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For me the main thing is that foreign community basically made the switch without even knowing if the game was any good. They just assumed, because of Blizzard marketing intense activity and the hype of the novelty that the smart thing to do was to stop playing bw and start as soon as possible mass gaming at SC2 in order to be the next world champion.
That prove only one thing, which is that foreign community is immature.
1- Koreans take their time. It doesn't matter that you started the first day in order to be world champion. Let me tell you that if Korea swap to SC2 massively, people like Idra or DeMuslim will be outclassed by Jaedong and Flash in a matter of days if they start playing seriously.
2- Because people invested themselves so much in SC2 before it was even released, nobody has taken the time to look at the game with a critical approach.
Now, I've not been playing much, but I have been watching a lot. And I can say, without any implication / bias: the game blows compared to BW. It is "clever" and everything is designed for the player, which means it has no depth whatsoever. It's about big balls of units killing each other in a matter of second without the viewer being even able to say what the fuck is happening under the phony spell animations.
Now I will tell you what happens next: SC2 will be big for a couple of years. Very big. There will be a shitload of money, especially since Blizzard will be investing a lot so that teir game becomes the next BW. Then, I predict that in three or four years, everybody will be dead bored of it. I only hope BW can survive till then. Otherwise, we can say good bye to the franchise.
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I totally agree with Biff everyone is being too easy on this game. Didn't this game take like 4 years to make?
Not buying sc2 out of principle. Blizzard is being too greedy with the expansion and no- LAN policy. Just because it says starcraft in the title doesn’t mean it has anything to do with Starcraft. It is just too average, the game isn’t even good enough to justify the purchase, the game play is shallow and gimmicky compared to brood war; micro is gone, macro is gone, and some of the most awesome units in BW are gone. BIG disappointment I can’t imagine why this game took so long to develop. Seriously it looks soo gimmicky, 2 gases in every base LMAO are blizzard game engineers not smart enough to balance something as simple as that? Starcraft was simple but elegant. “Starcraft” 2 is just simple.
Maybe ill buy it if the expansions add a TON of features that improve the game but for now SC2 is just an inferior game that cost $55 more than BW.
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I have to say I'm suffering from buyers remorse with Starcraft 2.. Paid $148 ($133 USD) AUD for the CE. I even told myself I wasn't going to buy it because the beta was so bad and the game wasn't great. Somehow I convinced myself that Blizzard would pull through at retail and everything would be great.
Surprise. Instead I get stuck on SEA battle.net, Real ID doesn't work as advertised, no custom games on SEA and the ladder is dead in off peak times. To top it all off the actual game just isn't that great. It's good but it doesn't ever get past being just good. I haven't touched it in well over a week and I don't think I'm going to any time in the near future.
2 days ago I hopped on US West Brood War for some UMS because I was ready for bed but not quite tired yet and needed to kill 20 mins or so.
I had an absolute blast. Random UMS, 4v4 Fastest, 1v1 Python, talking to people (made 2 friends) and just having a good time. Pretty soon it was 4am and I didn't even realise.
Hopping back on Brood War reminded me what a great game it truly is and what a shitty period gaming is going through right now.
If I went back in time before the beta and told myself that I would be bored of Starcraft 2 1 week after release I would laugh at myself extremely hard.
I want my $150 back 
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Same argument as Street Fighter 2 vs Street Fighter 4.
If you love it so much, there's still a scene for you. Being good at the older one gives you a leg up on the newer competition. But most will move on, and you need to accept that.
BW is still cool, but I rather play SC2 all day. I like watching Bw pro games now and then still, but you cannot just say --insert better, clearer analogy--
Well you can, and it is a preference. But from a technical standpoint, one is clearly better. How can you expect everyone else to choose older model just for preference.
I dunno, BW will still be around if people want it to be around. But if it dies, then the scene will speak for itself. Don't need tons of players posting on behalf of the small percent of the scene that will not move on ever.
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its so weird with so many former BW players moving fully on to SC2 altogether. I asked a few of them why and they said"becuase it's new" and not "because it's better". most tell me they know it's not as good. most say that they cant go back to the old UI and bad path-finding and such. It makes me wonder why so many of them ever stuck to BW in the 1st place. Of course the game is archaic and hard to play, of course you have to fight the interface to play well. I thought that was part of the game (so to speak) and a reason why people liked playing it so much.
I remember thinking before SC2 beta came out that all us SCers are really stubborn old-timers playing a 10 yr old game because it's better than everything else despite how dated it is. I thought that we all embraced that fact and loved how it was hard to just play BW. I guess a lot more people played BW just cuz they were used to it and now can move on to SC2 because it's close enough. I dunno, I still cant really figure out why so many of my friends moved onto SC2 without thinking about why they loved BW in the 1st place... :\
It's just so funny because only NOW are BW players REALLY being called stubborn lol
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Croatia9540 Posts
On August 12 2010 03:48 SaetZero wrote:
Same argument as Street Fighter 2 vs Street Fighter 4.
If you love it so much, there's still a scene for you. Being good at the older one gives you a leg up on the newer competition. But most will move on, and you need to accept that.
BW is still cool, but I rather play SC2 all day. I like watching Bw pro games now and then still, but you cannot just say "Man, fuck the Ferrari FXX. I want the F355!."
Well you can, and it is a preference. But from a technical standpoint, one is clearly better. How can you expect everyone else to choose older model just for preference.
I dunno, BW will still be around if people want it to be around. But if it dies, then the scene will speak for itself. Don't need tons of players posting on behalf of the small percent of the scene that will not move on ever.
That is one bad analogy.
First of all, you are clearly assuming that SC2 actually looks better than BW simply because it's newer?
Yes, you're right that it's all about preference, but thinking something is "clearly better", as you've put it, just because it's newer is very shallow point of view.
Then every remake of some classic movie would be "clearly better" than original because it has bigger budget with better special effects. And movies are prime example that this is false in most cases.
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i bought sc2 not too long ago.
was dissapointed at the gameplay, and the no LAN rule
now i just play it for campaings every now and then
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On August 12 2010 02:33 Biff The Understudy wrote:
For me the main thing is that foreign community basically made the switch without even knowing if the game was any good. They just assumed, because of Blizzard marketing intense activity and the hype of the novelty that the smart thing to do was to stop playing bw and start as soon as possible mass gaming at SC2 in order to be the next world champion.
That prove only one thing, which is that foreign community is immature.
1- Koreans take their time. It doesn't matter that you started the first day in order to be world champion. Let me tell you that if Korea swap to SC2 massively, people like Idra or DeMuslim will be outclassed by Jaedong and Flash in a matter of days if they start playing seriously.
2- Because people invested themselves so much in SC2 before it was even released, nobody has taken the time to look at the game with a critical approach.
Now, I've not been playing much, but I have been watching a lot. And I can say, without any implication / bias: the game blows compared to BW. It is "clever" and everything is designed for the player, which means it has no depth whatsoever. It's about big balls of units killing each other in a matter of second without the viewer being even able to say what the fuck is happening under the phony spell animations.
Now I will tell you what happens next: SC2 will be big for a couple of years. Very big. There will be a shitload of money, especially since Blizzard will be investing a lot so that teir game becomes the next BW. Then, I predict that in three or four years, everybody will be dead bored of it. I only hope BW can survive till then. Otherwise, we can say good bye to the franchise.
sadly i agree... korean bw NEEDS to survive. ive only been following since end of 08 so its still new and fresh to me 
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On August 12 2010 04:04 2Pacalypse- wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2010 03:48 SaetZero wrote:
Same argument as Street Fighter 2 vs Street Fighter 4.
If you love it so much, there's still a scene for you. Being good at the older one gives you a leg up on the newer competition. But most will move on, and you need to accept that.
BW is still cool, but I rather play SC2 all day. I like watching Bw pro games now and then still, but you cannot just say "Man, fuck the Ferrari FXX. I want the F355!."
Well you can, and it is a preference. But from a technical standpoint, one is clearly better. How can you expect everyone else to choose older model just for preference.
I dunno, BW will still be around if people want it to be around. But if it dies, then the scene will speak for itself. Don't need tons of players posting on behalf of the small percent of the scene that will not move on ever. That is one bad analogy. First of all, you are clearly assuming that SC2 actually looks better than BW simply because it's newer? Yes, you're right that it's all about preference, but thinking something is "clearly better", as you've put it, just because it's newer is very shallow point of view. Then every remake of some classic movie would be "clearly better" than original because it has bigger budget with better special effects. And movies are prime example that this is false in most cases.
dinner for schmucks is CLEARLY better than citizen kane.
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Everyone is moving to SC2 because its newer. Thats exactly the reason. There is no Flash, and there is no Jaedong. People still have a shot at being a big name and winning some $$ without having to practice 8 hours a day to develop amazing game sense and get down a whole bunch of tiny timings.
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SC2 will of course get the D-level crowd that thrive on YouTube shoutcasters. But why would hardcore players move?
(Unless their goal is to earn E-Sports bucks in the much much easier SC2 scene, of course.)
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On August 12 2010 04:44 Xyik wrote:
Everyone is moving to SC2 because its newer. Thats exactly the reason. There is no Flash, and there is no Jaedong. People still have a shot at being a big name and winning some $$ without having to practice 8 hours a day to develop amazing game sense and get down a whole bunch of tiny timings.
Yeah, thta's pretty much what I was saying. Hardcore gamers switched immediately because of the hope of somehow being the best and not because the game was any better. The proof is that the switched was done basically the first day of the beta when nobody had a clue if the game was not terribad (and imo, it is, at least compared to what we could expect).
It's so wrong that it's laughable for two reasons:
1- If SC2 doesn't develop or doesn't have the potential to be a succesfull esport, theses people will basically have lost their time.
2- If the game does develop, we will be in the same situation than we were in BW: Korean will form teams, with people 865443 time more dedicated, more serious and more organized than foreigners and our proud americans/europeans player will be as little competitive as they were in BW.
But the real main thing is the following one: the reason why foreigners have been blowing compared to koreans in BW is the exact same reason why they all swapped to SC2 immediately. On the one hand, we have people who love the game and spend their life trying to be the best, with humility, sacrifices and maturity. On the other hand, the foreign community is completely un-professional, with people trying to be e-famous and the best of the best without thinking ahead and without waiting the release of a game before saying that they will dedicate their life to it.
That leads me to the sad conclusion that the worst thing which could happen to wannabe professional SC2 gamers is that Korea goes into SC2. It would be a lolpwnage almost immediately.
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It's funny that people are saying SC2 players are shallow and close-minded for switching over, when the exact same thing can be applicable from the other point of view.
Regardless, both games are good. It's a stupid argument, so stop having it. I don't see why everyone is so worried about what game everyone else is playing. Just play the one YOU like better, and don't worry about it.
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Croatia9540 Posts
On August 12 2010 04:39 Ideas wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2010 04:04 2Pacalypse- wrote:On August 12 2010 03:48 SaetZero wrote:
Same argument as Street Fighter 2 vs Street Fighter 4.
If you love it so much, there's still a scene for you. Being good at the older one gives you a leg up on the newer competition. But most will move on, and you need to accept that.
BW is still cool, but I rather play SC2 all day. I like watching Bw pro games now and then still, but you cannot just say "Man, fuck the Ferrari FXX. I want the F355!."
Well you can, and it is a preference. But from a technical standpoint, one is clearly better. How can you expect everyone else to choose older model just for preference.
I dunno, BW will still be around if people want it to be around. But if it dies, then the scene will speak for itself. Don't need tons of players posting on behalf of the small percent of the scene that will not move on ever. That is one bad analogy. First of all, you are clearly assuming that SC2 actually looks better than BW simply because it's newer? Yes, you're right that it's all about preference, but thinking something is "clearly better", as you've put it, just because it's newer is very shallow point of view. Then every remake of some classic movie would be "clearly better" than original because it has bigger budget with better special effects. And movies are prime example that this is false in most cases. dinner for schmucks is CLEARLY better than citizen kane.
Now I've never heard of dinner for schmucks, but I can't believe they would remake the citizen kane under that name -.-
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On August 12 2010 05:05 Cofo wrote:
It's funny that people are saying SC2 players are shallow and close-minded for switching over, when the exact same thing can be applicable from the other point of view.
Regardless, both games are good. It's a stupid argument, so stop having it. I don't see why everyone is so worried about what game everyone else is playing. Just play the one YOU like better, and don't worry about it.
I am not calling anyone shallow or closed minded for switching over I just stated that overall don't see what the appeal of sc2 is. If you do, go ahead spend 60 bucks and eventually 180 bucks for the 3 expansion. I am not a huge gamer, but I buy the games that I think are really worth it, I am disappointed because before beta came out I was sure I would buy starcraft 2 but now just feel I wouldn't play it for more than a couple weeks before I got bored of it.
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I play bw with friends that don't have sc2 once in a while. But mainly play sc2.
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On August 12 2010 05:30 2Pacalypse- wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2010 04:39 Ideas wrote:On August 12 2010 04:04 2Pacalypse- wrote:On August 12 2010 03:48 SaetZero wrote:
Same argument as Street Fighter 2 vs Street Fighter 4.
If you love it so much, there's still a scene for you. Being good at the older one gives you a leg up on the newer competition. But most will move on, and you need to accept that.
BW is still cool, but I rather play SC2 all day. I like watching Bw pro games now and then still, but you cannot just say "Man, fuck the Ferrari FXX. I want the F355!."
Well you can, and it is a preference. But from a technical standpoint, one is clearly better. How can you expect everyone else to choose older model just for preference.
I dunno, BW will still be around if people want it to be around. But if it dies, then the scene will speak for itself. Don't need tons of players posting on behalf of the small percent of the scene that will not move on ever. That is one bad analogy. First of all, you are clearly assuming that SC2 actually looks better than BW simply because it's newer? Yes, you're right that it's all about preference, but thinking something is "clearly better", as you've put it, just because it's newer is very shallow point of view. Then every remake of some classic movie would be "clearly better" than original because it has bigger budget with better special effects. And movies are prime example that this is false in most cases. dinner for schmucks is CLEARLY better than citizen kane. Now I've never heard of dinner for schmucks, but I can't believe they would remake the citizen kane under that name -.-
it's actually a remake of a good movie called the dinner game
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Iam gonna try to play more which iam gonna stream but somehow iam not motivated anymore TT
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On August 12 2010 04:04 2Pacalypse- wrote:
That is one bad analogy.
First of all, you are clearly assuming that SC2 actually looks better than BW simply because it's newer?
Yes, you're right that it's all about preference, but thinking something is "clearly better", as you've put it, just because it's newer is very shallow point of view.
Then every remake of some classic movie would be "clearly better" than original because it has bigger budget with better special effects. And movies are prime example that this is false in most cases.
From a technical standpoint, SC2 is a better game graphic wise. You need a better graphics card to play it, the graphics are better.
Do I mean they LOOK better? No. Just like my analogy... which maybe was meh. The FXX in terms of 'how fucking fast is this car' is clearly better, but does that mean everyone would rather have a FXX over a F355? Not at all.
I personally like the graphics better from a Pokemon Yellow then I do a Pokemon SoulSilver. I like some things design better in BW then SC2, and vice versa.
But the fact is the graphics are better from a technical standpoint. Not artistic, not an opinion or your preference. Purely technical.
Your movie remake analogy... yea I would say from a production cost standpoint, the graphics in the many remakes are technically better. Does it make the movie better? Not at all. Does it even make the movie look better. Again, not at all.
It is all preference. I will ont even argue Sc2 is better than BW as a game, nor would I argue the other way around. But purely Technically... like 'how much computer do I need to play this game'... SC2 is more powerful than Bw.
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EPT
