shocked and halfway disgusted to find an uncircumcised one. In short, she wants her kid to look 'normal' like me.
Now I have to re-evaluate my position: if the health pros/cons are even, can I make a cosmetic decision for my kid? I still lean to no. I think what you do is slap your gf for being such a shallow idiot really haha! I mean halfway disgusted?? Jesus im never ever ever going near an american girl if they freak out over this kind of stuff. Seriously. Do you really want your son dating vapid bitches who will dump him because of his non-mutilation? I dont think you meant to quote me I did; I was agreeing with you.
Then colour me an idiot
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You guys take discussion up and beyond serious o_____o!
As if anything said here is a permanent decision.
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On September 09 2011 12:08 BigLighthouse wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 12:02 gogogadgetflow wrote:
I'm cut but not for religious reasons.
So after doing some research I found out that based on the preponderance of the evidence both for and against, no esteemed health organization in the world suggests routine infant circumcision. Even in the socially conservative, mostly-circumcised US, the American Pediatric Association did not come out in favor of circumcision.
With that in mind I decided that I would let my kid decide for himself if and when he wanted what basically amounts to genital cosmetic surgery.
My girlfriend is appalled, however. She said she would not find my cock nearly as sexy uncircumcised (insult or flattery?), and that she would in fact have been very shocked and halfway disgusted to find an uncircumcised one. In short, she wants her kid to look 'normal' like me.
Now I have to re-evaluate my position: if the health pros/cons are even, can I make a cosmetic decision for my kid? I still lean to no. I think what you do is slap your gf for being such a shallow idiot really haha! I mean halfway disgusted?? Jesus im never ever ever going near an american girl if they freak out over this kind of stuff.
I admit I hyperbolised here :/ . The fact is though, that to people who are used to cut dicks, uncut dicks look funny and foreign and not at all sexy. Does it make me shallow to be disgusted by uncut dicks, because I am. I can't help it, just like I can't help being disgusted by the thought of gay sex. Maybe I'm shallow like most americans to think cut dicks look better, but we do.
I'd have to live with the decision of making my kid look odd to not only his future partners, but possibly himself as well. How do I reconcile that?
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On September 09 2011 12:12 Torte de Lini wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 12:09 matjlav wrote:On September 09 2011 12:08 Torte de Lini wrote:On September 09 2011 12:04 matjlav wrote:On September 09 2011 12:03 Torte de Lini wrote:On September 09 2011 12:01 RockIronrod wrote:On September 09 2011 11:59 Torte de Lini wrote:
In the end, tough luck. It's my child and I get to decide if he gets a circumcised penis or not.
Selfish? You bet?
Bullshit? Uh-huh.
Completely repulsive? Ask his future girlfriend(s)
Unfair? Ha, maybe.
Bad parenting? Yes, let's define the entirety of my potential in parenting based on a decision I took away from a barely conscious child.
I'm sure every one of you hate seeing your penis have a head. ):
I gave my rationale, even from the outer perspective its irrational, but I don't care, neither will the child (very likely) and nor will the world because no one will see it (in some rare occasion, they will). You know those rednecks who give their baby's tattoos or piercings and everyone is disgusted by them? You're unabashedly one of those now. Congratulations, here's your complimentary Insane Clown Posse shirt and "Half-dicked baby on board" car sticker. Thank you. I'm glad you're able to label someone based on one dimension of their decisions or views. You've done very well being equally as understanding as they very person you're bashing. Just because there is more than that one aspect to your parenting philosophy, that does not mean that this one given aspect is not incredibly stupid. It's like how I think it's incredibly wrong and stupid to bring children up believing that there's a God who will send them to Hell if they don't believe in him. I still know plenty of people who do that and are otherwise great parents. People have flaws. It's people who recognize these flaws and say "Yeah, I know it's a flaw, but fuck it" that I don't understand. Especially when that flaw is affecting other people around you. The flaw is minor in the grand scheme of things. You guys exaggerate and distort it heavily with general descriptions! YOURE CUTTING OFF A PART OF HIS PENIS Yeah, foreskin that plays no actual or significant role in the function of the body YOURE SO SHALLOW FOR DOING IT FOR COSMETIC REASON etc etc etc Yes, it's minor in the grand scheme of things. It's still a flaw. Why not correct it when this correction takes absolutely no effort on your part? Because I don't feel it'll be a problem for the child. I'm trying to really hard to see where a child might be bothered. That we made a decision for him? Yeah, so? We do that for a lot of things? That we took away a part of his penis? I have mine taken away too. It's also a part he's never seen or recognized as significant to be troubled over. That our intentions do not reflect his own? Mm, yes. This is true, but we had good intentions and given the above, I don't see why he'd throw a fit or tantrum.
If a deaf guy forces his son to be deaf at birth, who cares, he could never hear anyway.
Also, good intentions? What? I don't see any intentions other then "i think its better" and "THAT RELIGION I DON'T CARE ABOUT BUT DO CARE ABOUT TOLD ME TO"
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Woah. I had no idea people would really get this upset over this discussion. I always assumed it as one of those "who really gives a shit" choices that parents make.
On September 09 2011 12:08 MagicGunner wrote:
I guess I'm what you'd call a skin head.
LOL
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[QUOTE]On September 09 2011 12:01 matjlav wrote:
[QUOTE]
In the end, tough luck. It's my daughter and I get to decide if she gets her clit removed or not.
I really don't understand how you can say, "Yeah, I'm wrong, but I don't care." [/QUOTE]
I do find it amusing how it's perfectly acceptable, even demanded of by many women, to mutilate young boys without their consent just so it looks good to them and they experience less pleasure, but any time female circumcision is mentioned for any reason, it's a terrible crime. Some people find that it looks better and like the idea of women receiving less pleasure as well, but people don't let that argument pass if it's a girl.
My personal opinion is that if it's not necessary for medical reasons, it's child abuse and a human rights issue. I understand the idea in less civilised times. But today, we have these things called showers. Just take care of it and avoid such barbaric mutilation.
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On September 09 2011 12:13 gogogadgetflow wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 12:08 BigLighthouse wrote:On September 09 2011 12:02 gogogadgetflow wrote:
I'm cut but not for religious reasons.
So after doing some research I found out that based on the preponderance of the evidence both for and against, no esteemed health organization in the world suggests routine infant circumcision. Even in the socially conservative, mostly-circumcised US, the American Pediatric Association did not come out in favor of circumcision.
With that in mind I decided that I would let my kid decide for himself if and when he wanted what basically amounts to genital cosmetic surgery.
My girlfriend is appalled, however. She said she would not find my cock nearly as sexy uncircumcised (insult or flattery?), and that she would in fact have been very shocked and halfway disgusted to find an uncircumcised one. In short, she wants her kid to look 'normal' like me.
Now I have to re-evaluate my position: if the health pros/cons are even, can I make a cosmetic decision for my kid? I still lean to no. I think what you do is slap your gf for being such a shallow idiot really haha! I mean halfway disgusted?? Jesus im never ever ever going near an american girl if they freak out over this kind of stuff. I admit I hyperbolised here :/ . The fact is though, that to people who are used to cut dicks, uncut dicks look funny and foreign and not at all sexy. Does it make me shallow to be disgusted by uncut dicks, because I am. I can't help it, just like I can't help being disgusted by the thought of gay sex. Maybe I'm shallow like most americans to think cut dicks look better, but we do. I'd have to live with the decision of making my kid look odd to not only his future partners, but possibly himself as well. How do I reconcile that?
The only way you would be making him anything is by taking the decision into your own hands. If he dont like it he can damn well change it himself. If he's more than fine with it, then theres no reason you'd need to reconcile anything.
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On September 09 2011 12:11 Cedstick wrote:
I wouldn't consider it a flaw, I'd consider it a -- in my case -- medical decision.
Quick, chop out the kid's appendix, doesn't serve any real purpose and could cause health complications down the road.
Yeah, there are medical justifications for it. But when else do people perform permanent disfigurements as a pre-emptive medical procedure? If the foreskin is causing some problem, by all means, remove it. I still haven't seen any rational reason why it should happen otherwise in the developed world.
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It's not shallow to find something unappealing. If the penis is sexually unappealing, some women won't have sex.
Yes, morally, they should have sex because they love the person. But removing the entire aesthetic interest or desire in love-making is ridiculous. There needs to be a physical attractiveness or acceptance on both parts.
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On September 09 2011 12:12 Torte de Lini wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 12:09 matjlav wrote:On September 09 2011 12:08 Torte de Lini wrote:On September 09 2011 12:04 matjlav wrote:On September 09 2011 12:03 Torte de Lini wrote:On September 09 2011 12:01 RockIronrod wrote:On September 09 2011 11:59 Torte de Lini wrote:
In the end, tough luck. It's my child and I get to decide if he gets a circumcised penis or not.
Selfish? You bet?
Bullshit? Uh-huh.
Completely repulsive? Ask his future girlfriend(s)
Unfair? Ha, maybe.
Bad parenting? Yes, let's define the entirety of my potential in parenting based on a decision I took away from a barely conscious child.
I'm sure every one of you hate seeing your penis have a head. ):
I gave my rationale, even from the outer perspective its irrational, but I don't care, neither will the child (very likely) and nor will the world because no one will see it (in some rare occasion, they will). You know those rednecks who give their baby's tattoos or piercings and everyone is disgusted by them? You're unabashedly one of those now. Congratulations, here's your complimentary Insane Clown Posse shirt and "Half-dicked baby on board" car sticker. Thank you. I'm glad you're able to label someone based on one dimension of their decisions or views. You've done very well being equally as understanding as they very person you're bashing. Just because there is more than that one aspect to your parenting philosophy, that does not mean that this one given aspect is not incredibly stupid. It's like how I think it's incredibly wrong and stupid to bring children up believing that there's a God who will send them to Hell if they don't believe in him. I still know plenty of people who do that and are otherwise great parents. People have flaws. It's people who recognize these flaws and say "Yeah, I know it's a flaw, but fuck it" that I don't understand. Especially when that flaw is affecting other people around you. The flaw is minor in the grand scheme of things. You guys exaggerate and distort it heavily with general descriptions! YOURE CUTTING OFF A PART OF HIS PENIS Yeah, foreskin that plays no actual or significant role in the function of the body YOURE SO SHALLOW FOR DOING IT FOR COSMETIC REASON etc etc etc Yes, it's minor in the grand scheme of things. It's still a flaw. Why not correct it when this correction takes absolutely no effort on your part? Because I don't feel it'll be a problem for the child. I'm trying to really hard to see where a child might be bothered. That we made a decision for him? Yeah, so? We do that for a lot of things? That we took away a part of his penis? I have mine taken away too. It's also a part he's never seen or recognized as significant to be troubled over. That our intentions do not reflect his own? Mm, yes. This is true, but we had good intentions and given the above, I don't see why he'd throw a fit or tantrum.
He's GOING to have the internet, if he ever hears about what was done to him and reads the studies on desensitivity then he'll probably be pretty pissed off. By the way the foreskin has thousands of nerve endings that all contribute to the pleasure of sex so your argument that it is useless is void.
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On September 09 2011 12:15 Harrow wrote:Show nested quote +On September 09 2011 12:11 Cedstick wrote:
I wouldn't consider it a flaw, I'd consider it a -- in my case -- medical decision. Quick, chop out the kid's appendix, doesn't serve any real purpose and could cause health complications down the road. Yeah, there are medical justifications for it. But when else do people perform permanent disfigurements as a pre-emptive medical procedure? If the foreskin is causing some problem, by all means, remove it. I still haven't seen any rational reason why it should happen otherwise in the developed world.
Appendix has no religious significance.
Has no aesthetic change if removed.
Has no traditional sense established.
Costs a lot, achieves nothing if removed.
If you can prevent the foreskin causing problems, why not do it before-hand when the child cannot retain the memory or the potential (if any) pain.
It's hypothetical, not my stance (or is it?)
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On September 09 2011 12:15 Torte de Lini wrote:
It's not shallow to find something unappealing. If the penis is sexually unappealing, some women won't have sex.
Yes, morally, they should have sex because they love the person. But removing the entire aesthetic interest or desire in love-making is ridiculous. There needs to be a physical attractiveness or acceptance on both parts.
DICKS LOOK THE SAME ERECT REGARDLESS
With an erection the foreskin retracts and is hidden mostly by the head. The most difference you'll get is a slight ring around the head.
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are you kidding me? 20 pages in less than 5 hours for a circumcision thread on TL?
for what it's worth, uncut is a pretty big deal in the gay community tons of guys go crazy for it
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what purpose was this thread created for out of curiosity? to sway people towards contempt for circumcision? you already stated in the OP that its basically a cultural practice, who exactly are you to say what a culture should do?
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EPT
