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Starcraft 2 -- It's coming. Show your support. - Page 2

Forum Index > BW General
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SoLaR[i.C]
Profile Blog Joined August 2003
United States2969 Posts
September 10 2004 14:28 GMT
#21
I think if it looked similar to War3 3D, it wouldn't be so bad at all. I'd like to see it 3d infact.
ssidengi
Profile Joined September 2004
Korea (South)326 Posts
September 10 2004 14:39 GMT
#22
starcraft2... I'm worried it'll turn out like Starship Troopers 2 -_-;;;
Orlandu
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
China2450 Posts
September 10 2004 14:45 GMT
#23
On September 10 2004 21:50 tfeign wrote:

Hard counter = extremely little room for mistakes. Takes a massive amount of skill to make sure your units are alive. Skill-intensive

Soft counter = TONS of rooms for mistakes. You have time to pull back your units and not be hurt so badly at all. You don't have to be attentive to your units. Newbie-friendly

It's basically comparing skill-intensive vs newbie friendly. Which is similar to comparing SC vs W3.

SC takes a massive amount of skill because the player has to be extremely attentive to their units. W3 allows lots of room for mistakes


Saying one has be more attentive to their units in SC than in War3 just shows the lack of knowledge of both games as a whole. The argument in place has nothing to do with having to be more attentive to units, or being newbie-friendly. If anything, under such logic hard counter would be newbie friendly because there is a clear counter, as opposed to having to intelligently coordinate combinations to counter the enemy most-effectively. There's arguments for both cases, but for the sake of everyone, leave out the "newb-friendly" and "more micro" arguments because they are irrelevant and are only fuel for the fire.

With that said I particularly prefer the hard counter style simply because things become much more clear and as a result, simpler. One can concentrate more on improving raw skill than worrying about whether or not a loss was caused by improper unit combinations.
We cant give up just because things arent the way we want them to be.
OhThatDang
Profile Joined August 2004
United States4685 Posts
September 10 2004 14:46 GMT
#24
On September 10 2004 23:39 ssidengi wrote:
starcraft2... I'm worried it'll turn out like Starship Troopers 2 -_-;;;


cause sc2 will be so good starcraft one wouldnt be able to compare?
troi oi thang map nai!!!
SoLaR[i.C]
Profile Blog Joined August 2003
United States2969 Posts
September 10 2004 14:49 GMT
#25
On September 10 2004 23:45 Orlandu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 10 2004 21:50 tfeign wrote:

Hard counter = extremely little room for mistakes. Takes a massive amount of skill to make sure your units are alive. Skill-intensive

Soft counter = TONS of rooms for mistakes. You have time to pull back your units and not be hurt so badly at all. You don't have to be attentive to your units. Newbie-friendly

It's basically comparing skill-intensive vs newbie friendly. Which is similar to comparing SC vs W3.

SC takes a massive amount of skill because the player has to be extremely attentive to their units. W3 allows lots of room for mistakes


Saying one has be more attentive to their units in SC than in War3 just shows the lack of knowledge of both games as a whole. The argument in place has nothing to do with having to be more attentive to units, or being newbie-friendly. If anything, under such logic hard counter would be newbie friendly because there is a clear counter, as opposed to having to intelligently coordinate combinations to counter the enemy most-effectively. There's arguments for both cases, but for the sake of everyone, leave out the "newb-friendly" and "more micro" arguments because they are irrelevant and are only fuel for the fire.

With that said I particularly prefer the hard counter style simply because things become much more clear and as a result, simpler. One can concentrate more on improving raw skill than worrying about whether or not a loss was caused by improper unit combinations.
Agreed. Has nothing to do with having more skill or being "noob friendly"
0wNaG3-
Profile Joined May 2004
333 Posts
September 10 2004 15:15 GMT
#26
Man, I really really hope Blizzard doesnt completely fuck the dog on SC2. Think of how desasterous it would be. The community would be devided, websites and gamers would chose a side. The Korean progaming scene would completely crash and/or lose most of its fans. I'm so nervous. I worry that blizzard is going to really mess this up. And the fact that Blizzard gets all it's feed back from battle.net forums sickens me. I'm scared.....
AKA: frEeLoSS
GroT
Profile Blog Joined January 2004
Belgium3003 Posts
September 10 2004 15:19 GMT
#27
i just hope they leave out the luck factor, random EMP missile drop in front of your lvl 5 jim raynor, anyone?

and for the love of god, please, keep the tempo
DANCE ALL DAY
booooo
Profile Joined March 2004
Singapore372 Posts
September 10 2004 15:20 GMT
#28
LOL... u guys should read some of the opinions of people who supports autocast for sc2...

"Since Starcraft was about large unit battles, autocast would be needed in a sequal. The game isn't about micromanagement. "

"If Starcraft 2 had autocast, it would also be balanced around that as well, like Warcraft 3 is."


Arguments without basis...


I love SCVs!
0wNaG3-
Profile Joined May 2004
333 Posts
September 10 2004 15:24 GMT
#29
That first quote makes me want to pull a Jay and Silent Bob on all the faggots who post there.
AKA: frEeLoSS
0wNaG3-
Profile Joined May 2004
333 Posts
September 10 2004 15:24 GMT
#30
God damnit, I'm gonna go to bed now, but I dunno how im gonna be able to sleep tonight with this on my mind.
AKA: frEeLoSS
krzych113
Profile Blog Joined April 2003
United Kingdom547 Posts
September 10 2004 17:37 GMT
#31
Well hmm when I see w3 and the battle begins well seriously I can't see anything ( dunno is this a 3D problem but it sucks though ^^) . Better graphic + no experience.
ChApFoU
Profile Blog Joined July 2004
France2982 Posts
September 10 2004 17:54 GMT
#32
war 3 is messy also because of the layout, units size and mass spells. Not only 3d.
"I honestly think that whoever invented toilet paper in a genius" Kang Min
ChApFoU
Profile Blog Joined July 2004
France2982 Posts
September 10 2004 17:57 GMT
#33
pb with war 3 is not skill lvl needed or 3d or heroes, it's just too simple and repetitive mainly because maps have no real influence on build orders and global strategy.
"I honestly think that whoever invented toilet paper in a genius" Kang Min
Casper...
Profile Joined October 2002
Liberia4948 Posts
September 10 2004 18:06 GMT
#34
they should stop fucking around and just ask the koreans
JAM THE FUCKER!
Casper...
Profile Joined October 2002
Liberia4948 Posts
September 10 2004 18:15 GMT
#35
it says alot that they need to ask at all

when they were making sc they just asked the war2 kali players
for bw, they asked the top sc players

when it came time to make war3 they fucked it all up by not listening to the community which was damned near unanimous in saying "no heros, hard counters, fast-paced, rewards aggression, good looking, direct damage spells, strong skirmishing units"

we got "heros, soft counters, slow-paced, rewards not fighting your opponent, good looking, sluggish direct interface, billions of buffs, weak skirmishing units"

some stuff was good. maleable terrain, more clearly-defined tactical options, enhanced multi-unit interface. it looked good, but ran poorly. even on today's computers, war3 does not bench any better than 60fps, which speaks to the very cpu consumptive engine.

they brought zman in to fix it, and he did a pretty good job, but it's still broke

if they don't get alpha and early beta builds to korean progamers, or at the very least, the likes of maynard, rekrul and froz sc2 will be a disaster
JAM THE FUCKER!
Taguchi
Profile Joined February 2003
Greece1575 Posts
September 10 2004 18:29 GMT
#36
On September 11 2004 03:06 Casper... wrote:
they should stop fucking around and just ask the koreans

he said it all, now someone with credibility on the bnet forums repost it :p
Great minds might think alike, but fastest hands rule the day~
gravity
Profile Joined March 2004
Australia1847 Posts
September 10 2004 18:30 GMT
#37
I don't think Blizzard has the skill anymore to make a Starcraft 2 that won't be mostly a disappointment. The people who left must have been all the ones who knew what they were doing when it comes to RTSes :/.

You could say that Starcraft is good because it's like a complex real-time boardgame. The chances of that being maintained in a sequel are virutally zero because the general public wants everything shiny, new, 3D, mistake-friendly, etc.
Travin
Profile Blog Joined June 2004
Sweden672 Posts
September 10 2004 18:40 GMT
#38
atleast im sure that i dont want units to be constant moving like mutalisks, keep the good ol turn of ure engines while u stand still thing (to bad it dsnt work irl).

I dont want them to add more races blizzard has proven that they cant balance 4 races.

most important of all, you should be able to select more than 12 units, so u dsnt have to group millions of units just to attack..

Pob
Profile Joined February 2004
880 Posts
September 10 2004 18:49 GMT
#39
well travin i think that 16 is a good number of selections for sc 2 , go much higher than that and it starts to favour zerg.As for the game i'm not holding my breath like i did with Warcraft 3 , i'm expecting it to suck this time to avoid such disapointment again.

war2>war3
gravity
Profile Joined March 2004
Australia1847 Posts
September 10 2004 19:00 GMT
#40
I'd rather have unlimited unit selection, and just tone down Zerg slightly if it turns out to favour them. I'd also like unlimited multiple building selection, with balance also adjusted if necessary.
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