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It's really weird but it seems like CJ fans are much more disjointed from reality than Khan fans. THey predict their players to win all matches except ones where the other guy is ridiculously favored, such as Much vs Jangbi.
Khan fans on the other hand tend to say stuff like "I hope Khan wins. It will be tough but i think we got this, etc." Their comments are tempered by numerous failures and fluke losses lol. CJ's fans seem to worship their team's players and think they can do no wrong...
Effort's good, but he's not a 100% lock for every single match guys. There's a reason he's 60+% and not 100%. To always predict he's going to win is just ludicrous. How do you expect a guy to win his match, win the possible ace match, then go on to win the super ace match? I don't see Cho making effort responsible for TWO ace matches in one night. That's a tremendous burden for any player. He is the favorite vs Great. He is a great ace player. But to predict 3-0 in one night? That's a tall order. Even if the ace maps are the same.
And then the CJ fans calling Kwanro > Miracle. Sure, it could happen, but it flies in the face of reason. Kwanro lost just last night! And it's not like he lost on some fluke or to some kind of failed all-in. Miracle had a build order advantage and then absolutely crushed Kwanro with it, while Kwanro showed that he doesn't have what it takes to harass Miracle. If that's not an obvious indicator that Kwanro and Miracle are equally matched, I don't know what is. There was no point in that game where Kwanro showed any superiority. Not in micro, macro, strategy, or starsense.
Same with the Iris vs FBH game. I'd squarely put that in FBH's corner. He is a superb TvT player and nothing he's done during his slump has indicated otherwise. How many players you know could push FLash into a disadvantageous position in mid-game? Sure FBH lost it by playing too conservatively and just banking on BC's, but it doesn't take away from his skill. Iris has shown multiple times that he just cannot handle late-game play. He can't. To predict Iris > FBH across the board is just nutty in my op.
Movie vs Juni I'd give to Movie. THis guy's beaten JD multiple times. He's no fluke here. Juni is god awful. No arguments from me here.
But overall, I think it is very much a tossup. My predictions:
SkyHigh < Stork
Kwanro = Miracle
Effort > Great
Much < Jangbi
Iris < FBH
Movie > Juni
Effort > Jangbi
Effort < Jangbi
Khan in 4:2 or Khan in Super Ace.
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On July 26 2009 01:52 crucifix wrote:
I'll suicide if CJ loses to KHAN. Super Ace match coming?
EffOrt vs FBH/Stork ?
Oh please. Stop making these "If ___ loses, I'll do ___" promises. There have been plenty of these already. There was once a guy who promised to suck a row of cocks if his player lost, and that player did lose.
In the end, when your prediction fails and you don't fulfill your promise, you just look like a loser.
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On July 26 2009 09:55 BisuBoi wrote:
It's really weird but it seems like CJ fans are much more disjointed from reality than Khan fans. THey predict their players to win all matches except ones where the other guy is ridiculously favored, such as Much vs Jangbi.
Khan fans on the other hand tend to say stuff like "I hope Khan wins. It will be tough but i think we got this, etc." Their comments are tempered by numerous failures and fluke losses lol. CJ's fans seem to worship their team's players and think they can do no wrong...
Effort's good, but he's not a 100% lock for every single match guys. There's a reason he's 60+% and not 100%. To always predict he's going to win is just ludicrous. How do you expect a guy to win his match, win the possible ace match, then go on to win the super ace match? I don't see Cho making effort responsible for TWO ace matches in one night. That's a tremendous burden for any player. He is the favorite vs Great. He is a great ace player. But to predict 3-0 in one night? That's a tall order. Even if the ace maps are the same.
And then the CJ fans calling Kwanro > Miracle. Sure, it could happen, but it flies in the face of reason. Kwanro lost just last night! And it's not like he lost on some fluke or to some kind of failed all-in. Miracle had a build order advantage and then absolutely crushed Kwanro with it, while Kwanro showed that he doesn't have what it takes to harass Miracle. If that's not an obvious indicator that Kwanro and Miracle are equally matched, I don't know what is. There was no point in that game where Kwanro showed any superiority. Not in micro, macro, strategy, or starsense.
Same with the Iris vs FBH game. I'd squarely put that in FBH's corner. He is a superb TvT player and nothing he's done during his slump has indicated otherwise. How many players you know could push FLash into a disadvantageous position in mid-game? Sure FBH lost it by playing too conservatively and just banking on BC's, but it doesn't take away from his skill. Iris has shown multiple times that he just cannot handle late-game play. He can't. To predict Iris > FBH across the board is just nutty in my op.
Movie vs Juni I'd give to Movie. THis guy's beaten JD multiple times. He's no fluke here. Juni is god awful. No arguments from me here.
But overall, I think it is very much a tossup. My predictions:
SkyHigh < Stork
Kwanro = Miracle
Effort > Great
Much < Jangbi
Iris < FBH
Movie > Juni
Effort > Jangbi
Effort < Jangbi
Khan in 4:2 or Khan in Super Ace.
Why do you make the assumption that everybody does this. And there is plenty of posts from Khan fans that say like "4-0 Khan EZ" or "4-1 Khan EZ". Please don't be a hypocrite and please don't make the assumption that everyone does it.
EDIT: Also on the matter of FBH wrecking Iris in a TvT, Iris can still lay it down with his relentless play vs Hwasin. It isn't just something thats out there but looking at recent Iris TvT performance it is not surprising at all because of his recent play.
Also Effort is 80% vs all since the end of winners league which was when his play began to step up. Also Effort has a history for delivering when it matters in clutch situations. People are saying that Effort will win no doubt because they have a such trust in him. And also looking at your talking you are a serious hypocrite. You also don't seem to know what the word predict means.
Effort's good, but he's not a 100% lock for every single match guys. There's a reason he's 60+% and not 100%. To always predict he's going to win is just ludicrous.
You know 60% is a high win rate. He's playing at a higher lvl than almost everybody in starcraft. It is reasonable to PREDICT that he will win because he's better than the people he is playing in proleague and it is always a safe bet to PREDICT that because he will usually deliver.
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4-0 Ez for khan =D
Some people cant take jokes... its like soccer (here on latinamerica) you always tell to the other team that they doesnt have chances against yours... its like to spice up the things. If everyone were like "yeah CJ its a better team than Khan thast why i think that my team its going to lose"... Fuck that.. KHAN FTW!
When nobody believe in Khan we stayed besides them and Im going to be a KHAN fan always.. even if the lose today!
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If this goes anywhere near an ace match, Khan will be in deep shit..Hoping they could wrap things up by then. 
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yet again i hope 2 see some /dance and BM CC's for FBH =)
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On July 26 2009 09:55 BisuBoi wrote:
It's really weird but it seems like CJ fans are much more disjointed from reality than Khan fans. THey predict their players to win all matches except ones where the other guy is ridiculously favored, such as Much vs Jangbi.
Khan fans on the other hand tend to say stuff like "I hope Khan wins. It will be tough but i think we got this, etc." Their comments are tempered by numerous failures and fluke losses lol. CJ's fans seem to worship their team's players and think they can do no wrong...
Effort's good, but he's not a 100% lock for every single match guys. There's a reason he's 60+% and not 100%. To always predict he's going to win is just ludicrous. How do you expect a guy to win his match, win the possible ace match, then go on to win the super ace match? I don't see Cho making effort responsible for TWO ace matches in one night. That's a tremendous burden for any player. He is the favorite vs Great. He is a great ace player. But to predict 3-0 in one night? That's a tall order. Even if the ace maps are the same.
And then the CJ fans calling Kwanro > Miracle. Sure, it could happen, but it flies in the face of reason. Kwanro lost just last night! And it's not like he lost on some fluke or to some kind of failed all-in. Miracle had a build order advantage and then absolutely crushed Kwanro with it, while Kwanro showed that he doesn't have what it takes to harass Miracle. If that's not an obvious indicator that Kwanro and Miracle are equally matched, I don't know what is. There was no point in that game where Kwanro showed any superiority. Not in micro, macro, strategy, or starsense.
Same with the Iris vs FBH game. I'd squarely put that in FBH's corner. He is a superb TvT player and nothing he's done during his slump has indicated otherwise. How many players you know could push FLash into a disadvantageous position in mid-game? Sure FBH lost it by playing too conservatively and just banking on BC's, but it doesn't take away from his skill. Iris has shown multiple times that he just cannot handle late-game play. He can't. To predict Iris > FBH across the board is just nutty in my op.
Movie vs Juni I'd give to Movie. THis guy's beaten JD multiple times. He's no fluke here. Juni is god awful. No arguments from me here.
But overall, I think it is very much a tossup. My predictions:
SkyHigh < Stork
Kwanro = Miracle
Effort > Great
Much < Jangbi
Iris < FBH
Movie > Juni
Effort > Jangbi
Effort < Jangbi
Khan in 4:2 or Khan in Super Ace.
Honestly, it just seems like you like being an ass for no reason. CJ fans aren't some mysterious phenomenon that is like this - there are fans for every team that do it. To say it's just CJ fans makes you look like a complete jackass. People predict Effort to win because he's the 2nd best Zerg in the league - 3 wins in a night may be extreme, but people make radical predictions all the time and it's no exception with Effort because he's pretty much CJ's best player hands. He's also picked to win so many because, if you pool all the players on each team, he's probably the best player out of them all. He's currently performing better than anyone else on either team, and KHAN definitely can't hold a player up to him - KHAN's 3 big names are all slumping pretty badly.
People also call Kwanro over Miracle because out of everything we know, it's the logical decision. Kwanro has risen to be in the top tier of players in the league, and his performance has shown it - Miracle's definitely hasn't. Just because he lost to Miracle doesn't mean Kwanro sucks. Look at Effort vs. Jaedong in the GSL. Effort completely raped Jaedong and made him look like a scrub in a BO3 series, winning 2-0. Are you still going to actually seriously predict Effort to beat Jaedong in a game, let alone a ZvZ, where JD is at EIGHTY PERCENT? Only if you were a complete moron.
Iris is predicted over FBH for a lot of people because, over the past couple months, FBH has been in the worst slump known to man. He has dropped out of every individual league and has dropped plenty of PL games. Furthermore, Iris is NOT some slouch. He is easily able to be named as one of the top Terrans around, and his performance in the individual leagues shows it. He's a seasoned veteran and his recent performance has been very noteable (of course, with some losses, but everyone has those. It's not like he's looked as bad as, say, his upcoming opponent).
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You say that Kwanro > Miracle "flies in the face of reason" because of one game they played against each other? Really?
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Ah, I'm glad I'm a SKT1 fan, don't have to worry about Bisu, Best, and Fantasy  (Imagine if we get to see Boxer in the finals...omg! (This is probably a pipe dream though))
Personally, I hope Khan wins, as it will be easier for SKT1.
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On July 26 2009 10:41 Aegraen wrote:Ah, I'm glad I'm a SKT1 fan, don't have to worry about Bisu, Best, and Fantasy (Imagine if we get to see Boxer in the finals...omg! (This is probably a pipe dream though)) Personally, I hope Khan wins, as it will be easier for SKT1.
Ditto for Khan, January can sleep tight knowing there are no good zergs on SKT1 to sniper her players lol.
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On July 26 2009 10:47 dinmsab wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2009 10:41 Aegraen wrote:Ah, I'm glad I'm a SKT1 fan, don't have to worry about Bisu, Best, and Fantasy (Imagine if we get to see Boxer in the finals...omg! (This is probably a pipe dream though)) Personally, I hope Khan wins, as it will be easier for SKT1. Ditto for Khan, January can sleep tight knowing there are no good zergs on SKT1 to sniper her players lol.
Don't need to snipe when the overall skill for SKT1 dwarfs Khan.
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On July 26 2009 10:41 Aegraen wrote:Ah, I'm glad I'm a SKT1 fan, don't have to worry about Bisu, Best, and Fantasy (Imagine if we get to see Boxer in the finals...omg! (This is probably a pipe dream though)) Personally, I hope Khan wins, as it will be easier for SKT1.
Be careful of what you say.
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On July 26 2009 10:33 Stratos_speAr wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2009 09:55 BisuBoi wrote:
It's really weird but it seems like CJ fans are much more disjointed from reality than Khan fans. THey predict their players to win all matches except ones where the other guy is ridiculously favored, such as Much vs Jangbi.
Khan fans on the other hand tend to say stuff like "I hope Khan wins. It will be tough but i think we got this, etc." Their comments are tempered by numerous failures and fluke losses lol. CJ's fans seem to worship their team's players and think they can do no wrong...
Effort's good, but he's not a 100% lock for every single match guys. There's a reason he's 60+% and not 100%. To always predict he's going to win is just ludicrous. How do you expect a guy to win his match, win the possible ace match, then go on to win the super ace match? I don't see Cho making effort responsible for TWO ace matches in one night. That's a tremendous burden for any player. He is the favorite vs Great. He is a great ace player. But to predict 3-0 in one night? That's a tall order. Even if the ace maps are the same.
And then the CJ fans calling Kwanro > Miracle. Sure, it could happen, but it flies in the face of reason. Kwanro lost just last night! And it's not like he lost on some fluke or to some kind of failed all-in. Miracle had a build order advantage and then absolutely crushed Kwanro with it, while Kwanro showed that he doesn't have what it takes to harass Miracle. If that's not an obvious indicator that Kwanro and Miracle are equally matched, I don't know what is. There was no point in that game where Kwanro showed any superiority. Not in micro, macro, strategy, or starsense.
Same with the Iris vs FBH game. I'd squarely put that in FBH's corner. He is a superb TvT player and nothing he's done during his slump has indicated otherwise. How many players you know could push FLash into a disadvantageous position in mid-game? Sure FBH lost it by playing too conservatively and just banking on BC's, but it doesn't take away from his skill. Iris has shown multiple times that he just cannot handle late-game play. He can't. To predict Iris > FBH across the board is just nutty in my op.
Movie vs Juni I'd give to Movie. THis guy's beaten JD multiple times. He's no fluke here. Juni is god awful. No arguments from me here.
But overall, I think it is very much a tossup. My predictions:
SkyHigh < Stork
Kwanro = Miracle
Effort > Great
Much < Jangbi
Iris < FBH
Movie > Juni
Effort > Jangbi
Effort < Jangbi
Khan in 4:2 or Khan in Super Ace.
Honestly, it just seems like you like being an ass for no reason. CJ fans aren't some mysterious phenomenon that is like this - there are fans for every team that do it. To say it's just CJ fans makes you look like a complete jackass. People predict Effort to win because he's the 2nd best Zerg in the league - 3 wins in a night may be extreme, but people make radical predictions all the time and it's no exception with Effort because he's pretty much CJ's best player hands. He's also picked to win so many because, if you pool all the players on each team, he's probably the best player out of them all. He's currently performing better than anyone else on either team, and KHAN definitely can't hold a player up to him - KHAN's 3 big names are all slumping pretty badly. People also call Kwanro over Miracle because out of everything we know, it's the logical decision. Kwanro has risen to be in the top tier of players in the league, and his performance has shown it - Miracle's definitely hasn't. Just because he lost to Miracle doesn't mean Kwanro sucks. Look at Effort vs. Jaedong in the GSL. Effort completely raped Jaedong and made him look like a scrub in a BO3 series, winning 2-0. Are you still going to actually seriously predict Effort to beat Jaedong in a game, let alone a ZvZ, where JD is at EIGHTY PERCENT? Only if you were a complete moron. Iris is predicted over FBH for a lot of people because, over the past couple months, FBH has been in the worst slump known to man. He has dropped out of every individual league and has dropped plenty of PL games. Furthermore, Iris is NOT some slouch. He is easily able to be named as one of the top Terrans around, and his performance in the individual leagues shows it. He's a seasoned veteran and his recent performance has been very noteable (of course, with some losses, but everyone has those. It's not like he's looked as bad as, say, his upcoming opponent).
It doesn't make me look like anything, but cursing at people several times and calling them names over it certainly doesn't make you look like a decent fellow. I thank you for taking the time respond back with reasons, but I don't see why it's necessary to curse at people and freak out. Even if you think I'm stupid, that doesn't make it okay to go apeshit. Just state your case and I'll look a lot dumber based on your argument (if it's a good one).
Anyhow, I don't think you can call Kwanro's ZvT anything close to JD's ZvZ. The analogy doesn't work for me. And just percentage wise, Miracle's 57%. Yeah, I know, Kwanro historically has proven himself more than Miracle has. But you could say the same for all of Khan's A-team compared to CJ's (sans Iris).
The difference I think is that Khan has excellent players that have recently not performed well. CJ has players that recently are on very hot streaks, but historically have not been crazily dominant like a Bisu, Stork, JD, Flash.
I just think it's silly to ALWAYS call it for the A-team guy over the B-team guy. It's like okay, people can make these predictions, but there's no thinking involved in just picking the guy with higher stats. If it was that easy, everyone would be #1 on LB. Guess I'm just wondering why people have such stale predictions that are based on win %'s more than anything else.
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On July 26 2009 10:34 Jaksiel wrote:
You say that Kwanro > Miracle "flies in the face of reason" because of one game they played against each other? Really?
Yup, because of how that game played out. I'll be vindicated a few hours from now . Or Miracle will get raped and you can quote me and ridicule me lol.
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On July 26 2009 10:56 BisuBoi wrote:
I just think it's silly to ALWAYS call it for the A-team guy over the B-team guy. It's like okay, people can make these predictions, but there's no thinking involved in just picking the guy with higher stats. If it was that easy, everyone would be #1 on LB. Guess I'm just wondering why people have such stale predictions that are based on win %'s more than anything else.
Again why do you assume everybody does this.
pre·dict (prĭ-dĭkt')
v. tr.
To state, tell about, or make known in advance, especially on the basis of special knowledge.
First let me assure you that there is always people who will just base their predictions on win rates. And if people making the predictions are in your opinion "stale," thats fine with me but please stop your bickering there will always be people like this. You make it seem that almost everybody but yourself does that. MOST people don't just base it on that they look at head to head match ups, recent performance of the two. Who they have beat and how effectively they beat them. And also the Meta game. And no it is not silly to assume the A-team guy will beat the B-team guide unless of the use of special knowledge or variables that the B team guy has been doing well and the A-team guy has been doing bad and the use of the other special knowledge and more stated above. There is a reason why somebody is on A-team and someone is on B-Team. They are on A-team because they can perform, and they are on B-team because their coach thinks other wise.
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On July 26 2009 09:51 bluemanrocks wrote:
coach cho will probably do something crazy like send out odin.
That would be pretty crazy. o.O
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I'd really like to see this go to another super ace match. While I hate the format, it is rather exciting to see everything come down to a single game. If I remember correctly, both super ace matches last week were pretty epic matches too - no cheese wins in 5 minutes so it didn't feel like a cheap victory.
So, that being said, I'd love to see CJ get an early win here so we can get to the super ace that much faster! I'd rather not be up until 3 or 4am again!
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konadora
Singapore66162 Posts
On July 26 2009 09:51 bluemanrocks wrote:
coach cho will probably do something crazy like send out odin.
Huh what
???
Coach Cho = CJ coach
oDin = Samsung Khan player
what
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On July 26 2009 11:40 konadora wrote:Show nested quote +On July 26 2009 09:51 bluemanrocks wrote:
coach cho will probably do something crazy like send out odin. Huh what ??? Coach Cho = CJ coach oDin = Samsung Khan player what
that's how crazy he is.
Actually wanting khan to win has paid off. Hopefully Jangbi can pull out an amazing ace win against effort. I love these super ace matches and the excitement they bring to the winning player
Predicting Khan to win in the super ace!
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Khan should win just to shut up all the arrogant cj fans!
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EPT
