DTs are one of the best units in the game, lol. They are so unbelievably good lategame, vs zerg especially. Early game DT builds or 2base dt drops vs terran are also incredibly strong. If you think DTs are "worthless" then you're doing it wrong, basically.

Badfatpanda

United States9719 Posts

June 19 2011 10:34 GMT

#62

On June 19 2011 17:04 ROOTFayth wrote:
I disagree

This. Despite the high costs cloak pushes the opponent to get detection, whether static or unit oriented and a late game cloaked tech switch can catch any skill of player off guard. After sniping overseers and observers cloaked ghosts make a HUGE impact tvz and tvp, the extra control you are allowed to have over your snipes and emps can make a massive difference in the game outcome.

FeyFey

Germany10114 Posts

June 19 2011 10:35 GMT

#63

well concerning early dts, they are damn common at some regions in the ladder, so people are prepared for them even if you don't get them.
Other then that not using dts as i prefer warp prism harass (cheaper + more effectiv).
But i like cloaked banshees (getting cloak only lategame though) and ghosts or burrow

DarQraven

Netherlands553 Posts

June 19 2011 10:40 GMT

#64

The only time I really believe in DT's is when using them as a means to contain a player so I can expand, for instance a DT expand in PvT. If they happen to be doing a build without sufficient detection, I can power through can commit to the harassment.
The map control they can give you is amazing.

However, I don't buy the "you force him to get detection" argument. At its cheapest, and assuming you've already got Twilight Council, you spend 375 gas just to get one DT out on the field, and 125 for each successive one. You really need multiple to be able to do anything at all.

In turn, that DT might force several spore crawlers ... which cost only minerals. 75 (125 if you include the cost of the drone) for Zerg, or 100 for Terran. Even if you force 5 turrets/spores in that one base - which is a gross overreaction - you're exchanging 625/500 minerals for 375 gas. In this case, gas is a lot more valuable resource, especially as Protoss.

With this in mind, I firmly believe that if you get DT's and fail to do any gas-intensive damage with them, you are behind. You really just need to take out a tech structure or addon or something, else you're wasting one of your most precious resources to force Terran to waste their most plentiful one.

Lategame is a different story, of course. The purpose of DT's shifts from trying to catch a player without detection to trying to get a player to make mistakes in multitasking. The investment of a Shrine and several DT's, even if you don't get any gas damage done, is well worth it to make an opponent have to defend 3-4 locations at once.

Disquiet

Australia628 Posts

June 19 2011 10:48 GMT

#65

I actually think cloaked units are very nicely balanced in starcraft 2. You can pay to be completely safe from them but its a trade-off with having a smaller army or economy. If you tech to cloaked units and you don't do any damage, you are behind so, both options are risky. What usually happens is a middle ground where players will get minimal detection like 1 turret or try just rely on scans or morphing in an overseer in time. Then its a micro/anticipation battle to see if the harasser can get around the detection and do damage while the defender hurries to shore up any holes in his detection because they skimped in favor of economy. Result is nice, cloaked units are viable but not overpowered.

alepov

Netherlands1132 Posts

June 19 2011 10:57 GMT

#66

it's the most annoying thing ever to play vs someone who controls his cloaked units properly.

Xahhk

Canada540 Posts

June 19 2011 11:08 GMT

#67

Think of it this way, getting DTs for instance require the zerg player lets say to be even more wary of overseer control and map awareness-it taxes him mentally to have another thing to worry about.

tuestresfat

2555 Posts

June 19 2011 11:17 GMT

#68

On June 19 2011 18:45 Blackspell wrote:

Show nested quote +

God for fucks sake why is the thread dumb? I didn't put it in the strategy section for a reason, I corrected myself for making a couple stupid statements. I'm a still learning player who turned to the forums to understand how to use cloaked units better. Give me a break!

Well look at the type of responses you are getting and tell me it's not a dumb thread.

Yes, perhaps you're just seeking advice, trying to improve your play. If that is the case, you should be more cautious on how you choose to express yourself because most people just think you're a troll. That's why nobody has offered you specific, applicable, or useful information. It has more or less been: "No. You're wrong I disagree completely.", "Dt's are cool yo". We don't say more than that because we feel you're just wasting our time.

DRAM

United Kingdom33 Posts

June 19 2011 11:25 GMT

#69

A recent game I played had wonderful DT harass. A single pylon was placed just so the outer edges of its ring touched into a part of my base. 2 DT's quick warped in bypassing my front defended by my cannon straight into my mineral line. By the time I had detection and had warped in units to take them out I had lost the game.

sjschmidt93

United States2518 Posts

June 19 2011 11:28 GMT

#70

Mid-game DTs are awful. Early game and late game DTs... they kick ass against all races. Just warping in 1 DT and sending 1 to every base is awesome. Also forcing terran's to scan is very useful.

Zealot/dt/ht drops are so good late game vT and vZ.

oblong

United States86 Posts

June 19 2011 11:39 GMT

#71

yeah, ur not right.

Probe1

United States17920 Posts

June 19 2011 12:01 GMT

#72

All time time (I play zerg. Burrow can be equated to cloak). Moving burrowed infestors into mineral lines, baneling land mines every match against terran, burrowed tunnel roaches against everyone. Cloaked units are great.

Except the multitudes of cloaked banshees and DTs used against me. Rarely a cloaked ghost though.

GLLvz

Norway122 Posts

June 19 2011 12:18 GMT

#73

Lategame depending on what i see i use it in all matchup, i also use it as a cheesy opener or as something to keep my opponent in his base for a while to secure a Risky expand where i cant afford him to move out.

so, id say Enough

awwnuts07

United States621 Posts

June 19 2011 13:54 GMT

#74

I've stopped using DT openers because they are sooooo damn expensive, but I do use them in the mid/late game because my opponent is so spread out.

Samuel Neptune

United States95 Posts

June 19 2011 13:57 GMT

#75

if i had cloaked units i would use them whenever standard play seemed insufficient

dartoo

India2889 Posts

June 19 2011 14:04 GMT

#76

Dts are my favortite units. The number of times they've saved me from certain defeat :D

My goto build against protoss is dt rush, I use them for mid game harass against terran, along with the warp prism(not a big fan of colossi,prefer templars). And dts against zerg are so awesome, especially you send one to an expansion, while you pressure, and forget about him, and suddenly he's like boss..there's nothing left to kill here.

And for terrans, builds taht use the banshee are the ones that I have a lot of problems with. Especially late game they are kinda tough to deal with, because you need to storm them or have some air(when in mass).

Firesilver

United Kingdom1190 Posts

June 19 2011 14:15 GMT

#77

Those few games just played at Dreamhack by WhiteRa really showed how powerful DTs can be, even keeping them passively around the map causes lots of scans and overall delays Terran's economy.

T0fuuu

Australia2275 Posts

June 19 2011 14:19 GMT

#78

Cloaked units arent a waste of minerals -__- they cost too much gas...

Benkestok

Denmark63 Posts

June 19 2011 14:27 GMT

#79

Honestly, if you dont see a use for cloaked units, it just means your not a good enough player yet. They are really strong, and if they dont work out for you, its cause your using them wrong.

epikAnglory

United States1120 Posts

June 20 2011 04:19 GMT

#80

On June 19 2011 19:24 Noocta wrote:
I wish zerg could have a unit to punish the lack of detection sometimes.

I miss Lurker rush. :<

I honestly, in every god damn way, hope you are not kidding.