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How Protoss can beat Flash - Page 10

Forum Index > BW General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 8 9 10 11 12 17 Next All
ella_guru
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Canada1741 Posts
May 13 2010 14:06 GMT
#181
On May 13 2010 23:01 dtnmang wrote:
Try to deny Flash's third?


Trying isnt good enough?
Each day gets better : )
Severedevil
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States4839 Posts
May 13 2010 14:54 GMT
#182
On May 13 2010 23:06 ella_guru wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 13 2010 23:01 dtnmang wrote:
Try to deny Flash's third?


Trying isnt good enough?

On some maps it's not plausible to deny Terran's third... which is perfectly fine, as long as Protoss keeps expanding in response.
My strategy is to fork people.
dtnmang
Profile Joined April 2010
Vietnam752 Posts
May 13 2010 15:06 GMT
#183
On May 13 2010 23:54 Severedevil wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 13 2010 23:06 ella_guru wrote:
On May 13 2010 23:01 dtnmang wrote:
Try to deny Flash's third?


Trying isnt good enough?

On some maps it's not plausible to deny Terran's third... which is perfectly fine, as long as Protoss keeps expanding in response.
Then Flash will send some units over and rape Protoss's remote expansions?
KT Roflster - the lulziest team of Proleague.
BlueApex
Profile Joined May 2010
63 Posts
May 13 2010 15:29 GMT
#184
or, you can wall off his scouting scv with 4 forges to mind control later.

This seems like a good idea but Flash moves when he hits 200/200. You'll die before you have tanks up.
The very best, I want to be
Pliers
Profile Joined October 2008
Canada42 Posts
May 13 2010 15:44 GMT
#185
When Flash hits 200/200 Toss will have his maxed ground army as well and is able to keep reinforcing his P ground army to fight terran. The idea is not to rely on T tech to beat Flash, it's to use excess money P has while maxed out to build a complimentary army of only siege tanks. Stop it with the TvT crap that's not what this suggests at all.
dtnmang
Profile Joined April 2010
Vietnam752 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-13 15:57:52
May 13 2010 15:54 GMT
#186
On May 14 2010 00:44 Pliers wrote:
When Flash hits 200/200 Toss will have his maxed ground army as well and is able to keep reinforcing his P ground army to fight terran. The idea is not to rely on T tech to beat Flash, it's to use excess money P has while maxed out to build a complimentary army of only siege tanks. Stop it with the TvT crap that's not what this suggests at all.
Flash doesn't move out when he hits 200/200.
He timing pushes.
And Protoss does not have excess money while maxed out against Flash like when they are against other Terrans, since he overruns their expansions.
KT Roflster - the lulziest team of Proleague.
years
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
Costa Rica216 Posts
May 13 2010 16:21 GMT
#187
On May 13 2010 22:28 butchji wrote:
How about playing like this?



holy shit best stop sucking and get back to this.

whats going on with the protoss coach in skt? the protoss lineup was one of the strongest.
"Member of Hyuk Hyuk Hyuk Cafe! He's the next Jaedong, baby!" Through high and low, bisu boy, through high and low.
Pliers
Profile Joined October 2008
Canada42 Posts
May 13 2010 16:25 GMT
#188
On May 14 2010 00:54 dtnmang wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 14 2010 00:44 Pliers wrote:
When Flash hits 200/200 Toss will have his maxed ground army as well and is able to keep reinforcing his P ground army to fight terran. The idea is not to rely on T tech to beat Flash, it's to use excess money P has while maxed out to build a complimentary army of only siege tanks. Stop it with the TvT crap that's not what this suggests at all.
Flash doesn't move out when he hits 200/200.
He timing pushes.
And Protoss does not have excess money while maxed out against Flash like when they are against other Terrans, since he overruns their expansions.


Yep, so Toss still needs to fight him normally in the early to mid game. When Toss survives till late can and has enough money for carrier switch, then the DA's can be employed. (research MC beforehand if going for this strat in the long term)
Bac
Profile Joined January 2009
United States53 Posts
May 13 2010 16:33 GMT
#189
Fantastic storming/stasis is the ONLY way to beat flash at the moment without ridiculous cheese.
emucxg
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Finland4559 Posts
May 13 2010 16:37 GMT
#190
On May 14 2010 01:25 Pliers wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 14 2010 00:54 dtnmang wrote:
On May 14 2010 00:44 Pliers wrote:
When Flash hits 200/200 Toss will have his maxed ground army as well and is able to keep reinforcing his P ground army to fight terran. The idea is not to rely on T tech to beat Flash, it's to use excess money P has while maxed out to build a complimentary army of only siege tanks. Stop it with the TvT crap that's not what this suggests at all.
Flash doesn't move out when he hits 200/200.
He timing pushes.
And Protoss does not have excess money while maxed out against Flash like when they are against other Terrans, since he overruns their expansions.


Yep, so Toss still needs to fight him normally in the early to mid game. When Toss survives till late can and has enough money for carrier switch, then the DA's can be employed. (research MC beforehand if going for this strat in the long term)

this will not work
lone_hydra
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Canada1460 Posts
May 13 2010 16:39 GMT
#191
The only way to beat a terran in PvT is to make full effect of any error a terran makes (mines, unit postioning, timings). Protoss cannot beat a terran that refuses to make errors.
Fav Gamers: 2)Stork 5)Bisu
QuothTheRaven
Profile Joined December 2008
United States5524 Posts
May 13 2010 16:44 GMT
#192
lol that would be so awesome to see
. . . nevermore
NeCroPoTeNce
Profile Joined July 2009
United States513 Posts
May 13 2010 16:46 GMT
#193
It would be weird to see Flash lose, because he's only been programmed to win. : P
zerg all the way! Lee Jaedong hwaiting
years
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
Costa Rica216 Posts
May 13 2010 16:51 GMT
#194
Seriously, Flash is go(o)d and everything, but its not like anyone else is stepping up to perform. Micro and macro is still very much lacking by protoss, and zerg players for that matter, as well as game sense. Im sure that a protoss player that trains more and gets out of his mind the oh dawd im playing flash attitude could be troublesome, at the very least, for the guy.
"Member of Hyuk Hyuk Hyuk Cafe! He's the next Jaedong, baby!" Through high and low, bisu boy, through high and low.
bubblegumbo
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Taiwan1296 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-13 17:02:20
May 13 2010 17:00 GMT
#195
I can't believe that some people are taking this stupid strategy seriously, the viability of using MC to get more population/better composition has been discussed before. At the pro level it is stupid to rely on something that is this unreliable. MCing a SCV and getting it out alive from enemy territory, and then watching over 2 races is just insanely hard. Unless you have a reliable way for sneaking a SCV out, the chances of pulling this off is ridiculously slime.

Against Flash you will be hard pressed to match his insane multitasking and APM already, you will lose trying too much time spent trying to get MC quickly and getting SCVs out alive, or fall behind trying to manage two race's worth of supply count/macro. Obviously recalls to get SCVs out will be difficult as well, since arbiters are always expected in TvP.
This is more "gimmicky" that practicing a well crafted cheese/all-in strategy, which would be more reliable and actually worth the practice time.
"I honestly think that whoever invented toilet paper is a genius. For man to survive, they need toilet paper!"- Nal_rA
Philar
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Hong Kong126 Posts
May 13 2010 17:05 GMT
#196
A lot of flash's win are based on exploiting opponent's mistakes since he is able to consistently make the least amount of mistake compared to his opponent, he is able to come out ahead every time.
Pliers
Profile Joined October 2008
Canada42 Posts
May 13 2010 17:25 GMT
#197
+ Show Spoiler +
On May 14 2010 02:00 bubblegumbo wrote:
I can't believe that some people are taking this stupid strategy seriously, the viability of using MC to get more population/better composition has been discussed before. At the pro level it is stupid to rely on something that is this unreliable. MCing a SCV and getting it out alive from enemy territory, and then watching over 2 races is just insanely hard. Unless you have a reliable way for sneaking a SCV out, the chances of pulling this off is ridiculously slime.

Against Flash you will be hard pressed to match his insane multitasking and APM already, you will lose trying too much time spent trying to get MC quickly and getting SCVs out alive, or fall behind trying to manage two race's worth of supply count/macro. Obviously recalls to get SCVs out will be difficult as well, since arbiters are always expected in TvP.
This is more "gimmicky" that practicing a well crafted cheese/all-in strategy, which would be more reliable and actually worth the practice time.


I mentioned before that getting the scv will be the hard part. It's not a reliable pvt strategy for sure but it's an option in the late game that can be taken advantage of if T does not watch his scv's well. Why not apply a strategy (although it sounds crazy) that has potential to put P ahead when P is deadlocked on bases with T anyway. Also T wont even see the arb if you're recalling out the scvs so not sure what you meant there.
538
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Hungary3932 Posts
May 13 2010 17:32 GMT
#198
On May 14 2010 02:00 bubblegumbo wrote:MCing a SCV and getting it out alive from enemy territory, and then watching over 2 races is just insanely hard. Unless you have a reliable way for sneaking a SCV out, the chances of pulling this off is ridiculously slime.

You can always recall a Dark Archon (immune to mines!) into his base, then recall the mind controlled scv back to your base :-p
BW fighting!
KristianJS
Profile Joined October 2009
2107 Posts
May 13 2010 18:01 GMT
#199
lol, "beat Flash", what a silly thing to contemplate
You need to be 100% behind someone before you can stab them in the back
JDforever
Profile Joined December 2009
China69 Posts
May 13 2010 18:02 GMT
#200
Today's match prove that no Protoss can beat flash.
I love Frank
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