hmm it seemed Twisted / Midian figured zvt forte out decently (so they claim) one of them should post reps.

my zvt here is still very risky / aggressive and isnt a safe/strong thing to advocate :D

Cloud

Sexico5880 Posts

October 29 2005 04:53 GMT

#62

I played a tvz, in that map, he expoed secretly to another main pretty soon, im almost sure it was his 2nd hatch. After that, he made mutas and kept me contained for a while(i had already expoed and he was 2 gas mutas), he had sunkens in his bases and since they were above a ramp, it was pretty impossible to break with only mnm. So he kept me contained, expoed twice and switched to lurks. Then i somehow got the upperhands with my valks and 2 factory tanks but i still spent 15 minutes killing him because of stupid defilers.

Cloud

Sexico5880 Posts

October 29 2005 04:53 GMT

#63

But that looked like a cool build

[GiTM]-Ace

United States4935 Posts

October 29 2005 20:01 GMT

#64

they dont the tank rush and any of the pro reps T_T

NovaTheFeared

United States7232 Posts

October 29 2005 20:25 GMT

#65

I'd like to hear some theory on ZvT in this map because I'm getting gayed a lot of the time:

Replay

Also looking at the statistics on PGT Terran is dominating this map like crazy :/ I think I'll play on Bifrost instead of Forte 'til MOTW changes unless Midian comes to save the day and tell us how to play this mu.

k3fka

Argentina1267 Posts

October 30 2005 00:02 GMT

#66

z vs t on forte is probably like z vs t in guillotine, just play it like you used to.

iNcontroL

USA29055 Posts

October 30 2005 00:58 GMT

#67

no its really not. And im really really interested in seeing how you draw the comparison. Guillotine have a shrunken ramp with a tiny initial platform? Guillotine is a bigger map than Forte. Butyeah please explain!

k3fka

Argentina1267 Posts

October 30 2005 03:09 GMT

#68

but you said your problem was early game , since you have to 3 hatch to secure an expo and die easily to fast tank push so youll have to 12 hatch choke. However theres a build that is particulary different from guillotine that blackman did vs raven. Make your chole hatch close to the minerals of your exp and go 2 hatch and you can still go lurk or play it like nostalgia.

YoUr_KiLLeR

United States3420 Posts

October 30 2005 10:06 GMT

#69

control, or any other zergs here, how have you guys dealt with fast expoing T's on this map?

[GiTM]-Ace

United States4935 Posts

October 30 2005 10:40 GMT

#70

how do u zvt on bifrost while we are at it lol

NovaTheFeared

United States7232 Posts

October 30 2005 11:12 GMT

#71

Fast expo is seriously exposed to harass on Forte more than on something like Luna. You can easily harass the minerals with muta or drop lurkers. I've only had one terran do a true fast expo to me so far, and I think with good reason. The real threat is the fast tank push because of the relatively close distances and the fact that 3 hatch is needed to take expo.

iNcontroL

USA29055 Posts

October 30 2005 16:51 GMT

#72

lotsa t's do a 1 rax / supply block at the mineral spot on Forte this allows them to bunk rush a potential choke hatch and than switch to a fast expo with block build. It is VERY strong, my only advice i guess is 1, sometimes i try 9pool cause most t's build on lower platform as oppose to upper and this can allow for a safe 3 hatch tech to muta/lurk w/e u are comfortable with or 2. stem the rush with drones and scout if you see block know they are most likely FE'ing so either grab another expo (hidden) and go muta contain or try fast lurk for a risky attempt at ending it quick.

NovaTheFeared

United States7232 Posts

October 30 2005 17:37 GMT

#73

I'm hoping for some reasonably balanced motws next time because Bifrost and Forte aren't my idea of fun ZvT.

PhilGood2DaY

Germany7424 Posts

October 31 2005 05:24 GMT

#74

haaard to play the right strategy.. T_T
maybe sacrifice one drone to scout really early ?

uT)Murray

Finland359 Posts

October 31 2005 06:29 GMT

#75

Drop harrassing mainbase is effective I think, it's slow to bring troops to help because of small ramp ~_~

iNcontroL

USA29055 Posts

October 31 2005 07:08 GMT

#76

its getting to the situation where u can drop that is the problem.

YoUr_KiLLeR

United States3420 Posts

October 31 2005 07:22 GMT

#77

i dont know, it seems harder to me to harass on forte than it does on other maps, since the main is so small it seems like its easier to defend, and the T gets a buncha turrets along the cliffside of his natural. i might just be timing my 3rd base wrong and not macroing well enough.

iD.SquaLL

Spain250 Posts

October 31 2005 07:39 GMT

#78

Uhm, I think the best bo there is just making expansion at 12 drone, then play 2 hatch lings lurk, if u see he is playing 2 rax just start pumping lings non stop untill u get get lurk, thats useful against a m&m fast attack, tank push or t expansion. It will be useful to get drop asap that will let you harras his expansion. After u get drop just make 3rd hatch at choke, contain him with some lurk ling, get 1 more expansion, then hive. At this point i use to make guardian so I can stop a posible mass tank attack, etc etc...

YoUr_KiLLeR

United States3420 Posts

October 31 2005 10:09 GMT

#79

i hate bifrost

how do you zergs open on this map? i tried 12 hatch at natural and pumped speedlings to hold off the first m&m wave, but i'm not sure it'd work vs better players. i haven't tried a 3 hatch opening yet. im thinking the 12 hatch at choke and then later take the 2nd gas might work with some proper defending of your main minerals.

edit: oh sorry, dont mean to hijack the thread or anything, but this might make for good discussion

Cloud

Sexico5880 Posts

October 31 2005 10:44 GMT

#80

In the only zvt i have played on bitfrost i did 12 hatch to nat(mineral only) and then the pool and then right away the extractor, then continue with lings to defend against bunk rushes and then right when i hit 100 gas i got lair, my lurkers were soon enough to wall the choke(or at least scare him back) before his mnm were at my door.