For me its just a huge waste of minerals. I was playing around with some early DT builds tonight which only ended up with a fews loses. Ghosts aside It just seems that unless you're dimwitted at this point and don't throw down either a cannon or a turret or spawn an overseer, cloaked or burrowed units should be pretty much on the back burner.

Anyone care to disagree?

EDIT: I apologize if my OP was a little to frank or absurd. My statement is my own experience and I'm merely trying to understand how higher ranked players utilize cloaked units. I'm here to learn. Also I stand corrected in using the term dimwitted, It was out of place considering that players don't necessarily put down detection in early game.

ROOTFayth

Canada3351 Posts

June 19 2011 08:04 GMT

I disagree

NeXiLe

Canada262 Posts

June 19 2011 08:07 GMT

I realized while watching a stream earlier that I don't use dt's (or any sort of small harass) near enough. If you do it right, 1 turret or 1 cannon can save your probes but that's about it. People forget you can split a few dt's into different areas and it's no longer being dimwitted, it's being smart because you can't afford to cover your base in detectors. Seriously if there's a turret at the probe line, hit up some add-ons, stray marines or supply depots or anything ^^

kineSiS-

Korea (South)1068 Posts

June 19 2011 08:08 GMT

Then I guess the majority of the pro-gaming scene including the top players such as Losira are dimwits who don't know how to play?

Oh wait, am I being too rash?

There's a reason you're terrible with cloaked units, you lack the expertise, strategy, and mechanics in order to pull off a correctly planned harassment through cloaked units.

Also, have you ever heard of, although this is a BW reference, the Sair/DT build. When Bisu first came out with it (renovated it), he was considered the Revolutionist.

Cloaked units are terrible on their own, but a wonderful compliment to a well-built army and multitasking.

Also, I feel I won't devote any more time to this as a topic such as this was not given much thought before being posted and doesn't deserve thought-out responses. I hope you have an epiphany where you become cognizant of your blatant fallacy.

Ruscour

5233 Posts

June 19 2011 08:08 GMT

You don't use DTs (and Banshees, and to an extent burrowed Banelings) expecting to win the game, they are for harassment and map control. Let's say I go DTs against Zerg, I kill a few probes at his natural but he gets an overseer out quickly. That's not a wasted effort. He will now have to commit to Spore Crawlers at every base, which is indirect economic harassment. You can take out the Spore Crawlers while poking at a base, you can have DTs roaming around picking up reinforcements streaming in, taking Xel'Naga towers, and annoying bases which forces your opponent to respond or else he loses his workers.

You're thinking about it the wrong way. Cloaked units do not win you the game outright, they're like Mutas in that regard. They allow you to pressure and annoy your opponent, which indirectly forces mistakes.

EDIT: typo

Ulfsark

United States958 Posts

June 19 2011 08:09 GMT

Late game DTs are awesome once you can afford it, Send 1 to each base(vs any race) and you get way ahead if they forget detection.

Also DT drops are really good against terran, they are good to have in an army as well, most people don't notice if there are like 5-10 DTs in your army, and you can blink and snipe overseers.

MLG_Wiggin

United States767 Posts

June 19 2011 08:09 GMT

Also remember that cloaked units accomplish more then just the damage they deal. They force excess defense/detection, and grant map control.

sevia

United States954 Posts

June 19 2011 08:10 GMT

Cloaked units aren't only good in the early game. Late game PvZ and PvT for example, sending DTs to deny expansions and harass newly established ones is a great way to shut down their economy. It costs a lot to lay down static cloak defense at every mineral line, so just by the presence of cloaked units, you force your opponent to invest a lot of resources that could otherwise be going to their army or economy.

Blackspell

United States80 Posts

June 19 2011 08:10 GMT

I'm not only using cloaked units. Thats imbecilic. I'm merely suggesting that its hard to pull off an early DT harass.

Chicane

United States7875 Posts

June 19 2011 08:14 GMT

#10

On June 19 2011 17:02 Blackspell wrote:
For me its just a huge waste of minerals. I was playing around with some early DT builds tonight which only ended up with a fews loses. Ghosts aside It just seems that unless you're dimwitted at this point and don't throw down either a cannon or a turret or spawn an overseer, cloaked or burrowed units should be pretty much on the back burner.

Anyone care to disagree?

I don't get it. Clearly pro players use cloaked units, yet you managed to come to the conclusion that they suck based off a few games? Care to elaborate how you came to the conclusion?

EchoZ

Japan5041 Posts

June 19 2011 08:14 GMT

#11

I love DTs.

zhurai

United States5660 Posts

June 19 2011 08:14 GMT

#12

we zergs only have burrow here, and can't attack while burrowed nowadays

Blackspell

United States80 Posts

June 19 2011 08:14 GMT

#13

Also I'm a relatively new player so the thread is more or less to get some more experienced advice on how to properly utilize a cloaked unit.

NeXiLe

Canada262 Posts

June 19 2011 08:15 GMT

#14

On June 19 2011 17:10 Blackspell wrote:
I'm not only using cloaked units. Thats imbecilic. I'm merely suggesting that its hard to pull off an early DT harass.

Thread title is slightly misleading then imo :x

Teras

Great Britain103 Posts

June 19 2011 08:15 GMT

#15

In which matchup? DT's are brilliant against T early-mid game when you force them to sacrifice MULE's for scans, you can one shot SCV's that are building turrets and if you have your wits about you, you can dodge the scans pretty easily.

Late game any matchup they're brilliant for warping in 3 all rallied to different expos (there's a reason Zerg now build 1 spore and 1 spine in their mineral lines you know).

DT's are pretty situational but it seems you're purposefully shooting yourself in the foot if you aren't using them.

Blackspell

United States80 Posts

June 19 2011 08:15 GMT

#16

On June 19 2011 17:14 Chicane wrote:

Show nested quote +

I don't get it. Clearly pro players use cloaked units, yet you managed to come to the conclusion that they suck based off a few games? Care to elaborate how you came to the conclusion?

I never said the sucked. I said they should be placed on the back burner. Like they shouldn't be a primary concern.

Blackspell

United States80 Posts

June 19 2011 08:18 GMT

#17

On June 19 2011 17:15 NeXiLe wrote:

Show nested quote +

Thread title is slightly misleading then imo :x

I was referring to his statement about what I said in the post. My question remains how often do you find yourself using cloaked units in matches.

Deleted_143

Australia256 Posts

June 19 2011 08:21 GMT

#18

--- Nuked ---

cheeseplease

Korea (South)5 Posts

June 19 2011 08:22 GMT

#19

Cloaked banshees are an awesome cloaked unit utilized in all matchups. Cloak = makes opponent get detection thus forcing them to use resources and brain power to fend it off, putting you at an advantage.

Navillus

United States1188 Posts

June 19 2011 08:23 GMT

#20

On June 19 2011 17:10 Blackspell wrote:
I'm not only using cloaked units. Thats imbecilic. I'm merely suggesting that its hard to pull off an early DT harass.

Yes, yes it is hard to pull off, welcome to Starcraft, if you want to ever get any good you will need to do things that are hard to pull off...