EPT[Question] How to beat Flash? - Page 10
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s[O]rry
Canada398 Posts
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lavion
Singapore286 Posts
dont' skip sunk fast hatch fast hive just play standard and hope for the best best player wins... which is most likely flash at the moment | ||
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7mk
Germany10157 Posts
On January 02 2010 12:38 lavion wrote: the best way for a zerg to beat flash is to STOP BEING SO BLOODY GREEDY. dont' skip sunk fast hatch fast hive just play standard and hope for the best best player wins... which is most likely flash at the moment People need every advantage they can get vs flash, so I wholeheartedly disagree with this. Also I dont think getting a fast hive means being greedy And what do you mean with "dont fast hatch" dont go 12 hatch? get your 3rd hatch later? both probably bad advice | ||
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lavion
Singapore286 Posts
On January 02 2010 12:51 7mk wrote: People need every advantage they can get vs flash, so I wholeheartedly disagree with this. Also I dont think getting a fast hive means being greedy And what do you mean with "dont fast hatch" dont go 12 hatch? get your 3rd hatch later? both probably bad advice what i meant was something like set 4 of calm vs flash | ||
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chewychoclat
23 Posts
Of course this only works if he actually goes for the wraiths | ||
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AraqirG
United States266 Posts
On January 02 2010 02:32 okum wrote: For those who claim that TvZ imbalanced: the combined TvZ win rate for this season's OSL, MSL and Proleague games so far is 52.8% if you count Flash's games and 46.3% if you don't. Essentially, Flash is single-handedly responsible for the balance of this matchup right now. If anything, TvZ is very slightly zerg favored at the moment and any terran nerfing would make the matchup impossible for everyone except Flash. The big question is whether other terrans can rise to Flash's level? Given how a number of zergs almost caught up with Jaedong in 2009, I wouldn't call it impossible. But they better get on it soon. Ok, I was curious so I ran some numbers... + Show Spoiler + First off, Flash is a fucking beast. Overall this season in the MSL, OSL and PL, he is 20-3 making for an ungodly 87% TvZ win rate this season. Anyway, As okum pointed out, overall, TvZ is around 52.8% this season. If you remove Flash and Jaedong from the data, its 47.4% but that isn't really fair considering how many more TvZs Flash played than Jaedong. Additionally, Jaedong wasn't great at TvZ this season, going 4-3. Effort did much better with a 7-2 record in TvZ. If we exclude effort instead, TvZ this season would be 48.2% Note: I'm not great with numbers so someone might wanna check my math. | ||
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FabledIntegral
United States9232 Posts
On January 02 2010 13:01 lavion wrote: what i meant was something like set 4 of calm vs flash Still doesn't make sense. Calm was the opposite of greedy in set four. | ||
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0neder
United States3733 Posts
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AzureEye
United States1360 Posts
On January 02 2010 02:32 okum wrote: For those who claim that TvZ imbalanced: the combined TvZ win rate for this season's OSL, MSL and Proleague games so far is 52.8% if you count Flash's games and 46.3% if you don't. Essentially, Flash is single-handedly responsible for the balance of this matchup right now. If anything, TvZ is very slightly zerg favored at the moment and any terran nerfing would make the matchup impossible for everyone except Flash. The big question is whether other terrans can rise to Flash's level? Given how a number of zergs almost caught up with Jaedong in 2009, I wouldn't call it impossible. But they better get on it soon. Looking at just this season's data doesn't mean anything. You have to look at the bigger picture, look at the entire 10 years of TvZ. Because metagame will always evolve. And Terrans have raped Zergs in the past, the rape is just temporarily gone for now From looking at how long Zergs have been getting dominated, despite their new ways to change up the game by creating new styles, Zergs have never dominated Terrans for as long as Terrans have dominated Zergs. Unless Blizzard miraculously decides to change the actual units or gameplay of Terran and Zerg, TvZ will always remain imbalanced. That imbalance is reduced when a better Zerg player (i.e. Jaedong) plays a Terran or a map that heavily favors Zerg but it will always be there. This is why players like Effort or JD have to fight uphill battles vs. Terrans | ||
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nebffa
Australia776 Posts
On January 02 2010 14:49 FabledIntegral wrote: Still doesn't make sense. Calm was the opposite of greedy in set four. did you see how few lurkers he had against flash's push? did you see how few zerglings he had too? calm tried to power extremely hard by adding more hatcheries and tech, but not enough units to stop flash's push. the 'opposite of greedy' would have overproduced zerglings + lurkers, foregoing additional tech and drones. watch the VOD. the standard 3tank/1vessel hanbang from the terran smashed calm in the face cause he didnt have nearly enough units to stop it. | ||
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zenkicker
257 Posts
If you are more confident than Flash.. If you train more than Flash.. then you MIGHT win against him.. | ||
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Cedstick
Canada3336 Posts
On January 01 2010 05:19 icemac wrote: In all seriousness, some sort of timing attack made just for beating flash. "This here? This here's mah Flash Stick. I use it for... well, you kin' guess." | ||
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SK.Testie
Canada11084 Posts
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Sentenal
United States12398 Posts
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Orbifold
United States1922 Posts
On January 02 2010 19:04 Sentenal wrote: Stork was able to handle Flash pretty well. On HBR. | ||
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IdrA
United States11541 Posts
On January 02 2010 16:28 AzureEye wrote: Looking at just this season's data doesn't mean anything. You have to look at the bigger picture, look at the entire 10 years of TvZ. Because metagame will always evolve. And Terrans have raped Zergs in the past, the rape is just temporarily gone for now From looking at how long Zergs have been getting dominated, despite their new ways to change up the game by creating new styles, Zergs have never dominated Terrans for as long as Terrans have dominated Zergs. Unless Blizzard miraculously decides to change the actual units or gameplay of Terran and Zerg, TvZ will always remain imbalanced. That imbalance is reduced when a better Zerg player (i.e. Jaedong) plays a Terran or a map that heavily favors Zerg but it will always be there. This is why players like Effort or JD have to fight uphill battles vs. Terrans ya lets look at statistics from before muta micro and hive abuse to determine modern balance! that makes perfect sense! zergs used to do badly because their innovators came later than the terran's. nada and oov showed t's relatively modern tvz years before savior/ggplay/jaedong came and fixed zvt. looking at statistics from pre-muta micro and pre-hive abuse games in order to talk about current zvt is fucking retarded. and theres absolutely no reason to assume the metagame will swing back in terrans favor as the improvements in zvt are not something fragile or counterable, theyre solid improvements in general gameplay that will not go away. its like terran going from one base openings to fe. people just got flat out better at the matchup. | ||
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jodogohoo
Canada2533 Posts
On January 02 2010 18:19 MYM.Testie wrote: MOTHER FUCKER IF I KNEW THE ANSWER I'D BE IN KOREA WITH OVER A 70% WIN RATE FUCK YEAH, HOOAH | ||
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