EPTiCCup - Reranked! - Page 7
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Kiante
Australia7069 Posts
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blueblimp
Canada297 Posts
On April 01 2013 09:36 blueblimp wrote: This is possible. In general, I'm not a big fan of Win-Loss records. They encourage damaging behaviour like clearing stats and noob-stomping. But since it's only a handful of people that will look at this leaderboard anyway, might as well.  Okay, it now shows win-loss records: http://malcolmsharpe.github.com/iccup-ratings/html/leaderboard.html. Sometimes these are inconsistent with what iCCup shows. For example, superkor[pain] has a 106 - 41 record according to iCCup, but if you look at his matchlist, there are only 23 games there. | ||
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Sum41
Chile345 Posts
On April 01 2013 10:12 blueblimp wrote: Okay, it now shows win-loss records: http://malcolmsharpe.github.com/iccup-ratings/html/leaderboard.html. Sometimes these are inconsistent with what iCCup shows. For example, superkor[pain] has a 106 - 41 record according to iCCup, but if you look at his matchlist, there are only 23 games there. I assume this is some kind of bug in the iCCup website. no, he may have transfered stats | ||
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[sc1f]eonzerg
Belgium6805 Posts
On April 01 2013 10:12 blueblimp wrote: Okay, it now shows win-loss records: http://malcolmsharpe.github.com/iccup-ratings/html/leaderboard.html. Sometimes these are inconsistent with what iCCup shows. For example, superkor[pain] has a 106 - 41 record according to iCCup, but if you look at his matchlist, there are only 23 games there. I assume this is some kind of bug in the iCCup website. hmm u play bw ? u use iccup often ?.down the knife.not need blame iccup for everything.also iCCUP its amazing !!!!!! | ||
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blueblimp
Canada297 Posts
I see, thanks. I've never used transfer stats so I didn't know it would show up like this. Is there any way to see which account the stats came from? It would be nice to include the older in the ranking too. Although thankfully trueskill converges pretty quickly, so SuperkOr[PaiN] still gets a good ranking despite the algorithm not having seen most of his games. | ||
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blueblimp
Canada297 Posts
On April 01 2013 10:21 [sc1f]eonzerg wrote: hmm u play bw ? u use iccup often ?.down the knife.not need blame iccup for everything.also iCCUP its amazing !!!!!! Maybe my post came off more complaining than I intended it? I agree that iCCup is great. It's nice to have a foreign BW server, and the anti-hack launcher is good. There are probably some other good things going on with iCCup that I don't even know about. It's just that the website is a bit quirky, is all. For example, page0229 has played some BW 1v1s, but if you try to access his player page, you get an error: http://www.iccup.com/starcraft/gamingprofile/page0229.html. That doesn't take away from iCCup in general. But man, when trying to get information from the website, then you notice the little quirks like this. Edit: Also I recognize that it's only by the grace of iCCup that running these rankings is even possible. If iCCup didn't publish game histories on their website, there'd be no way to do this at all. (It seems like fish doesn't, so it's not possible to do something similar for fish.) And of course iCCup could always choose to block my IP address and then I'd be hosed. I'm really hoping they don't choose to do that; I'm respecting their robots.txt (http://iccup.com/robots.txt) request to only make one request per 15 seconds, so the load on the server shouldn't be too extreme. Plus my goal is to do a fun thing that may enhance the play experience for some players, not to cause any problem for iCCup. | ||
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blueblimp
Canada297 Posts
On April 01 2013 10:43 blueblimp wrote: I see, thanks. I've never used transfer stats so I didn't know it would show up like this. Is there any way to see which account the stats came from? It would be nice to include the older in the ranking too. Although thankfully trueskill converges pretty quickly, so SuperkOr[PaiN] still gets a good ranking despite the algorithm not having seen most of his games. To update, I guess it's fairly likely that superkor[pain] got his stats from superkorean2 and superkorean, given the similarity of their names and that those two accounts have more games on their matchlist than in their stats. It seems like it would be a real mess to figure out what happened with the stats transfer, though, especially since superkorean2 has some games from after the transfer. | ||
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traceurling
United States1240 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/BMEogjz.jpg) In case you wanted to make your own thread I couldn't find a TrueSkill logo/insignia or anything...also didn't want to put the iCCup logo on cuz it's not exactly iCCup endorsed but I did steal their font  | ||
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blueblimp
Canada297 Posts
Since I'm posting here anyway, lemme mention the new "race" column, which tries to guess each player's main race via a bunch of heuristics (which still need tweaking--for example, das_boot's picking scheme of all-but-mirrors is not detected well). What's interesting is some of the weird race-picking you see even at relatively high levels of iCCup. One fun example: Auksaviriai plays PvT, PvP... and ZvZ. (Leaderboard at http://malcolmsharpe.github.com/iccup-ratings/html/leaderboard.html as before.) | ||
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traceurling
United States1240 Posts
only potential problem would be the few people like Nemu who random :O but that'll be a very small number...actually giving me motiviation to want to ladder | ||
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Deleted User 268575
146 Posts
On April 02 2013 12:38 traceurling wrote: Looks very nice only potential problem would be the few people like Nemu who random :O but that'll be a very small number...actually giving me motiviation to want to ladder For random players I think they put them under "?" so for instance if you choose random all the time, then it would say (?vZ, ?vP, ?vT) next to your name. Correct me if I'm wrong. Edit: nevermind, it only records what race was played, not what race was chosen, so if you chose random and got zerg all the time, your race would be shown as Z. but in theory, if you did random all the time, you should get a mixed results of matchups. and still show the "?vZ, ?vP, ?vT," but at the same time if you only chose random against a certain race, then there would be no way of detecting that.. | ||
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blueblimp
Canada297 Posts
On April 02 2013 15:18 Jemah wrote: + Show Spoiler + On April 02 2013 12:38 traceurling wrote: Looks very nice only potential problem would be the few people like Nemu who random :O but that'll be a very small number...actually giving me motiviation to want to ladder For random players I think they put them under "?" so for instance if you choose random all the time, then it would say (?vZ, ?vP, ?vT) next to your name. Correct me if I'm wrong. Edit: nevermind, it only records what race was played, not what race was chosen, so if you chose random and got zerg all the time, your race would be shown as Z. but in theory, if you did random all the time, you should get a mixed results of matchups. and still show the "?vZ, ?vP, ?vT," but at the same time if you only chose random against a certain race, then there would be no way of detecting that.. Yeah, "?" just means "I don't know what race this person prefers", which could be random, or just picking a lot of different races. It's not possible to tell from the game info. | ||
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rauk
United States2228 Posts
what does the level system mean on the left side? how's it calculated? | ||
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Bakuryu
Germany1065 Posts
the ranking doesnt catch games which afterwards have been nullified (or i just happen to run into a bug) my iccup stats are 63-8 and B-, your ranking says im 64-8 and C+ my game vs The_WendiGo] has been nullified. (disc in a replay, i got win awarded, we made complaint, points refund) | ||
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traceurling
United States1240 Posts
On April 09 2013 07:35 rauk wrote: @blueblimp what does the level system mean on the left side? how's it calculated? The level system is part of True Skill...look it up I don't know all the details, but it's something about levels relative to everyone else I think... | ||
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blueblimp
Canada297 Posts
On April 09 2013 09:20 Bakuryu wrote: @ blueblimp the ranking doesnt catch games which afterwards have been nullified (or i just happen to run into a bug) my iccup stats are 63-8 and B-, your ranking says im 64-8 and C+ my game vs The_WendiGo] has been nullified. (disc in a replay, i got win awarded, we made complaint, points refund) Thanks for the bug report! It's true that the crawler will only add games and never delete them. This is because it can't tell for sure if a game has disappeared from the list, because if a player has multiple pages of games, it will only look far enough to find all the new games of that player. That said, if a game has been nullified recently enough (or if I force the crawler to look farther back into a player's history), then it ought to be able to fix it. Is this the game you're referring to? http://www.iccup.com/starcraft/details/45909.html. Is there something on the iCCup website that indicates the game is nullified? I could just ignore games where the races are both "x", but maybe that happens sometimes in non-nullified games. Alternatively, if there is a list of nullified games somewhere, the crawler could use that. (I've never requested a game nullification so I don't know where it appears.) The wrong iCCup ranking is a bug too but a different one. The way the iCCup ranking is displayed is by looking at the most recent game on your match list. In your case, you were C+ before your most recent game, so it shows C+. So the ranking can be 1 game out of date (even if the crawler knows all the games). This should be fixable--I just need to adjust the ranking to account for the change after the game, which is visible in the match list. | ||
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blueblimp
Canada297 Posts
On April 09 2013 07:35 rauk wrote: @blueblimp what does the level system mean on the left side? how's it calculated? The level is a conservative estimate of how good a player is. It vaguely means "the ranking algorithm thinks this player is at least this good". To get the number, it uses the skill range to the right. For example, for TopStar, the skill range is "48.717 ± 7.648". 48.717 - 7.648 = 41.069, which rounding down gives a level of 41. Mathematically, what's going on is that trueskill has an estimate of each player's skill (for TopStar, 48.717) and the uncertainty about that skill (for TopStar, 7.648). Ranking players by the skill estimate would be a bit misleading, because players who haven't played much might have high skill estimates even though the algorithm isn't very sure about their skill. So the uncertainty is subtracted to say that the player is probably at least that good. You can read more about trueskill here: http://research.microsoft.com/en-us/projects/trueskill/. | ||
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blueblimp
Canada297 Posts
By the way, to add to what I said in the previous post about "level", don't take the ranking here too seriously. It can give some idea of how good a player is, but there's no such thing as a perfect ranking system. | ||
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Jealous
10270 Posts
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asel
Germany1601 Posts
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