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[WL] FINALS: CJ vs OZ - Page 4

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
Post a Reply
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fusionsdf
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
Canada15390 Posts
March 26 2009 14:33 GMT
#61
On March 26 2009 22:19 EvoChamber wrote:
Putting Jaedong out first is even riskier than it was against KTF. CJ has incredible depth and intelligence, and it will all be focused on knocking him out as soon as possible. I wouldn't put it past Effort to 4pool, to be honest, and Jaedong should definitely scout with his 9th drone in the non-mirror matches. There's no telling what crazy builds CJ has cooked up to take him out. Of course, even with all the preparation in the world, a Jaedong all-kill is still possible. If he's not shot down in the first two games, his momentum should carry him through to, if not an all-kill, at least a Hwaseung victory.

I think the reasoning behind Jaedong's placement is more due to the map pool than anything else. It also forces CJ to narrow their planning down to dealing with him in a way that a Hiya-start would not and thus increases Hwaseung's chances in the event of a loss from Jaedong. Maps 2-4 are reasonably Terran-friendly, and Hiya can be expected to step in the event of a Jaedong loss to stop the bleeding and finish the job Jaedong started. Maps 5-7 are Protoss friendly, and if both teams are still alive after four games Young will be sent out. Lecaf's fourth slot will go to Lomo, or less likely Backho, who aren't very good but might be able to steal a win if need be. Oz's gameplan is about as solid as it can possibly be, but that alone has never guaranteed a victory.

Sending Effort out is a very smart move by CJ. He's the only CJ Zerg that has a viable chance of defeating Jaedong, and putting him first will amplify the effects of his potential victory greatly. If Effort wins, there's a strong chance that Effort will all-kill, and even if he doesn't he'll open the door for Savior to demonstrate his non-mirror play against the rest of Oz. I'm expecting CJ's quartet to consist of Effort, Skyhigh, Iris, and Savior (with the ever-present possibility of a surprise appearance by Much). These are all dangerous opponents, and any one of them could break out and execute a triple kill or all kill. That's been CJ's strength throughout all of Winner's League, and it's why they've been able to relax for two weeks while Oz has had to play other teams to secure a shot at the title.

Anything could happen. I love both teams, and I hope we see some great matches regardless of who wins. Go CJ! Go OZ!



I'd expect the same if 4 pool was any good in zvz
SKT_Best: "I actually chose Protoss because it was so hard for me to defeat Protoss as a Terran. When I first started Brood War, my main race was Terran."
lxginverse
Profile Joined May 2008
Monaco1506 Posts
March 26 2009 14:34 GMT
#62
CJ will win this...


and wouldnt even be close...
fromis_9 enjoyer
3nickma
Profile Joined November 2007
Denmark1510 Posts
March 26 2009 15:00 GMT
#63
I forgot to mention that I don't want to see a Frozean/Cute Angel repeat!
L E E J A E D O N G ! <3
nK)Duke
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Germany936 Posts
March 26 2009 15:18 GMT
#64
Savior REVERSEALLKILL

You heard it first!!!!!!!!!!!
Genjimaru
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Canada515 Posts
March 26 2009 15:24 GMT
#65
I think Iris or Much will do the job of taking out Jaedong. But it's possible Effort or Skyhigh could do it as well.
boxxyownz
Profile Joined February 2009
United States103 Posts
March 26 2009 15:30 GMT
#66
does cj have a better snipe team then, forgg, luxury, flash??
zzz
StylishVODs
Profile Joined December 2005
Sweden5331 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-26 15:47:44
March 26 2009 15:46 GMT
#67
On March 26 2009 23:07 Ozarugold wrote:
There is no way Jaedong can get another all kill. Or can he? There is no way that any player can be that good. What would it be if he all killed CJ...four all kills? Yeah, there's no way...but maybe...maybe...

I'm so torn...


If he can kill luxury flash forgg and hoejja he can do the same to CJ.
CJ doesn't have even close to as good zergsnipers as KTF has, but they can snipe him with cheese.

ForGG and Flash are imo better vs zerg than SkyHigh and Iris.
Luxury has better zvz than savior.
hoejja and effort might be close in zvz skills i dont know about that..

its kinda lol that Oz only can rely on jaedong and hiya pretty much..

According to Reach, he is the fastest learner he has ever seen. He start bw only like 2/3 years ago. Infact, his bw history knowledge is so limited, he didn't even know what the map Guillotine was.
Deleted User 31060
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
3788 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-03-26 15:59:44
March 26 2009 15:57 GMT
#68
On March 26 2009 18:09 WindCalibur wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 26 2009 17:44 Infinity.SkyLark wrote:
Effort vs Jaedong. Wow.

But yeah Jaedong will walk over him...it'll prolly go

(Z)EffOrt < (Z)Jaedong
(Z)sAviOr / (P)Much < (Z)Jaedong
(T)Iris < (Z)Jaedong
(T)sKyHigh < (Z)Jaedong

QFT


+1!!!

that is, of course, barring a jaedong insta-all-kill

On March 27 2009 00:46 StylishVODs wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 26 2009 23:07 Ozarugold wrote:
There is no way Jaedong can get another all kill. Or can he? There is no way that any player can be that good. What would it be if he all killed CJ...four all kills? Yeah, there's no way...but maybe...maybe...

I'm so torn...


If he can kill luxury flash forgg and hoejja he can do the same to CJ.
CJ doesn't have even close to as good zergsnipers as KTF has, but they can snipe him with cheese.

ForGG and Flash are imo better vs zerg than SkyHigh and Iris.
Luxury has better zvz than savior.
hoejja and effort might be close in zvz skills i dont know about that..

its kinda lol that Oz only can rely on jaedong and hiya pretty much..



I'd say that Effort = Luxury and Hoejja = Savior (approximately) in ZvZ
Peaked at C- on ICCUP and proud of it! @Sunyveil
Ace
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States16096 Posts
March 26 2009 15:58 GMT
#69
Iris is a sexy vZ user. Hell Iris is almost an auto fav in any matchup because he's that damn good.
Math me up, scumboi. - Acrofales
Cloud
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
Sexico5880 Posts
March 26 2009 16:01 GMT
#70
I sense some skyhigh cheese as 2nd game like the last time.

Only this time, it will fail miserably.
BlueLaguna on West, msg for game.
ZenDeX
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
Philippines2916 Posts
March 26 2009 16:02 GMT
#71
(Z)EffOrt > (Z)Jaedong
(Z)EffOrt > (T)HiyA
(Z)EffOrt > (P)BackHo/(P)Spear
(Z)EffOrt > (T)Lomo
fusionsdf
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
Canada15390 Posts
March 26 2009 16:04 GMT
#72
(Z)EffOrt > (Z)Jaedong
*Hwaseung has forfeited the match*

SKT_Best: "I actually chose Protoss because it was so hard for me to defeat Protoss as a Terran. When I first started Brood War, my main race was Terran."
StylishVODs
Profile Joined December 2005
Sweden5331 Posts
March 26 2009 16:23 GMT
#73
Sunyveil effort has 10-5 in the matchup is it enough to judge wether or not he's as good as Luxury who's concidered the best zerg in practice in korea?

Even if so my statement still stays.
According to Reach, he is the fastest learner he has ever seen. He start bw only like 2/3 years ago. Infact, his bw history knowledge is so limited, he didn't even know what the map Guillotine was.
jnheart35
Profile Joined February 2009
United States178 Posts
March 26 2009 16:45 GMT
#74
On March 27 2009 01:04 fusionsdf wrote:
(Z)EffOrt > (Z)Jaedong
*Hwaseung has forfeited the match*



LOL
Zozma
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States1626 Posts
March 26 2009 16:46 GMT
#75
Jaedong > Effort
Jaedong < Iris

and then Iris all-kills.
Warrior Madness
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Canada3791 Posts
March 26 2009 17:05 GMT
#76
On March 26 2009 22:11 CDRdude wrote:
I know JD's ZvZ is monstrous, but I'm really worried that Effort can snipe him. The last time they played, it was really, really close. If Effort's build counters jaedongs, it could be game over for hwaseung.


Yes I'm really worried about this as well. I have a feeling Effort will snipe JD. Even with JD preparing pretty much solely for ZvZ I'm still worried. Effort is so good and the matchup is that unpredictable. Besides Effort, CJ has such a deep and intelligent lineup I think that if any team can snipe JD it would be CJ.
The Past: Yellow, Julyzerg, Chojja, Savior, GGplay -- The Present: Luxury, Jae- The Future: -Dong, maGma, Zero, Effort, Hoejja, hyvaa, by.hero, calm, Action ---> SC2 (Ret?? Kolll Idra!! SEN, Cool, ZergBong, Leenock)
Pufftrees
Profile Joined March 2009
2449 Posts
March 26 2009 17:05 GMT
#77
On March 27 2009 01:04 fusionsdf wrote:
(Z)EffOrt > (Z)Jaedong
*Hwaseung has forfeited the match*




basically
Chance favors the prepared mind.
p4NDemik
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
United States13896 Posts
March 26 2009 17:09 GMT
#78
On March 27 2009 00:46 StylishVODs wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 26 2009 23:07 Ozarugold wrote:
There is no way Jaedong can get another all kill. Or can he? There is no way that any player can be that good. What would it be if he all killed CJ...four all kills? Yeah, there's no way...but maybe...maybe...

I'm so torn...

If he can kill luxury flash forgg and hoejja he can do the same to CJ.
CJ doesn't have even close to as good zergsnipers as KTF has, but they can snipe him with cheese.

ForGG and Flash are imo better vs zerg than SkyHigh and Iris.
Luxury has better zvz than savior.
hoejja and effort might be close in zvz skills i dont know about that..

its kinda lol that Oz only can rely on jaedong and hiya pretty much..

How are HoeJJa and EffOrt possibly "close in ZvZ skills," when EffOrt is 10-5 and HoeJJa has never won a televised ZvZ? From this post it's like you think HoeJJa is actually better than EffOrt, and you aren't sure if EffOrt is close to his skill level.

EffOrt is much, much closer to Luxury's ZvZ skill level than HoeJJa, though he isn't quite there yet.

(Z)Luxury > (Z)EffOrt in ZvZ, but it's close.
(Z)sAviOr >>>> (Z)HoeJJa not even close.
Moderator
Roffles *
Profile Blog Joined April 2007
Pitcairn19291 Posts
March 26 2009 17:12 GMT
#79
Any given night though, someone might pull something out of their ass and scratch out a win. But in regards to ZvZ, Lux > Effort = Savior > Hoejja. Lux I believe is in his own world just a tier below Jaedong in regards to ZvZ.
God Bless
Kyuukyuu
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Canada6263 Posts
March 26 2009 17:14 GMT
#80
Jeez, JD starting again? I dunno about this. Barring any cheese, JD should be able to take out all of CJ (except maybe Effort?) in straight up games, but I doubt that's gonna be the case... I might have to go for CJ here ><
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