NOTE: Two players from each of the four groups play their final group games today, with the other two players playing their last games on Friday the 13th. The groups are a round-robin format.
The day's most exciting match-up, two starleague winners play in their best match-ups with a lot riding on the line. Bisu and EffOrt have played several times before, with the protoss holding a 3-0 advantage in televised games. However, their last meeting was at the IEF exhibition, in a game that EffOrt won. This history is somwhat meaningless, however because they haven't played in nearly a year. Bisu is roaring back after a horrendous mid-season slump, while EffOrt is coasting after a stunning OSL title run. Both players barely missed each other on several occasions in the proleague playoffs, and are surely ready to finally play each other.
Mentally, EffOrt has the peculiar edge of this game being a must-win. If he does not win this game, his OSL title defense will come to an end. Bisu, meanwhile will assure himself at least a tiebreaker with a win, and will be in excellent position to advance outright. The map is Flight-Dreamliner, which has a 4-2 advantage for zerg, but has been a difficult map to pin down so far. What is clear is that its short air distance will favor harass-based play, which should favor Bisu. While both players are sublime multi-taskers, both are noticably better on the attack than the defensive. If EffOrt can deflect the expected corsair/[imba protoss unit] play from Bisu, then he should take the game home, as the map's many paths and wide-open raised center favor the late-game ling play that he excels at.
Just several days ago, this match would've been the time to go catch your breath after the set before, maybe grab a drink, and do some stretches. No longer. ZerO, once the poster child for middling ZvZ has completely reinvented himself in two successive nights in the STX Master's, defeating both Jaedong and EffOrt back-to-back. Suddenly, ZerO is on a tear, and is full of the kind of confidence that leads you to say, "I'm not scared of anybody". Beating the two top ZvZ'ers in BW in one week is impressive, but at least one player won't be impressed by it. That's because Hyuk actually put together an eerily similar performance last year, around the time when it appeared he might amount to something after all. Since then however, his luster has faded, although his ZvZ remains quite strong. The true pretender, then, will be revealed in this game.
The map is Eye of the Storm, which remains one of the single most forgettable maps ever made, (Can you remember a single game that was interesting because of this map? I sure can't.) and really doesn't have much in the way of positional imbalances that could doom either player. Plus, it's a ZvZ so there's no match-up advantage. The crucial thing here, then, will be the mental aspect, and in that regard, ZerO seemingly holds a huge edge. He's been taking names in the match-up recently, and has a lot to play for in this OSL. Hyuk, meanwhile, is at the basement of his group, and while this game is a must-win for him, his uninspired performances in his two previous games suggest that he'll have trouble finding the will to fight this one out. ZerO will win with an advantage, even builds, or possibly with a disadvantage.
This is yet another battle of a 1-1 player against the last player in the group, and that means it's a must-win for Pure, and a highly recommended win for Jaedong. But unlike the previous two games, the calibre of both players in this game is not particularly even. Pure is a good but not great protoss, who has struggled mightily in this match-up recently. This lack of confidence led to a horrifically ill-advised one-base build on the protoss-favored Polaris Rhapsody led to a loss against Hydra on the first day of the group stage. Meanwhile, Jaedong finds himself in a small hole, after a loss to Sealate-game terran mech put him in the second-place position in the group. Nonetheless, he is supremely confident in ZvP, having not lost to protoss players not named Stork, Bisu, or Kal since JUNE of LAST YEAR. Perhaps then it's good news for Pure that he's never played a televised game against Jaedong.
The map is Grand Line SE, which looks a little out of place without a terran on it. Results on the map have been mixed in this match-up, and neither player has played it in this MU. Nonetheless, the map lends itself well to zerg simcities, and mutalisk harass, while the cut-up middle makes it hard for protoss to control the land. (See vulture harass on this map for an example.) And honestly, it's Pure against Jaedong. It'd be a huge surprise to see anything other than a strong Jaedong victory here.
Group D had so much promise, but disappointing performances from Kal and fantasy sealed their doom before the final two games of the series have been played. The final game of the fifth day is a bit of dessert, an exhibition between two strong PvP players. Winning this group is a questionable honor, as Jaedong or ZerO might await that player. At any rate, both players will likely be playing to win and playing to entertain, which will hopefully cap off the night in an exciting way.
Thankfully for this end, the map is on Polaris Rhapsody, which has proved to be an exciting map for protoss in all match-ups, even the mirror. The multiple passages and openness of the bases to harass has made PvP's on PR some of the most memorable games of the season. Surprisingly, Free has played a single PvP on PR, and Stork has never done it, which makes this the second match between (near)map virgins. In the end though, Stork simply has the better play in the MU, with no real advantages to mark towards free. It could go either way, but it'll probably go to Stork.
Bisu > Effort (small air distance, Effort's losses to P are mostly heavy harass-type games, which is what Bisu will do with Dreamliner) ZerO > Hyuk (ZerO's been really good lately, Hyuk just lost the last game of the finals, it's a confidence thing.) Jaedong > Pure (THE DONG) Free > Stork (game doesn't matter. also, JD and Bisu are likely to get 2nd, so it's easier to dodge them by getting 2nd. People will accuse whoever loses of throwing the game.)
Bisu pls don't fail! ZvZ... as if anyone cared... JD doesn't lose to lesser tosses! never! I like Stork better, so he should lose in order not to play against Flash next round ^^
On August 11 2010 09:58 ggrrg wrote: Bisu pls don't fail! ZvZ... as if anyone cared... JD doesn't lose to lesser tosses! never! I like Stork better, so he should lose in order not to play against Flash next round ^^
Considering Flash is like 90% likely to win the group, you should root for him to win to avoid Flash. Not to mention Stork vs Flash in the FINALS would be much better than in Ro8.
Also, IMO a player should always aim for the 1st seed if possible. In Ro8 the 1st seed eliminates one map, which could be huge if such a map is very imbalanced for any particular matchup.
If EffOrt wins, that will make my day, but i like Bisu and his PvZ so i don't really mind. ZerO to beat Hyuk Jaedong vs Pure i'd be happy either way, but prefer Jaedong so i can study the vod. Free!
On August 11 2010 15:39 Camlito wrote: If EffOrt wins, that will make my day, but i like Bisu and his PvZ so i don't really mind. ZerO to beat Hyuk Jaedong vs Pure i'd be happy either way, but prefer Jaedong so i can study the vod. Free!
Hope for some gg's
lmao what will there to "study" in Pure vs Jaedong. It'll literally look like any ZvP against a generic protoss.
Personally, I think Bisu should be able to win. Effort seems to lose quite a significant amount of ZvP games to the Bisu build or some variant similar to it. Considering Bisu is still good at PvZ, he should stand a pretty good chance of winning.
Besides Bisu vs Effort, I'm not expecting too much from tonight. Pure vs Jaedong will probably be more onesided than Hyuk vs Flash, Hyuk vs Zero will be fairly uninteresting, and I doubt Free and Stork even practiced for their games since they're already through to the Ro8.
The one who loses in the final group will almost for sure will be playing a terran . The one who wins will be playing a top level zerg or Bisu . The smart choise will be losing so i don't expect much of this final game .
For the sake of BW I hope Bisu can win today. We need more protoss so OSL does not turn out to be the terran/zerg party that the MSL is.
As for Stork vs Free, I want stork to lose so he dont have to play Jaedong. Though would be kinda irnoic if he does lose and then Sea fails and we havea tiebrake that Jaedong wins......epic fail :-)
Bisu vs. Effort - I just had to come here and hype. Looking forward to this so much. JD vs. Pure seems promising as well. Hope Pure turns on the magic =)
On August 11 2010 17:54 Yxes2211 wrote: Why can't I live in Korea D: instead of waiting till 3:30 in the morning D:
Oh duh hell with it Starcraft > Sleep
Gotta love this. Everytime i want to watch Starcraft 2, i need to wait like you do, but when i want to watch Bw, i can happily wake up at 10-12am here in Europe. 8)
You know the feeling when you are all pumped for the games to start at 18.00, and then no streams because they start at 18.30? Now I gotta kill 30min . . .
Alright. I can actually enjoy a pressure-free day of OSL today, given that Stork has already advanced. Here's hoping that results lead to some nice tie-breakers.
On August 11 2010 18:32 Chen wrote: If tiebreakers are required, will they be played today or at a different date?
Since no groups finish all their games today, I'll presume a different date.
err. sorry i meant the day that all groups finish, do they do the tiebreaks then or give people time to prep?
Oh. well last season they were on a different date, and seeing how a tiebreaker is not entirely unprobable in this format, I'd say a different day just for tiebreakers.
On August 11 2010 18:37 Assymptotic wrote: Can anyone translate that pentagon shaped graph that pops up? I wanna know these players' power levels according to experts.
its been translated before, sorry i forgot the thread though
On August 11 2010 18:40 sAAvior wrote: I like both Effort and Bisu so I just hope for great game. Could someone summarize situation in this group ? Is there any chance Bisu qualifies ?
If Bisu wins, he will either have to do a tie breaker or will advance. If effort wins he will either still be eliminated or have to do a tie breaker.
On August 11 2010 18:37 Assymptotic wrote: Can anyone translate that pentagon shaped graph that pops up? I wanna know these players' power levels according to experts.
On August 11 2010 18:37 Assymptotic wrote: Can anyone translate that pentagon shaped graph that pops up? I wanna know these players' power levels according to experts.
On August 11 2010 18:41 538 wrote: I have an important question: at the start of the games, how do the fan-teams decide which one of them will go first with the "xyz fighting!" cheer?
I'm pretty sure they discuss it amongst themselves beforehand.
On August 11 2010 18:41 538 wrote: I have an important question: at the start of the games, how do the fan-teams decide which one of them will go first with the "xyz fighting!" cheer?
I'm pretty sure they discuss it amongst themselves beforehand.
they decide it with pure violence and brute force.
only 1 cannon for bisu, pretty normal. effort chasing scouting probe. natural nexus finished and cyber core has started. effort has started his 3rd at the gas expo and lair en route
2 zealots and a dragoon close the wall at his natural while the second cannon finishes. first corsair out which is sent to efforts main. spire just about to finish
2 more hatcheries and a hydra den for effort while he takes his natural's gas. 2 pairs of scourge pop. bisu gets 1 overlord kill then runs away. robotics facility for bisu as well. looking like reaver sair opening
Bisu's sairs roaming round the map, pick off 1 OL and then find a juicy pack of 3 overlords, but Hydras show up just in time to save them.
Effort going for a hydra bust at the front! Bisu having to pull a ton of probes to defend, reaver not out nearly in time, not looking good at all for Bisu.
Bisu GGs. Too bad we didn't get to see a longer or more exciting game from these two.
Pretty much textbook standard ZvP from Effort, Bisu going with the standard but less common sair reaver PvZ but just not having anything for Effort's small hydra timing attack
On August 11 2010 18:52 Ciryandor wrote: Not a good game, build order loss for Bisu flat out; too much sairs, not enough ground for Hydra bust.
How is that a build order loss, when they had scourage/sairs scouting each others base? Bisu knew it was 5 hatch hydra, plus it is like the most standard zvp build ever.
Obviously it was shuttle first because the robo bay was still building. But I do wonder if Bisu had spent that 200 gold on an extra cannon earlier if he would've lived.
On August 11 2010 18:52 Ciryandor wrote: Not a good game, build order loss for Bisu flat out; too much sairs, not enough ground for Hydra bust.
How is that a build order loss, when they had scourage/sairs scouting each others base? Bisu knew it was 5 hatch hydra, plus it is like the most standard zvp build ever.
no thats too much logic. Bisu fanbois wanted effort, after scouting the dual stargate +1 core ups to go 3 hatch muta and get wiped.
I love the choice of build in that game from EffOrt. Everyone knew we'd see sair-heavy play on Flight-Dreamliner from Bisu, and extremely likely either dts or reavers to make up for it. EffOrt completely avoided the issue by immediately getting overlord speed, and meanwhile he prepared a timing attack that would take advantage of how little units Bisu had.
No epic game, but I'm happy with the result. That was just smart play. And EffOrt is easily on even terms with Bisu, if not the favorite, and I'd be saying that even if he lost.
On August 11 2010 18:53 SkytoM wrote: why shuttle first is a really good question, with reaver that break would have been no problem..
he wanted to harass faster obviously. shuttle you can have 1/2-2/3 finished by the time support bay is done if you started support bay immediately after robo. going shuttle first delays reaver by maybe 20 seconds but doing the opposite delays shuttle by around a minute. Hindsight being 20/20 we can criticize his decision, but every strat has pros and cons
and scratch everything, Bisu either forgot to build his reaver or was pylon blocked =.=
Can you stop your tears please? They just showed the replay and Bisu took too long to build his reaver. Stop the cries of imbalance and watch the damn game.
On August 11 2010 18:52 onewingedmoogle wrote: lesson learned, build ur robotic inside ur main.
Umm, it's standard to build the robo bay at the natural in PvZ. What I find it weird is why Bisu didn't add cannons earlier when he had the scouting info.
On August 11 2010 18:52 onewingedmoogle wrote: lesson learned, build ur robotic inside ur main.
Umm, it's standard to build the robo bay at the natural in PvZ. What I find it weird is why Bisu didn't add cannons earlier when he had the scouting info.
I have to disagree. Just because it's standard doesn't necessarily mean it's a good idea. The robotics is just too cosly and time consuming to risk placing it at your natural.
On August 11 2010 18:52 Ciryandor wrote: Not a good game, build order loss for Bisu flat out; too much sairs, not enough ground for Hydra bust.
How is that a build order loss, when they had scourage/sairs scouting each others base? Bisu knew it was 5 hatch hydra, plus it is like the most standard zvp build ever.
Built Shuttle first when he scouted 5 hatch hydra instead of going for reaver. Shuttle before Reaver was the BO loss there, he had to defend first before he could harass... >_> And this is not me being a fanboy, it's me criticizing how that was bad decision-making. Effort did do a good decision going for 5 hatch Hydra.
On August 11 2010 18:57 hitthat wrote: i hate the games like that, but now i want Zero to win. Love both Hyuk and Zero, but Hyukie is officialy out, so GOGOGO Zero!
On August 11 2010 18:52 onewingedmoogle wrote: lesson learned, build ur robotic inside ur main.
Umm, it's standard to build the robo bay at the natural in PvZ. What I find it weird is why Bisu didn't add cannons earlier when he had the scouting info.
Yeah he waited very late I mean his corsairs saw them moving so I don't know why he delayed so much. His building placement in his nat were also very tight, didn't look like he could put many cannons down.
Yeah so if you screw some seconds in a matchup after a safe opening you get curb stomped by the other player who is also one expo ahead for free. That's cool.
Even if the reaver popped out I think Bisu was in trouble. Effort had a ton of hydras pouring in the reaver wouldn't have enough time to build enough scarabs to stop him. Even if Bisu got that reaver on time it was very close.
On August 11 2010 19:00 Salteador Neo wrote: Yeah so if you screw some seconds in a matchup after a safe opening you get curb stomped by the other player who is also one expo ahead for free. That's cool.
why even talk with zerg players about zvp? thats like teaching zombies to read :p
On August 11 2010 19:01 Ace wrote: Even if the reaver popped out I think Bisu was in trouble. Effort had a ton of hydras pouring in the reaver wouldn't have enough time to build enough scarabs to stop him. Even if Bisu got that reaver on time it was very close.
he needed 2 cannons earlier and shouldnt have built the shuttle + no pylon stuck so reaver gets out earlier. this would have won him the game easily. and it's not like that would be hard to do. also he had scouting information, he just fucked up here totally,.
but I guess he should win a game sometime so its fine, even yellow beat bisu once
Back in those days Bisu was worth something and besides effort was a rokie then . Right now Bisu is just another protoss that lost to a top zerg sorry ...
On August 11 2010 18:57 hitthat wrote: i hate the games like that, but now i want Zero to win. Love both Hyuk and Zero, but Hyukie is officialy out, so GOGOGO Zero!
hyuk is not out?
or do you expect to hiya beat flash? :D
Yes, its possible that Hiya will beat Flash, and thats why i want Zero to win
On August 11 2010 18:52 onewingedmoogle wrote: lesson learned, build ur robotic inside ur main.
Umm, it's standard to build the robo bay at the natural in PvZ. What I find it weird is why Bisu didn't add cannons earlier when he had the scouting info.
Yeah he waited very late I mean his corsairs saw them moving so I don't know why he delayed so much. His building placement in his nat were also very tight, didn't look like he could put many cannons down.
He very clearly expected EffOrt to spend a longer time defending his overlords. But EffOrt just rushed to speed, and then brought his ovies with him, or sent them randomly around the map. He was getting two cannons at the time of the attack, which probably would've saved him.
@Skytom I thought he had 2 cannons already, and then tried to warp in a third and fourth and got caught. Even so I doubt that would have won him the game because Effort had an absolute monster amount of Hydras pouring in.
On August 11 2010 18:52 onewingedmoogle wrote: lesson learned, build ur robotic inside ur main.
Umm, it's standard to build the robo bay at the natural in PvZ. What I find it weird is why Bisu didn't add cannons earlier when he had the scouting info.
Yeah he waited very late I mean his corsairs saw them moving so I don't know why he delayed so much. His building placement in his nat were also very tight, didn't look like he could put many cannons down.
He very clearly expected EffOrt to spend a longer time defending his overlords. But EffOrt just rushed to speed, and then brought his ovies with him, or sent them randomly around the map. He was getting two cannons at the time of the attack, which probably would've saved him.
Effort ran his ovies to the top left corner of the map, and Bisu didn't expect him to leave them defenseless up in that corner; and Bisu had one Cannon up and one warping. The space at the nat was could have added one or two cannons, but they were warped in too late to do much if anything.
On August 11 2010 18:52 onewingedmoogle wrote: lesson learned, build ur robotic inside ur main.
Umm, it's standard to build the robo bay at the natural in PvZ. What I find it weird is why Bisu didn't add cannons earlier when he had the scouting info.
Yeah he waited very late I mean his corsairs saw them moving so I don't know why he delayed so much. His building placement in his nat were also very tight, didn't look like he could put many cannons down.
Now that you say that, I think it's true. But if so, his decision to go 2-stargate makes less sense, unless he was expecting to kill gazillion ovies before Effort could macro up. But if so, then that would've been a very dangerous build to execute, because he'd be screwed if he failed as demonstrated in the game. No reason to do so, especially when he's ahead given that drone kill.
On August 11 2010 19:06 Zona wrote: Wonder if Leta will try his best...both Effort and Bisu's chance at tiebreakers depends on him.
On August 11 2010 18:56 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Then again if Leta loses he might get Flash in RO8 (as he is Group A 2nd place), If he wins maybe Jaedong. Don't know which one is better.
Well let's face it, either player is going to run Leta into the ground. Playing Flash is probably less painful since Leta is already rock solid at TvT.
On August 11 2010 18:56 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Then again if Leta loses he might get Flash in RO8 (as he is Group A 2nd place), If he wins maybe Jaedong. Don't know which one is better.
Well Leta also has beaten both Bisu and Effort, so he is not afraid of them. Also Bisu and Effort could take out stronger competition. So it works both ways. Leta is going to try to win.
On August 11 2010 18:56 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Then again if Leta loses he might get Flash in RO8 (as he is Group A 2nd place), If he wins maybe Jaedong. Don't know which one is better.
Question is in what kind of MU Leta has more confidence in. Based on his prior experience, he'll go for a win and want to MU a Zerg so he can do his Wraith builds.
On August 11 2010 19:06 Zona wrote: Wonder if Leta will try his best...both Effort and Bisu's chance at tiebreakers depends on him.
On August 11 2010 18:56 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Then again if Leta loses he might get Flash in RO8 (as he is Group A 2nd place), If he wins maybe Jaedong. Don't know which one is better.
Question is in what kind of MU Leta has more confidence in. Based on his prior experience, he'll go for a win and want to MU a Zerg so he can do his Wraith builds.
Leta's gimmicky TvZ builds have never seemed to work vs Jaedong though. Seriously a rock and a hard place situation
but I guess he should win a game sometime so its fine, even yellow beat bisu once
Those games are more than a year old. EffOrt has a 71% ZvP, welcome to 2010!
look at his stats back in 2009, Im sure they were even more impressive (88.89%)
His stats were not 88,9%, they were 58% ZvP. Where are you getting your numbers from? =/
you actually linked me to his stats from 2008 and some games till May 2009 but whatever
Effort is the shit
No, i linked you to stats from somewhere in 2007 (when effort started playing) till mid 2009 (when he played Bisu and lost). Which defined his ZvP at the time.
but I guess he should win a game sometime so its fine, even yellow beat bisu once
Those games are more than a year old. EffOrt has a 71% ZvP, welcome to 2010!
look at his stats back in 2009, Im sure they were even more impressive (88.89%)
His stats were not 88,9%, they were 58% ZvP. Where are you getting your numbers from? =/
you actually linked me to his stats from 2008 and some games till May 2009 but whatever
Effort is the shit
No, i linked you to stats from somewhere in 2007 (when effort started playing) till mid 2009 (when he played Bisu and lost). Which defined his ZvP at the time.
good thing people and effort himself talked about "Effort from 2009" then nevermind indeed, its all pointless, your guy won, lets celebrate like brothers
As much as I like Bisu his decision-making in the last 2-3 weeks has been farken killing me.
Fact is he doesn't deserve to be in the Ro8 the way he's playing atm.
I'm as pissed as any Bisu fan about that last game, but you can't deny that Effort deserved the win. It ruins the rest of the night (over here) for me, but such is life as a Bisu fan atm
Zero really seems to have matured as a player. I haven't seen any more of that "prince of the zerg" and "impress the fans" bullshit in a while, and he just seems pretty comfortable in the booth. While not a favorite to win a starleague, he's been pretty consistently hitting the ro8. I might have to change my opinion of him from an annoying attention whore to a respectable player.
On August 11 2010 19:19 integral wrote: Zero really seems to have matured as a player. I haven't seen any more of that "prince of the zerg" and "impress the fans" bullshit in a while, and he just seems pretty comfortable in the booth. While not a favorite to win a starleague, he's been pretty consistently hitting the ro8. I might have to change my opinion of him from an annoying attention whore to a respectable player.
What? So going against the mechanical mainstream, and playing unorthodox and fun to watch strategies - with putting up results! - is now "attention whoring"?
On August 11 2010 19:19 integral wrote: Zero really seems to have matured as a player. I haven't seen any more of that "prince of the zerg" and "impress the fans" bullshit in a while, and he just seems pretty comfortable in the booth. While not a favorite to win a starleague, he's been pretty consistently hitting the ro8. I might have to change my opinion of him from an annoying attention whore to a respectable player.
What? So going against the mechanical mainstream, and playing unorthodox and fun to watch strategies - with putting up results! - is now "attention whoring"?
It's not what he did, it was why he was doing it, giving himself that nickname prince of the zerg and trying to use queens in a game... it was gimmicky, like a self-promoting marketing ploy.
On August 11 2010 19:19 integral wrote: Zero really seems to have matured as a player. I haven't seen any more of that "prince of the zerg" and "impress the fans" bullshit in a while, and he just seems pretty comfortable in the booth. While not a favorite to win a starleague, he's been pretty consistently hitting the ro8. I might have to change my opinion of him from an annoying attention whore to a respectable player.
I dunno really, zero has always seemed to me to be a really streaky player--he had that crazy zvp streak a while back, and then for a long time did nothing of real note. He's on fire now, and it's pretty awesome to see him like this, but it remains to be seen if he can keep going if he hits a couple stumbling blocks.
On August 11 2010 19:19 integral wrote: Zero really seems to have matured as a player. I haven't seen any more of that "prince of the zerg" and "impress the fans" bullshit in a while, and he just seems pretty comfortable in the booth. While not a favorite to win a starleague, he's been pretty consistently hitting the ro8. I might have to change my opinion of him from an annoying attention whore to a respectable player.
but that would be calling every progamer that ever did anything innovative or new
On August 11 2010 19:21 Yxes2211 wrote: Im calling a JD run-by right now
I might have to go with you on this call. Pure's gonna play super greedy in an attempt to get some advantage and JD will just punch him in the face(metaphorically).
On August 11 2010 19:19 integral wrote: Zero really seems to have matured as a player. I haven't seen any more of that "prince of the zerg" and "impress the fans" bullshit in a while, and he just seems pretty comfortable in the booth. While not a favorite to win a starleague, he's been pretty consistently hitting the ro8. I might have to change my opinion of him from an annoying attention whore to a respectable player.
The thing is, he was always like that. He would occasionally play a creative game or two by abusing maps, or giving some fanservice after a lead, but he was one of the most solid macro zvters and zvpers ever. Once the Ro32s/Ro16s start he would start playing incredible SC and go on insane streaks with solid solid play, and it falls apart once he reaches the ro8 and has to face a good zerg or flash and would go on losing streaks. He can play S-class for a while, then he goes to being a B/A player which is frustrating for a fan.
On August 11 2010 19:21 Yxes2211 wrote: Im calling a JD run-by right now
I might have to go with you on this call. Pure's gonna play super greedy in an attempt to get some advantage and JD will just punch him in the face(metaphorically).
On August 11 2010 19:19 integral wrote: Zero really seems to have matured as a player. I haven't seen any more of that "prince of the zerg" and "impress the fans" bullshit in a while, and he just seems pretty comfortable in the booth. While not a favorite to win a starleague, he's been pretty consistently hitting the ro8. I might have to change my opinion of him from an annoying attention whore to a respectable player.
What? So going against the mechanical mainstream, and playing unorthodox and fun to watch strategies - with putting up results! - is now "attention whoring"?
It's not what he did, it was why he was doing it, giving himself that nickname prince of the zerg and trying to use queens in a game... it was gimmicky, like a self-promoting marketing ploy.
how did you know he was doing it for those reasons?
On August 11 2010 19:19 integral wrote: Zero really seems to have matured as a player. I haven't seen any more of that "prince of the zerg" and "impress the fans" bullshit in a while, and he just seems pretty comfortable in the booth. While not a favorite to win a starleague, he's been pretty consistently hitting the ro8. I might have to change my opinion of him from an annoying attention whore to a respectable player.
What? So going against the mechanical mainstream, and playing unorthodox and fun to watch strategies - with putting up results! - is now "attention whoring"?
It's not what he did, it was why he was doing it, giving himself that nickname prince of the zerg and trying to use queens in a game... it was gimmicky, like a self-promoting marketing ploy.
Whats wrong with trying to use queens ? I still say that if they are used right they can be pretty useful in all MUs ...
Hyuk had higher APM in every category but it didn't help
Hyuk somehow wasn't able to really get a good arc with his lings in the first attack - lots of lings left behind the front line and the sunken break was pretty bad...
On August 11 2010 19:19 integral wrote: Zero really seems to have matured as a player. I haven't seen any more of that "prince of the zerg" and "impress the fans" bullshit in a while, and he just seems pretty comfortable in the booth. While not a favorite to win a starleague, he's been pretty consistently hitting the ro8. I might have to change my opinion of him from an annoying attention whore to a respectable player.
What? So going against the mechanical mainstream, and playing unorthodox and fun to watch strategies - with putting up results! - is now "attention whoring"?
It's not what he did, it was why he was doing it, giving himself that nickname prince of the zerg and trying to use queens in a game... it was gimmicky, like a self-promoting marketing ploy.
how did you know he was doing it for those reasons?
But the sunken placement was good too - not much area for Hyuk to attack, and again lots of his lings were left behind until he belatedly tried to get them around the hatchery, but it was already too late then.
On August 11 2010 19:19 integral wrote: Zero really seems to have matured as a player. I haven't seen any more of that "prince of the zerg" and "impress the fans" bullshit in a while, and he just seems pretty comfortable in the booth. While not a favorite to win a starleague, he's been pretty consistently hitting the ro8. I might have to change my opinion of him from an annoying attention whore to a respectable player.
What? So going against the mechanical mainstream, and playing unorthodox and fun to watch strategies - with putting up results! - is now "attention whoring"?
It's not what he did, it was why he was doing it, giving himself that nickname prince of the zerg and trying to use queens in a game... it was gimmicky, like a self-promoting marketing ploy.
Whats wrong with trying to use queens ? I still say that if they are used right they can be pretty useful in all MUs ...
On August 11 2010 19:19 integral wrote: Zero really seems to have matured as a player. I haven't seen any more of that "prince of the zerg" and "impress the fans" bullshit in a while, and he just seems pretty comfortable in the booth. While not a favorite to win a starleague, he's been pretty consistently hitting the ro8. I might have to change my opinion of him from an annoying attention whore to a respectable player.
What? So going against the mechanical mainstream, and playing unorthodox and fun to watch strategies - with putting up results! - is now "attention whoring"?
It's not what he did, it was why he was doing it, giving himself that nickname prince of the zerg and trying to use queens in a game... it was gimmicky, like a self-promoting marketing ploy.
Could you quote where he gave himself the prince of the zerg nickname? I'm doubious.
He showed a completely viable queen strategy against Bisu on HBR, then abused some map imbalance with it against Kal. He used queens in ZvZ too once, but its known that pure muta gets counter-productive after a while, and the answer is either ensnare, or hive tech.
All in all, I don't see your point. It seems like you might have a grudge against Zero fanboys, and that Zero gave them ground for whatever nicknames they liked, that is no reason to hate the player.
On August 11 2010 19:19 integral wrote: Zero really seems to have matured as a player. I haven't seen any more of that "prince of the zerg" and "impress the fans" bullshit in a while, and he just seems pretty comfortable in the booth. While not a favorite to win a starleague, he's been pretty consistently hitting the ro8. I might have to change my opinion of him from an annoying attention whore to a respectable player.
What? So going against the mechanical mainstream, and playing unorthodox and fun to watch strategies - with putting up results! - is now "attention whoring"?
It's not what he did, it was why he was doing it, giving himself that nickname prince of the zerg and trying to use queens in a game... it was gimmicky, like a self-promoting marketing ploy.
Whats wrong with trying to use queens ? I still say that if they are used right they can be pretty useful in all MUs ...
Correct. Zero eliminated Bisu from his group in the Lost Saga MSL with much thanks to his clever use of queens (broodlings on templars and infest parasite on archons).
On August 11 2010 19:19 integral wrote: Zero really seems to have matured as a player. I haven't seen any more of that "prince of the zerg" and "impress the fans" bullshit in a while, and he just seems pretty comfortable in the booth. While not a favorite to win a starleague, he's been pretty consistently hitting the ro8. I might have to change my opinion of him from an annoying attention whore to a respectable player.
What? So going against the mechanical mainstream, and playing unorthodox and fun to watch strategies - with putting up results! - is now "attention whoring"?
It's not what he did, it was why he was doing it, giving himself that nickname prince of the zerg and trying to use queens in a game... it was gimmicky, like a self-promoting marketing ploy.
Whats wrong with trying to use queens ? I still say that if they are used right they can be pretty useful in all MUs ...
"It's not what he did, it's why he was doing it."
It's fanservice...
He gives us entertaining games, what do you have to complain about? If it works then it's a fine strategy. Do you even remember the games he went queen on? He abused queens vs that map with a neutral cc vs kal and hwasin, and that game vs Bisu on HBr with a proper strat to snipe HTs with the ledges on that map, and a game vs skyhigh where he was meching. Queens are standard in late game zvz because ensnare destroys stacked mutas.
On August 11 2010 19:19 integral wrote: Zero really seems to have matured as a player. I haven't seen any more of that "prince of the zerg" and "impress the fans" bullshit in a while, and he just seems pretty comfortable in the booth. While not a favorite to win a starleague, he's been pretty consistently hitting the ro8. I might have to change my opinion of him from an annoying attention whore to a respectable player.
I dunno really, zero has always seemed to me to be a really streaky player--he had that crazy zvp streak a while back, and then for a long time did nothing of real note. He's on fire now, and it's pretty awesome to see him like this, but it remains to be seen if he can keep going if he hits a couple stumbling blocks.
yeah I completely agree. Zero could always play at an extremely high level and having this streak right now doesnt mean that much yet, although he says himself that his ZvZ has improved a lot which will be really helpful for him to advance deep. I feel like since calm has an indivitual title, zero should definitely have one.
On August 11 2010 19:29 Elroi wrote: So, does Effort have a chance to advance now?
it's been discussed in this thread to lenghts before. If Leta wins against Action, then Action, Bisu and Effort will play tiebreakers for the second place in the group.
On August 11 2010 19:26 Zona wrote: But the sunken placement was good too - not much area for Hyuk to attack, and again lots of his lings were left behind until he belatedly tried to get them around the hatchery, but it was already too late then.
Yeah, zero's building placement zvz has always been solid. Hyuk's decision making in all-in attacks really seems too desperate at times, and the fine point of his zvz always was his air control, and he was already far behind once spire units popped.
Realistically though, hyuking jokes aside, I don't really think anyone really expected Hyuk to bounce back after losing to Flash on the biggest stage like he did...
On August 11 2010 19:29 purpose wrote: Bah I get back from lunch only to find out that Bisu lost to a hydra bust......cant say I am surprised but still it sucks.
Just another normal day for us protoss players :-(
He lost to hydras, yes, but not to a rush. He lost to a better strategy that delivered a timing attack before he could effectively harass.
EDIT: The way he said it implied some sort of two/three hatch hydra bust with no econ. Saying protoss lost to a 'hydra attack' is kind of like saying terran lost to a recall. It's totally unremarkable.
On August 11 2010 19:30 Vanka wrote: Yeah, zero's building placement zvz has always been solid. Hyuk's decision making in all-in attacks really seems too desperate at times, and the fine point of his zvz always was his air control, and he was already far behind once spire units popped.
Yes! At least last year Hyuk's muta micro was pretty good, good enough to win zvz's against strong zergs. But lately he's been trying to ling break in so many of his games...did his muta micro slip away or something?
On August 11 2010 19:29 purpose wrote: Bah I get back from lunch only to find out that Bisu lost to a hydra bust......cant say I am surprised but still it sucks.
Just another normal day for us protoss players :-(
He lost to hydras, yes, but not to a rush. He lost to a better strategy that delivered a timing attack before he could effectively harass.
On August 11 2010 19:29 purpose wrote: Bah I get back from lunch only to find out that Bisu lost to a hydra bust......cant say I am surprised but still it sucks.
Just another normal day for us protoss players :-(
He lost to hydras, yes, but not to a rush. He lost to a better strategy that delivered a timing attack before he could effectively harass.
No, he lost to building his reaver late and not having enough cannons.
JD looks half asleep...probably relaxing just a little bit before the match starts. Pure actually also puts his finger to his eyes and closes them for a bit. Here's hoping they show us a good game.
On August 11 2010 19:29 purpose wrote: Bah I get back from lunch only to find out that Bisu lost to a hydra bust......cant say I am surprised but still it sucks.
Just another normal day for us protoss players :-(
He lost to hydras, yes, but not to a rush. He lost to a better strategy that delivered a timing attack before he could effectively harass.
or you could tell it as is and say bisu massively fucked up his reaver timing >.> he lost cause he either didnt build the reaver immediately after his support bay finished due to bad multi-tasking or couldnt because he was pylon blocked. Effort did nothing special that game. it was all bisu failing.
Pure scouts JD first try, steals 8 minerals - JD movingshot drone as it moves to deny JD"s nat expo Probe can't do much to delay the nat expo as it has 2 hits left
On August 11 2010 19:29 purpose wrote: Bah I get back from lunch only to find out that Bisu lost to a hydra bust......cant say I am surprised but still it sucks.
Just another normal day for us protoss players :-(
He lost to hydras, yes, but not to a rush. He lost to a better strategy that delivered a timing attack before he could effectively harass.
or you could tell it as is and say bisu massively fucked up his reaver timing >.> he lost cause he either didnt build the reaver immediately after his support bay finished due to bad multi-tasking or couldnt because he was pylon blocked. Effort did nothing special that game. it was all bisu failing.
yeah effort had nothing to do with winning that game. Bisu just failed exactly as hard as he needed to
On August 11 2010 19:29 purpose wrote: Bah I get back from lunch only to find out that Bisu lost to a hydra bust......cant say I am surprised but still it sucks.
Just another normal day for us protoss players :-(
He lost to hydras, yes, but not to a rush. He lost to a better strategy that delivered a timing attack before he could effectively harass.
or you could tell it as is and say bisu massively fucked up his reaver timing >.> he lost cause he either didnt build the reaver immediately after his support bay finished due to bad multi-tasking or couldnt because he was pylon blocked. Effort did nothing special that game. it was all bisu failing.
It's really funny that every game that Bisu loses is him failing, but his opponents never seem to play well against him. He must really suck if he beats bad opponents only some of the time.
On August 11 2010 19:19 integral wrote: Zero really seems to have matured as a player. I haven't seen any more of that "prince of the zerg" and "impress the fans" bullshit in a while, and he just seems pretty comfortable in the booth. While not a favorite to win a starleague, he's been pretty consistently hitting the ro8. I might have to change my opinion of him from an annoying attention whore to a respectable player.
What? So going against the mechanical mainstream, and playing unorthodox and fun to watch strategies - with putting up results! - is now "attention whoring"?
It's not what he did, it was why he was doing it, giving himself that nickname prince of the zerg and trying to use queens in a game... it was gimmicky, like a self-promoting marketing ploy.
Could you quote where he gave himself the prince of the zerg nickname? I'm doubious.
He showed a completely viable queen strategy against Bisu on HBR, then abused some map imbalance with it against Kal. He used queens in ZvZ too once, but its known that pure muta gets counter-productive after a while, and the answer is either ensnare, or hive tech.
All in all, I don't see your point. It seems like you might have a grudge against Zero fanboys, and that Zero gave them ground for whatever nicknames they liked, that is no reason to hate the player.
Wow people are really bad at understanding nuance. I don't hate the kid, and I don't have a grudge against zero fanboys. I was noticing a trend of zero maturing over time.
A year ago, zero was 68 wins - 74 losses (47.89%) and was hovering around 50% in all matchups. He was a player who was putting up barely mediocre results. He kept getting sent out, yeah, but so did every zerg on every team at that time -- which was doubly embarrassing since he couldn't ZvZ to save his life. His games were often absolutely painful.
Anyway, for how lackluster his results were, he sure was accepting a lot of accolades for his "innovative" queen play in his interviews. The prince of the zerg nickname was extremely presumptuous for him considering these results, and it annoyed me. In interviews, players like jaedong and flash almost always had an air of humility and determination ("I will work harder") despite how badass they are -- meanwhile zero was like "teehee I'll use queens because I like the attention, I'm the prince of the zerg!" I consider this to be immature.
This is my perception, my opinion, it's not truth and you're welcome to disagree.
Pure completely lost his drive. walks zealots into lings without attacking, loses his sairs to a ton of scourge, and lets his archon get surrounded by lings.
On August 11 2010 19:29 purpose wrote: Bah I get back from lunch only to find out that Bisu lost to a hydra bust......cant say I am surprised but still it sucks.
Just another normal day for us protoss players :-(
He lost to hydras, yes, but not to a rush. He lost to a better strategy that delivered a timing attack before he could effectively harass.
or you could tell it as is and say bisu massively fucked up his reaver timing >.> he lost cause he either didnt build the reaver immediately after his support bay finished due to bad multi-tasking or couldnt because he was pylon blocked. Effort did nothing special that game. it was all bisu failing.
It's really funny that every game that Bisu loses is him failing, but his opponents never seem to play well against him. He must really suck if he beats bad opponents only some of the time.
He hasnt been sucking as much lately, but this game brought back the suck from his recent slump pretty hard. You have to admit effort did nothing special there. Not saying that if bisu hadnt fucked this up he woulda won, im 100% sure effort would beat him if it got to later stages. Just saying that it didnt get to that not because effort did something clever or played super well, but because bisu just fucked up
On August 11 2010 19:29 purpose wrote: Bah I get back from lunch only to find out that Bisu lost to a hydra bust......cant say I am surprised but still it sucks.
Just another normal day for us protoss players :-(
He lost to hydras, yes, but not to a rush. He lost to a better strategy that delivered a timing attack before he could effectively harass.
or you could tell it as is and say bisu massively fucked up his reaver timing >.> he lost cause he either didnt build the reaver immediately after his support bay finished due to bad multi-tasking or couldnt because he was pylon blocked. Effort did nothing special that game. it was all bisu failing.
It's really funny that every game that Bisu loses is him failing, but his opponents never seem to play well against him. He must really suck if he beats bad opponents only some of the time.
He hasnt been sucking as much lately, but this game brought back the suck from his recent slump pretty hard. You have to admit effort did nothing special there. Not saying that if bisu hadnt fucked this up he woulda won, im 100% sure effort would beat him if it got to later stages. Just saying that it didnt get to that not because effort did something clever or played super well, but because bisu just fucked up
What happened was par for the course, Bisu made calculated moves like getting an earlier shuttle for a later reaver, and going double stargate to put the pressure on. EffOrt didn't show anything revolutionary, it's true, but he responded well to what was dealt to him.
Also, that was my favorite gg timing ever. Completely correct, but there was no massive battle or anything.
Effort did do something special there: He got overlord speed, avoided the rape and punished Bisu with excellent control. It's ludicrous to say he didn't do anything special when most Zergs would have folded to Bisu. Give credit where it's due and stop complaining.
On August 11 2010 19:29 purpose wrote: Bah I get back from lunch only to find out that Bisu lost to a hydra bust......cant say I am surprised but still it sucks.
Just another normal day for us protoss players :-(
He lost to hydras, yes, but not to a rush. He lost to a better strategy that delivered a timing attack before he could effectively harass.
or you could tell it as is and say bisu massively fucked up his reaver timing >.> he lost cause he either didnt build the reaver immediately after his support bay finished due to bad multi-tasking or couldnt because he was pylon blocked. Effort did nothing special that game. it was all bisu failing.
It's really funny that every game that Bisu loses is him failing, but his opponents never seem to play well against him. He must really suck if he beats bad opponents only some of the time.
He hasnt been sucking as much lately, but this game brought back the suck from his recent slump pretty hard. You have to admit effort did nothing special there. Not saying that if bisu hadnt fucked this up he woulda won, im 100% sure effort would beat him if it got to later stages. Just saying that it didnt get to that not because effort did something clever or played super well, but because bisu just fucked up
What happened was par for the course, Bisu made calculated moves like getting an earlier shuttle for a later reaver, and going double stargate to put the pressure on. EffOrt didn't show anything revolutionary, it's true, but he responded well to what was dealt to him.
Also, that was my favorite gg timing ever. Completely correct, but there was no massive battle or anything.
watch the replay. the robo facility sat idle for 10-20 seconds after the support bay was done. this wasnt a case of Bisu playing risky and delaying the reaver, he just fucked up, either with pylons or his multi-tasking.
I should know it better but evertime when a player like Jaedong shows that another _PRO_gamer is a noob compared to him I'm really surprised. I will never understand how this gameplay is possible.^^
On August 11 2010 19:29 purpose wrote: Bah I get back from lunch only to find out that Bisu lost to a hydra bust......cant say I am surprised but still it sucks.
Just another normal day for us protoss players :-(
He lost to hydras, yes, but not to a rush. He lost to a better strategy that delivered a timing attack before he could effectively harass.
or you could tell it as is and say bisu massively fucked up his reaver timing >.> he lost cause he either didnt build the reaver immediately after his support bay finished due to bad multi-tasking or couldnt because he was pylon blocked. Effort did nothing special that game. it was all bisu failing.
It's really funny that every game that Bisu loses is him failing, but his opponents never seem to play well against him. He must really suck if he beats bad opponents only some of the time.
He hasnt been sucking as much lately, but this game brought back the suck from his recent slump pretty hard. You have to admit effort did nothing special there. Not saying that if bisu hadnt fucked this up he woulda won, im 100% sure effort would beat him if it got to later stages. Just saying that it didnt get to that not because effort did something clever or played super well, but because bisu just fucked up
What happened was par for the course, Bisu made calculated moves like getting an earlier shuttle for a later reaver, and going double stargate to put the pressure on. EffOrt didn't show anything revolutionary, it's true, but he responded well to what was dealt to him.
Also, that was my favorite gg timing ever. Completely correct, but there was no massive battle or anything.
watch the replay. the robo facility sat idle for 10-20 seconds after the support bay was done. this wasnt a case of Bisu playing risky and delaying the reaver, he just fucked up, either with pylons or his multi-tasking.
Maybe he was just spending the money on canons to actually survive the push? So he cut unit production and spammed canons?
It's not like 1 reaver and 3 units and 3 canons will actually hold 2 groups of hydraling with more streaming off multiple hatches.
On August 11 2010 19:29 purpose wrote: Bah I get back from lunch only to find out that Bisu lost to a hydra bust......cant say I am surprised but still it sucks.
Just another normal day for us protoss players :-(
He lost to hydras, yes, but not to a rush. He lost to a better strategy that delivered a timing attack before he could effectively harass.
or you could tell it as is and say bisu massively fucked up his reaver timing >.> he lost cause he either didnt build the reaver immediately after his support bay finished due to bad multi-tasking or couldnt because he was pylon blocked. Effort did nothing special that game. it was all bisu failing.
It's really funny that every game that Bisu loses is him failing, but his opponents never seem to play well against him. He must really suck if he beats bad opponents only some of the time.
He hasnt been sucking as much lately, but this game brought back the suck from his recent slump pretty hard. You have to admit effort did nothing special there. Not saying that if bisu hadnt fucked this up he woulda won, im 100% sure effort would beat him if it got to later stages. Just saying that it didnt get to that not because effort did something clever or played super well, but because bisu just fucked up
What happened was par for the course, Bisu made calculated moves like getting an earlier shuttle for a later reaver, and going double stargate to put the pressure on. EffOrt didn't show anything revolutionary, it's true, but he responded well to what was dealt to him.
Also, that was my favorite gg timing ever. Completely correct, but there was no massive battle or anything.
watch the replay. the robo facility sat idle for 10-20 seconds after the support bay was done. this wasnt a case of Bisu playing risky and delaying the reaver, he just fucked up, either with pylons or his multi-tasking.
Maybe he was just spending the money on canons to actually survive the push? So he cut unit production and spammed canons?
It's not like 1 reaver and 3 units and 3 canons will actually hold 2 groups of hydraling with more streaming off multiple hatches.
And EffOrt lost a drone in the beginning. So his screw-up didn't matter and Bisu's did?
On August 11 2010 19:56 dkpl wrote: Just tuning in now to see I'm so far 3/3 in LB :D
So all SKT players are either 1:2 or 0:3? Well I guess that's to be expected from all the after-grandfinals drinking
To be fair, the favorites have won every game. (And if you didn't consider EffOrt the favorite, they were very tight, I'll give you that.)
On August 11 2010 19:29 purpose wrote: Bah I get back from lunch only to find out that Bisu lost to a hydra bust......cant say I am surprised but still it sucks.
Just another normal day for us protoss players :-(
He lost to hydras, yes, but not to a rush. He lost to a better strategy that delivered a timing attack before he could effectively harass.
or you could tell it as is and say bisu massively fucked up his reaver timing >.> he lost cause he either didnt build the reaver immediately after his support bay finished due to bad multi-tasking or couldnt because he was pylon blocked. Effort did nothing special that game. it was all bisu failing.
It's really funny that every game that Bisu loses is him failing, but his opponents never seem to play well against him. He must really suck if he beats bad opponents only some of the time.
He hasnt been sucking as much lately, but this game brought back the suck from his recent slump pretty hard. You have to admit effort did nothing special there. Not saying that if bisu hadnt fucked this up he woulda won, im 100% sure effort would beat him if it got to later stages. Just saying that it didnt get to that not because effort did something clever or played super well, but because bisu just fucked up
What happened was par for the course, Bisu made calculated moves like getting an earlier shuttle for a later reaver, and going double stargate to put the pressure on. EffOrt didn't show anything revolutionary, it's true, but he responded well to what was dealt to him.
Also, that was my favorite gg timing ever. Completely correct, but there was no massive battle or anything.
watch the replay. the robo facility sat idle for 10-20 seconds after the support bay was done. this wasnt a case of Bisu playing risky and delaying the reaver, he just fucked up, either with pylons or his multi-tasking.
Maybe he was just spending the money on canons to actually survive the push? So he cut unit production and spammed canons?
It's not like 1 reaver and 3 units and 3 canons will actually hold 2 groups of hydraling with more streaming off multiple hatches.
he had PLENTY of money. =.= there is literally no excuse, he just didnt build the reaver. he might have been pylon blocked, i couldnt see the supply count because the livestream banner blocked it =.=
also 1 reaver behind cannons/zlots woulda been plenty to hold off that hydra bust
On August 11 2010 19:55 Miragee wrote: I should know it better but evertime when a player like Jaedong shows that another _PRO_gamer is a noob compared to him I'm really surprised. I will never understand how this gameplay is possible.^^
Its not surprising, Pure literally did not want to be there from the get go.
Same thing happened in Flash vs Free in the MSL. Pure basically asking to be raped was nearly as painful to watch too, only a bit better because its PvZ and its only a single game instead of three.
On August 11 2010 19:29 purpose wrote: Bah I get back from lunch only to find out that Bisu lost to a hydra bust......cant say I am surprised but still it sucks.
Just another normal day for us protoss players :-(
He lost to hydras, yes, but not to a rush. He lost to a better strategy that delivered a timing attack before he could effectively harass.
or you could tell it as is and say bisu massively fucked up his reaver timing >.> he lost cause he either didnt build the reaver immediately after his support bay finished due to bad multi-tasking or couldnt because he was pylon blocked. Effort did nothing special that game. it was all bisu failing.
It's really funny that every game that Bisu loses is him failing, but his opponents never seem to play well against him. He must really suck if he beats bad opponents only some of the time.
He hasnt been sucking as much lately, but this game brought back the suck from his recent slump pretty hard. You have to admit effort did nothing special there. Not saying that if bisu hadnt fucked this up he woulda won, im 100% sure effort would beat him if it got to later stages. Just saying that it didnt get to that not because effort did something clever or played super well, but because bisu just fucked up
What happened was par for the course, Bisu made calculated moves like getting an earlier shuttle for a later reaver, and going double stargate to put the pressure on. EffOrt didn't show anything revolutionary, it's true, but he responded well to what was dealt to him.
Also, that was my favorite gg timing ever. Completely correct, but there was no massive battle or anything.
watch the replay. the robo facility sat idle for 10-20 seconds after the support bay was done. this wasnt a case of Bisu playing risky and delaying the reaver, he just fucked up, either with pylons or his multi-tasking.
Maybe he was just spending the money on canons to actually survive the push? So he cut unit production and spammed canons?
It's not like 1 reaver and 3 units and 3 canons will actually hold 2 groups of hydraling with more streaming off multiple hatches.
And EffOrt lost a drone in the beginning. So his screw-up didn't matter and Bisu's did?
he forgot to make the most important unit in his build. that trumps losing a single worker. That one screw up lost bisu the game, period.
On August 11 2010 19:55 Miragee wrote: I should know it better but evertime when a player like Jaedong shows that another _PRO_gamer is a noob compared to him I'm really surprised. I will never understand how this gameplay is possible.^^
Its not surprising, Pure literally did not want to be there from the get go.
Same thing happened in Flash vs Free in the MSL. Pure basically asking to be raped was nearly as painful to watch too, only a bit better because its PvZ and its only a single game instead of three.
Jesus >.< Don't remind me >.< stayed up all frickin night to watch that travesty Dx
Slightly louder cheers as Stork is introduced. Samsung could use a uniform change. Stork gets the chubby boothgirl, the booth which contained the losing players on both of the previous games.
On August 11 2010 19:55 Fenrax wrote: What is it with Wombo Combo? Why did they frak out so much? For someone who never played Smash Bros.?
It's not a real combo (or wasn't until that point), and wasn't anything particularly notable.
In SSBM, when you're playing 2v1 in teams, you can generally combo someone really hard, full to dead.
So when Zhu's ally died, the commentators/crowd got a little excited, figuring that they'd see something cool. But for whatever reason (passion of the moment, I guess) they just go crazy over-the-top with their cheering and it's memorable for that ridiculousness. Combo itself isn't anything particularly notable, just sorta a funny overreaction that caught on and went viral, so to speak.
Anyways, back to Starcraft. Hopefully Free and Stork can put up a decent game for us here and make up for an otherwise fairly disappointing night.
On August 11 2010 19:29 purpose wrote: Bah I get back from lunch only to find out that Bisu lost to a hydra bust......cant say I am surprised but still it sucks.
Just another normal day for us protoss players :-(
He lost to hydras, yes, but not to a rush. He lost to a better strategy that delivered a timing attack before he could effectively harass.
or you could tell it as is and say bisu massively fucked up his reaver timing >.> he lost cause he either didnt build the reaver immediately after his support bay finished due to bad multi-tasking or couldnt because he was pylon blocked. Effort did nothing special that game. it was all bisu failing.
It's really funny that every game that Bisu loses is him failing, but his opponents never seem to play well against him. He must really suck if he beats bad opponents only some of the time.
He hasnt been sucking as much lately, but this game brought back the suck from his recent slump pretty hard. You have to admit effort did nothing special there. Not saying that if bisu hadnt fucked this up he woulda won, im 100% sure effort would beat him if it got to later stages. Just saying that it didnt get to that not because effort did something clever or played super well, but because bisu just fucked up
What happened was par for the course, Bisu made calculated moves like getting an earlier shuttle for a later reaver, and going double stargate to put the pressure on. EffOrt didn't show anything revolutionary, it's true, but he responded well to what was dealt to him.
Also, that was my favorite gg timing ever. Completely correct, but there was no massive battle or anything.
watch the replay. the robo facility sat idle for 10-20 seconds after the support bay was done. this wasnt a case of Bisu playing risky and delaying the reaver, he just fucked up, either with pylons or his multi-tasking.
Maybe he was just spending the money on canons to actually survive the push? So he cut unit production and spammed canons?
It's not like 1 reaver and 3 units and 3 canons will actually hold 2 groups of hydraling with more streaming off multiple hatches.
And EffOrt lost a drone in the beginning. So his screw-up didn't matter and Bisu's did?
he forgot to make the most important unit in his build. that trumps losing a single worker. That one screw up lost bisu the game, period.
Fine, the only reason Bisu lost is because he is retarded. You can have it your way.
On August 11 2010 19:55 Miragee wrote: I should know it better but evertime when a player like Jaedong shows that another _PRO_gamer is a noob compared to him I'm really surprised. I will never understand how this gameplay is possible.^^
Its not surprising, Pure literally did not want to be there from the get go.
Pure looked really focused and ready. For all of his failings in-game, he looked extremely prepared out of it. Jaedong doesn't have a monopoly on looking really focused, it's just that he's the only player who turns that face into wins.
I will never get sick of seeing EffOrt first in the OSL intro.
On August 11 2010 19:59 Zona wrote: Slightly louder cheers as Stork is introduced. Samsung could use a uniform change. Stork gets the chubby boothgirl, the booth which contained the losing players on both of the previous games.
She's chubby? Say what? Jebus... some of you have some odd standards.
On August 11 2010 19:55 Miragee wrote: I should know it better but evertime when a player like Jaedong shows that another _PRO_gamer is a noob compared to him I'm really surprised. I will never understand how this gameplay is possible.^^
Its not surprising, Pure literally did not want to be there from the get go.
Pure looked really focused and ready. For all of his failings in-game, he looked extremely prepared out of it. Jaedong doesn't have a monopoly on looking really focused, it's just that he's the only player who turns that face into wins.
I will never get sick of seeing EffOrt first in the OSL intro.
I really disagree he was already looking nervous as hell and it became even worse after he lost his first corsairs. The face after after losing his corsairs was the face of defeat and despair.
Stork's core spinning - did free's probe see it before it died? Stork successfully retreats his scouting probe from free's base free also getting range.
Stork sends a good all the way to free's bridge to get some shots off on free's zealot but it withdraws as Stork loses his scouting probe he sent in from the right to goons
free starts his 3rd, storks DT kills a probe at top right and scouts 3 o clock for an expo. free's DT snipes a probe at storks min only about to expand!
He wins some points for pylon-blocking Free's double gas expo, but Stork is still economically behind. He has to win a fight or harass like a motherfucker.
free threatening to attack with his main army alongside the left while 8 speedlots trying to get to storks 3rd. stork trying to hold everywhere. frees speedlots deny stork top right
Looking at how the other groups shake out, I almost daresay Stork was probably more motivated to not win today? If he finishes second, he's almost sure to face a terran player next round, since they're all first in their groups. (Leta, Sea or Flash)
On August 11 2010 20:27 Noxide wrote: Fun to watch but poor Stork. He will get revenge in the Ro8...against somebody.
Unless something strange happens Stork will have a good set of terran opponents in Leta Sea and Flash . Giving that PvT is his best MU he should be happy .
While Free will most likely play one of Zero Jaedong and Action Bisu or Effort .
On August 11 2010 20:29 Gnabgib wrote: Looking at how the other groups shake out, I almost daresay Stork was probably more motivated to not win today? If he finishes second, he's almost sure to face a terran player next round, since they're all first in their groups. (Leta, Sea or Flash)
Even if he is more confident in PvT, I doubt he'll relish playing any of those in their current form.
On August 11 2010 20:29 Gnabgib wrote: Looking at how the other groups shake out, I almost daresay Stork was probably more motivated to not win today? If he finishes second, he's almost sure to face a terran player next round, since they're all first in their groups. (Leta, Sea or Flash)
Even if he is more confident in PvT, I doubt he'll relish playing any of those in their current form.
So what is the deal now in the ro8? Is it already decided who plays who or do they draw that when all groups are done?
I see that some people claim that Free will play Jaedong if Sea win his game, but then some people say that he will play one of the 2n finishers in the other groups?
On August 11 2010 21:23 purpose wrote: So what is the deal now in the ro8? Is it already decided who plays who or do they draw that when all groups are done?
I see that some people claim that Free will play Jaedong if Sea win his game, but then some people say that he will play one of the 2n finishers in the other groups?
I'm pretty sure they draw every 2nd place finisher randomly against one of the 3 1st place finishers not in his group. So we currently have no idea who will meet who. In particular since we only know the complete outcome of 1 group so far.
I want a protoss to win this OSL, didn't want 100 hours of tie-breakers courtesy of Effort (remember last OSL) but looks like Bisu couldn't pull it through.
On August 11 2010 22:01 OpticalShot wrote: I want a protoss to win this OSL, didn't want 100 hours of tie-breakers courtesy of Effort (remember last OSL) but looks like Bisu couldn't pull it through.
If you want a protoss winner you should be rooting for Free and Stork , because they can win in PvT .
On August 11 2010 20:29 Gnabgib wrote: Looking at how the other groups shake out, I almost daresay Stork was probably more motivated to not win today? If he finishes second, he's almost sure to face a terran player next round, since they're all first in their groups. (Leta, Sea or Flash)
Even if he is more confident in PvT, I doubt he'll relish playing any of those in their current form.
BISU... T_T. Alright Leta, time to go 3-0 and let Bisu go through in tie-breaker. free, you're PvP confuses me. You beat Kal, then lose 1-2 to Pure, then beat Stork? What.
On August 12 2010 01:08 bokchoi wrote: BISU... T_T. Alright Leta, time to go 3-0 and let Bisu go through in tie-breaker. free, you're PvP confuses me. You beat Kal, then lose 1-2 to Pure, then beat Stork? What.
EDIT: wow, i've just been plummeting in lb
Didn't think that Stork was practicing, I think Stork was just like "w.e"
Leta if you lose on Friday I'm going to be so mad. Leta/Action advancing instead of Leta/Bisu or Leta/Effort is just mehhhh. I mean Action is a great player and all, but I just want Bisu or Effort in the quarterfinals for entertainment value.
On August 12 2010 02:23 3 Lions wrote: Leta if you lose on Friday I'm going to be so mad. Leta/Action advancing instead of Leta/Bisu or Leta/Effort is just mehhhh. I mean Action is a great player and all, but I just want Bisu or Effort in the quarterfinals for entertainment value.
Hey Action's lategame Defiler management play is entertaining! Its better than Efforts!
if leta is an ass and throws his game, both bisu and effort are eliminated. interesting.... but in his situation (FA) he should probably give his best in every game.
On August 11 2010 19:43 Fenrax wrote: This runby is becoming a running gag. That this happened in like ~ 6-7 of 8 of the last JvP is an embarassment for Protoss Pros.
6 or 7 in the last 8? I'm trying to remember a game when Jaedong didn't do a ling runby and I'm drawing a blank. I can only hypothesize that Protoss players are practicing against people who aren't as good at it, because it's not like they're caught by surprise when Jaedong goes for it. I mean, everyone including the Protoss player must know it's coming :p
EPT
![[image loading]](http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/SilverskY/KoreanAirOSLS2.jpg)
Bisu < Flight-Dreamliner > 
EffOrt
Leta: 2-0![[image loading]](http://i41.tinypic.com/2a8romg.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i42.tinypic.com/2dvsjvc.jpg)
+ Show Spoiler +![[image loading]](http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y150/Stormalong/bonus3.jpg)
. His OSL loss was overcommitting to Mutas.
![[image loading]](http://aasi.ebm.fi/4265/ostrich_vs_elephant.gif)
Jebus... some of you have some odd standards.![[image loading]](http://i35.tinypic.com/1zbawbt.png)
Forgot to check, I just gave up after wfbrood and nevake didn't have them.
