EPTFlash 14cc Stats - Page 2
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flamewheel
FREEAGLELAND26782 Posts
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Purind
Canada3562 Posts
On June 20 2010 17:38 Sadistx wrote: That's ~64% which is worse than his average (including 14CC), so it's a slightly worse history overall. It's still a good winrate though, much better than any non-S-class player can hope to achieve in a lifetime on the scene. That's how good Flash is Even that's considered bad What a great player | ||
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Reborn8u
United States1761 Posts
Front page worthy IMO  | ||
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Qwertify
United States2531 Posts
On June 20 2010 17:54 Carnivorous Sheep wrote: You watched like a minute of 173 TvZs haha...props to you, did you do it all in one go or did you have to do it in chunks? I'd imagine I'd've died of boredom doing that  Awesome - puts to rest a lot of theorizing. | ||
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Jugan
United States1566 Posts
On June 20 2010 17:38 Sadistx wrote: That's ~64% which is worse than his average (including 14CC), so it's a slightly worse history overall. It's still a good winrate though, much better than any non-S-class player can hope to achieve in a lifetime on the scene. But let's not forget, some of these games are "old", so it might not be reflective of his current skills with a 14 CC build. | ||
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kemoryan
Spain1506 Posts
On June 20 2010 17:38 Sadistx wrote: That's ~64% which is worse than his average (including 14CC), so it's a slightly worse history overall. It's still a good winrate though, much better than any non-S-class player can hope to achieve in a lifetime on the scene. I dare his 14cc stats, despite being below his average, have in fact pushed his other stats higher. What I'm trying to say is that having this strat in his reportoire makes it tougher for his opponents to prepare against him, so it's not as easy as saying he'd have higher overall % if he never went 14cc. | ||
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Piste
6183 Posts
On June 20 2010 17:38 Sadistx wrote: That's ~64% which is worse than his average (including 14CC), so it's a slightly worse history overall. It's still a good winrate though, much better than any non-S-class player can hope to achieve in a lifetime on the scene. take a look at his last ten 14cc games. 9-1. he doesn't just blindly try 14cc like he used to when he lost many times becouse of it. | ||
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MangoTango
United States3670 Posts
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eshlow
United States5210 Posts
Although he has much better results now with it since the fact that he's been switching up his builds more as noted by the 9-1 in past 10 games. So strategic use is a good thing it looks like. | ||
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shalafi
394 Posts
On June 21 2010 05:50 eshlow wrote: Considering that his overall winrate is (or rather was if it's dropped now after all of the proleague ace losses) above 70% then a 64% winrate is obviously detracting from his overall ability to win the game. Although he has much better results now with it since the fact that he's been switching up his builds more as noted by the 9-1 in past 10 games. So strategic use is a good thing it looks like. Wait what? Did you check vs what players he used it? 64% is way more than the expected winrate vs most of those players. | ||
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Armathai
1023 Posts
I really think 14CC is a good opening, tobad it failed so much vs Effort, but awesome anyhow! | ||
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NeCroPoTeNce
United States513 Posts
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bearbuddy
3442 Posts
On June 21 2010 06:14 shalafi wrote: Wait what? Did you check vs what players he used it? 64% is way more than the expected winrate vs most of those players. Was about to say this. He doesn't just randomly do a 14cc build at random intervals between all leagues. | ||
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3FFA
United States3931 Posts
On June 20 2010 22:47 LosingID8 wrote: lol nice writeup i'm a fan of pie charts too! Who isn't a fan of pie charts? Although then again whenever I look at one I see an actually pie... Anyways, nice writeup! Now if someone could tell me why this isn't in the News section, I would be thankful. I like pie, 3FFA(who else?!?) | ||
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eshlow
United States5210 Posts
On June 21 2010 06:14 shalafi wrote: Wait what? Did you check vs what players he used it? 64% is way more than the expected winrate vs most of those players. I didn't see any analysis of expected wins vs those players. I do agree with that the player list is harder though, but that doesn't necessarily mean much in some cases. Conversely, it's over such a long period of time that it's going to be really hard to compare expect win rates vs those certain players. Basically, it is what it is. Flash tends to use it more when he is less confident he can win. Sometimes it backfires against early pressure (such as against Effort in OSL..., and protoss in general for a while there), and sometimes it works magnificently. I wonder how many times he actually wins in management games when he goes 14cc. That may be an interesting stat to look at. | ||
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tedster
984 Posts
On June 21 2010 05:19 kemoryan wrote: I dare his 14cc stats, despite being below his average, have in fact pushed his other stats higher. What I'm trying to say is that having this strat in his reportoire makes it tougher for his opponents to prepare against him, so it's not as easy as saying he'd have higher overall % if he never went 14cc. Please don't forget this. If you don't work unconventional strats and rushes into your general gameplay, your opponents get to cut corners and run optimal builds against you 100% of the time. Conversely, if you are known for enjoying unconventional/risky builds, your opponents will often run less optimal builds to compensate, giving you an advantage the rest of the time when you play standard. | ||
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Black Gun
Germany4482 Posts
but the 9-1 stats in his last 10 14cc games are kinda deluding as this one loss has cost him the osl title and the golden mouse. but with flashs monster macro, if he can pull off a 14cc and his opponent fails to successfully counter it with either an early attack or some kind of eco cheese on his own, then its basically a won game for flash. does any1 know a game where flash went 14 cc and his opponent did not go 14cc, 3 hatch or 12nex on his own and still won? | ||
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DemiSe
883 Posts
Love the Pie charts <3. Thanks a lot for doing this. | ||
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koreasilver
9109 Posts
On June 21 2010 09:21 Black Gun wrote: great read, thumbs up! but the 9-1 stats in his last 10 14cc games are kinda deluding as this one loss has cost him the osl title and the golden mouse. but with flashs monster macro, if he can pull off a 14cc and his opponent fails to successfully counter it with either an early attack or some kind of eco cheese on his own, then its basically a won game for flash. does any1 know a game where flash went 14 cc and his opponent did not go 14cc, 3 hatch or 12nex on his own and still won? I'm assuming you're saying 3hatch no pool because 12hatch 11pool 13hatch starts gets pretty behind 14cc. Jaedong won against Flash on Loki 2 with a normal 3hatch build. | ||
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yes9111
United States420 Posts
But gotta give you props for watching every. single. one. of Flash's TvZs holy smokes. I would have died of boredom. Thank you for the work - so apparently Flash is pretty good with 14cc? | ||
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